Orvis Premium Fly Tying Kit?

[Tim G]

Hi,

I'm a non-fly-tying fly fisherman - one of those - who finally thinks
he needs to get into tying.

I've combed your old posts, and read all your warnings against buying
a fly-tying kit... yet, still, I can't help but think that a good kit
might not be a bad way to go, simply for learning's sake. I
understand that I'll certainly be buying new materials (and not using
some that come with the kit), possibly buying some new tools later
on... and that overall it might not be the most cost-effective way to
go... but even so, I still can't help but think this might just make
things a bit easier to start.

With that in mind, does anyone have any thoughts on the Orvis Premium
Fly Tying Kit? I ask about this one because I'd seen a post back when
saying that it actually wasn't so bad...

Any thoughts on this, or suggestions for any other good kits, are
greatly appreciated.

Thanks, Tim

[Dave LaCourse]

Tim G. writes:

<snip>

>Any thoughts on this, or suggestions for any other good kits, are
>greatly appreciated.

You could possibly save yourself some money by seeing if you *enjoy* tying
flies. Many flyshops have lessons in the off-season (Nov-Mar), and many supply
the tools and necessary materials.

My advice would be to see if a local flyshop (or fly tying organization) offers
lessons and provides the tools and materials. Enroll, finish the course, and
*then* buy the necessary tools and materials. I have seen friends buy
expensive tools and lots of materials only to give it all away in a year or two
because they didn't enjoy tying.

Just my $0.02.
Dave
http://hometown.aol.com/davplac/myhomepage/index.html

[Dave LaCourse]

Tim G. writes:

<snip>

>Any thoughts on this, or suggestions for any other good kits, are
>greatly appreciated.

You could possibly save yourself some money by seeing if you *enjoy* tying
flies. Many flyshops have lessons in the off-season (Nov-Mar), and many supply
the tools and necessary materials.

My advice would be to see if a local flyshop (or fly tying organization) offers
lessons and provides the tools and materials. Enroll, finish the course, and
*then* buy the necessary tools and materials. I have seen friends buy
expensive tools and lots of materials only to give it all away in a year or two
because they didn't enjoy tying.

Just my $0.02.
Dave
http://hometown.aol.com/davplac/myhomepage/index.html

[Stephen Welsh]

(Dave LaCourse) wrote in
:

> My advice would be to see if a local flyshop (or fly tying
> organization) offers lessons and provides the tools and materials.
> Enroll, finish the course, and *then* buy the necessary tools and
> materials.

Dave speaks wisely, Tim.

After a course you'll hopefully also have a better idea what "good"
materials and tools look (and feel) like.

Steve

[Big Dale]

Dave gave some pretty good advice here. When you take the course ask the
teacher to explain how to choose the correct materials and how to avoid the
wrong ones. I found this the most difficult thing for most of us to learn in
the beginning. It is not too bad with the synthetics, but choosing the correct
natural materials is the most difficult for me to learn then and after a couple
of decades as well.

Big Dale

[Big Dale]

Dave gave some pretty good advice here. When you take the course ask the
teacher to explain how to choose the correct materials and how to avoid the
wrong ones. I found this the most difficult thing for most of us to learn in
the beginning. It is not too bad with the synthetics, but choosing the correct
natural materials is the most difficult for me to learn then and after a couple
of decades as well.

Big Dale

[Jeff Miller]

tim - i bought it two years ago. it's mediocre stuff, but probably a
good introduction to tying package. you won't be satisfied with the vise
and materials once you've progressed unless you stick to basic ties.
i've not continued tying. might start back one day... a smart fellow
would follow the recommendations given thus far, or find a friend who
ties. i've watched big dale and dave lacourse tie...i think watching and
learning from someone will prove a better experience than trying to
follow the orvis lesson book.

jeff

Tim G wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I'm a non-fly-tying fly fisherman - one of those - who finally thinks
> he needs to get into tying.
>
> I've combed your old posts, and read all your warnings against buying
> a fly-tying kit... yet, still, I can't help but think that a good kit
> might not be a bad way to go, simply for learning's sake. I
> understand that I'll certainly be buying new materials (and not using
> some that come with the kit), possibly buying some new tools later
> on... and that overall it might not be the most cost-effective way to
> go... but even so, I still can't help but think this might just make
> things a bit easier to start.
>
> With that in mind, does anyone have any thoughts on the Orvis Premium
> Fly Tying Kit? I ask about this one because I'd seen a post back when
> saying that it actually wasn't so bad...
>
> Any thoughts on this, or suggestions for any other good kits, are
> greatly appreciated.
>
> Thanks, Tim
>
>

[Jeff Miller]

tim - i bought it two years ago. it's mediocre stuff, but probably a
good introduction to tying package. you won't be satisfied with the vise
and materials once you've progressed unless you stick to basic ties.
i've not continued tying. might start back one day... a smart fellow
would follow the recommendations given thus far, or find a friend who
ties. i've watched big dale and dave lacourse tie...i think watching and
learning from someone will prove a better experience than trying to
follow the orvis lesson book.

jeff

Tim G wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I'm a non-fly-tying fly fisherman - one of those - who finally thinks
> he needs to get into tying.
>
> I've combed your old posts, and read all your warnings against buying
> a fly-tying kit... yet, still, I can't help but think that a good kit
> might not be a bad way to go, simply for learning's sake. I
> understand that I'll certainly be buying new materials (and not using
> some that come with the kit), possibly buying some new tools later
> on... and that overall it might not be the most cost-effective way to
> go... but even so, I still can't help but think this might just make
> things a bit easier to start.
>
> With that in mind, does anyone have any thoughts on the Orvis Premium
> Fly Tying Kit? I ask about this one because I'd seen a post back when
> saying that it actually wasn't so bad...
>
> Any thoughts on this, or suggestions for any other good kits, are
> greatly appreciated.
>
> Thanks, Tim
>
>

[Scott Seidman]

(Tim G) wrote in
om:

> Hi,
>
> I'm a non-fly-tying fly fisherman - one of those - who finally thinks
> he needs to get into tying.
>
> I've combed your old posts, and read all your warnings against buying
> a fly-tying kit... yet, still, I can't help but think that a good kit
> might not be a bad way to go, simply for learning's sake. I
> understand that I'll certainly be buying new materials (and not using
> some that come with the kit), possibly buying some new tools later
> on... and that overall it might not be the most cost-effective way to
> go... but even so, I still can't help but think this might just make
> things a bit easier to start.
>
> With that in mind, does anyone have any thoughts on the Orvis Premium
> Fly Tying Kit? I ask about this one because I'd seen a post back when
> saying that it actually wasn't so bad...
>
> Any thoughts on this, or suggestions for any other good kits, are
> greatly appreciated.
>
> Thanks, Tim
>
>

Even for learning's sake, I don't think a kit is a very good deal. The
kit won't make it easier to learn, and it won't save you money. A course
is a good idea, but often you need scissors, bobbin, thread, vice, before
you can take a course.

Nothing will get you into tying faster than catching fish on your own
ties. So, pick the fly you want to tie-- maybe something that doesn't
require you to buy a hackle neck, or if you do need hackles you might
consider one of the Whiting 100 packs-- get the stuff you need to tie it,
and tie it. If you don't like it, You can sell the vise, and you're
probably only invested for $20-$30 at the end.

Scott

[Scott Seidman]

(Tim G) wrote in
om:

> Hi,
>
> I'm a non-fly-tying fly fisherman - one of those - who finally thinks
> he needs to get into tying.
>
> I've combed your old posts, and read all your warnings against buying
> a fly-tying kit... yet, still, I can't help but think that a good kit
> might not be a bad way to go, simply for learning's sake. I
> understand that I'll certainly be buying new materials (and not using
> some that come with the kit), possibly buying some new tools later
> on... and that overall it might not be the most cost-effective way to
> go... but even so, I still can't help but think this might just make
> things a bit easier to start.
>
> With that in mind, does anyone have any thoughts on the Orvis Premium
> Fly Tying Kit? I ask about this one because I'd seen a post back when
> saying that it actually wasn't so bad...
>
> Any thoughts on this, or suggestions for any other good kits, are
> greatly appreciated.
>
> Thanks, Tim
>
>

Even for learning's sake, I don't think a kit is a very good deal. The
kit won't make it easier to learn, and it won't save you money. A course
is a good idea, but often you need scissors, bobbin, thread, vice, before
you can take a course.

Nothing will get you into tying faster than catching fish on your own
ties. So, pick the fly you want to tie-- maybe something that doesn't
require you to buy a hackle neck, or if you do need hackles you might
consider one of the Whiting 100 packs-- get the stuff you need to tie it,
and tie it. If you don't like it, You can sell the vise, and you're
probably only invested for $20-$30 at the end.

Scott

[DaveMohnsen]

"Tim G" > wrote in message
om...
> Hi,
>
> I'm a non-fly-tying fly fisherman - one of those - who finally thinks
> he needs to get into tying.
>
(snip)

> With that in mind, does anyone have any thoughts on the Orvis Premium
> Fly Tying Kit? I ask about this one because I'd seen a post back when
> saying that it actually wasn't so bad...
>
> Thanks, Tim
>
Hi Tim,
Good advice by all. The taking a class thing is important.
But, be smart about it. Ask for an outline of what is to be covered during
the class. I used to teach. 4 sessions advertised at 2 hours each, which
usually went 2 1/2-3 hours. I furnished everything. Would only take 6
people for a class. Spent a lot of time covering the selecting materials.
Did 12 flies in four sessions. ( the first fly was a woolly bugger . .
..only fly tied for the first session)

Surprisingly, I seemed to continually have a person or so come to a class,
who had previously had a fly tying class . . .uhh . . .and though, thinking
some level of competence, and trying to " help" me, didn't understand the
basics. Thus showing to me anyhow, the various levels of quality of
instruction that seems to happen. I've met some great guides, in my
opinion, that I wouldn't trust to teach any fly tying stuff.
(sooooo . . . . get the outline . . .the course should provide everything .
.. .don't trust the folks that want you to bring your own tools)

Ohh . . . and the Orvis Kit . . .$249.00 US. Are you kidding? The best
thing about the kit is Tom Rosenbauer's Tying Guide, which people here and
on ROFF have mentioned. ( heh . . .heh . . .I have never seen it . . .I
have met Tom a couple times . . . on other occasions . . .of which he will
never recall . . .but I got the impression, that if he focused on it, it
maybe a pretty good primer.)

Well Tim, where are you located? If in the US, email me.
I'd be willing to send a set of the "cheap" hardware to get you started.
( you would owe me "one" woolly bugger . . .heck, even I need something from
my investment)
BestWishes,
DaveMohnsen
Denver

[DaveMohnsen]

"Tim G" > wrote in message
om...
> Hi,
>
> I'm a non-fly-tying fly fisherman - one of those - who finally thinks
> he needs to get into tying.
>
(snip)

> With that in mind, does anyone have any thoughts on the Orvis Premium
> Fly Tying Kit? I ask about this one because I'd seen a post back when
> saying that it actually wasn't so bad...
>
> Thanks, Tim
>
Hi Tim,
Good advice by all. The taking a class thing is important.
But, be smart about it. Ask for an outline of what is to be covered during
the class. I used to teach. 4 sessions advertised at 2 hours each, which
usually went 2 1/2-3 hours. I furnished everything. Would only take 6
people for a class. Spent a lot of time covering the selecting materials.
Did 12 flies in four sessions. ( the first fly was a woolly bugger . .
..only fly tied for the first session)

Surprisingly, I seemed to continually have a person or so come to a class,
who had previously had a fly tying class . . .uhh . . .and though, thinking
some level of competence, and trying to " help" me, didn't understand the
basics. Thus showing to me anyhow, the various levels of quality of
instruction that seems to happen. I've met some great guides, in my
opinion, that I wouldn't trust to teach any fly tying stuff.
(sooooo . . . . get the outline . . .the course should provide everything .
.. .don't trust the folks that want you to bring your own tools)

Ohh . . . and the Orvis Kit . . .$249.00 US. Are you kidding? The best
thing about the kit is Tom Rosenbauer's Tying Guide, which people here and
on ROFF have mentioned. ( heh . . .heh . . .I have never seen it . . .I
have met Tom a couple times . . . on other occasions . . .of which he will
never recall . . .but I got the impression, that if he focused on it, it
maybe a pretty good primer.)

Well Tim, where are you located? If in the US, email me.
I'd be willing to send a set of the "cheap" hardware to get you started.
( you would owe me "one" woolly bugger . . .heck, even I need something from
my investment)
BestWishes,
DaveMohnsen
Denver

[Sierra fisher]

I've been tying for over 20 years and I have never seen a set that was worth
half of what it is selling for. As others have stated, get into a lesson,
buy the materials you need for the lesson. Pick out another fly. Buy the
materials you need for tha fly. Keep going......... You will end up with a
lot better value. you will also end up wtih the materials you need and use.

Even if you buy this kit, you will soon be at the fly shop to buy something
that isn't in the kit

--


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"Tim G" > wrote in message
om...
> Hi,
>
> I'm a non-fly-tying fly fisherman - one of those - who finally thinks
> he needs to get into tying.
>
> I've combed your old posts, and read all your warnings against buying
> a fly-tying kit... yet, still, I can't help but think that a good kit
> might not be a bad way to go, simply for learning's sake. I
> understand that I'll certainly be buying new materials (and not using
> some that come with the kit), possibly buying some new tools later
> on... and that overall it might not be the most cost-effective way to
> go... but even so, I still can't help but think this might just make
> things a bit easier to start.
>
> With that in mind, does anyone have any thoughts on the Orvis Premium
> Fly Tying Kit? I ask about this one because I'd seen a post back when
> saying that it actually wasn't so bad...
>
> Any thoughts on this, or suggestions for any other good kits, are
> greatly appreciated.
>
> Thanks, Tim
>
>

[Padishar Creel]

"Big Dale" > wrote in message
...
> Dave gave some pretty good advice here. When you take the course ask the
> teacher to explain how to choose the correct materials and how to avoid
the
> wrong ones. I found this the most difficult thing for most of us to learn
in
> the beginning. It is not too bad with the synthetics, but choosing the
correct
> natural materials is the most difficult for me to learn then and after a
couple
> of decades as well.
----------------
Lots of great advice given on this thread! My own .02 will seem minor, but
it has been a real benefit to me personally. IF and only IF you decide,
after following the previous advice, you do want to get into fly tying make
sure you have a permanent place to setup your fly tying stuff. The reason I
say this is that some of my fly fishin' associates have a 'portable' fly
tying station and slowly over time they just don't bother to haul it all out
to tie a few flies. I have a desk, lamp and all my tools within easy
access, so when I get a minute I can sit down and tie a few without a big
production thing.

FWIW Chris

[John]

Tim asked:

> Any thoughts on this, or suggestions for any other good kits, are
> greatly appreciated.

If you buy a kit off the shelf to start with, chances are the kit will
contain some material you won't use for a long while, maybe never. Skip the
Orvis kit. Also pass on Ebay antique kits or yard sale kits to start with.

Check out your local community college or University fly tying classes.
They probably will tie flies for your local area. They may offer basic,
intermediate and advanced classes. They may offer specific tying classes
such as for trout, bass, panfish, steelhead, salmon, etc. The instructor
may have collected kits for the class made available through the student
store. If you start this way, you'll only have the material you need to tie
specific class patterns, initially.

Later as you take additional fly tying courses at fishing clubs, fly shops,
trade shows, etc. you can add the materials and upgrade your tools to fit
your individual needs.

Good luck and welcome aboard!
John


Remove FLY to reply

[jeffc]

"Dave LaCourse" > wrote in message
...
> Tim G. writes:
>
> <snip>
>
> >Any thoughts on this, or suggestions for any other good kits, are
> >greatly appreciated.
>
> You could possibly save yourself some money by seeing if you *enjoy* tying
> flies.

Yeah, that's a good reason to start smaller than a full kit.

[jeffc]

"Dave LaCourse" > wrote in message
...
> Tim G. writes:
>
> <snip>
>
> >Any thoughts on this, or suggestions for any other good kits, are
> >greatly appreciated.
>
> You could possibly save yourself some money by seeing if you *enjoy* tying
> flies.

Yeah, that's a good reason to start smaller than a full kit.

[jeffc]

"Scott Seidman" > wrote in message
. 1.4...
>If you don't like it, You can sell the vise, and you're
> probably only invested for $20-$30 at the end.

Maybe even less if you bought the stuff used on eBay to begin with.

[jeffc]

"Scott Seidman" > wrote in message
. 1.4...
>If you don't like it, You can sell the vise, and you're
> probably only invested for $20-$30 at the end.

Maybe even less if you bought the stuff used on eBay to begin with.

[jeffc]

"Sierra fisher" > wrote in message
...
> I've been tying for over 20 years and I have never seen a set that was
worth
> half of what it is selling for.

I wouldn't go that far. That are tool sets, at least, that are very
worthwhile - in fact a slight discount if you happen to want those tools.

[jeffc]

"Sierra fisher" > wrote in message
...
> I've been tying for over 20 years and I have never seen a set that was
worth
> half of what it is selling for.

I wouldn't go that far. That are tool sets, at least, that are very
worthwhile - in fact a slight discount if you happen to want those tools.

[flytyer]

Tim,
Another option to the "kit" would be to identify the flies commonly used on
your home waters with success. Then purchase the materials to tie those
flies. The shop owner and other mentors can suggest the "easier to tie
flies", form that group, on which you can start. I heartily agree with the
recommendation of taking a beginner's class. Books are great- some better
than others- but they do not listen when you have a question, nor can they
place materials on the hook for you like an instructor can.
Best wishes for many years of tying and fishing those flies.--
G.S. "Stack" Scoville, Jr., Owner, FLYTYER FLIES
Specializing in Framed Atlantic Salmon
and Spey Flies for the Collector

"Tim G" > wrote in message
om...
> Hi,
>
> I'm a non-fly-tying fly fisherman - one of those - who finally thinks
> he needs to get into tying.

Snip>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

[flytyer]

Tim,
Another option to the "kit" would be to identify the flies commonly used on
your home waters with success. Then purchase the materials to tie those
flies. The shop owner and other mentors can suggest the "easier to tie
flies", form that group, on which you can start. I heartily agree with the
recommendation of taking a beginner's class. Books are great- some better
than others- but they do not listen when you have a question, nor can they
place materials on the hook for you like an instructor can.
Best wishes for many years of tying and fishing those flies.--
G.S. "Stack" Scoville, Jr., Owner, FLYTYER FLIES
Specializing in Framed Atlantic Salmon
and Spey Flies for the Collector

"Tim G" > wrote in message
om...
> Hi,
>
> I'm a non-fly-tying fly fisherman - one of those - who finally thinks
> he needs to get into tying.

Snip>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

[flytyer]

Tim,
Another option to the "kit" would be to identify the flies commonly used on
your home waters with success. Then purchase the materials to tie those
flies. The shop owner and other mentors can suggest the "easier to tie
flies", form that group, on which you can start. I heartily agree with the
recommendation of taking a beginner's class. Books are great- some better
than others- but they do not listen when you have a question, nor can they
place materials on the hook for you like an instructor can.
Best wishes for many years of tying and fishing those flies.--
G.S. "Stack" Scoville, Jr., Owner, FLYTYER FLIES
Specializing in Framed Atlantic Salmon
and Spey Flies for the Collector

"Tim G" > wrote in message
om...
> Hi,
>
> I'm a non-fly-tying fly fisherman - one of those - who finally thinks
> he needs to get into tying.

Snip>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

[riverman]

"Padishar Creel" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Big Dale" > wrote in message
> ...
>> Dave gave some pretty good advice here. When you take the course ask the
>> teacher to explain how to choose the correct materials and how to avoid
> the
>> wrong ones. I found this the most difficult thing for most of us to learn
> in
>> the beginning. It is not too bad with the synthetics, but choosing the
> correct
>> natural materials is the most difficult for me to learn then and after a
> couple
>> of decades as well.
> ----------------
> Lots of great advice given on this thread! My own .02 will seem minor,
> but
> it has been a real benefit to me personally. IF and only IF you decide,
> after following the previous advice, you do want to get into fly tying
> make
> sure you have a permanent place to setup your fly tying stuff. The reason
> I
> say this is that some of my fly fishin' associates have a 'portable' fly
> tying station and slowly over time they just don't bother to haul it all
> out
> to tie a few flies. I have a desk, lamp and all my tools within easy
> access, so when I get a minute I can sit down and tie a few without a big
> production thing.

Excellent and obvious observation, Chris! And strangely enough, it only
dawned on me last night! I was tying up a dozen flies, and my portable kit
has just reached critical mass where its not so simple to haul out all the
varieties of dubbing, hackle, hardware, etc. I was buried up to my ankles in
piles of stuff, and once I was done and put it all away again, my thought
was that I didn't want all that tidying up work do do afterwards again. I'm
setting up a permanent station tonight.

--riverman

[riverman]

"jeffc" > wrote in message
. com...
>
> "Scott Seidman" > wrote in message
> . 1.4...
>>If you don't like it, You can sell the vise, and you're
>> probably only invested for $20-$30 at the end.
>
> Maybe even less if you bought the stuff used on eBay to begin with.
>
>

And less even yet if you know of anyone who tried it, decided they didn't
like it, and is selling a whole kit with all the materials and hardware.

But then we're back at stage one!

I think, to modify Dave's initial advise, I'd say if you can get into a
complete kit (especially used) for a very reasonable price (under $30-40),
then go ahead and get it and see if you like it. Taking a class or finding
out if you really want to start tying is a nice idea, but if you can get
puttering around a bit on your own on the cheap, go for it.

The thing to avoid is to go buy the best of all materials, keep adding to it
until you have hundreds of dollars invested, and THEN decide that you really
don't like it!

--riverman