How to rig & fish a spoon?

[Mark Pruett]

How do I rig up a spoon, and after that, how do I fish with one? I'm
pretty much a live bait kind of guy (Galveston Bay), but I'm curious
about various artificial lures, so I'm going to start with a spoon.

Problem is, I don't know exactly how to rig it up and fish with one.

[RichG]

Since I fish West Galveston bay with spoons, maybe this will help.

Buy some 1/4 oz. or even 1/8th oz. Johnson Sprite ( Gold for reds, Silver
for trout ) spoons. Put the red "fan" that comes in the package on to the
hook. Take off the little red tab that Johnson supplies.

Add a Stainless steel split ring to the spoon. The reason for the split ring
is that Johnson makes these spoons with just a punch hole into the metal.
That punch hole will cut your line very quickly, unless you add the
protection of the SS split ring.

To the Split ring, tie on 15/20 inches of fluorocarbon ( I use a simple loop
knot ) or at least clear monofilament. Many use 20 lb test. It is for a
"shock leader" to help avoid cut-offs with the shell you hope you are
fishing over. Tie a good quality black swivel on to the Fluorocarbon shock
leader. Tie 10 lb. mono onto the swivel. Cast as far as you can. Jig it
back and hang on! Some people just reel it back in slowly. I find my best
luck is when I "work it" back with five inch or so pulls and stops. Try
them all.

Good luck, let us know how it works.
RichG
p.s. Where do you fish in Galveston bay complex????

[Mark Pruett]

"RichG" > wrote in message >...

> p.s. Where do you fish in Galveston bay complex????

Well, I haven't been fishing much in the past 15 or so years- my
grandfather passing away, college and moving to Dallas put a big crimp
in that. Before all that, we used to go in the West bay, around
Pelican Island bridge and up in between Pelican Island and Galveston.
Occasionally we'd go out into Jones Lake, but not that often.

Looks like this next week my brother and I will be going to my aunt
and uncle's place on Lake Madeline in Galveston- no idea if we'll
catch anything or not there.

[Short Wave Sportfishing]

On Fri, 05 Mar 2004 05:26:00 -0500, joe > wrote:

>In article >,
> "RichG" > wrote:

~~ snippage ~~

>Most of my reds are caught on the silver spoon but I have also caught
>gator trout and snook.

Interesting thread guys. I might find some of those spoons to use up
here for weakfish - nothing ventured, nothing gained.

But I gotta ask - what's a gator trout?

Later,

Tom
S. Woodstock, CT
-----------
"Do fishermen eat avocados? This is a question
that no one ever thinks to ask."

Russel Chatham, "Dark Waters" (1988)

[joe]

In article >,
Short Wave Sportfishing > wrote:

> But I gotta ask - what's a gator trout?

Maybe a 'slang' term but among those I fish the flats with in FL a
speckled trout (sal****er variety) over 24 - 25 inches is commonly
called a gator trout.

I suppose due to the large mouth and those fangs. They do typically
behave differently. They usually do not behave the same way as the
schooling trout that are smaller. Usually solitary and holding to a good
ambush spot or cruising the shallows looking for a meal.

Someone my point out my misunderstandings but that is how I got it.

good fishin'

atljoe
--
"Atlanta Joe" aka Joe Webb
Flats fishing is Flat Fun!
Visit my site at http://flatsfisher.com

[RichG]

Here is a write-up by a respected ( now retired ) married guide couple,
LLoyd and Cookie Pepper. It mentions Lake Madeline. I've never fished
there, but have fished Anderson Ways (aka Sportsman's Road) and Confederate
Reef. As a matter of fact, both areas have been producing, according to
written reports, trout this Winter. Have fun.
regards, RichG




Fall 1996
by A.C. Becker, Jr.
FISHING WITH A PEPPER


East Bay is the third largest major bay within the Galveston Estuary,
It is also the best sportfishing bay of the upper Texas Coast. But that's
true only if you know what, where and how to fish it. The fishing is most
consistent from spring through the fall. It is inconsistent during the
winter,
but if you know when and where to go, winter fishing can be bonanza time
for speckled trout, especially six to nine pound trophies, and keeper
redfish.
My personal trophies from West Bay include a 10.1 pound speckled trout and
an 8.6 pound flounder. Down through the years the bay has yielded one state
record sheepshead and three consecutive state record flounder.



The bay is best understood when one converses with people who have spent
a lifetime fishing it. Two such people are Lloyd and Cookie Pepper, a man
and wife Galveston Island guide team that has fished West Bay exclusively
since 1957. Cookie, who started guiding professionally in 1973, specializes
in drift fishing and fishing the birds. She has a 9 1/2 pound speckled trout
and 48 inch redfish to her credit from West Bay. Lloyd guides the same kind
of fishing but he prefers wadefishing. His West Bay trophies include an
8 1/2 pound speck and a 25 pound redfish. When not on the water fishing,
Lloyd spends his time building custom fishing rods.



"The bay is nothing like it was when we started fishing it in 1957,"
Lloyd says. "The in and out flow of the water at San Luis Pass has
changed very much since the building of the San Luis Pass Bridge. The Pass
is getting narrower and the only deep holes behind it are on the curves
opposite the KOA Camp, Cold Pass, Mud Island and Bird Island. The water
over the bars is getting shallower, and that makes for poor fishing on fast
incoming tides because the water becomes so sandy. The best fishing is on
a slow moving outgoing tide." The best fishing in the vicinity of the
Pass starts in April and continues through October. Experience shows the
east part of the bay from Carancahua Reef and into deep water Offatts Bayou
and the Crash Boat Basin is from late fall through the following March.



"In this part of the bay the fish can move quickest from shallow
to deep water and back," says Cookie. "The tides and currents
aren't as strong in this part of the bay in the cold weather months. Studies
by biologists indicate during the cold months fish move from the jetties
(North and South Jetties bordering the Galveston harbor entrance) to the
east end of West Bay."



The Peppers agree West Bay gets the bulk of the sport anglers because
it is so easy to reach from Houston. They note it is a narrow bay protected
fairly well from the wind. They say a lot of people fish the bay from small
boats totally unsuited for wide open Galveston Bay, the largest bay in the
estuary. Galveston Bay can become violently rough, during the passage of
winter weather fronts.



"People come down to West Bay for speckled trout, redfish and flounder
in that order," Cookie says. "West Bay seems to hold a lot of
flounder through the winter, but I really don't know why. Every year we
have that big flounder run around Seawolf Park on the east end of Galveston
Island and along the Jetties. We used to have flounder runs like that at
San Luis Pass, but that was back before the San Luis Pass Bridge was built."
Since the construction of the bridge, San Luis Pass has become narrower
and narrower with the pass proper shifting closer and closer to the east
end of Brazoria County.



Actually, flounder fishing is generally good the year around in West
Bay, and along the saltgrass marshes on the Galveston Island side of the
bay. The most productive area stretches from behind San Luis Pass eastward
to Anderson's Ways."



The Peppers say salt grass and widgeon grass show signs of coming back
in West Bay. "Salt grass has been planted behind San Luis Pass and
off Galveston Island State Park at the end of Jolly Roger Road," Lloyd
says. "Getting grass growing back in the bay again would be a big help
for fishing. There is already a lot of shell in the bay, and the oysters
show signs of reproducing since the bay has been closed to oyster boats."



Cookie adds the large number of shell reefs in the bay make for excellent
drift fishing for speckled trout and keeper size redfish.



West Bay is the shallowest of the four major bays in the Galveston estuary,
and as a result in order to score well on fish one has to pay attention
to the tides. The lowest tides occur during the winter months when blustery
weather fronts howl in with northerly winds that literally blow the tides
out of the bays. There are many occasions in the winter when tides fall
from two to four feet below the predicted stand or so low the overall area
looks like a scattering of wet mud flats. This is when the fishing is best
in the eastern end of the bay where there are numerous branches of deep
water: Intracoastal Waterway, Offatts Bayou, Lake Madeline, Crash Boat
Basin,
Anderson's Ways Channel, Hitchcock Diversionary Canal, and some holes around
North and South Deer Islands.



Easterly and southerly winds make for the best fishing since these winds
tend to push water into the bay. Sustained easterly and southeasterly winds
can make tides in West Bay rise two to three feet above the predicted stand.
Fishing can be good on a very light northerly wind, but strong northerly
winds blow the water out of the bay. The poorest fishing is on westerly
winds. Look for best fishing conditions on easterly and southerly winds.



Key reefs for fishing include Carancahua at the mid-point of the bay
and mile long Confederate Reef in the east end. The most consistent fishing
under the birds occurs along the north side of the bay from Carancahua Reef
eastward to Green's Cut and on the Galveston Island side from Anderson's
Ways westward to Hoecker's Point. This area is called Duncan's Alley.



"Although San Luis Pass isn't what it used to be," Lloyd says,
"from June through August you can find all kinds of fish, such as tarpon,
jackfish, Spanish mackerel, ling and tripletail in the far west end of the
bay." When the Peppers started fishing the bay in 1957, tarpon were
occasionally found as far east as the I-45 Causeway and Offatts Bayou.



There are boat launching and bait facilities at most of the bayfront
developments on West Bay. (Fish Finder map no. 1018 covers West Galveston
Bay to Freeport.)



The Pepper's can be reached at 409-737-1136.



Front Page"Mark Pruett" > wrote in message
om...
> "RichG" > wrote in message
>...
>
> > p.s. Where do you fish in Galveston bay complex????
>
> Well, I haven't been fishing much in the past 15 or so years- my
> grandfather passing away, college and moving to Dallas put a big crimp
> in that. Before all that, we used to go in the West bay, around
> Pelican Island bridge and up in between Pelican Island and Galveston.
> Occasionally we'd go out into Jones Lake, but not that often.
>
> Looks like this next week my brother and I will be going to my aunt
> and uncle's place on Lake Madeline in Galveston- no idea if we'll
> catch anything or not there.

[RichG]

re "gator trout"...some might call it a "big -un".... ho ho ho

On the East coast.. I believe they call the same fish a "spotted weakfish";
or a "Speckled trout"; and a Spotted Sea Trout; Here in Texas, it is
commonly known as a just a "Speck".

--
RichG
http://groups.msn.com/CarolinaSkiffOwners

[pcadd]

Just saw this and had basically the same question. Very good reply,
but one other thing that I have seen other's use is a snap swivel with
the spoon and with jigs. What do you thing? should a snap swivel be
used with spoons and jigs?


"RichG" > wrote in message >...
> Since I fish West Galveston bay with spoons, maybe this will help.
>
> Buy some 1/4 oz. or even 1/8th oz. Johnson Sprite ( Gold for reds, Silver
> for trout ) spoons. Put the red "fan" that comes in the package on to the
> hook. Take off the little red tab that Johnson supplies.
>
> Add a Stainless steel split ring to the spoon. The reason for the split ring
> is that Johnson makes these spoons with just a punch hole into the metal.
> That punch hole will cut your line very quickly, unless you add the
> protection of the SS split ring.
>
> To the Split ring, tie on 15/20 inches of fluorocarbon ( I use a simple loop
> knot ) or at least clear monofilament. Many use 20 lb test. It is for a
> "shock leader" to help avoid cut-offs with the shell you hope you are
> fishing over. Tie a good quality black swivel on to the Fluorocarbon shock
> leader. Tie 10 lb. mono onto the swivel. Cast as far as you can. Jig it
> back and hang on! Some people just reel it back in slowly. I find my best
> luck is when I "work it" back with five inch or so pulls and stops. Try
> them all.
>
> Good luck, let us know how it works.
> RichG
> p.s. Where do you fish in Galveston bay complex????

[joe]

In article >,
(pcadd) wrote:

> Just saw this and had basically the same question. Very good reply,
> but one other thing that I have seen other's use is a snap swivel with
> the spoon and with jigs. What do you thing? should a snap swivel be
> used with spoons and jigs?

Depends on the kind of spoon really.

The Johnson Silver Minnow (with weed guard and single integral hook)
will definitely induce line twist. If you are using a baitcaster not so
much a problem but on a spinning reel it can be a disastor.

Some spoons are 'wobblers' and could be used with only a split ring.

When you are already using a shiny metal lure no reason not to use the
swivel in regard to spooking fish.

One reason some may avoid the snap swivel is that it is another point of
possible failure. And they sometimes do. However, having major line
twist and getting your line fouled can also cost you a fish or a shot at
a fish.

good fishin'

atljoe
--
"Atlanta Joe" aka Joe Webb
Flats fishing is Flat Fun!
Visit my site at http://flatsfisher.com

[Short Wave Sportfishing]

On Fri, 05 Mar 2004 14:21:01 GMT, "RichG" >
wrote:

>re "gator trout"...some might call it a "big -un".... ho ho ho
>
>On the East coast.. I believe they call the same fish a "spotted weakfish";
>or a "Speckled trout"; and a Spotted Sea Trout; Here in Texas, it is
>commonly known as a just a "Speck".

Squeteague!!!!!

Heh, heh,heh....where do they come up with these names? ;>)

Later,

Tom
S. Woodstock, CT
-----------
"Do fishermen eat avocados? This is a question
that no one ever thinks to ask."

Russel Chatham, "Dark Waters" (1988)

[Short Wave Sportfishing]

On Fri, 05 Mar 2004 08:25:05 -0500, joe > wrote:

>In article >,
> Short Wave Sportfishing > wrote:
>
>> But I gotta ask - what's a gator trout?
>
>Maybe a 'slang' term but among those I fish the flats with in FL a
>speckled trout (sal****er variety) over 24 - 25 inches is commonly
>called a gator trout.
>
>I suppose due to the large mouth and those fangs. They do typically
>behave differently. They usually do not behave the same way as the
>schooling trout that are smaller. Usually solitary and holding to a good
>ambush spot or cruising the shallows looking for a meal.

Squeteague - big ugly things, but mighty tasty.

I miss fishing for specks. When I lived in Louisiana, I used to catch
them down around Venice and along Lake Ponchatrain in New Orleans
where I lived.

Later,

Tom
S. Woodstock, CT
-----------
"Do fishermen eat avocados? This is a question
that no one ever thinks to ask."

Russel Chatham, "Dark Waters" (1988)

[RichG]

I'd give anyone about ten minutes with almost any spoon...before their line
would be a twisted mess...without a swivel somewhere in the rigging. Even
the wonderful motion of a wobble-only (Johnson Silver minnow..etc. ) spoon
turns into a "spinning" spoon if it is retrieved just a little too quickly.

Some people prefer a snap swivel to attach the lure to the line. It serves
two purposes. One is - THE SWIVEL-...the other is it attaches the spoon
"loosely" so that the spoon gives more wobble than if it were tied on
tightly. I prefer to tie a simple loop; bowlin; or circle knot to give the
"looseness" that adds wobble. I think it adds attractiveness to every lure I
use. In the case of spoons, the swivel is attached at the top of the "shock
leader" so it is far removed from the spoon itself. Maybe it is better,
maybe not...but it is how I do it.

Regarding the loop knot....I can no longer just tie something directly on,
unless it is a spinnerbait.
--
RichG
http://groups.msn.com/CarolinaSkiffOwners

[pcadd]

Thanks, basically what I thought. Except for the part about the little
red tab. I have not been taking them off. Reading your reply I guess
it is useless to have them attached, right? Can extra "fans" or
"skirts" be purchased seperatly somewhere and do you use snap swivels
on jigs? Great info here.

(pcadd) wrote in message >...
> Just saw this and had basically the same question. Very good reply,
> but one other thing that I have seen other's use is a snap swivel with
> the spoon and with jigs. What do you thing? should a snap swivel be
> used with spoons and jigs?
>
>
> "RichG" > wrote in message >...
> > Since I fish West Galveston bay with spoons, maybe this will help.
> >
> > Buy some 1/4 oz. or even 1/8th oz. Johnson Sprite ( Gold for reds, Silver
> > for trout ) spoons. Put the red "fan" that comes in the package on to the
> > hook. Take off the little red tab that Johnson supplies.
> >
> > Add a Stainless steel split ring to the spoon. The reason for the split ring
> > is that Johnson makes these spoons with just a punch hole into the metal.
> > That punch hole will cut your line very quickly, unless you add the
> > protection of the SS split ring.
> >
> > To the Split ring, tie on 15/20 inches of fluorocarbon ( I use a simple loop
> > knot ) or at least clear monofilament. Many use 20 lb test. It is for a
> > "shock leader" to help avoid cut-offs with the shell you hope you are
> > fishing over. Tie a good quality black swivel on to the Fluorocarbon shock
> > leader. Tie 10 lb. mono onto the swivel. Cast as far as you can. Jig it
> > back and hang on! Some people just reel it back in slowly. I find my best
> > luck is when I "work it" back with five inch or so pulls and stops. Try
> > them all.
> >
> > Good luck, let us know how it works.
> > RichG
> > p.s. Where do you fish in Galveston bay complex????

[RichG]

After a year or so, I'll sell you all of the little red tabs that I
remove!!!

Nah.. I don't know where one could buy more of either. The red tabs may work
very well for you. I just got in the habit of removing them since I started
with the red "fans" and didn't want to change when the red tabs came out.
The red "fans" are certainly more garish. The red tabs might work well in
very clear water, which is at a premium here in the summer. I just related
what I do and why I do it. Just cause I do it, doesn't make it the only or
the right way.

re snap swivels on jigs...nope, just a loop knot. Probably should have
clarified that earlier. No reason why one couldn't use a shock leader with
a snap swivel, just like a spoon. If I move from a spoon to a jig , then
I'd just snip the spoon off and tie the jighead on.

My favorite "tout" or jig is the red and white ones. I guess most guys use
"lime-treuse" bass-assassins from what I've read..... but I'm old and old
fashioned. RichG
--
RichG
http://groups.msn.com/CarolinaSkiffOwners

[joe]

In article >,
(pcadd) wrote:

> Thanks, basically what I thought. Except for the part about the little
> red tab. I have not been taking them off. Reading your reply I guess
> it is useless to have them attached, right? Can extra "fans" or
> "skirts" be purchased seperatly somewhere and do you use snap swivels
> on jigs? Great info here.

You can add pretty much anything on the hook; grub tail, pork skin,
fishbites (scented strip), etc. I have one I added a rattle to the ring
up top. Just be aware that anything you add will likely change the
action at a given retrieve speed. You can use this to your advantage. I
use trailers in the winter to slow down the spoon retrieve for sluggish
fish.
--
"Atlanta Joe" aka Joe Webb
Flats fishing is Flat Fun!
Visit my site at http://flatsfisher.com