Deep Water Part 2

[Joshuall]

It's fall. I'm reading about Warren's 6 lb. + fish and RichZ's drooling over
it being fall. And I'm just lost. I've tried fishing deep. One time last
year I caught one 5lb er on a carolina rig. Nothing since.

Last Friday it was 75 degrees air temp. Judy and I went to Cal River/ Lake
Mich. looking for smallies. My graph in the river above the locks looked
like the dead sea no matter where we went in the river Water temps there
were 53 degrees. So.... I decided to go out and try the big pond. Water
temps there were same give or take a degree... my sonar just laughed at me.

Later in the day to avoid the dreaded skunk, I locked through, went back
down river into some marina's and caught six nice buck keepers. But..... If
I hadn't done that I'd have gone home skunked. I can't find fish in deep
water and even when I do I can't catch em. grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.

I don't understand this whole fall/pre winter pattern thing. What temps make
them move and how deep ? And even in summer months I've rarely been able to
make deep fish bite. and how do I know the deep fish on my sonar aren't just
garbage fish like carp etc? Very frustrating.. I know this is an old
subject, but I just can't seem to master deep water fishing. grrrrr. help.

--
God Bless America

Josh The Bad Bear

[RichZ]

Josh,

In a river, the first thing you're trying to do is find areas big enough
to hold a sizable aggregation of bass that are protected from the
current. You did that when you went into the marina. They don't have to
be deep. They just seek out the area most insulated from the conditions
that cause them stress. The two things they try to avoid most in the
winter are frequent water temperature fluctuations and current. Find the
best protection from those two items and you'll likely find bass. The
worse an environment is, the more the bass will bunch into the areas
that protect them from stress.

And for what it's worth, in 50 to 55 degree water in fall, especially in
a river, I'm more likely to be throwing a jerkbait, crankbait or
spinnerbait than a jig or drop shot. My life doesn't start to get really
good in the rivers until the water's under about 47 degrees.

Joshuall wrote:
> It's fall. I'm reading about Warren's 6 lb. + fish and RichZ's drooling over
> it being fall. And I'm just lost. I've tried fishing deep. One time last
> year I caught one 5lb er on a carolina rig. Nothing since.
>
> Last Friday it was 75 degrees air temp. Judy and I went to Cal River/ Lake
> Mich. looking for smallies. My graph in the river above the locks looked
> like the dead sea no matter where we went in the river Water temps there
> were 53 degrees. So.... I decided to go out and try the big pond. Water
> temps there were same give or take a degree... my sonar just laughed at me.
>
> Later in the day to avoid the dreaded skunk, I locked through, went back
> down river into some marina's and caught six nice buck keepers. But..... If
> I hadn't done that I'd have gone home skunked. I can't find fish in deep
> water and even when I do I can't catch em. grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.
>
> I don't understand this whole fall/pre winter pattern thing. What temps make
> them move and how deep ? And even in summer months I've rarely been able to
> make deep fish bite. and how do I know the deep fish on my sonar aren't just
> garbage fish like carp etc? Very frustrating.. I know this is an old
> subject, but I just can't seem to master deep water fishing. grrrrr. help.
>

[RichZ]

Josh,

In a river, the first thing you're trying to do is find areas big enough
to hold a sizable aggregation of bass that are protected from the
current. You did that when you went into the marina. They don't have to
be deep. They just seek out the area most insulated from the conditions
that cause them stress. The two things they try to avoid most in the
winter are frequent water temperature fluctuations and current. Find the
best protection from those two items and you'll likely find bass. The
worse an environment is, the more the bass will bunch into the areas
that protect them from stress.

And for what it's worth, in 50 to 55 degree water in fall, especially in
a river, I'm more likely to be throwing a jerkbait, crankbait or
spinnerbait than a jig or drop shot. My life doesn't start to get really
good in the rivers until the water's under about 47 degrees.

Joshuall wrote:
> It's fall. I'm reading about Warren's 6 lb. + fish and RichZ's drooling over
> it being fall. And I'm just lost. I've tried fishing deep. One time last
> year I caught one 5lb er on a carolina rig. Nothing since.
>
> Last Friday it was 75 degrees air temp. Judy and I went to Cal River/ Lake
> Mich. looking for smallies. My graph in the river above the locks looked
> like the dead sea no matter where we went in the river Water temps there
> were 53 degrees. So.... I decided to go out and try the big pond. Water
> temps there were same give or take a degree... my sonar just laughed at me.
>
> Later in the day to avoid the dreaded skunk, I locked through, went back
> down river into some marina's and caught six nice buck keepers. But..... If
> I hadn't done that I'd have gone home skunked. I can't find fish in deep
> water and even when I do I can't catch em. grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.
>
> I don't understand this whole fall/pre winter pattern thing. What temps make
> them move and how deep ? And even in summer months I've rarely been able to
> make deep fish bite. and how do I know the deep fish on my sonar aren't just
> garbage fish like carp etc? Very frustrating.. I know this is an old
> subject, but I just can't seem to master deep water fishing. grrrrr. help.
>

[RichZ]

Josh,

In a river, the first thing you're trying to do is find areas big enough
to hold a sizable aggregation of bass that are protected from the
current. You did that when you went into the marina. They don't have to
be deep. They just seek out the area most insulated from the conditions
that cause them stress. The two things they try to avoid most in the
winter are frequent water temperature fluctuations and current. Find the
best protection from those two items and you'll likely find bass. The
worse an environment is, the more the bass will bunch into the areas
that protect them from stress.

And for what it's worth, in 50 to 55 degree water in fall, especially in
a river, I'm more likely to be throwing a jerkbait, crankbait or
spinnerbait than a jig or drop shot. My life doesn't start to get really
good in the rivers until the water's under about 47 degrees.

Joshuall wrote:
> It's fall. I'm reading about Warren's 6 lb. + fish and RichZ's drooling over
> it being fall. And I'm just lost. I've tried fishing deep. One time last
> year I caught one 5lb er on a carolina rig. Nothing since.
>
> Last Friday it was 75 degrees air temp. Judy and I went to Cal River/ Lake
> Mich. looking for smallies. My graph in the river above the locks looked
> like the dead sea no matter where we went in the river Water temps there
> were 53 degrees. So.... I decided to go out and try the big pond. Water
> temps there were same give or take a degree... my sonar just laughed at me.
>
> Later in the day to avoid the dreaded skunk, I locked through, went back
> down river into some marina's and caught six nice buck keepers. But..... If
> I hadn't done that I'd have gone home skunked. I can't find fish in deep
> water and even when I do I can't catch em. grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.
>
> I don't understand this whole fall/pre winter pattern thing. What temps make
> them move and how deep ? And even in summer months I've rarely been able to
> make deep fish bite. and how do I know the deep fish on my sonar aren't just
> garbage fish like carp etc? Very frustrating.. I know this is an old
> subject, but I just can't seem to master deep water fishing. grrrrr. help.
>

[go-bassn]

Obviously the rewards are there for the few folks willing to commit to
fishing deep Josh. The problem is very few people are willing to sacrifice
leaving their "comfort zone" & put time in fishing the depths. When I take
people into water over 20', usually tournament riders, they often express
the feeling of being on another planet. I ask them if they think my boat is
very long, and they always reply "not really". I then point out that my
boat is over 20' long, and that 20' really isn't that deep.

Think about all the years of fishing & thousands of hours most bass
fishermen have devoted to fishing the 1-15' zones. There are tons of guys
that have done this & never once spent even a full single day on the water
plying the 20'+ zones. Those few that do, however, and gain confidence in
deep water patterns, become very appreciative of the fact that thier
competition doesn't fish deep. My belief is that if there is deep water
available, and that if the needs of the bass can be satisfied in that deep
water, that the biggest bass in the lake can usually be found there. I also
find these fish much more eager to bite, as they are generally unmolested
when compared to the shallow fish. I'd much more prefer to compete against
5% of the other guys than 95% of them.

As for "what temps" make the fish move deep/shallow in the fall/early
winter, that is the wrong way to look at it; All movements this time of
year are based on the movement of bait & baitfish, not so much water temp.
Bass want to feast this time of year.

I hope you put the deepwater thing together next year Josh.

Warren


"Joshuall" > wrote in message
...
> It's fall. I'm reading about Warren's 6 lb. + fish and RichZ's drooling
over
> it being fall. And I'm just lost. I've tried fishing deep. One time last
> year I caught one 5lb er on a carolina rig. Nothing since.
>
> Last Friday it was 75 degrees air temp. Judy and I went to Cal River/ Lake
> Mich. looking for smallies. My graph in the river above the locks looked
> like the dead sea no matter where we went in the river Water temps there
> were 53 degrees. So.... I decided to go out and try the big pond. Water
> temps there were same give or take a degree... my sonar just laughed at
me.
>
> Later in the day to avoid the dreaded skunk, I locked through, went back
> down river into some marina's and caught six nice buck keepers. But.....
If
> I hadn't done that I'd have gone home skunked. I can't find fish in deep
> water and even when I do I can't catch em. grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.
>
> I don't understand this whole fall/pre winter pattern thing. What temps
make
> them move and how deep ? And even in summer months I've rarely been able
to
> make deep fish bite. and how do I know the deep fish on my sonar aren't
just
> garbage fish like carp etc? Very frustrating.. I know this is an old
> subject, but I just can't seem to master deep water fishing. grrrrr. help.
>
> --
> God Bless America
>
> Josh The Bad Bear
>
>

[Joshuall]

Thanks Warren, Rich - One more dumb question
so what makes the bait fish go deep?
And next year I'm comitted to learning more about the abyss.
--
God Bless America

Josh The Bad Bear

[Joshuall]

Thanks Warren, Rich - One more dumb question
so what makes the bait fish go deep?
And next year I'm comitted to learning more about the abyss.
--
God Bless America

Josh The Bad Bear

[Charles Summers]

Center Hill will almost force you to fish deep.

Warren's boat length example is usually what I try to gauge my depth zone
with, and keeps me confident that I can fish 20-30' of water comfortably.
Surely you've fished the bluffs on Percy Priest. Most of them range from 10'
to 30' and I find bass on nearly all of them.


"Joshuall" > wrote in message
...
> Thanks Warren, Rich - One more dumb question
> so what makes the bait fish go deep?
> And next year I'm comitted to learning more about the abyss.
> --
> God Bless America
>
> Josh The Bad Bear
>
>

[Joshuall]

Yes I've fished the bluffs, . . . never caught even a cold on one of them.
See ?

--
God Bless America

Josh The Bad Bear

[Joshuall]

Yes I've fished the bluffs, . . . never caught even a cold on one of them.
See ?

--
God Bless America

Josh The Bad Bear

[Calif Bill]

"Charles Summers" > wrote in message
...
> Center Hill will almost force you to fish deep.
>
> Warren's boat length example is usually what I try to gauge my depth zone
> with, and keeps me confident that I can fish 20-30' of water comfortably.
> Surely you've fished the bluffs on Percy Priest. Most of them range from
10'
> to 30' and I find bass on nearly all of them.
>
>
> "Joshuall" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Thanks Warren, Rich - One more dumb question
> > so what makes the bait fish go deep?
> > And next year I'm comitted to learning more about the abyss.
> > --
> > God Bless America
> >
> > Josh The Bad Bear
> >
> >
>
>

20-30' that shallow? But being California and Oroville at 700'+ deep and
Shasta at over 900' when full, we have to fish at 60' or so at times.

[Calif Bill]

"Charles Summers" > wrote in message
...
> Center Hill will almost force you to fish deep.
>
> Warren's boat length example is usually what I try to gauge my depth zone
> with, and keeps me confident that I can fish 20-30' of water comfortably.
> Surely you've fished the bluffs on Percy Priest. Most of them range from
10'
> to 30' and I find bass on nearly all of them.
>
>
> "Joshuall" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Thanks Warren, Rich - One more dumb question
> > so what makes the bait fish go deep?
> > And next year I'm comitted to learning more about the abyss.
> > --
> > God Bless America
> >
> > Josh The Bad Bear
> >
> >
>
>

20-30' that shallow? But being California and Oroville at 700'+ deep and
Shasta at over 900' when full, we have to fish at 60' or so at times.

[Charles B. Summers]

Now that could create a problem! I'd hate to sink about sinking the boat in
that depth. Recovery would be impossible! lol

I'm comfortable up to about 30'.... beyond that, you'd have to catch
something to convince me.

"Calif Bill" > wrote in message
ink.net...
>
>
> 20-30' that shallow? But being California and Oroville at 700'+ deep and
> Shasta at over 900' when full, we have to fish at 60' or so at times.
>
>

[Charles B. Summers]

Now that could create a problem! I'd hate to sink about sinking the boat in
that depth. Recovery would be impossible! lol

I'm comfortable up to about 30'.... beyond that, you'd have to catch
something to convince me.

"Calif Bill" > wrote in message
ink.net...
>
>
> 20-30' that shallow? But being California and Oroville at 700'+ deep and
> Shasta at over 900' when full, we have to fish at 60' or so at times.
>
>

[RichZ]

Charles B. Summers wrote:

> I'm comfortable up to about 30'.... beyond that, you'd have to catch
> something to convince me.

Went out to Zoar this morning expecting to find 'em stacked in deep
water. The water's still 50 degrees, so they weren't really stacked, but
we did manage a few. The guy who went with me wanted to learn drop
shotting, and he certainly did that. This one came from somewhere
between 35 and 38 feet.

http://ctfisherman.com/data/589fishski_dropshot.jpg

And I kinda stuck with the 3/4 oz jig looking for the bigger bites. This
one came from 42 feet or so.

http://ctfisherman.com/data/589zoar_11_06_04.jpg

[RichZ]

Charles B. Summers wrote:

> I'm comfortable up to about 30'.... beyond that, you'd have to catch
> something to convince me.

Went out to Zoar this morning expecting to find 'em stacked in deep
water. The water's still 50 degrees, so they weren't really stacked, but
we did manage a few. The guy who went with me wanted to learn drop
shotting, and he certainly did that. This one came from somewhere
between 35 and 38 feet.

http://ctfisherman.com/data/589fishski_dropshot.jpg

And I kinda stuck with the 3/4 oz jig looking for the bigger bites. This
one came from 42 feet or so.

http://ctfisherman.com/data/589zoar_11_06_04.jpg

[go-bassn]

Nice fish Rich!

--
Warren

http://www.warrenwolk.com
Http://www.tri-statebassmasters.com
2004 NJ B.A.S.S. Federation State Champions

"RichZ" > wrote in message
...
> Charles B. Summers wrote:
>
>> I'm comfortable up to about 30'.... beyond that, you'd have to catch
>> something to convince me.
>
> Went out to Zoar this morning expecting to find 'em stacked in deep water.
> The water's still 50 degrees, so they weren't really stacked, but we did
> manage a few. The guy who went with me wanted to learn drop shotting, and
> he certainly did that. This one came from somewhere between 35 and 38
> feet.
>
> http://ctfisherman.com/data/589fishski_dropshot.jpg
>
> And I kinda stuck with the 3/4 oz jig looking for the bigger bites. This
> one came from 42 feet or so.
>
> http://ctfisherman.com/data/589zoar_11_06_04.jpg

[go-bassn]

Nice fish Rich!

--
Warren

http://www.warrenwolk.com
Http://www.tri-statebassmasters.com
2004 NJ B.A.S.S. Federation State Champions

"RichZ" > wrote in message
...
> Charles B. Summers wrote:
>
>> I'm comfortable up to about 30'.... beyond that, you'd have to catch
>> something to convince me.
>
> Went out to Zoar this morning expecting to find 'em stacked in deep water.
> The water's still 50 degrees, so they weren't really stacked, but we did
> manage a few. The guy who went with me wanted to learn drop shotting, and
> he certainly did that. This one came from somewhere between 35 and 38
> feet.
>
> http://ctfisherman.com/data/589fishski_dropshot.jpg
>
> And I kinda stuck with the 3/4 oz jig looking for the bigger bites. This
> one came from 42 feet or so.
>
> http://ctfisherman.com/data/589zoar_11_06_04.jpg

[go-bassn]

Nice fish Rich!

--
Warren

http://www.warrenwolk.com
Http://www.tri-statebassmasters.com
2004 NJ B.A.S.S. Federation State Champions

"RichZ" > wrote in message
...
> Charles B. Summers wrote:
>
>> I'm comfortable up to about 30'.... beyond that, you'd have to catch
>> something to convince me.
>
> Went out to Zoar this morning expecting to find 'em stacked in deep water.
> The water's still 50 degrees, so they weren't really stacked, but we did
> manage a few. The guy who went with me wanted to learn drop shotting, and
> he certainly did that. This one came from somewhere between 35 and 38
> feet.
>
> http://ctfisherman.com/data/589fishski_dropshot.jpg
>
> And I kinda stuck with the 3/4 oz jig looking for the bigger bites. This
> one came from 42 feet or so.
>
> http://ctfisherman.com/data/589zoar_11_06_04.jpg