On Thu, 03 Feb 2005 11:09:21 -0600, Conan the Librarian
wrote:

Charlie Choc wrote:

You don't want to wear studded boots, the rocks you need to climb over are too
hard for the studs to get a grip and it will be like wearing rollerblades. In
June you should be able to wet wade everywhere.

But will plain felts be OK for hiking? I know that mine (Hodgemans)
offer less than ideal traction when hiking.

Plain felts should be OK for that, or you can just wear sneakers and carry
your wading shoes. The biggest problem I have with felts and hiking is in the
fall when everything is covered with wet leaves.
--
Charlie...
http://www.chocphoto.com/ - photo galleries
http://www.chocphoto.com/roff

He's ALIVE!!! He's ALIVE!!!!

Damn, Waldo, whereinthehell ya been?

Danl


hey danl,

i been fishin and drinkin and whor... ummm..... dreamin down here in ole nor
cackalackey.

and lookin fer da caps key... howzat work?

seriously..... just working way too much and fishing very little. when marie
and i moved down here to morganton last fall, i made a decision not to
install a 'puter in the house, hence my lack of roff adventures. there are
times i've wanted the puter handy at night to come here and play..... but
it's nice to just relax and read some good books.

see ya,

waldo

Ken Fortenberry wrote:

First and foremost you should remember that Graham County is a
dry county. [shudder] I get the heebie jeebies just thinking
about it.

It's not a big deal to me. I lived in Nashville, I can remember
when they first were trying to pass liquor-by-the-drink laws there. And
the little town I live in here doesn't sell booze in its stores.

I just make sure to stock up when I'm in civilization. :-)

I don't think Forney is worth the hike, in fact the only *must
fish* stream in the Park is Hazel in my opinion. One not on your
list that fishes pretty well at that time is the Slickrock on the
NC-Tenn. border. Nice browns in there but it's a hike and a half.
And don't forget Santeetlah, they stock it but it's a gorgeous
place to fish.

Thanks for the suggestions. I had intended to include Slickrock,
but had a brain fart and typed "Sl*ck" instead. But if *you* say it's a
hike and a half, I'll probably pass. :-)

I'd like to do Hazel, but I'd need some reassurance that the guys
who ferry you across will return the same day to pick you up.

Like Charlie said, waders are not necessary, just good wading
boots. Fly selection isn't all that critical, something gray,
something yellow, something orange and a handful of Royal Wulffs
should do.

As for pests none that you mentioned are worth worrying about
as much as the killer rhodos and the dry county.

The dry country I can deal with, the rhodos I'm not so sure. It's
been a while since I tackled rhodo hells. Used to hike and camp (even
though it wasn't legal) in the Fall Creek Falls park in Tennessee, and
depending on the water level of the creek, you were at the mercy of the
rhodos.

And I wasn't even trying to flyfish in those days. Yikes.

I recommend at least one dinner at the Fryemont Inn in Bryson
City. It's a cool old place and the dinner is good and cheap.

Thanks, now that you mention it, I remember seeing you write about
that spot from one of the NC claves (or was it an anti-clave?). I'll
make plans to check it out. Is it a BYOB place?


Chuck Vance

ezflyfisher wrote:

hey chuck,

focus on santeelah and snowbird. both are excellent streams and are easy to
get to. the park streams are more effort and the illini budsotten fellah is
correct.... forn is a worthless stream... a godforsakend, snakeinfested
debacle of moral unrighteousness and totally devoid of any piscatorial
life...

Wow, it's that good, huh? :-)

as far as flies go.... the ones you mentioned are fine along with a madamx
and a ...

http://wilsoncreekoutfitters.com/hotflies.html

Thanks for the link, waldo.

if by chance you make it eastward, stop on by the shop to say hi and i'll
point ya in a good direction to some waters in this area....

Very generous of you. If time permits, I'm hoping to head towards
Boone. If I do, I'll definitely make plans to come and visit.


Chuck Vance

Conan the Librarian wrote:
Ken Fortenberry wrote:
I recommend at least one dinner at the Fryemont Inn in Bryson
City. It's a cool old place and the dinner is good and cheap.

Thanks, now that you mention it, I remember seeing you write about
that spot from one of the NC claves (or was it an anti-clave?). I'll
make plans to check it out. Is it a BYOB place?

No, they have a pedestrian little wine list and a nice bar
off the dining room for an after dinner drink. Bryson City
is in Swain County, much more civilized than Graham County. ;-)

--
Ken Fortenberry

On Thu, 03 Feb 2005 11:19:03 -0600, Conan the Librarian
wrote:

Ken Fortenberry wrote:

I recommend at least one dinner at the Fryemont Inn in Bryson
City. It's a cool old place and the dinner is good and cheap.

Thanks, now that you mention it, I remember seeing you write about
that spot from one of the NC claves (or was it an anti-clave?). I'll
make plans to check it out. Is it a BYOB place?

At one of the NC claves I mentioned I liked the food there and 40 went to some
length on how pedestrian he thought the place was. I do like the food there,
and the place has a bar. FWIW
--
Charlie...
http://www.chocphoto.com/ - photo galleries
http://www.chocphoto.com/roff

On 2/3/05 12:13 PM, in article ,
"ezflyfisher" wrote:


He's ALIVE!!! He's ALIVE!!!!

Damn, Waldo, whereinthehell ya been?

Danl


hey danl,

i been fishin and drinkin and whor... ummm..... dreamin down here in ole nor
cackalackey.

and lookin fer da caps key... howzat work?

seriously..... just working way too much and fishing very little. when marie
and i moved down here to morganton last fall, i made a decision not to
install a 'puter in the house, hence my lack of roff adventures. there are
times i've wanted the puter handy at night to come here and play..... but
it's nice to just relax and read some good books.

Well, my friend, this book thing will only lead to ruin and damnation, I can
tell you. Late nights, early morning, bleary eyes, over long sentences when
selling hook-less yallerhammers... Not good. Not good at all.


Bill

thanks wolfgang...


After much Googling and consulting Lawrence's _The Fly Fisherman's
Guide to the Great Smoky Mountains National Park_, Jacobs' _Trout
Streams of Southern Appalachia_, and the Delorme for NC, I have
identified B*g Sn*wb*rd, N*l*nd, Abr*ms, H*z*l, F*rn*y, D**p and Sl*ck
Creeks as well as the West Prong of the Pigeon, the Little and
possibly
some sections of the Oconaluftee (sp?) River as places worth
investigating. (I know ... I can't expect to do them all. :-)

um...how long will you be in the area? a month may not be enough time. g

snowbird is an "everyman's" stream. it's stocked from its mouth at the
lake all the way up to the "junction" where the big snowbird backcountry
trail begins. there are some big browns and rainbows in the stocked
areas. upstream of the junction are wild fish. easy hike for the most
part. you should fish a section of the upstream areas at least once.
walk the trail for 45 minutes. it's important to plan your entry and
exit as the upstream banks are steep in places, and the rhodo
unforgiving. but, if you work a bit at finding a less traveled entry
and exit...or you are willing to fish a long day and beyond the easy
exits, you'll be rewarded. above the first falls are brookies. the
stream from mouth to upper falls is around 20 miles of fishable water.
little snowbird (it joins big snowbird at the turn off the paved road)
also holds nice fish.

big santeetlah above the stewart cabin (go at least one mile) is a
stream of big boulders and scaleable waterfalls. in its upper-middle
reaches, it may well be the most beautiful stream in nc imo. it has
pocket water, long runs, riffles, deep pools, and some big fish (in nc
terms). i know they stock the lower portion, but i'm not sure about the
upper section. it's an unpredictable stream...feast or famine.

little santeetlah (go to joyce kilmer nat'l forest entry and trail) is
full of little rainbows. it's fun to fish once you get away from the
trail. i took rachel there one day in october and fished above the
first bridge so she could walk along with me.

in the park, on the nc side, eagle, hazel, forney, noland, and deep
creeks are the primary streams for fishing. noland and deep creek are
close to bryson city. you can drive to a parking area, then hike as
much as you choose on a trail that parallels the streams. i've avoided
deep creek because it's a popular camping, day-hiking area - even has
inner tube squealers in the lower stretch. i'm told it gets better the
farther upstream you walk. noland is an easy walk and holds lots of
typical nc small rainbows. it's a pretty place, and oddly enough, it's
rarely crowded. you can dayhike to forney from the noland parking lot
by the tunnel - the end of the road to nowhere. i've not done the hike,
but i have boated across the lake to its mouth.

eagle and hazel are on the west side (near fontana dam). you can hike
to eagle from the dam...but, the boat ride there and to hazel are more
pleasant. in june, there will be crowds on the weekends, but probably
nothing like you're accustomed to out west. still, i'd recommend a
weekday visit. fontana marina has water taxi service, and they'll put
you in with some others to make the cost worthwhile. you can rent a
boat with a 9.9 outboard for about $50 for the day. hazel is the
biggest watershed of the streams and holds the most promise for a large
wild trout on a dry fly in nc.

i've not fished abrams...it's in tennessee by cades cove.


I have also been tying with an eye towards the obvious flies for
the
area (Adams, caddis, yellow and orange palmers, NC Wulffs,
yallerhammers, etc.).

in june, parachute adams, sulphurs, elk hair caddis, stimulators,
hoppers, humpies, royal wulff, and trudes work. there's really not much
that won't work...even madame x's and tarantulas. stealth and placement
are key. screw the yallerhammer myth...it's a nice story, but the fly
isn't equal to the fables, imo. try what you feel most confident and
comfortable fishing... nc trout are starving, opportunistic feeders, but
scare easily. once spooked, they'll have lockjaw for a while. there
aren't many fish per mile, so don't stay in one place too long. hiking
up the stream is part of the joy of stalking nc trout. kinda like quail
hunting...


So, now I need some advice from youse guys and gals. In addition
to
the above creeks, are there any other must-fish spots that I am
missing?

you've got enough to keep you busy. there are others, and you'll
definitely miss them... g


On the dangers of the park and environs: I've read of timber
rattlers, cottonmouths, bears and yellowjackets as the likely "pests"
I
might run into. At that time of year (first week of June), which of
the
above would you expect to be more active/likely to encounter? FWIW,
I'm
familiar with rattlers, cottonmouths and yellowjackets. I've only
seen
bears from a distance ... a *long* distance.

I've also read that a couple of the creeks are considered
dangerous
for a fisherperson to explore alone (Abr*ms, in particular). Also,
felt
soles are mentioned as a must for negotiating the streams. But felt
soles are a pain for hiking any distance (especially if the terrain is
rough). Would my studded Aquastealth boots be a viable option in that
area? I know I love them for hiking, but have had mixed results
depending on the composition of the stream bottom.

felt soles...forget the aquastealths. but, if you choose to use the
aquastealths, will you allow me to acquire a bit of life insurance on
your life? normal vigilance and precaution, and you'll be fine. never
had a problem with snakes, bears, or boars. have been stung by
yellowjackets, but i stepped on their home.


Also, at that time of year should I plan to wet-wade, or would
breathables be useful to carry?

wet wade...but, it's always nice to have waders along when you want to
stay dry or bumpass down a ridge bank.

On food and libations: As I understand it, Bryson City is
probably
the closest place to go for adult beverages. Is it also the best
place
for stocking up on groceries, or can I plan to do that in
Robbinsville?

ingles in robbinsville is a better than decent full-sized grocery store
in robbinsville. alcohol can be found in andrews as well as in bryson
city.

Are there any decent places to eat in Robbinsville

sort of... there's a mexican restaurant, a chinese restaurant (buffet
style), and a new place called the magnolia cafe...all located at or
near the main intersection. also a pizza place, and there's a great
little coffee, pastry/sandwich shop called rosie's up on top of main
street. none of the restaurants are "gourmet", but each is pleasant
enough and offers filling food that tastes good enough after a long day.
prices are inexpensive. over on the south side of santeetlah, at the
beginning of the cherohala skyway is the snowbird lodge...gourmet
dining, gourmet pricing.

bryson city is a tourist venue for the great smoky mountain railway, the
GSMNP, and nantahala outdoor center. fryemont inn offers decent food and
drinks, and there are other typical restaurants in the area. it's about
30-40 minutes from robbinsville to bryson city.

(or in Bryson
City,
for that matter)? (FWIW, I'll be renting a house with a full kitchen,
so when I'm not on the water, I'll be eating most of my meals at the
house.)

where is the place located?


On general sightseeing: Supposedly the Cherohala Skyway is a
must,
and I expect I'll want to hit the Blue Ridge Parkway for at least part
of a day (maybe towards Boone, as I've got an old friend living
nearby).

Boone is about 3.5 hours northwest of robbinsville. it's a full day
round trip. if you do it, i'd suggest getting on the BRP around
asheville...it runs a fairly decent, albeit slower course, up to boone,
passing by mt. mitchell and grandfather mountain.

How about the Foothills Parkway?

huh?? that's gotta be over in tennessee somewhere... about the only
reason to leave graham county to see anything in tennessee would be to
fish some of the good border waters on that side of the smokies, or if
dolly was gonna bare her breasts and tickets were cheap... g

Any other must-see spots?

fontana dam, tail-of-the-dragon, cades cove, asheville's biltmore house,
mount mitchell... but, are you goin fishin or what? g.

jeff

Conan the Librarian wrote:

But will plain felts be OK for hiking? I know that mine (Hodgemans)
offer less than ideal traction when hiking.

Hiking will wear out felt soles pretty quickly. I usually carry my
wading boots to where I'll fish if I have to hike more than a mile or two.

--
Cut "to the chase" for my email address.

Charlie Choc wrote:
At one of the NC claves I mentioned I liked the food there and 40 went to some
length on how pedestrian he thought the place was. I do like the food there,
and the place has a bar. FWIW

Pedestrian doesn't preclude good and cheap. The fare *is* pedestrian,
and it's also good and cheap. I think the Fryemont is the best dinner
value in Bryson City. Pick it up and put it in Urbana and I wouldn't
eat there. I might have a cheap cognac (that's the only kind they
have ;-) at their bar after dinner though. The building is cool and
worth a visit in its own right.

--
Ken Fortenberry