A little TV fishin'

[Mark Bowen]

After a long day on the property, yesterday, settin' up auto-deer feeders, I decided
to spend a lazy day inside today. Sittin' here listenin' to NPR and watchin' PBS, I
watched a program about scientist who were attemptin' to capture--live-- a monster
man-eater croc (better than 45' long and estimated to be 60 y.o.) in Burundi. They
didn't succeed.

The next program to come on was Carolina Outdoor Journal which, I believe is produced
down around Mr. Miller's way in Greenville, NC. Today's show centered on flyfishin'
in the Pisgah--though they never say exactly where--on a delayed-harvest stream. I
think that it may have been up in Wilkes Co. on Stone Mountain Creek, but I don't
really know. They did say that they were fishin' in May and as always they do a
segment on the gear they use. The fishermen used the tried and true caddis and Adams'
patterns primarily, but they also fished with droppers--beadhead pheasant tail.

A few thing that they did or suggested seemed odd to me: They netted most all of the
fish, no matter the size and then handled the fish for what seemed an eternity. Now I
realize that they are producing a TV program and need to show the fish to make the
show interesting, but handlin' the fish after netting seems to defeat the purpose of
the net?

One, of the two guides, stated that a 7 1/2' to 8' rod and 4 and 5 weight rods were
recommended for the small streams in the Pisgah. I tend to use shorter and lighter
weight rods myself, but then I'm not a guide. There are times when I fish that I wish
that I had a longer rod on the small streams that I fish; mostly, those times are when
I am tryin' to keep my line off the water when castin' over a spill, or when tryin' to
get my line across a fast current to an eddy on the other side of the stream. For the
majority of my fishin' needs, on our small streams, I like a 6' to 7 1/2' rod in the 3
wt. range. I find that I can cast to difficult to get to sections of water by
positioning myself and I can get under rhodo branches more easily with a shorter rod.
I like usin' a 3 wt., cause *I believe* it gives me a more delicate presentation and I
can feel the fish I catch. The majority of fish I catch are in the 7 to 11 inch
range, though it's not uncommon to catch wild trout up to 18 inches on some stretches
of water I fish.

Finally, I couldn't help but notice that neither the guide nor their guests took any
but the largest fish to reel? Obviously, COJ isn't produced with the elite flyfisher
in mind.

Mark

[Tim Lysyk]

Mark Bowen wrote:

> A few thing that they did or suggested seemed odd to me: They netted most all of the
> fish, no matter the size and then handled the fish for what seemed an eternity. Now I
> realize that they are producing a TV program and need to show the fish to make the
> show interesting, but handlin' the fish after netting seems to defeat the purpose of
> the net?

I net the larger fish. Smaller fish don't need to be netted, and I can
usually get the fly out out with a pair of long forceps. I don't like
handling the fish too much, but at the same time, I thnk trout can take
a lot more handling than people give them credit for.
>
> One, of the two guides, stated that a 7 1/2' to 8' rod and 4 and 5 weight rods were
> recommended for the small streams in the Pisgah. I tend to use shorter and lighter
> weight rods myself

Lots of things determine choice of rod weight, I think personal
preference is the overriding factor. I tend to stay away from the really
light rods on the streams I fish. I will use a 6 wt most often, or a 5
wt in the summer when fishing dries. Around here, wind is the limiting
factor, and a 5 wt is about a light as I want to go; it is a good
compromise between rod weight nd being able to cast in the wind. On calm
days, in the summer, I like to use a 4 weight for dries, just because.
Delicate presentation doesn't enter into my choice of rod weights.
>
> Finally, I couldn't help but notice that neither the guide nor their guests took any
> but the largest fish to reel? Obviously, COJ isn't produced with the elite flyfisher
> in mind.

Getting fish on the reel is only worthwhile for the larger fish. I enjoy
playing fish on the reel, but I don't think the trout care one way or
the other.

Tim Lysyk

[Tim Lysyk]

Mark Bowen wrote:

> A few thing that they did or suggested seemed odd to me: They netted most all of the
> fish, no matter the size and then handled the fish for what seemed an eternity. Now I
> realize that they are producing a TV program and need to show the fish to make the
> show interesting, but handlin' the fish after netting seems to defeat the purpose of
> the net?

I net the larger fish. Smaller fish don't need to be netted, and I can
usually get the fly out out with a pair of long forceps. I don't like
handling the fish too much, but at the same time, I thnk trout can take
a lot more handling than people give them credit for.
>
> One, of the two guides, stated that a 7 1/2' to 8' rod and 4 and 5 weight rods were
> recommended for the small streams in the Pisgah. I tend to use shorter and lighter
> weight rods myself

Lots of things determine choice of rod weight, I think personal
preference is the overriding factor. I tend to stay away from the really
light rods on the streams I fish. I will use a 6 wt most often, or a 5
wt in the summer when fishing dries. Around here, wind is the limiting
factor, and a 5 wt is about a light as I want to go; it is a good
compromise between rod weight nd being able to cast in the wind. On calm
days, in the summer, I like to use a 4 weight for dries, just because.
Delicate presentation doesn't enter into my choice of rod weights.
>
> Finally, I couldn't help but notice that neither the guide nor their guests took any
> but the largest fish to reel? Obviously, COJ isn't produced with the elite flyfisher
> in mind.

Getting fish on the reel is only worthwhile for the larger fish. I enjoy
playing fish on the reel, but I don't think the trout care one way or
the other.

Tim Lysyk

[Tim Lysyk]

Mark Bowen wrote:

> A few thing that they did or suggested seemed odd to me: They netted most all of the
> fish, no matter the size and then handled the fish for what seemed an eternity. Now I
> realize that they are producing a TV program and need to show the fish to make the
> show interesting, but handlin' the fish after netting seems to defeat the purpose of
> the net?

I net the larger fish. Smaller fish don't need to be netted, and I can
usually get the fly out out with a pair of long forceps. I don't like
handling the fish too much, but at the same time, I thnk trout can take
a lot more handling than people give them credit for.
>
> One, of the two guides, stated that a 7 1/2' to 8' rod and 4 and 5 weight rods were
> recommended for the small streams in the Pisgah. I tend to use shorter and lighter
> weight rods myself

Lots of things determine choice of rod weight, I think personal
preference is the overriding factor. I tend to stay away from the really
light rods on the streams I fish. I will use a 6 wt most often, or a 5
wt in the summer when fishing dries. Around here, wind is the limiting
factor, and a 5 wt is about a light as I want to go; it is a good
compromise between rod weight nd being able to cast in the wind. On calm
days, in the summer, I like to use a 4 weight for dries, just because.
Delicate presentation doesn't enter into my choice of rod weights.
>
> Finally, I couldn't help but notice that neither the guide nor their guests took any
> but the largest fish to reel? Obviously, COJ isn't produced with the elite flyfisher
> in mind.

Getting fish on the reel is only worthwhile for the larger fish. I enjoy
playing fish on the reel, but I don't think the trout care one way or
the other.

Tim Lysyk

[rw]

Tim Lysyk wrote:
>
> Getting fish on the reel is only worthwhile for the larger fish. I enjoy
> playing fish on the reel, but I don't think the trout care one way or
> the other.

Dishonorable. And unethical.

--
Cut "to the chase" for my email address.

[rw]

Tim Lysyk wrote:
>
> Getting fish on the reel is only worthwhile for the larger fish. I enjoy
> playing fish on the reel, but I don't think the trout care one way or
> the other.

Dishonorable. And unethical.

--
Cut "to the chase" for my email address.

[rw]

Tim Lysyk wrote:
>
> Getting fish on the reel is only worthwhile for the larger fish. I enjoy
> playing fish on the reel, but I don't think the trout care one way or
> the other.

Dishonorable. And unethical.

--
Cut "to the chase" for my email address.

[Jeff Miller]

coj is produced for business reasons - money. but it's producer, joe
albea, is a devoted outdoorsman who cares about fishing, hunting, and
protecting the areas sportsmen/women and wildlife enjoy. he's worked
hard at foiling the navy's plan to build a practice landing strip in an
area known (and renown) for its goose and swan populations. he's not
really figured out nc mountain trout fishing yet, and just goes to those
areas where a tv production crew can tag along. he generally uses the
orvis/foscoe fishing guides. ollie has been down here flipping flies
for shad and stripers in the spring. fortunately, no one has told joe or
coj where to find real trout fishing...yet.

when i ran into joe last week, he said he's gonna do a show with judson
conway (eustace conway's brother - google "turtle island" for info about
eustace, and some about judson too) of elk creek outfitters (in boone)
about flyfishing for muskie in the new river or watauga... apparently,
they've found a strain in the area wanting to become teevee stars.
whatever you do, don't let him know your favorite fishing place or the
cable will need to be replaced with an escalator and turnstiles <g>.

its about time for another sortie between the trail and the falls, isn't
it? i've been thinking on coming up for a weekend to do it before
graham county.

jeff

Mark Bowen wrote:

> After a long day on the property, yesterday, settin' up auto-deer feeders, I decided
> to spend a lazy day inside today. Sittin' here listenin' to NPR and watchin' PBS, I
> watched a program about scientist who were attemptin' to capture--live-- a monster
> man-eater croc (better than 45' long and estimated to be 60 y.o.) in Burundi. They
> didn't succeed.
>
> The next program to come on was Carolina Outdoor Journal which, I believe is produced
> down around Mr. Miller's way in Greenville, NC. Today's show centered on flyfishin'
> in the Pisgah--though they never say exactly where--on a delayed-harvest stream. I
> think that it may have been up in Wilkes Co. on Stone Mountain Creek, but I don't
> really know. They did say that they were fishin' in May and as always they do a
> segment on the gear they use. The fishermen used the tried and true caddis and Adams'
> patterns primarily, but they also fished with droppers--beadhead pheasant tail.
>
> A few thing that they did or suggested seemed odd to me: They netted most all of the
> fish, no matter the size and then handled the fish for what seemed an eternity. Now I
> realize that they are producing a TV program and need to show the fish to make the
> show interesting, but handlin' the fish after netting seems to defeat the purpose of
> the net?
>
> One, of the two guides, stated that a 7 1/2' to 8' rod and 4 and 5 weight rods were
> recommended for the small streams in the Pisgah. I tend to use shorter and lighter
> weight rods myself, but then I'm not a guide. There are times when I fish that I wish
> that I had a longer rod on the small streams that I fish; mostly, those times are when
> I am tryin' to keep my line off the water when castin' over a spill, or when tryin' to
> get my line across a fast current to an eddy on the other side of the stream. For the
> majority of my fishin' needs, on our small streams, I like a 6' to 7 1/2' rod in the 3
> wt. range. I find that I can cast to difficult to get to sections of water by
> positioning myself and I can get under rhodo branches more easily with a shorter rod.
> I like usin' a 3 wt., cause *I believe* it gives me a more delicate presentation and I
> can feel the fish I catch. The majority of fish I catch are in the 7 to 11 inch
> range, though it's not uncommon to catch wild trout up to 18 inches on some stretches
> of water I fish.
>
> Finally, I couldn't help but notice that neither the guide nor their guests took any
> but the largest fish to reel? Obviously, COJ isn't produced with the elite flyfisher
> in mind.
>
> Mark
>

[Jeff Miller]

coj is produced for business reasons - money. but it's producer, joe
albea, is a devoted outdoorsman who cares about fishing, hunting, and
protecting the areas sportsmen/women and wildlife enjoy. he's worked
hard at foiling the navy's plan to build a practice landing strip in an
area known (and renown) for its goose and swan populations. he's not
really figured out nc mountain trout fishing yet, and just goes to those
areas where a tv production crew can tag along. he generally uses the
orvis/foscoe fishing guides. ollie has been down here flipping flies
for shad and stripers in the spring. fortunately, no one has told joe or
coj where to find real trout fishing...yet.

when i ran into joe last week, he said he's gonna do a show with judson
conway (eustace conway's brother - google "turtle island" for info about
eustace, and some about judson too) of elk creek outfitters (in boone)
about flyfishing for muskie in the new river or watauga... apparently,
they've found a strain in the area wanting to become teevee stars.
whatever you do, don't let him know your favorite fishing place or the
cable will need to be replaced with an escalator and turnstiles <g>.

its about time for another sortie between the trail and the falls, isn't
it? i've been thinking on coming up for a weekend to do it before
graham county.

jeff

Mark Bowen wrote:

> After a long day on the property, yesterday, settin' up auto-deer feeders, I decided
> to spend a lazy day inside today. Sittin' here listenin' to NPR and watchin' PBS, I
> watched a program about scientist who were attemptin' to capture--live-- a monster
> man-eater croc (better than 45' long and estimated to be 60 y.o.) in Burundi. They
> didn't succeed.
>
> The next program to come on was Carolina Outdoor Journal which, I believe is produced
> down around Mr. Miller's way in Greenville, NC. Today's show centered on flyfishin'
> in the Pisgah--though they never say exactly where--on a delayed-harvest stream. I
> think that it may have been up in Wilkes Co. on Stone Mountain Creek, but I don't
> really know. They did say that they were fishin' in May and as always they do a
> segment on the gear they use. The fishermen used the tried and true caddis and Adams'
> patterns primarily, but they also fished with droppers--beadhead pheasant tail.
>
> A few thing that they did or suggested seemed odd to me: They netted most all of the
> fish, no matter the size and then handled the fish for what seemed an eternity. Now I
> realize that they are producing a TV program and need to show the fish to make the
> show interesting, but handlin' the fish after netting seems to defeat the purpose of
> the net?
>
> One, of the two guides, stated that a 7 1/2' to 8' rod and 4 and 5 weight rods were
> recommended for the small streams in the Pisgah. I tend to use shorter and lighter
> weight rods myself, but then I'm not a guide. There are times when I fish that I wish
> that I had a longer rod on the small streams that I fish; mostly, those times are when
> I am tryin' to keep my line off the water when castin' over a spill, or when tryin' to
> get my line across a fast current to an eddy on the other side of the stream. For the
> majority of my fishin' needs, on our small streams, I like a 6' to 7 1/2' rod in the 3
> wt. range. I find that I can cast to difficult to get to sections of water by
> positioning myself and I can get under rhodo branches more easily with a shorter rod.
> I like usin' a 3 wt., cause *I believe* it gives me a more delicate presentation and I
> can feel the fish I catch. The majority of fish I catch are in the 7 to 11 inch
> range, though it's not uncommon to catch wild trout up to 18 inches on some stretches
> of water I fish.
>
> Finally, I couldn't help but notice that neither the guide nor their guests took any
> but the largest fish to reel? Obviously, COJ isn't produced with the elite flyfisher
> in mind.
>
> Mark
>

[Jeff Miller]

coj is produced for business reasons - money. but it's producer, joe
albea, is a devoted outdoorsman who cares about fishing, hunting, and
protecting the areas sportsmen/women and wildlife enjoy. he's worked
hard at foiling the navy's plan to build a practice landing strip in an
area known (and renown) for its goose and swan populations. he's not
really figured out nc mountain trout fishing yet, and just goes to those
areas where a tv production crew can tag along. he generally uses the
orvis/foscoe fishing guides. ollie has been down here flipping flies
for shad and stripers in the spring. fortunately, no one has told joe or
coj where to find real trout fishing...yet.

when i ran into joe last week, he said he's gonna do a show with judson
conway (eustace conway's brother - google "turtle island" for info about
eustace, and some about judson too) of elk creek outfitters (in boone)
about flyfishing for muskie in the new river or watauga... apparently,
they've found a strain in the area wanting to become teevee stars.
whatever you do, don't let him know your favorite fishing place or the
cable will need to be replaced with an escalator and turnstiles <g>.

its about time for another sortie between the trail and the falls, isn't
it? i've been thinking on coming up for a weekend to do it before
graham county.

jeff

Mark Bowen wrote:

> After a long day on the property, yesterday, settin' up auto-deer feeders, I decided
> to spend a lazy day inside today. Sittin' here listenin' to NPR and watchin' PBS, I
> watched a program about scientist who were attemptin' to capture--live-- a monster
> man-eater croc (better than 45' long and estimated to be 60 y.o.) in Burundi. They
> didn't succeed.
>
> The next program to come on was Carolina Outdoor Journal which, I believe is produced
> down around Mr. Miller's way in Greenville, NC. Today's show centered on flyfishin'
> in the Pisgah--though they never say exactly where--on a delayed-harvest stream. I
> think that it may have been up in Wilkes Co. on Stone Mountain Creek, but I don't
> really know. They did say that they were fishin' in May and as always they do a
> segment on the gear they use. The fishermen used the tried and true caddis and Adams'
> patterns primarily, but they also fished with droppers--beadhead pheasant tail.
>
> A few thing that they did or suggested seemed odd to me: They netted most all of the
> fish, no matter the size and then handled the fish for what seemed an eternity. Now I
> realize that they are producing a TV program and need to show the fish to make the
> show interesting, but handlin' the fish after netting seems to defeat the purpose of
> the net?
>
> One, of the two guides, stated that a 7 1/2' to 8' rod and 4 and 5 weight rods were
> recommended for the small streams in the Pisgah. I tend to use shorter and lighter
> weight rods myself, but then I'm not a guide. There are times when I fish that I wish
> that I had a longer rod on the small streams that I fish; mostly, those times are when
> I am tryin' to keep my line off the water when castin' over a spill, or when tryin' to
> get my line across a fast current to an eddy on the other side of the stream. For the
> majority of my fishin' needs, on our small streams, I like a 6' to 7 1/2' rod in the 3
> wt. range. I find that I can cast to difficult to get to sections of water by
> positioning myself and I can get under rhodo branches more easily with a shorter rod.
> I like usin' a 3 wt., cause *I believe* it gives me a more delicate presentation and I
> can feel the fish I catch. The majority of fish I catch are in the 7 to 11 inch
> range, though it's not uncommon to catch wild trout up to 18 inches on some stretches
> of water I fish.
>
> Finally, I couldn't help but notice that neither the guide nor their guests took any
> but the largest fish to reel? Obviously, COJ isn't produced with the elite flyfisher
> in mind.
>
> Mark
>

[Tim Lysyk]

rw wrote:
> Tim Lysyk wrote:
>
>>
>> Getting fish on the reel is only worthwhile for the larger fish. I
>> enjoy playing fish on the reel, but I don't think the trout care one
>> way or the other.
>
>
> Dishonorable. And unethical.
>

Why?

Tim Lysyk

[Tim Lysyk]

rw wrote:
> Tim Lysyk wrote:
>
>>
>> Getting fish on the reel is only worthwhile for the larger fish. I
>> enjoy playing fish on the reel, but I don't think the trout care one
>> way or the other.
>
>
> Dishonorable. And unethical.
>

Why?

Tim Lysyk

[Tim Lysyk]

rw wrote:
> Tim Lysyk wrote:
>
>>
>> Getting fish on the reel is only worthwhile for the larger fish. I
>> enjoy playing fish on the reel, but I don't think the trout care one
>> way or the other.
>
>
> Dishonorable. And unethical.
>

Why?

Tim Lysyk

[Mark Bowen]

"Jeff Miller" > wrote in message
news:BWI_c.252542$Oi.46811@fed1read04...
> coj is produced for business reasons - money.

Yes, ad that is why I noted the need to make the shows interesting to viewers. I have
nothing but respect for Joe's works. If I happen to be watchin' PBS and COJ comes on,
I watch! I saw a great show a while back on grouse huntin' in the mountains, while
SNOW was fallin, which got me thinkin' about gettin' a bird dog, once Beau passes on
of course.

I like how they break the show up into segments--gear-time, southern cookin'--though,
there are times, I wish that they would continue with the huntin' and fishin' portions
for longer periods.

>but it's producer, joe albea, is a devoted outdoorsman who cares about fishing,
hunting, and
> protecting the areas sportsmen/women and wildlife enjoy. he's worked
> hard at foiling the navy's plan to build a practice landing strip in an
> area known (and renown) for its goose and swan populations.

Has there been an outcome to that sad affair yet?

>he's not
> really figured out nc mountain trout fishing yet, and just goes to those
> areas where a tv production crew can tag along. he generally uses the
> orvis/foscoe fishing guides. ollie has been down here flipping flies
> for shad and stripers in the spring. fortunately, no one has told joe or
> coj where to find real trout fishing...yet.

Yeah, I've seen a show or two with Ollie.

>
> when i ran into joe last week, he said he's gonna do a show with judson
> conway (eustace conway's brother - google "turtle island" for info about
> eustace, and some about judson too) of elk creek outfitters (in boone)
> about flyfishing for muskie in the new river or watauga... apparently,
> they've found a strain in the area wanting to become teevee stars.

Yep, familiar with Eustace and Turtle Island. PBS has done a show or twon on
Eustace's place that I have seen. Different sort of fella that Eustace?

> whatever you do, don't let him know your favorite fishing place or the
> cable will need to be replaced with an escalator and turnstiles <g>.

Duly and dually noted!

>
> its about time for another sortie between the trail and the falls, isn't
> it? i've been thinking on coming up for a weekend to do it before
> graham county.

Contact me by phone 828-758-9542 or by e-mail and let me know a date, and I will take
the time necessary for a death march. If you want to do it in the middle of the week,
just say, and I will take off work! We need to do it soon, as the days are growing
shorter and you do remember the last time we did that trip, right?!!

Mark --Who would enjoy fishin' with a rude and lazy non-hikin' and campin', proud NC
legal man, any day of the year!--

>
> jeff

[Mark Bowen]

"Jeff Miller" > wrote in message
news:BWI_c.252542$Oi.46811@fed1read04...
> coj is produced for business reasons - money.

Yes, ad that is why I noted the need to make the shows interesting to viewers. I have
nothing but respect for Joe's works. If I happen to be watchin' PBS and COJ comes on,
I watch! I saw a great show a while back on grouse huntin' in the mountains, while
SNOW was fallin, which got me thinkin' about gettin' a bird dog, once Beau passes on
of course.

I like how they break the show up into segments--gear-time, southern cookin'--though,
there are times, I wish that they would continue with the huntin' and fishin' portions
for longer periods.

>but it's producer, joe albea, is a devoted outdoorsman who cares about fishing,
hunting, and
> protecting the areas sportsmen/women and wildlife enjoy. he's worked
> hard at foiling the navy's plan to build a practice landing strip in an
> area known (and renown) for its goose and swan populations.

Has there been an outcome to that sad affair yet?

>he's not
> really figured out nc mountain trout fishing yet, and just goes to those
> areas where a tv production crew can tag along. he generally uses the
> orvis/foscoe fishing guides. ollie has been down here flipping flies
> for shad and stripers in the spring. fortunately, no one has told joe or
> coj where to find real trout fishing...yet.

Yeah, I've seen a show or two with Ollie.

>
> when i ran into joe last week, he said he's gonna do a show with judson
> conway (eustace conway's brother - google "turtle island" for info about
> eustace, and some about judson too) of elk creek outfitters (in boone)
> about flyfishing for muskie in the new river or watauga... apparently,
> they've found a strain in the area wanting to become teevee stars.

Yep, familiar with Eustace and Turtle Island. PBS has done a show or twon on
Eustace's place that I have seen. Different sort of fella that Eustace?

> whatever you do, don't let him know your favorite fishing place or the
> cable will need to be replaced with an escalator and turnstiles <g>.

Duly and dually noted!

>
> its about time for another sortie between the trail and the falls, isn't
> it? i've been thinking on coming up for a weekend to do it before
> graham county.

Contact me by phone 828-758-9542 or by e-mail and let me know a date, and I will take
the time necessary for a death march. If you want to do it in the middle of the week,
just say, and I will take off work! We need to do it soon, as the days are growing
shorter and you do remember the last time we did that trip, right?!!

Mark --Who would enjoy fishin' with a rude and lazy non-hikin' and campin', proud NC
legal man, any day of the year!--

>
> jeff

[Mark Bowen]

"Jeff Miller" > wrote in message
news:BWI_c.252542$Oi.46811@fed1read04...
> coj is produced for business reasons - money.

Yes, ad that is why I noted the need to make the shows interesting to viewers. I have
nothing but respect for Joe's works. If I happen to be watchin' PBS and COJ comes on,
I watch! I saw a great show a while back on grouse huntin' in the mountains, while
SNOW was fallin, which got me thinkin' about gettin' a bird dog, once Beau passes on
of course.

I like how they break the show up into segments--gear-time, southern cookin'--though,
there are times, I wish that they would continue with the huntin' and fishin' portions
for longer periods.

>but it's producer, joe albea, is a devoted outdoorsman who cares about fishing,
hunting, and
> protecting the areas sportsmen/women and wildlife enjoy. he's worked
> hard at foiling the navy's plan to build a practice landing strip in an
> area known (and renown) for its goose and swan populations.

Has there been an outcome to that sad affair yet?

>he's not
> really figured out nc mountain trout fishing yet, and just goes to those
> areas where a tv production crew can tag along. he generally uses the
> orvis/foscoe fishing guides. ollie has been down here flipping flies
> for shad and stripers in the spring. fortunately, no one has told joe or
> coj where to find real trout fishing...yet.

Yeah, I've seen a show or two with Ollie.

>
> when i ran into joe last week, he said he's gonna do a show with judson
> conway (eustace conway's brother - google "turtle island" for info about
> eustace, and some about judson too) of elk creek outfitters (in boone)
> about flyfishing for muskie in the new river or watauga... apparently,
> they've found a strain in the area wanting to become teevee stars.

Yep, familiar with Eustace and Turtle Island. PBS has done a show or twon on
Eustace's place that I have seen. Different sort of fella that Eustace?

> whatever you do, don't let him know your favorite fishing place or the
> cable will need to be replaced with an escalator and turnstiles <g>.

Duly and dually noted!

>
> its about time for another sortie between the trail and the falls, isn't
> it? i've been thinking on coming up for a weekend to do it before
> graham county.

Contact me by phone 828-758-9542 or by e-mail and let me know a date, and I will take
the time necessary for a death march. If you want to do it in the middle of the week,
just say, and I will take off work! We need to do it soon, as the days are growing
shorter and you do remember the last time we did that trip, right?!!

Mark --Who would enjoy fishin' with a rude and lazy non-hikin' and campin', proud NC
legal man, any day of the year!--

>
> jeff

[Mark Bowen]

"Tim Lysyk" > wrote in message
news:eeJ_c.117741$X12.99215@edtnps84...
> rw wrote:
> > Tim Lysyk wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> Getting fish on the reel is only worthwhile for the larger fish. I
> >> enjoy playing fish on the reel, but I don't think the trout care one
> >> way or the other.
> >
> >
> > Dishonorable. And unethical.
> >
>
> Why?
>
> Tim Lysyk

I believe that was a shot over Kenny's bow and intended for it's humor--even if there
wasn't a smiley face.

Mark

[Mark Bowen]

"Tim Lysyk" > wrote in message
news:eeJ_c.117741$X12.99215@edtnps84...
> rw wrote:
> > Tim Lysyk wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> Getting fish on the reel is only worthwhile for the larger fish. I
> >> enjoy playing fish on the reel, but I don't think the trout care one
> >> way or the other.
> >
> >
> > Dishonorable. And unethical.
> >
>
> Why?
>
> Tim Lysyk

I believe that was a shot over Kenny's bow and intended for it's humor--even if there
wasn't a smiley face.

Mark

[Mark Bowen]

"Tim Lysyk" > wrote in message
news:eeJ_c.117741$X12.99215@edtnps84...
> rw wrote:
> > Tim Lysyk wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> Getting fish on the reel is only worthwhile for the larger fish. I
> >> enjoy playing fish on the reel, but I don't think the trout care one
> >> way or the other.
> >
> >
> > Dishonorable. And unethical.
> >
>
> Why?
>
> Tim Lysyk

I believe that was a shot over Kenny's bow and intended for it's humor--even if there
wasn't a smiley face.

Mark

[rw]

Tim Lysyk wrote:
> rw wrote:
>
>> Tim Lysyk wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Getting fish on the reel is only worthwhile for the larger fish. I
>>> enjoy playing fish on the reel, but I don't think the trout care one
>>> way or the other.
>>
>>
>>
>> Dishonorable. And unethical.
>>
>
> Why?

Ask 40.

--
Cut "to the chase" for my email address.

[rw]

Tim Lysyk wrote:
> rw wrote:
>
>> Tim Lysyk wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Getting fish on the reel is only worthwhile for the larger fish. I
>>> enjoy playing fish on the reel, but I don't think the trout care one
>>> way or the other.
>>
>>
>>
>> Dishonorable. And unethical.
>>
>
> Why?

Ask 40.

--
Cut "to the chase" for my email address.

[rw]

Tim Lysyk wrote:
> rw wrote:
>
>> Tim Lysyk wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Getting fish on the reel is only worthwhile for the larger fish. I
>>> enjoy playing fish on the reel, but I don't think the trout care one
>>> way or the other.
>>
>>
>>
>> Dishonorable. And unethical.
>>
>
> Why?

Ask 40.

--
Cut "to the chase" for my email address.

[Ken Fortenberry]

rw wrote:
> Tim Lysyk wrote:
>> rw wrote:
>>> Tim Lysyk wrote:
>>>> Getting fish on the reel is only worthwhile for the larger fish. I
>>>> enjoy playing fish on the reel, but I don't think the trout care one
>>>> way or the other.
>>>
>>> Dishonorable. And unethical.
>>
>> Why?
>
> Ask 40.

There is honor is doing things right, and **FOR ME** putting the
fish on the reel is doing fly fishing right. You hardly ever know
which fish is going to be good size and which is not so it's good
practice to use proper technique every time. Part of proper
technique is never having more line outside the reel than you can
retrieve when you get a fish on. There is honor in doing things
right as opposed to half-assed and slapdash.

This attitude, or more accurately this attitude of *MINE*, caused
wee Willi Loehman to have one of his squealing hissy fits. In
other words, the usual roff hyperbole and nonsense. Bottom line,
Barnard's a putz and he's just trying to stir up old **** because
he's not creative, witty or smart enough to stir up any new ****
of his own.

--
Ken Fortenberry

[Ken Fortenberry]

rw wrote:
> Tim Lysyk wrote:
>> rw wrote:
>>> Tim Lysyk wrote:
>>>> Getting fish on the reel is only worthwhile for the larger fish. I
>>>> enjoy playing fish on the reel, but I don't think the trout care one
>>>> way or the other.
>>>
>>> Dishonorable. And unethical.
>>
>> Why?
>
> Ask 40.

There is honor is doing things right, and **FOR ME** putting the
fish on the reel is doing fly fishing right. You hardly ever know
which fish is going to be good size and which is not so it's good
practice to use proper technique every time. Part of proper
technique is never having more line outside the reel than you can
retrieve when you get a fish on. There is honor in doing things
right as opposed to half-assed and slapdash.

This attitude, or more accurately this attitude of *MINE*, caused
wee Willi Loehman to have one of his squealing hissy fits. In
other words, the usual roff hyperbole and nonsense. Bottom line,
Barnard's a putz and he's just trying to stir up old **** because
he's not creative, witty or smart enough to stir up any new ****
of his own.

--
Ken Fortenberry

[Mark Bowen]

"Ken Fortenberry" > wrote in message
. com...
> > Tim Lysyk wrote:
> >>> Tim Lysyk wrote:
> >>>> Getting fish on the reel is only worthwhile for the larger fish. I
> >>>> enjoy playing fish on the reel, but I don't think the trout care one
> >>>> way or the other.
> >>>
> >> Why?
> >
> Ken Fortenberry

And there you have it! Like you I don't think the trout really care either, and even
if it did, it wouldn't matter, as we are the one's who are hookin' the trout and not
the other way around.

Mark

[Mark Bowen]

"Ken Fortenberry" > wrote in message
. com...
> > Tim Lysyk wrote:
> >>> Tim Lysyk wrote:
> >>>> Getting fish on the reel is only worthwhile for the larger fish. I
> >>>> enjoy playing fish on the reel, but I don't think the trout care one
> >>>> way or the other.
> >>>
> >> Why?
> >
> Ken Fortenberry

And there you have it! Like you I don't think the trout really care either, and even
if it did, it wouldn't matter, as we are the one's who are hookin' the trout and not
the other way around.

Mark

[Mark Bowen]

"Ken Fortenberry" > wrote in message
. com...
> > Tim Lysyk wrote:
> >>> Tim Lysyk wrote:
> >>>> Getting fish on the reel is only worthwhile for the larger fish. I
> >>>> enjoy playing fish on the reel, but I don't think the trout care one
> >>>> way or the other.
> >>>
> >> Why?
> >
> Ken Fortenberry

And there you have it! Like you I don't think the trout really care either, and even
if it did, it wouldn't matter, as we are the one's who are hookin' the trout and not
the other way around.

Mark

[Wolfgang]

"Ken Fortenberry" > wrote in message
. com...
>
>You hardly ever know
> which fish is going to be good size and which is not

You, who? Me? I almost always know within two seconds. What am I doing
wrong?

> so it's good
> practice to use proper technique every time.

You've forgotten, haven't you? Many of us have seen you fish. :)

Wolfgang
whose mama always said proper is as proper does.

[Wolfgang]

"Ken Fortenberry" > wrote in message
. com...
>
>You hardly ever know
> which fish is going to be good size and which is not

You, who? Me? I almost always know within two seconds. What am I doing
wrong?

> so it's good
> practice to use proper technique every time.

You've forgotten, haven't you? Many of us have seen you fish. :)

Wolfgang
whose mama always said proper is as proper does.

[Jeff Miller]

Mark Bowen wrote:

>
> Has there been an outcome to that sad affair yet?

nope...federal judge issued a preliminary injunction stopping land
acquisitions pending better evidence on environmental/wildlife impact.
it's interesting watching the military fight with struggling eastern nc
towns, poor farmers, and rich charlotte lawyers (who are working without
charge or fee), with one of jesse helms' handpicked judges right in the
middle. the navy never had a chance. <g>
>


> Contact me

will do. we'll walk a bit farther before we start fishing this
time...and, you did say you discovered a trail out didn't you? <g>

....probably in the next two or three weeks, and might have to be a saturday.

jeff

[Jeff Miller]

Mark Bowen wrote:

>
> Has there been an outcome to that sad affair yet?

nope...federal judge issued a preliminary injunction stopping land
acquisitions pending better evidence on environmental/wildlife impact.
it's interesting watching the military fight with struggling eastern nc
towns, poor farmers, and rich charlotte lawyers (who are working without
charge or fee), with one of jesse helms' handpicked judges right in the
middle. the navy never had a chance. <g>
>


> Contact me

will do. we'll walk a bit farther before we start fishing this
time...and, you did say you discovered a trail out didn't you? <g>

....probably in the next two or three weeks, and might have to be a saturday.

jeff

[Mark Bowen]

"Jeff Miller" > wrote in message
news:VYN_c.40110$wu.23672@okepread04...
> nope...federal judge issued a preliminary injunction stopping land
> acquisitions pending better evidence on environmental/wildlife impact.
> it's interesting watching the military fight with struggling eastern nc
> towns, poor farmers, and rich charlotte lawyers (who are working without
> charge or fee), with one of jesse helms' handpicked judges right in the
> middle. the navy never had a chance. <g>

I'll go with the poor farmers every time!

> >
>
>
> > Contact me
>
> will do. we'll walk a bit farther before we start fishing this
> time...and, you did say you discovered a trail out didn't you? <g>

Yeah, I found two. One, is on the left side of the stream and you followed it to the
parking lot the last time; the other one is on the right side of the stream and it
goes up to the top of the falls, where ya cross to another trail up to the parking
lot.

Remember to bring a second pair of glasses, other than sunglasses, dry matches,
flashlight, dry change of clothes, GPS, and a BIG flask of single malt!


> ...probably in the next two or three weeks, and might have to be a saturday.

Sounds good to me, but I suggest that we get to the stream at the break of dawn! I
fished it back in the Spring, by myself, and it took me 9 1/2 hours. I skipped a lot
of the lower section and was not able to fish the last stretch due to an unplanned
lightning, hail and torrential rain storm. Of course, then I had to hike out the
trail and 2 miles of 181 Hwy back to my truck. I was beat for two days afterwards.

See ya soon, I can't wait to to do the death march boogie!

Mark

>
> jeff

[Ken Fortenberry]

Wolfgang wrote:
> "Ken Fortenberry" wrote:
>>You hardly ever know
>>which fish is going to be good size and which is not
>
> You, who? Me? I almost always know within two seconds. What am I doing
> wrong?

If you know which fish is good size two seconds after you catch
it, you're doing nothing wrong. If you know for sure which fish
is going to be good size two seconds BEFORE you catch it, what
you're doing wrong is wasting your time fishing. You should be
buying stocks and bonds all week and playing the horses on the
weekends.

>>so it's good
>>practice to use proper technique every time.
>
> You've forgotten, haven't you? Many of us have seen you fish. :)

I can't remember anything I've forgotten, what's your point ?

--
Ken Fortenberry

[Ken Fortenberry]

Wolfgang wrote:
> "Ken Fortenberry" wrote:
>>You hardly ever know
>>which fish is going to be good size and which is not
>
> You, who? Me? I almost always know within two seconds. What am I doing
> wrong?

If you know which fish is good size two seconds after you catch
it, you're doing nothing wrong. If you know for sure which fish
is going to be good size two seconds BEFORE you catch it, what
you're doing wrong is wasting your time fishing. You should be
buying stocks and bonds all week and playing the horses on the
weekends.

>>so it's good
>>practice to use proper technique every time.
>
> You've forgotten, haven't you? Many of us have seen you fish. :)

I can't remember anything I've forgotten, what's your point ?

--
Ken Fortenberry

[Ken Fortenberry]

Wolfgang wrote:
> "Ken Fortenberry" wrote:
>>You hardly ever know
>>which fish is going to be good size and which is not
>
> You, who? Me? I almost always know within two seconds. What am I doing
> wrong?

If you know which fish is good size two seconds after you catch
it, you're doing nothing wrong. If you know for sure which fish
is going to be good size two seconds BEFORE you catch it, what
you're doing wrong is wasting your time fishing. You should be
buying stocks and bonds all week and playing the horses on the
weekends.

>>so it's good
>>practice to use proper technique every time.
>
> You've forgotten, haven't you? Many of us have seen you fish. :)

I can't remember anything I've forgotten, what's your point ?

--
Ken Fortenberry

[Wolfgang]

"Ken Fortenberry" > wrote in message
. ..
> Wolfgang wrote:
> > "Ken Fortenberry" wrote:
> >>You hardly ever know
> >>which fish is going to be good size and which is not
> >
> > You, who? Me? I almost always know within two seconds. What am I
doing
> > wrong?
>
> If you know which fish is good size two seconds after you catch
> it,

And I generally do.......but then, we'd already established that......hadn't
we?

> you're doing nothing wrong.

Hm.......so, when Jeff, Mark, or Jennifer slaps you around they are doing
nothing wrong so long as they know approximately what size you are shortly
after they've got you hooked?

> If you know for sure which fish
> is going to be good size two seconds BEFORE you catch it, what
> you're doing wrong is wasting your time fishing. You should be
> buying stocks and bonds all week and playing the horses on the
> weekends.

Oh goody. I am REALLY looking forward to your beautifully crafted
explanation of what your knowlege of a fish BEFORE you hook it has to do
with the propriety of playing it on the reel after it's hooked.

Remember, "There is honor is doing things right, and **FOR ME** putting the
fish on the reel is doing fly fishing right.You hardly ever know which fish
is going to be good size and which is not so it's good practice to use
proper technique every time"?

> >>so it's good
> >>practice to use proper technique every time.

Well, yes, I see that you do remember.

> > You've forgotten, haven't you? Many of us have seen you fish. :)
>
> I can't remember anything I've forgotten, what's your point ?

That you don't remember anything you've forgotten........and this is, in
large part, the source of your pain.

Wolfgang

[Ken Fortenberry]

David Snedeker wrote:
> Be careful Ken; He is about to offer you drugs and the use of his jokes if
> you will take a dump on his head. Just say no.

Not to worry, I've known for quite some time now that
one should avoid tit-for-tat Usenet conversations with
Wolfie. Better I think to play with him a bit until he
inevitably makes a total ass of himself all by hisself.

--
Ken Fortenberry

[Ken Fortenberry]

David Snedeker wrote:
> Be careful Ken; He is about to offer you drugs and the use of his jokes if
> you will take a dump on his head. Just say no.

Not to worry, I've known for quite some time now that
one should avoid tit-for-tat Usenet conversations with
Wolfie. Better I think to play with him a bit until he
inevitably makes a total ass of himself all by hisself.

--
Ken Fortenberry

[Tim Lysyk]

Ken Fortenberry wrote:

> Bottom line,
> Barnard's a putz and he's just trying to stir up old **** because
> he's not creative, witty or smart enough to stir up any new ****
> of his own.

Well...he IS a politician.

Tim Lysyk

[Tim Lysyk]

Ken Fortenberry wrote:

> Bottom line,
> Barnard's a putz and he's just trying to stir up old **** because
> he's not creative, witty or smart enough to stir up any new ****
> of his own.

Well...he IS a politician.

Tim Lysyk

[Tim Lysyk]

Ken Fortenberry wrote:

> Bottom line,
> Barnard's a putz and he's just trying to stir up old **** because
> he's not creative, witty or smart enough to stir up any new ****
> of his own.

Well...he IS a politician.

Tim Lysyk

[Wolfgang]

"Ken Fortenberry" > wrote in
message m...
> ...I've known for quite some time now that
> one should avoid tit-for-tat Usenet conversations with
> Wolfie. Better I think to play with him a bit until he
> inevitably makes a total ass of himself all by hisself.


And yet......

Wolfgang
secure in the knowledge that no one would EVER be foolish enough to
respond.....tit-for-tat, that is. :)

[Wolfgang]

"Ken Fortenberry" > wrote in
message m...
> ...I've known for quite some time now that
> one should avoid tit-for-tat Usenet conversations with
> Wolfie. Better I think to play with him a bit until he
> inevitably makes a total ass of himself all by hisself.


And yet......

Wolfgang
secure in the knowledge that no one would EVER be foolish enough to
respond.....tit-for-tat, that is. :)

[Sam Matthews]

> >>>
> >>> Dishonorable. And unethical.
> >>
> >> Why?
> >
> > Ask 40.
>
> There is honor is doing things right, and **FOR ME** putting the
> fish on the reel is doing fly fishing right. You hardly ever know
> which fish is going to be good size and which is not so it's good
> practice to use proper technique every time. Part of proper
> technique is never having more line outside the reel than you can
> retrieve when you get a fish on. There is honor in doing things
> right as opposed to half-assed and slapdash.
>

So .... using your teeth is out?

sm

[Sam Matthews]

> >>>
> >>> Dishonorable. And unethical.
> >>
> >> Why?
> >
> > Ask 40.
>
> There is honor is doing things right, and **FOR ME** putting the
> fish on the reel is doing fly fishing right. You hardly ever know
> which fish is going to be good size and which is not so it's good
> practice to use proper technique every time. Part of proper
> technique is never having more line outside the reel than you can
> retrieve when you get a fish on. There is honor in doing things
> right as opposed to half-assed and slapdash.
>

So .... using your teeth is out?

sm