Palmering

[riverman]

When I tie Wooly Buggers, the hackle fibers inevitably end up either
vertical at best, or more commonly pointing forward. I've tried twisting
them as I wind them around to get them to lay back, and have tried tying
them on several different ways: with the stripped nub over the top of the
shaft, under it, parallel to it etc., and have experimented with how I
orient the curve of the hackle. I'm missing something, as I just cannot get
the palmered hackle to lay the right way; pointing backwards down the fly.
What's the trick?

--riverman

[Jarmo Hurri]

riverman> When I tie Wooly Buggers, the hackle fibers inevitably end
riverman> up either vertical at best, or more commonly pointing
riverman> forward. ... What's the trick?

Hi Myron!

The experts will give you the correct answer soon, but I've always
solved this problem by using reverse palmering:

http://www.frontrangeanglers.com/newsletter/aug04/reversehackle.htm

--
Jarmo Hurri

Commercial email countermeasures included in header email
address. Remove all garbage from header email address when replying,
or just use .

[Jarmo Hurri]

riverman> When I tie Wooly Buggers, the hackle fibers inevitably end
riverman> up either vertical at best, or more commonly pointing
riverman> forward. ... What's the trick?

Hi Myron!

The experts will give you the correct answer soon, but I've always
solved this problem by using reverse palmering:

http://www.frontrangeanglers.com/newsletter/aug04/reversehackle.htm

--
Jarmo Hurri

Commercial email countermeasures included in header email
address. Remove all garbage from header email address when replying,
or just use .

[Jarmo Hurri]

riverman> When I tie Wooly Buggers, the hackle fibers inevitably end
riverman> up either vertical at best, or more commonly pointing
riverman> forward. ... What's the trick?

Hi Myron!

The experts will give you the correct answer soon, but I've always
solved this problem by using reverse palmering:

http://www.frontrangeanglers.com/newsletter/aug04/reversehackle.htm

--
Jarmo Hurri

Commercial email countermeasures included in header email
address. Remove all garbage from header email address when replying,
or just use .

[riverman]

"Jarmo Hurri" > wrote in message
...
>
> riverman> When I tie Wooly Buggers, the hackle fibers inevitably end
> riverman> up either vertical at best, or more commonly pointing
> riverman> forward. ... What's the trick?
>
> Hi Myron!
>
> The experts will give you the correct answer soon, but I've always
> solved this problem by using reverse palmering:
>
> http://www.frontrangeanglers.com/newsletter/aug04/reversehackle.htm
>
> --
> Jarmo Hurri
>
Hey Jarmo;
Yep, thats what I was leading myself into also. I think thats how MC showed
me to do it in Denmark, also, but I haven't tied any wooly buggers in a
while and forgot! I can see three distinct advantages to it:
1) the hackle lies back the way it's supposed to
2) since the longer hairs are up near the head, the shape of the fly is more
like a bait fish
3) the windings over the top lock down the palmered hackle so that it won't
unwind if some fish bites it once too often.

Seeing as how its not a floating fly, the extra trips up the shaft of the
fly with the thread don't cause any negative effect on the weight, either.

I think I might just reverse palmer and not even care about why my straight
palmers don't curl right.

--riverman

[riverman]

"Jarmo Hurri" > wrote in message
...
>
> riverman> When I tie Wooly Buggers, the hackle fibers inevitably end
> riverman> up either vertical at best, or more commonly pointing
> riverman> forward. ... What's the trick?
>
> Hi Myron!
>
> The experts will give you the correct answer soon, but I've always
> solved this problem by using reverse palmering:
>
> http://www.frontrangeanglers.com/newsletter/aug04/reversehackle.htm
>
> --
> Jarmo Hurri
>
Hey Jarmo;
Yep, thats what I was leading myself into also. I think thats how MC showed
me to do it in Denmark, also, but I haven't tied any wooly buggers in a
while and forgot! I can see three distinct advantages to it:
1) the hackle lies back the way it's supposed to
2) since the longer hairs are up near the head, the shape of the fly is more
like a bait fish
3) the windings over the top lock down the palmered hackle so that it won't
unwind if some fish bites it once too often.

Seeing as how its not a floating fly, the extra trips up the shaft of the
fly with the thread don't cause any negative effect on the weight, either.

I think I might just reverse palmer and not even care about why my straight
palmers don't curl right.

--riverman

[Charlie Choc]

On Sun, 17 Oct 2004 13:05:05 +0100, "riverman" > wrote:

>Hey Jarmo;
>Yep, thats what I was leading myself into also. I think thats how MC showed
>me to do it in Denmark, also, but I haven't tied any wooly buggers in a
>while and forgot! I can see three distinct advantages to it:
>1) the hackle lies back the way it's supposed to
>2) since the longer hairs are up near the head, the shape of the fly is more
>like a bait fish
>3) the windings over the top lock down the palmered hackle so that it won't
>unwind if some fish bites it once too often.
>
>Seeing as how its not a floating fly, the extra trips up the shaft of the
>fly with the thread don't cause any negative effect on the weight, either.
>
>I think I might just reverse palmer and not even care about why my straight
>palmers don't curl right.
>
I palmer my wooly buggers that way for durability. As to 2), if you don't
reverse palmer just tie the tip of the hackle in at the hook bend instead of
the butt.
--
Charlie...

[Charlie Choc]

On Sun, 17 Oct 2004 13:05:05 +0100, "riverman" > wrote:

>Hey Jarmo;
>Yep, thats what I was leading myself into also. I think thats how MC showed
>me to do it in Denmark, also, but I haven't tied any wooly buggers in a
>while and forgot! I can see three distinct advantages to it:
>1) the hackle lies back the way it's supposed to
>2) since the longer hairs are up near the head, the shape of the fly is more
>like a bait fish
>3) the windings over the top lock down the palmered hackle so that it won't
>unwind if some fish bites it once too often.
>
>Seeing as how its not a floating fly, the extra trips up the shaft of the
>fly with the thread don't cause any negative effect on the weight, either.
>
>I think I might just reverse palmer and not even care about why my straight
>palmers don't curl right.
>
I palmer my wooly buggers that way for durability. As to 2), if you don't
reverse palmer just tie the tip of the hackle in at the hook bend instead of
the butt.
--
Charlie...

[riverman]

"Charlie Choc" > wrote in message
...
> On Sun, 17 Oct 2004 13:05:05 +0100, "riverman" > wrote:
>
>>Hey Jarmo;
>>Yep, thats what I was leading myself into also. I think thats how MC
>>showed
>>me to do it in Denmark, also, but I haven't tied any wooly buggers in a
>>while and forgot! I can see three distinct advantages to it:
>>1) the hackle lies back the way it's supposed to
>>2) since the longer hairs are up near the head, the shape of the fly is
>>more
>>like a bait fish
>>3) the windings over the top lock down the palmered hackle so that it
>>won't
>>unwind if some fish bites it once too often.
>>
>>Seeing as how its not a floating fly, the extra trips up the shaft of the
>>fly with the thread don't cause any negative effect on the weight, either.
>>
>>I think I might just reverse palmer and not even care about why my
>>straight
>>palmers don't curl right.
>>
> I palmer my wooly buggers that way for durability. As to 2), if you don't
> reverse palmer just tie the tip of the hackle in at the hook bend instead
> of
> the butt.

Yes, thats the correct method, but I keep breaking them that way. I hate
that...gotta get a lighter touch.

On another track...I just tied up my first #12 Red Humpy. Didn't have any
antron for the body, so I sliced up some red marabou and dubbed with
it....that part came out pretty nice. However, getting the 'wings' to sit up
in a nice tight little package was very hard, as they seem to want to spin
out into a fuzzball. And judging the length of deerhair to tie on so that it
makes the wing cases and wings the right length is nutso. My first humpy
looks more like a big grey burdock with a hangover.

--riverman

[riverman]

"Charlie Choc" > wrote in message
...
> On Sun, 17 Oct 2004 13:05:05 +0100, "riverman" > wrote:
>
>>Hey Jarmo;
>>Yep, thats what I was leading myself into also. I think thats how MC
>>showed
>>me to do it in Denmark, also, but I haven't tied any wooly buggers in a
>>while and forgot! I can see three distinct advantages to it:
>>1) the hackle lies back the way it's supposed to
>>2) since the longer hairs are up near the head, the shape of the fly is
>>more
>>like a bait fish
>>3) the windings over the top lock down the palmered hackle so that it
>>won't
>>unwind if some fish bites it once too often.
>>
>>Seeing as how its not a floating fly, the extra trips up the shaft of the
>>fly with the thread don't cause any negative effect on the weight, either.
>>
>>I think I might just reverse palmer and not even care about why my
>>straight
>>palmers don't curl right.
>>
> I palmer my wooly buggers that way for durability. As to 2), if you don't
> reverse palmer just tie the tip of the hackle in at the hook bend instead
> of
> the butt.

Yes, thats the correct method, but I keep breaking them that way. I hate
that...gotta get a lighter touch.

On another track...I just tied up my first #12 Red Humpy. Didn't have any
antron for the body, so I sliced up some red marabou and dubbed with
it....that part came out pretty nice. However, getting the 'wings' to sit up
in a nice tight little package was very hard, as they seem to want to spin
out into a fuzzball. And judging the length of deerhair to tie on so that it
makes the wing cases and wings the right length is nutso. My first humpy
looks more like a big grey burdock with a hangover.

--riverman

[riverman]

"Charlie Choc" > wrote in message
...
> On Sun, 17 Oct 2004 13:05:05 +0100, "riverman" > wrote:
>
>>Hey Jarmo;
>>Yep, thats what I was leading myself into also. I think thats how MC
>>showed
>>me to do it in Denmark, also, but I haven't tied any wooly buggers in a
>>while and forgot! I can see three distinct advantages to it:
>>1) the hackle lies back the way it's supposed to
>>2) since the longer hairs are up near the head, the shape of the fly is
>>more
>>like a bait fish
>>3) the windings over the top lock down the palmered hackle so that it
>>won't
>>unwind if some fish bites it once too often.
>>
>>Seeing as how its not a floating fly, the extra trips up the shaft of the
>>fly with the thread don't cause any negative effect on the weight, either.
>>
>>I think I might just reverse palmer and not even care about why my
>>straight
>>palmers don't curl right.
>>
> I palmer my wooly buggers that way for durability. As to 2), if you don't
> reverse palmer just tie the tip of the hackle in at the hook bend instead
> of
> the butt.

Yes, thats the correct method, but I keep breaking them that way. I hate
that...gotta get a lighter touch.

On another track...I just tied up my first #12 Red Humpy. Didn't have any
antron for the body, so I sliced up some red marabou and dubbed with
it....that part came out pretty nice. However, getting the 'wings' to sit up
in a nice tight little package was very hard, as they seem to want to spin
out into a fuzzball. And judging the length of deerhair to tie on so that it
makes the wing cases and wings the right length is nutso. My first humpy
looks more like a big grey burdock with a hangover.

--riverman

[Herman Nijland]

riverman wrote:
>
> Yes, thats the correct method, but I keep breaking them that way. I hate
> that...gotta get a lighter touch.
>
> On another track...I just tied up my first #12 Red Humpy. Didn't have any
> antron for the body, so I sliced up some red marabou and dubbed with
> it....that part came out pretty nice. However, getting the 'wings' to sit up
> in a nice tight little package was very hard, as they seem to want to spin
> out into a fuzzball. And judging the length of deerhair to tie on so that it
> makes the wing cases and wings the right length is nutso. My first humpy
> looks more like a big grey burdock with a hangover.
>
> --riverman
>
>

That's not bad at all for a first humpy. The humpy is a notorious
difficult fly to tie right, the choice and amount of the materials is
quite critical. I tied a couple in a tying class once, and decided I
didn't really need them :-).

--
Herman

[Herman Nijland]

riverman wrote:
>
> Yes, thats the correct method, but I keep breaking them that way. I hate
> that...gotta get a lighter touch.
>
> On another track...I just tied up my first #12 Red Humpy. Didn't have any
> antron for the body, so I sliced up some red marabou and dubbed with
> it....that part came out pretty nice. However, getting the 'wings' to sit up
> in a nice tight little package was very hard, as they seem to want to spin
> out into a fuzzball. And judging the length of deerhair to tie on so that it
> makes the wing cases and wings the right length is nutso. My first humpy
> looks more like a big grey burdock with a hangover.
>
> --riverman
>
>

That's not bad at all for a first humpy. The humpy is a notorious
difficult fly to tie right, the choice and amount of the materials is
quite critical. I tied a couple in a tying class once, and decided I
didn't really need them :-).

--
Herman

[Mike Connor]

"Jarmo Hurri" > wrote in message
...
>
> riverman> When I tie Wooly Buggers, the hackle fibers inevitably end
> riverman> up either vertical at best, or more commonly pointing
> riverman> forward. ... What's the trick?
>
> Hi Myron!
>
> The experts will give you the correct answer soon, but I've always
> solved this problem by using reverse palmering:
>
> http://www.frontrangeanglers.com/newsletter/aug04/reversehackle.htm
>
> --
> Jarmo Hurri
>
> Commercial email countermeasures included in header email
> address. Remove all garbage from header email address when replying,
> or just use .

That is indeed the best way to do it. Easier application, better appearance,
and greater durability. There is no real point in using any other method,
although traditionally salmon flies are palmered somewhat differently, in
order to obtain a special appearance.

TL
MC

[Mike Connor]

"Jarmo Hurri" > wrote in message
...
>
> riverman> When I tie Wooly Buggers, the hackle fibers inevitably end
> riverman> up either vertical at best, or more commonly pointing
> riverman> forward. ... What's the trick?
>
> Hi Myron!
>
> The experts will give you the correct answer soon, but I've always
> solved this problem by using reverse palmering:
>
> http://www.frontrangeanglers.com/newsletter/aug04/reversehackle.htm
>
> --
> Jarmo Hurri
>
> Commercial email countermeasures included in header email
> address. Remove all garbage from header email address when replying,
> or just use .

That is indeed the best way to do it. Easier application, better appearance,
and greater durability. There is no real point in using any other method,
although traditionally salmon flies are palmered somewhat differently, in
order to obtain a special appearance.

TL
MC

[Mike Connor]

"Jarmo Hurri" > wrote in message
...
>
> riverman> When I tie Wooly Buggers, the hackle fibers inevitably end
> riverman> up either vertical at best, or more commonly pointing
> riverman> forward. ... What's the trick?
>
> Hi Myron!
>
> The experts will give you the correct answer soon, but I've always
> solved this problem by using reverse palmering:
>
> http://www.frontrangeanglers.com/newsletter/aug04/reversehackle.htm
>
> --
> Jarmo Hurri
>
> Commercial email countermeasures included in header email
> address. Remove all garbage from header email address when replying,
> or just use .

That is indeed the best way to do it. Easier application, better appearance,
and greater durability. There is no real point in using any other method,
although traditionally salmon flies are palmered somewhat differently, in
order to obtain a special appearance.

TL
MC

[Stephen Welsh]

"riverman" > wrote in :

> What's the trick?
>

Fold the hackle and sweep the hackle backwards as you wrap forward.

http://www.flyanglersonline.com/flytying/atlantic/spey-dee/lesson3.html

has _one_ of the methods for folding hackle.


Steve

[Stephen Welsh]

"riverman" > wrote in :

> What's the trick?
>

Fold the hackle and sweep the hackle backwards as you wrap forward.

http://www.flyanglersonline.com/flytying/atlantic/spey-dee/lesson3.html

has _one_ of the methods for folding hackle.


Steve

[Stephen Welsh]

"riverman" > wrote in :

> What's the trick?
>

Fold the hackle and sweep the hackle backwards as you wrap forward.

http://www.flyanglersonline.com/flytying/atlantic/spey-dee/lesson3.html

has _one_ of the methods for folding hackle.


Steve

[Peter Charles]

On Sun, 17 Oct 2004 11:33:43 +0100, "riverman" >
wrote:

>When I tie Wooly Buggers, the hackle fibers inevitably end up either
>vertical at best, or more commonly pointing forward. I've tried twisting
>them as I wind them around to get them to lay back, and have tried tying
>them on several different ways: with the stripped nub over the top of the
>shaft, under it, parallel to it etc., and have experimented with how I
>orient the curve of the hackle. I'm missing something, as I just cannot get
>the palmered hackle to lay the right way; pointing backwards down the fly.
>What's the trick?
>
>--riverman
>

Who says that pointing forward is wrong?

Think about the action . . . .

Peter

turn mailhot into hotmail to reply

Visit The Streamer Page at http://www.mountaincable.net/~pcharles/streamers/index.html

[Peter Charles]

On Sun, 17 Oct 2004 11:33:43 +0100, "riverman" >
wrote:

>When I tie Wooly Buggers, the hackle fibers inevitably end up either
>vertical at best, or more commonly pointing forward. I've tried twisting
>them as I wind them around to get them to lay back, and have tried tying
>them on several different ways: with the stripped nub over the top of the
>shaft, under it, parallel to it etc., and have experimented with how I
>orient the curve of the hackle. I'm missing something, as I just cannot get
>the palmered hackle to lay the right way; pointing backwards down the fly.
>What's the trick?
>
>--riverman
>

Who says that pointing forward is wrong?

Think about the action . . . .

Peter

turn mailhot into hotmail to reply

Visit The Streamer Page at http://www.mountaincable.net/~pcharles/streamers/index.html

[Ed Gildone \(cox\)]

"Peter Charles" > wrote in message
> Who says that pointing forward is wrong?
>
> Think about the action . . . .
>
> Peter
Yes, I believe the trout is the final judge...

Ed
--


>
> turn mailhot into hotmail to reply
>
> Visit The Streamer Page at
http://www.mountaincable.net/~pcharles/streamers/index.html

[Ed Gildone \(cox\)]

"Peter Charles" > wrote in message
> Who says that pointing forward is wrong?
>
> Think about the action . . . .
>
> Peter
Yes, I believe the trout is the final judge...

Ed
--


>
> turn mailhot into hotmail to reply
>
> Visit The Streamer Page at
http://www.mountaincable.net/~pcharles/streamers/index.html

[Conan the Librarian]

riverman wrote:

> Yes, thats the correct method, but I keep breaking them that way. I hate
> that...gotta get a lighter touch.

FWIW, I tie the hackle in by the tip as well. I tie it slightly
forward of the tail and take a wrap or two of the chenille behind it
before wrappping the chenille forward.

Another thing you could try would be to strip the hackles off one
side of the feather and tie it in that way. It makes for a less-dense
hackle and it's much easier to control that way, IMHO.

> On another track...I just tied up my first #12 Red Humpy. Didn't have any
> antron for the body, so I sliced up some red marabou and dubbed with
> it....that part came out pretty nice. However, getting the 'wings' to sit up
> in a nice tight little package was very hard, as they seem to want to spin
> out into a fuzzball. And judging the length of deerhair to tie on so that it
> makes the wing cases and wings the right length is nutso. My first humpy
> looks more like a big grey burdock with a hangover.

Humpies are a true PIA to tie. But, Harry Mason has the tips you
need to know for getting the tail/shellback/wing proportions right:
http://www.troutflies.com/tutorials/humpy/


Chuck Vance (whose humpies look like hairy Quasimodos)

[Conan the Librarian]

riverman wrote:

> Yes, thats the correct method, but I keep breaking them that way. I hate
> that...gotta get a lighter touch.

FWIW, I tie the hackle in by the tip as well. I tie it slightly
forward of the tail and take a wrap or two of the chenille behind it
before wrappping the chenille forward.

Another thing you could try would be to strip the hackles off one
side of the feather and tie it in that way. It makes for a less-dense
hackle and it's much easier to control that way, IMHO.

> On another track...I just tied up my first #12 Red Humpy. Didn't have any
> antron for the body, so I sliced up some red marabou and dubbed with
> it....that part came out pretty nice. However, getting the 'wings' to sit up
> in a nice tight little package was very hard, as they seem to want to spin
> out into a fuzzball. And judging the length of deerhair to tie on so that it
> makes the wing cases and wings the right length is nutso. My first humpy
> looks more like a big grey burdock with a hangover.

Humpies are a true PIA to tie. But, Harry Mason has the tips you
need to know for getting the tail/shellback/wing proportions right:
http://www.troutflies.com/tutorials/humpy/


Chuck Vance (whose humpies look like hairy Quasimodos)

[riverman]

"Conan the Librarian" > wrote in message
...>
> Humpies are a true PIA to tie. But, Harry Mason has the tips you need
> to know for getting the tail/shellback/wing proportions right:
> http://www.troutflies.com/tutorials/humpy/

Nice site, thanks. But his aren't doing what mine do: even when I tie on the
tail, the fibers flare up and 'spin' with the slightest tightening of the
thread. If I were to tie it so that the tail stayed together like his do,
they would fall off of the fly!

I'm going to practice some more, and if I can't get it, I'm gonna start
tying streaking caddises!

--riverman

[riverman]

"Conan the Librarian" > wrote in message
...>
> Humpies are a true PIA to tie. But, Harry Mason has the tips you need
> to know for getting the tail/shellback/wing proportions right:
> http://www.troutflies.com/tutorials/humpy/

Nice site, thanks. But his aren't doing what mine do: even when I tie on the
tail, the fibers flare up and 'spin' with the slightest tightening of the
thread. If I were to tie it so that the tail stayed together like his do,
they would fall off of the fly!

I'm going to practice some more, and if I can't get it, I'm gonna start
tying streaking caddises!

--riverman

[Mike Connor]

"riverman" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Conan the Librarian" > wrote in message
> ...>
> > Humpies are a true PIA to tie. But, Harry Mason has the tips you
need
> > to know for getting the tail/shellback/wing proportions right:
> > http://www.troutflies.com/tutorials/humpy/
>
> Nice site, thanks. But his aren't doing what mine do: even when I tie on
the
> tail, the fibers flare up and 'spin' with the slightest tightening of the
> thread. If I were to tie it so that the tail stayed together like his do,
> they would fall off of the fly!
>
> I'm going to practice some more, and if I can't get it, I'm gonna start
> tying streaking caddises!
>
> --riverman
>

You need the right hair for such flies. The (non-flaring, because
non-compressing) tips are used for the tail.

QUOTE

5. Selecting hair is a matter of deciding what you are going to do with the
hair. You have two basic operations with deer or elk hair -- wings or tails
and spinning. The best hair for wings and tails on flies like humpies,
Wulffs, compara duns, etc is located (a strip about a foot wide) on the
animal along the back bone, down over the shoulder, and down over the rump.
The best hair for flaring or spinning is located on the rib and belly of the
animal. Seldom to we get the opportunity to select hair from a complete
hide. Usually we are searching through a group of 3"x5" plastic bags in a
fly shop hoping we will get usable hair and later finding the hair does not
fill our needs. Here's what you look for when selecting hair that is already
packaged. The hair fibers located near the back bone of the animal has a
dark gray band in the middle of each -- the hair fiber is colored starting
with a dark point on the tip followed by a tan (deer) or cream (elk) section
directly below the dark tip. From there the hair fiber enters a dark gray
area which eventually fades to a light gray area where the hair fiber joins
the animal's hide. For wings and tail you need hair the is at least 50% dark
grey in the middle of the hair. On the other hand if you are spinning hair
you want hair fibers whose middle section is mostly light grey in color.
REMEMBER -- dark gray hair, wings & tails --- light gray hair, spinning or
flaring. Back to the index.

UNQUOTE

Courtesy of http://www.btsflyfishing.com/Tips_Tricks/TT.htm

There is a lot more info on the web on selecting hair etc, a google search
will turn up a lot of stuff. It is more or less impossible to tie such
flies correctly with the wrong materials, as they simply will not function
properly.

TL
MC

[Mike Connor]

"riverman" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Conan the Librarian" > wrote in message
> ...>
> > Humpies are a true PIA to tie. But, Harry Mason has the tips you
need
> > to know for getting the tail/shellback/wing proportions right:
> > http://www.troutflies.com/tutorials/humpy/
>
> Nice site, thanks. But his aren't doing what mine do: even when I tie on
the
> tail, the fibers flare up and 'spin' with the slightest tightening of the
> thread. If I were to tie it so that the tail stayed together like his do,
> they would fall off of the fly!
>
> I'm going to practice some more, and if I can't get it, I'm gonna start
> tying streaking caddises!
>
> --riverman
>

You need the right hair for such flies. The (non-flaring, because
non-compressing) tips are used for the tail.

QUOTE

5. Selecting hair is a matter of deciding what you are going to do with the
hair. You have two basic operations with deer or elk hair -- wings or tails
and spinning. The best hair for wings and tails on flies like humpies,
Wulffs, compara duns, etc is located (a strip about a foot wide) on the
animal along the back bone, down over the shoulder, and down over the rump.
The best hair for flaring or spinning is located on the rib and belly of the
animal. Seldom to we get the opportunity to select hair from a complete
hide. Usually we are searching through a group of 3"x5" plastic bags in a
fly shop hoping we will get usable hair and later finding the hair does not
fill our needs. Here's what you look for when selecting hair that is already
packaged. The hair fibers located near the back bone of the animal has a
dark gray band in the middle of each -- the hair fiber is colored starting
with a dark point on the tip followed by a tan (deer) or cream (elk) section
directly below the dark tip. From there the hair fiber enters a dark gray
area which eventually fades to a light gray area where the hair fiber joins
the animal's hide. For wings and tail you need hair the is at least 50% dark
grey in the middle of the hair. On the other hand if you are spinning hair
you want hair fibers whose middle section is mostly light grey in color.
REMEMBER -- dark gray hair, wings & tails --- light gray hair, spinning or
flaring. Back to the index.

UNQUOTE

Courtesy of http://www.btsflyfishing.com/Tips_Tricks/TT.htm

There is a lot more info on the web on selecting hair etc, a google search
will turn up a lot of stuff. It is more or less impossible to tie such
flies correctly with the wrong materials, as they simply will not function
properly.

TL
MC

[Scott Seidman]

"riverman" > wrote in
:

> Nice site, thanks. But his aren't doing what mine do: even when I tie
> on the tail, the fibers flare up and 'spin' with the slightest
> tightening of the thread. If I were to tie it so that the tail stayed
> together like his do, they would fall off of the fly!
>

Try starting w/ looser wraps at the back of the tail, and tightening up as
you move toward the head when you tie down the tail. There are some cases
where "tight as you can get without breaking the thread" is the wrong way
to go.

Scott

[Scott Seidman]

"riverman" > wrote in
:

> Nice site, thanks. But his aren't doing what mine do: even when I tie
> on the tail, the fibers flare up and 'spin' with the slightest
> tightening of the thread. If I were to tie it so that the tail stayed
> together like his do, they would fall off of the fly!
>

Try starting w/ looser wraps at the back of the tail, and tightening up as
you move toward the head when you tie down the tail. There are some cases
where "tight as you can get without breaking the thread" is the wrong way
to go.

Scott

[Scott Seidman]

"riverman" > wrote in
:

> Nice site, thanks. But his aren't doing what mine do: even when I tie
> on the tail, the fibers flare up and 'spin' with the slightest
> tightening of the thread. If I were to tie it so that the tail stayed
> together like his do, they would fall off of the fly!
>

Try starting w/ looser wraps at the back of the tail, and tightening up as
you move toward the head when you tie down the tail. There are some cases
where "tight as you can get without breaking the thread" is the wrong way
to go.

Scott

[riverman]

"Mike Connor" > wrote in message
...

> You need the right hair for such flies. The (non-flaring, because
> non-compressing) tips are used for the tail.
>
> QUOTE
>
> 5. Selecting hair is a matter of deciding what you are going to do with
> the
> hair. You have two basic operations with deer or elk hair -- wings or
> tails
> and spinning. The best hair for wings and tails on flies like humpies,
> Wulffs, compara duns, etc is located (a strip about a foot wide) on the
> animal along the back bone, down over the shoulder, and down over the
> rump.
> The best hair for flaring or spinning is located on the rib and belly of
> the
> animal. Seldom to we get the opportunity to select hair from a complete
> hide. Usually we are searching through a group of 3"x5" plastic bags in a
> fly shop hoping we will get usable hair and later finding the hair does
> not
> fill our needs. Here's what you look for when selecting hair that is
> already
> packaged. The hair fibers located near the back bone of the animal has a
> dark gray band in the middle of each -- the hair fiber is colored starting
> with a dark point on the tip followed by a tan (deer) or cream (elk)
> section
> directly below the dark tip. From there the hair fiber enters a dark gray
> area which eventually fades to a light gray area where the hair fiber
> joins
> the animal's hide. For wings and tail you need hair the is at least 50%
> dark
> grey in the middle of the hair. On the other hand if you are spinning hair
> you want hair fibers whose middle section is mostly light grey in color.
> REMEMBER -- dark gray hair, wings & tails --- light gray hair, spinning or
> flaring. Back to the index.
>
> UNQUOTE
>
> Courtesy of http://www.btsflyfishing.com/Tips_Tricks/TT.htm
>
>

Thanks for that link and the quote: its come up here several times in the
past few years and I remembered it was out there, but forgot where.
Actually, I'm not using deer hair, so I have to be more educated in my
methods: I'm using some African critter that has hollow fiber hair like a
deer, but its a bit harder to work with. However, it sure flares easily, so
I think I really WILL stop trying to make humpies and instead just learn to
spin this. It might be rather special for that.

--riverman

[riverman]

"Mike Connor" > wrote in message
...

> You need the right hair for such flies. The (non-flaring, because
> non-compressing) tips are used for the tail.
>
> QUOTE
>
> 5. Selecting hair is a matter of deciding what you are going to do with
> the
> hair. You have two basic operations with deer or elk hair -- wings or
> tails
> and spinning. The best hair for wings and tails on flies like humpies,
> Wulffs, compara duns, etc is located (a strip about a foot wide) on the
> animal along the back bone, down over the shoulder, and down over the
> rump.
> The best hair for flaring or spinning is located on the rib and belly of
> the
> animal. Seldom to we get the opportunity to select hair from a complete
> hide. Usually we are searching through a group of 3"x5" plastic bags in a
> fly shop hoping we will get usable hair and later finding the hair does
> not
> fill our needs. Here's what you look for when selecting hair that is
> already
> packaged. The hair fibers located near the back bone of the animal has a
> dark gray band in the middle of each -- the hair fiber is colored starting
> with a dark point on the tip followed by a tan (deer) or cream (elk)
> section
> directly below the dark tip. From there the hair fiber enters a dark gray
> area which eventually fades to a light gray area where the hair fiber
> joins
> the animal's hide. For wings and tail you need hair the is at least 50%
> dark
> grey in the middle of the hair. On the other hand if you are spinning hair
> you want hair fibers whose middle section is mostly light grey in color.
> REMEMBER -- dark gray hair, wings & tails --- light gray hair, spinning or
> flaring. Back to the index.
>
> UNQUOTE
>
> Courtesy of http://www.btsflyfishing.com/Tips_Tricks/TT.htm
>
>

Thanks for that link and the quote: its come up here several times in the
past few years and I remembered it was out there, but forgot where.
Actually, I'm not using deer hair, so I have to be more educated in my
methods: I'm using some African critter that has hollow fiber hair like a
deer, but its a bit harder to work with. However, it sure flares easily, so
I think I really WILL stop trying to make humpies and instead just learn to
spin this. It might be rather special for that.

--riverman

[Scott Seidman]

Scott Seidman > wrote in
. 1.4:

> "riverman" > wrote in
> :
>
>> Nice site, thanks. But his aren't doing what mine do: even when I tie
>> on the tail, the fibers flare up and 'spin' with the slightest
>> tightening of the thread. If I were to tie it so that the tail stayed
>> together like his do, they would fall off of the fly!
>>
>
> Try starting w/ looser wraps at the back of the tail, and tightening
> up as you move toward the head when you tie down the tail. There are
> some cases where "tight as you can get without breaking the thread" is
> the wrong way to go.
>
> Scott

Or rather, tight wraps as you start, getting looser as you come to the
rear. Also, sometimes it helps to go an extra wrap or two, then back off
to reduce flare.

Sorry for the confusion-- I've been tying Irresistables lately, where you
tie the tail from back to front, so you end up on blank hook.

Mike's suggestion about using the right hair type for the right task is
dead on, as well

Scott

[Scott Seidman]

Scott Seidman > wrote in
. 1.4:

> "riverman" > wrote in
> :
>
>> Nice site, thanks. But his aren't doing what mine do: even when I tie
>> on the tail, the fibers flare up and 'spin' with the slightest
>> tightening of the thread. If I were to tie it so that the tail stayed
>> together like his do, they would fall off of the fly!
>>
>
> Try starting w/ looser wraps at the back of the tail, and tightening
> up as you move toward the head when you tie down the tail. There are
> some cases where "tight as you can get without breaking the thread" is
> the wrong way to go.
>
> Scott

Or rather, tight wraps as you start, getting looser as you come to the
rear. Also, sometimes it helps to go an extra wrap or two, then back off
to reduce flare.

Sorry for the confusion-- I've been tying Irresistables lately, where you
tie the tail from back to front, so you end up on blank hook.

Mike's suggestion about using the right hair type for the right task is
dead on, as well

Scott

[Conan the Librarian]

riverman wrote:

> "Conan the Librarian" > wrote in message
> ...>
>
>> Humpies are a true PIA to tie. But, Harry Mason has the tips you need
>>to know for getting the tail/shellback/wing proportions right:
>>http://www.troutflies.com/tutorials/humpy/
>
> Nice site, thanks. But his aren't doing what mine do: even when I tie on the
> tail, the fibers flare up and 'spin' with the slightest tightening of the
> thread. If I were to tie it so that the tail stayed together like his do,
> they would fall off of the fly!

I think I see the problem. It may seem counter-intuitive, but in
order to keep from flaring deer hair too much, you want *light* pressure
right at the tail, tightening up as you go up the shank of the hook. If
you crank down tightly right at the bend, you will only cause the hair
to flare more.

And I hold the tail fibers in place until I'm finished wrapping up
and back. If you let them go, you'll be sorry.

Of course, for spinning deer hair, you want to do just the opposite.



Chuck Vance

[Conan the Librarian]

riverman wrote:

> "Conan the Librarian" > wrote in message
> ...>
>
>> Humpies are a true PIA to tie. But, Harry Mason has the tips you need
>>to know for getting the tail/shellback/wing proportions right:
>>http://www.troutflies.com/tutorials/humpy/
>
> Nice site, thanks. But his aren't doing what mine do: even when I tie on the
> tail, the fibers flare up and 'spin' with the slightest tightening of the
> thread. If I were to tie it so that the tail stayed together like his do,
> they would fall off of the fly!

I think I see the problem. It may seem counter-intuitive, but in
order to keep from flaring deer hair too much, you want *light* pressure
right at the tail, tightening up as you go up the shank of the hook. If
you crank down tightly right at the bend, you will only cause the hair
to flare more.

And I hold the tail fibers in place until I'm finished wrapping up
and back. If you let them go, you'll be sorry.

Of course, for spinning deer hair, you want to do just the opposite.



Chuck Vance

[Mike Connor]

"riverman" > wrote in message
...
>
> Thanks for that link and the quote: its come up here several times in the
> past few years and I remembered it was out there, but forgot where.
> Actually, I'm not using deer hair, so I have to be more educated in my
> methods: I'm using some African critter that has hollow fiber hair like a
> deer, but its a bit harder to work with. However, it sure flares easily,
so
> I think I really WILL stop trying to make humpies and instead just learn
to
> spin this. It might be rather special for that.
>
> --riverman
>
>

It is relatively easy to test the properties of various hair etc. Simply
bind some on a bare hook, and see what happens. Hair which flares, does so
because it is compressible, this often means that it is also buoyant.

If you want to tie "humpies" with such stuff, then use a hackle bunch or
similar for the tail ( or some other hair, antelope, calf, zebra, etc etc),
and then tie in a bunch of your flaring hair at the bend with the tips
pointing forwards. Wrap the body, tying down the tips, and then bring the
hair over, and tie it down. Apply your wings and hackles as usual, and that
was it. Looks and works perfectly well, but overcomes several problems;
sizing the hair, and getting the right type.

If you want to flare( spin) hair, then do it on a blank hook. Only tie down
after applying each bunch. Push each bunch back tightly to pack it ( finger
and thumbnail works for me), take a turn ( or a half hitch) to secure, ( a
drop of varnish after each clump makes such flies nearly bombproof)and apply
the next bunch. Do not try to trim any hair, until the last bunch has been
applied.

TL
MC

[Mike Connor]

"riverman" > wrote in message
...
>
> Thanks for that link and the quote: its come up here several times in the
> past few years and I remembered it was out there, but forgot where.
> Actually, I'm not using deer hair, so I have to be more educated in my
> methods: I'm using some African critter that has hollow fiber hair like a
> deer, but its a bit harder to work with. However, it sure flares easily,
so
> I think I really WILL stop trying to make humpies and instead just learn
to
> spin this. It might be rather special for that.
>
> --riverman
>
>

It is relatively easy to test the properties of various hair etc. Simply
bind some on a bare hook, and see what happens. Hair which flares, does so
because it is compressible, this often means that it is also buoyant.

If you want to tie "humpies" with such stuff, then use a hackle bunch or
similar for the tail ( or some other hair, antelope, calf, zebra, etc etc),
and then tie in a bunch of your flaring hair at the bend with the tips
pointing forwards. Wrap the body, tying down the tips, and then bring the
hair over, and tie it down. Apply your wings and hackles as usual, and that
was it. Looks and works perfectly well, but overcomes several problems;
sizing the hair, and getting the right type.

If you want to flare( spin) hair, then do it on a blank hook. Only tie down
after applying each bunch. Push each bunch back tightly to pack it ( finger
and thumbnail works for me), take a turn ( or a half hitch) to secure, ( a
drop of varnish after each clump makes such flies nearly bombproof)and apply
the next bunch. Do not try to trim any hair, until the last bunch has been
applied.

TL
MC

[riverman]

"Mike Connor" > wrote in message
...
>
> If you want to tie "humpies" with such stuff, then use a hackle bunch or
> similar for the tail ( or some other hair, antelope, calf, zebra, etc
> etc),
> and then tie in a bunch of your flaring hair at the bend with the tips
> pointing forwards. Wrap the body, tying down the tips, and then bring the
> hair over, and tie it down.

If I'm reading this right, you're suggesting tying the wing/back hairs with
the butt ends as the exposed ends? Won't that screw up the wings? I use the
tips of the hump hairs as the wings, then tie on some hackle.

--rm

[riverman]

"Mike Connor" > wrote in message
...
>
> If you want to tie "humpies" with such stuff, then use a hackle bunch or
> similar for the tail ( or some other hair, antelope, calf, zebra, etc
> etc),
> and then tie in a bunch of your flaring hair at the bend with the tips
> pointing forwards. Wrap the body, tying down the tips, and then bring the
> hair over, and tie it down.

If I'm reading this right, you're suggesting tying the wing/back hairs with
the butt ends as the exposed ends? Won't that screw up the wings? I use the
tips of the hump hairs as the wings, then tie on some hackle.

--rm

[Mike Connor]

"riverman" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Mike Connor" > wrote in message
> ...
> >
> > If you want to tie "humpies" with such stuff, then use a hackle bunch or
> > similar for the tail ( or some other hair, antelope, calf, zebra, etc
> > etc),
> > and then tie in a bunch of your flaring hair at the bend with the tips
> > pointing forwards. Wrap the body, tying down the tips, and then bring
the
> > hair over, and tie it down.
>
> If I'm reading this right, you're suggesting tying the wing/back hairs
with
> the butt ends as the exposed ends? Won't that screw up the wings? I use
the
> tips of the hump hairs as the wings, then tie on some hackle.
>
> --rm
>
>

Tie in the tail using a bunch of fibres that suit you, tie down and cut off
the waste. Tie in the "shellback" using a bunch of fibres that suit you,
( or just use the ends of the tail fibres), form the body, tie the shellback
down and cut off the waste. Tie in your wings using a bunch of fibres that
suit you. Wind your hackle, and finish.

This saves quite a lot of buggering about, the flies work perfectly well,
and look good too.

This is doubtless the method you are using;
http://www.visi.com/~mpv/FlyFishing/Humpy/Humpy.html


Here is Harry Masons excellent tutorial;
http://www.troutflies.com/tutorials/humpy/01.shtml

Here is another method ( more or less as I described);
http://www.westfly.com/patterns/dry/humpy.shtml

Another; http://www.eflytyer.com/patterns/m_humpy.html

Another; http://www.danica.com/flytier/steps/iobo_humpy/iobo_humpy.htm

http://www.virtualflybox.com/swaps/swap.php?id=31

http://www.flyanglersonline.com/flytying/fotw/120699fotw.html

http://www.guidebc.com/flypatterns/humpy.asp

There are hundreds more, many with some other trick or variation. They all
work.

TL
MC

[Mike Connor]

"riverman" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Mike Connor" > wrote in message
> ...
> >
> > If you want to tie "humpies" with such stuff, then use a hackle bunch or
> > similar for the tail ( or some other hair, antelope, calf, zebra, etc
> > etc),
> > and then tie in a bunch of your flaring hair at the bend with the tips
> > pointing forwards. Wrap the body, tying down the tips, and then bring
the
> > hair over, and tie it down.
>
> If I'm reading this right, you're suggesting tying the wing/back hairs
with
> the butt ends as the exposed ends? Won't that screw up the wings? I use
the
> tips of the hump hairs as the wings, then tie on some hackle.
>
> --rm
>
>

Tie in the tail using a bunch of fibres that suit you, tie down and cut off
the waste. Tie in the "shellback" using a bunch of fibres that suit you,
( or just use the ends of the tail fibres), form the body, tie the shellback
down and cut off the waste. Tie in your wings using a bunch of fibres that
suit you. Wind your hackle, and finish.

This saves quite a lot of buggering about, the flies work perfectly well,
and look good too.

This is doubtless the method you are using;
http://www.visi.com/~mpv/FlyFishing/Humpy/Humpy.html


Here is Harry Masons excellent tutorial;
http://www.troutflies.com/tutorials/humpy/01.shtml

Here is another method ( more or less as I described);
http://www.westfly.com/patterns/dry/humpy.shtml

Another; http://www.eflytyer.com/patterns/m_humpy.html

Another; http://www.danica.com/flytier/steps/iobo_humpy/iobo_humpy.htm

http://www.virtualflybox.com/swaps/swap.php?id=31

http://www.flyanglersonline.com/flytying/fotw/120699fotw.html

http://www.guidebc.com/flypatterns/humpy.asp

There are hundreds more, many with some other trick or variation. They all
work.

TL
MC

[riverman]

"Mike Connor" > wrote in message
...
> There are hundreds more, many with some other trick or variation. They
> all
> work.

For YOU, maybe! ;-)

--riverman
(thanks for the links, btw)

[riverman]

"Mike Connor" > wrote in message
...
> There are hundreds more, many with some other trick or variation. They
> all
> work.

For YOU, maybe! ;-)

--riverman
(thanks for the links, btw)

[Mike Connor]

"riverman" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Mike Connor" > wrote in message
> ...
> > There are hundreds more, many with some other trick or variation. They
> > all
> > work.
>
> For YOU, maybe! ;-)
>
> --riverman
> (thanks for the links, btw)
>
>

It does not really matter how you achieve some results. I spent a very great
deal of time learning all sorts of tricks, tips, and wrinkles, however, for
my own flies, I generally use what I find to be the quickest and simplest
method.

Unless a certain method gives a functional advantage, or a specific effect
which is not otherwise achievable, or only with added difficulty, then I
usually choose the easiest. This is also dependent on the availability of
certain materials.

The main functional aspect of the humpy, is that the "shellback" when
properly applied with the correct hair, makes the fly more or less
unsinkable, but it still sits "in" the film like a real half drowned beetle,
even when completely waterlogged. No floatant is required, ( and is actually
probably detrimental in this case).

One may achieve the same results using foam, cork strips, etc etc. instead
of the deer hair for the "shellback".

Although many tie the humpy with longish tails and very dense hackle, in
order to get them to float high on the film, ( when treated with floatant),
I now tie them sparse, and have often tied them without any hackle at all,
or just a few wisps of hen hackle. This was after I noticed that the
"waterlogged" versions, ( only being held up by the buoyancy of the deer
hair "shellback"), caught a lot more fish under most conditions, than those
which were riding high. More of the fish which rose to the waterlogged
version were also hooked. Takes were more confident, and hook-sets easier.

The less superfluous appendages one applies, the less to get waterlogged
anyway. A couple of minimalist versions I use are merely a shell back of
black deer hair, over a purple, red, or brown silk body. These get darker
when wet, and "shine" through. Just like the real thing. One may add a few
wisps of hackle if desired, but I have not noticed any remarkable difference
in the success rate of such flies with hackle, as opposed to those without.
Used as "bombers", ( thrown with a "plop", to get the attention of the
fish), or dead drifted when appropriate beetles are in evidence, "dragged"
to give some action, or even just as a "searching" fly, these are hard to
beat. They are also extremely durable, more or less unsinkable, ( WITHOUT
floatant!), easy and quick to tie, and very very successful.

If one uses this fly as a mayfly ( American sense of "mayfly", meaning
practically any upwinged fly), then a high floating version may be better,
but I would not normally use such a fly as a mayfly imitation, ( although
tied sparse and long with a fullish hackle it is an excellent Mayfly
[E.danica] or "British" mayfly imitation). In such a case, the "shell back"
serves no function, as it never gets near the water, and one might as well
leave it off!

As a beetle pattern, in various colours, it excels. Also as a moth pattern
with white wings etc.

The function of this fly is far more important to me than its appearance.

When "inventing" flies, I usually strive to imitate the desired function
first, and worry about the appearance etc later, ( if at all!:)) I have
had a great deal more success doing this, than I have had by using any other
method.

It is interesting and fun to learn all the various methods people use, and
in some cases this is the only way to tie certain flies. This also assumes
that one knows what the original inventor was trying to achieve, ( or it was
just a lucky accident!:)), and why certain materials were used. In other
cases it is merely a monumental waste of time, most especially with various
"fancy" flies, that have no specific function, or any real practical
application. For years I carried a lot of such flies in my boxes, as a
result of recommendations, magazine articles etc etc. I no longer do so.
This makes it a great deal easier to choose a fly, I have a great deal less
to start with, ( although still a fair number), but I now know the function
I require, and what I may expect of it.

There is no point in carrying fifty different torpedo shaped weighted nymphs
in a range of colours. One will invariably suffice. The same goes for
practically everything else. It is of course still fascinating to tie all
these things, and most people I know who tie, do so. I rarely bother much
anymore, and have not done so for quite a while.

If one analyses the function of many flies, then it is a great deal easier
to "invent" better ones, or at least improve one´s own versions. This
reduces clutter, makes fly-choice easier, and invariably results in greater
success, not least because one knows exactly what one is trying to do, and
this gives greater confidence. A secondary advantage is that one finds it
easier to substitute materials, methods etc.

Several hundred ( or even just a dozen!) flies in box, about which one knows
nothing, are equally useless.How do you choose one? What do you want to do
with it?

A dozen good functional flies in the hands of even a moderately skilled
angler will outfish anybody with a dozen boxes full, who does not know what
to do with them.

TL
MC

[Mike Connor]

"riverman" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Mike Connor" > wrote in message
> ...
> > There are hundreds more, many with some other trick or variation. They
> > all
> > work.
>
> For YOU, maybe! ;-)
>
> --riverman
> (thanks for the links, btw)
>
>

It does not really matter how you achieve some results. I spent a very great
deal of time learning all sorts of tricks, tips, and wrinkles, however, for
my own flies, I generally use what I find to be the quickest and simplest
method.

Unless a certain method gives a functional advantage, or a specific effect
which is not otherwise achievable, or only with added difficulty, then I
usually choose the easiest. This is also dependent on the availability of
certain materials.

The main functional aspect of the humpy, is that the "shellback" when
properly applied with the correct hair, makes the fly more or less
unsinkable, but it still sits "in" the film like a real half drowned beetle,
even when completely waterlogged. No floatant is required, ( and is actually
probably detrimental in this case).

One may achieve the same results using foam, cork strips, etc etc. instead
of the deer hair for the "shellback".

Although many tie the humpy with longish tails and very dense hackle, in
order to get them to float high on the film, ( when treated with floatant),
I now tie them sparse, and have often tied them without any hackle at all,
or just a few wisps of hen hackle. This was after I noticed that the
"waterlogged" versions, ( only being held up by the buoyancy of the deer
hair "shellback"), caught a lot more fish under most conditions, than those
which were riding high. More of the fish which rose to the waterlogged
version were also hooked. Takes were more confident, and hook-sets easier.

The less superfluous appendages one applies, the less to get waterlogged
anyway. A couple of minimalist versions I use are merely a shell back of
black deer hair, over a purple, red, or brown silk body. These get darker
when wet, and "shine" through. Just like the real thing. One may add a few
wisps of hackle if desired, but I have not noticed any remarkable difference
in the success rate of such flies with hackle, as opposed to those without.
Used as "bombers", ( thrown with a "plop", to get the attention of the
fish), or dead drifted when appropriate beetles are in evidence, "dragged"
to give some action, or even just as a "searching" fly, these are hard to
beat. They are also extremely durable, more or less unsinkable, ( WITHOUT
floatant!), easy and quick to tie, and very very successful.

If one uses this fly as a mayfly ( American sense of "mayfly", meaning
practically any upwinged fly), then a high floating version may be better,
but I would not normally use such a fly as a mayfly imitation, ( although
tied sparse and long with a fullish hackle it is an excellent Mayfly
[E.danica] or "British" mayfly imitation). In such a case, the "shell back"
serves no function, as it never gets near the water, and one might as well
leave it off!

As a beetle pattern, in various colours, it excels. Also as a moth pattern
with white wings etc.

The function of this fly is far more important to me than its appearance.

When "inventing" flies, I usually strive to imitate the desired function
first, and worry about the appearance etc later, ( if at all!:)) I have
had a great deal more success doing this, than I have had by using any other
method.

It is interesting and fun to learn all the various methods people use, and
in some cases this is the only way to tie certain flies. This also assumes
that one knows what the original inventor was trying to achieve, ( or it was
just a lucky accident!:)), and why certain materials were used. In other
cases it is merely a monumental waste of time, most especially with various
"fancy" flies, that have no specific function, or any real practical
application. For years I carried a lot of such flies in my boxes, as a
result of recommendations, magazine articles etc etc. I no longer do so.
This makes it a great deal easier to choose a fly, I have a great deal less
to start with, ( although still a fair number), but I now know the function
I require, and what I may expect of it.

There is no point in carrying fifty different torpedo shaped weighted nymphs
in a range of colours. One will invariably suffice. The same goes for
practically everything else. It is of course still fascinating to tie all
these things, and most people I know who tie, do so. I rarely bother much
anymore, and have not done so for quite a while.

If one analyses the function of many flies, then it is a great deal easier
to "invent" better ones, or at least improve one´s own versions. This
reduces clutter, makes fly-choice easier, and invariably results in greater
success, not least because one knows exactly what one is trying to do, and
this gives greater confidence. A secondary advantage is that one finds it
easier to substitute materials, methods etc.

Several hundred ( or even just a dozen!) flies in box, about which one knows
nothing, are equally useless.How do you choose one? What do you want to do
with it?

A dozen good functional flies in the hands of even a moderately skilled
angler will outfish anybody with a dozen boxes full, who does not know what
to do with them.

TL
MC