Speaking of yaks . . .
 

Speaking of yaks . . .
 

On 04 Mar 2004 23:06:18 GMT, irate (Dave LaCourse) wrote:

Fortenberry writes:

You get up in arms when "corporate executives" want to build a condo
in the area but you don't have a problem with buzzing up and down your
favorite trout stream in a goddamn $3000 peewee jet ski ?

Remember this picture ?

http://www.flyrodreel.com/conservation112k.html

--
Ken Fortenberry

I get upset when greed overcomes some people, including corporate execs. There
are outboards already on Pond in the River, and have been for 50 years. These
same outboards (9.9 hp) go to the Spawning Beds and anchor to fish. They also
go up-river to Wing Dam, and I've seen one in Chubs Pool.
[snipped]

Hartwell roaring around Chubs drunk as hell in his gas powered dinghy while
threatening the sports - that what you have in mind? ;-)

Just so nobody reaches an erroneous conclusion, on any given day outboards are
a very infrequent sight on the Rapid, even on the busiest days when the banks
are riddled with waders. I've spent many a day on the more navigable parts of
the river without seeing a single powered boat. And when you see them they're
almost always motoring across Pondy, not running the river proper.

Folks have managed to fish the river without resorting to powered boats for a
few hundred years. I'd like to think most folks would prefer to keep it that
way for at least a few more years....

/daytripper

Speaking of yaks . . .
 

Dave T. writes:

Hartwell roaring around Chubs drunk as hell in his gas powered dinghy while
threatening the sports - that what you have in mind? ;-)

Uh..... it's HartFORD, and no, that is not what I had in mind. Peter B. and I
had his boat in Chubs one day several years ago. Caught lots of nice salmon...
no brookies.


Just so nobody reaches an erroneous conclusion, on any given day outboards
are
a very infrequent sight on the Rapid, even on the busiest days when the banks
are riddled with waders. I've spent many a day on the more navigable parts of
the river without seeing a single powered boat. And when you see them they're
almost always motoring across Pondy, not running the river proper.

Did I say "running the river proper"? I have seen several outboards go up the
current into Wing Dam Pool *without* bothering any fishermen. And, while you
can fish the Spawning Beds while wading, they are best fished by boat. Just
think, fish Wing Dam, 2nd Current, 1st Current, and if nothing is happening,
voila, in three minutes you're at The Spawning Beds.

Folks have managed to fish the river without resorting to powered boats for a
few hundred years. I'd like to think most folks would prefer to keep it that
way for at least a few more years....


Including me, but when you are a ":over the hill, dried up, ex-kinda-military
person", who is near his end, you need all the help you can get. Right? I
guess since Kerry is in his 60s, is also survivor of prostate cancer, and was
in the military, he must also fit that description, wot? Too sad, David.
When you have and,hopefully, recover from prostate cancer, I sure hope no one
calls you dried up. A rather cheap shot I'd say. But, forgivable. d;o)

Dave

http://hometown.aol.com/davplac/myhomepage/index.html

Speaking of yaks . . .
 

"Dave LaCourse" wrote in message
...
Dave T. writes:

Hartwell roaring around Chubs drunk as hell in his gas powered dinghy
while
threatening the sports - that what you have in mind? ;-)

Uh..... it's HartFORD, and no, that is not what I had in mind. Peter B.
and I
had his boat in Chubs one day several years ago. Caught lots of nice
salmon...
no brookies.


Just so nobody reaches an erroneous conclusion, on any given day
outboards
are
a very infrequent sight on the Rapid, even on the busiest days when the
banks
are riddled with waders. I've spent many a day on the more navigable
parts of
the river without seeing a single powered boat. And when you see them
they're
almost always motoring across Pondy, not running the river proper.

Did I say "running the river proper"? I have seen several outboards go up
the
current into Wing Dam Pool *without* bothering any fishermen. And, while
you
can fish the Spawning Beds while wading, they are best fished by boat.
Just
think, fish Wing Dam, 2nd Current, 1st Current, and if nothing is
happening,
voila, in three minutes you're at The Spawning Beds.

Folks have managed to fish the river without resorting to powered boats
for a
few hundred years. I'd like to think most folks would prefer to keep it
that
way for at least a few more years....


Including me, but when you are a ":over the hill, dried up,
ex-kinda-military
person", who is near his end, you need all the help you can get. Right?
I
guess since Kerry is in his 60s, is also survivor of prostate cancer, and
was
in the military, he must also fit that description, wot? Too sad, David.
When you have and,hopefully, recover from prostate cancer, I sure hope no
one
calls you dried up. A rather cheap shot I'd say. But, forgivable. d;o)

Dave

Thus demonstrating that a proper and thorough education in philosophy begins
and ends with.........Pogo.

Wolfgang
who never did believe that a placenta was anything to write home about.
:)

Speaking of yaks . . .
 

On 05 Mar 2004 02:07:08 GMT, irate (Dave LaCourse) wrote:

Dave T. writes:

Hartwell roaring around Chubs drunk as hell in his gas powered dinghy while
threatening the sports - that what you have in mind? ;-)

Uh..... it's HartFORD, and no, that is not what I had in mind. Peter B. and I
had his boat in Chubs one day several years ago. Caught lots of nice salmon...
no brookies.


Just so nobody reaches an erroneous conclusion, on any given day outboards
are
a very infrequent sight on the Rapid, even on the busiest days when the banks
are riddled with waders. I've spent many a day on the more navigable parts of
the river without seeing a single powered boat. And when you see them they're
almost always motoring across Pondy, not running the river proper.

Did I say "running the river proper"? I have seen several outboards go up the
current into Wing Dam Pool *without* bothering any fishermen. And, while you
can fish the Spawning Beds while wading, they are best fished by boat. Just
think, fish Wing Dam, 2nd Current, 1st Current, and if nothing is happening,
voila, in three minutes you're at The Spawning Beds.

Folks have managed to fish the river without resorting to powered boats for a
few hundred years. I'd like to think most folks would prefer to keep it that
way for at least a few more years....


Including me, but when you are a ":over the hill, dried up, ex-kinda-military
person", who is near his end, you need all the help you can get. Right? I
guess since Kerry is in his 60s, is also survivor of prostate cancer, and was
in the military, he must also fit that description, wot? Too sad, David.
When you have and,hopefully, recover from prostate cancer, I sure hope no one
calls you dried up. A rather cheap shot I'd say. But, forgivable. d;o)

Yeah, sure Dave.

Btw, if "They also go up-river to Wing Dam, and I've seen one in Chubs Pool"
doesn't mean running motors up the river, you're a worse trimmer than those
you've accused in the past...

/daytripper (So you have that going for you - along with your memory :-P)

Speaking of yaks . . .
 

"riverman" wrote in message
...

"Peter Charles" wrote in message
om...
Ken Fortenberry wrote in message
. com...
Peter Charles wrote:

... It would seem to beat the canoe alternative.

Why ? I mean for people of close to average proportions who can
walk and chew gum at the same time, why does a sit-on-top kayak
beat a solo canoe ?

Getting in and out, control, ease of beaching, weathercocking, ease of
putting on top of car, won't swamp. I'm neither an expert at canoes
or yaks but given my physical limitations, a yak seems better. I'm
prepared to be proven wrong.

Let me try, Peter, and repay you for your gentle introduction to roff a
few
years ago.

First, note that kayaks have decks, and sprayskirts to keep the water out
of
your lap. This applies to high-volume touring boats as well as smaller
playboats, which is not what you are interested in. This gives you an
'inside' for your gear, but it is not quickly accessible, or conducive for
a
long rod. SOTs, OTOH, are like sitting on a surfboard, so there is no
'inside' for your gear: it sits on top with you. That makes it easy to get
at, but also easy to fall out or for stuff to fall overboard.

Kayaks turn over pretty easily, and beginners always swim when they do.
This goes for SOTs also, so expect to lose some fishing gear when that
happens. Kayaks are inherenly less stable than canoes, ride lower in the
water so they swamp easier if you don't have the skirt on, are harder to
steer straight, and get very antsy in moving water. Working the blade can
be
a bit uninstinctual, especially if you are panicking. You also sit closer
to
the surface, have no place to put your paddle when you are casting (and
having it drift off is a bad thing), they are quite hard to get in and out
of when you are on a steep shore, and you cannot take a **** out of them
easily.

Canoes, OTOH, are very stable, do not tip over easily (at least, as easily
as a yak), you can stand to cast if you want, have a spacious 'inside' for
your gear, including a fully-rigged rod, beach easily, can be turned over
for a table, and you can take a friend. You can put your paddle and gear
in
it quickly and easily, can carry lunch, your gear won't wash overboard if
you drop it, and you can even carry extra rods easily.

The only real advantage to a yak is the weight for putting it on the roof
of
your car. However, some canoes (kevlar ones) are incredibly lightweight,
although they are incredibly expensive, and there are many tricks for
loading any canoe on a roof.

Your best bet is to try each one a few times. I could not imagine trying
to
fish out of a yak, nor could I imagine any portable boat more appropriate
and versatile than a canoe.

--riverman


I have a Klepper Aerius that doesn't turn over easily. You can in fact set
on the gunwals and it will not flip over, you may fall out but it will
remain upright. When your done paddling it knocks down into three bags
which fit in the trunk of the car.

Speaking of yaks . . .
 

Dave T. writes:

Yeah, sure Dave.

Btw, if "They also go up-river to Wing Dam, and I've seen one in Chubs Pool"
doesn't mean running motors up the river, you're a worse trimmer than those
you've accused in the past...

/daytripper (So you have that going for you - along with your memory :-P)

The boats that Lakewood guests have at the Pond in the River have been going
"up-river" to the Wing Dam pool for as long as I've been going to the Rapid.
Also, locals come in from lower Pond in the River with their own boats/canoes.
I have yet to see *anyone* disrupt another fisherman with his boat. If there
is no one fishing second current, I have seen friends putt putt up to the pool.
Ain't nothing wrong with that. The same people will walk the boat up next to
the island if there is someone in the current. Again, no problem. I have seen
yaks go up the 3rd current when folks have been fishing the 2nd. Again, no
problem. I think you're just ****ed that you didn't think of it first.....
sorta like the Green Rockworm and the Parachute Pheasant Tails. d;o) But, ya
gotta admit, from 2nd current to the Spawning Beds in under 4 minutes is
something else - and it's done without the noise of an outboard, OR its
polution.

Do you really think Kerry is an "over the hill, dried-up, ex-kinda-military"?
Shame on you. d;0p. Hey, Frank, and Frank, and Stev, and Warren, and BJ, and
Dave B., and Bob, and Jeffie, et al, don't grow old, get prostate cancer and
survive it handily, 'cause Tatosian won't like it!
Dave

http://hometown.aol.com/davplac/myhomepage/index.html

Speaking of yaks . . .
 

On 05 Mar 2004 04:23:57 GMT, irate (Dave LaCourse) wrote:
[snipped more weak rationalizations]
Do you really think Kerry is an "over the hill, dried-up, ex-kinda-military"?
Shame on you. d;0p. Hey, Frank, and Frank, and Stev, and Warren, and BJ, and
Dave B., and Bob, and Jeffie, et al, don't grow old, get prostate cancer and
survive it handily, 'cause Tatosian won't like it!
Dave

So much for "forgiving", huh Dave? You said that - what - two posts ago, but
you forgot already? That's been your life lately, isn't - say one thing,
immediately do another. Must be hell. Enjoy your stay.

btw, Kerry saw combat while your boy was MIA, OUI, OTL and AFU.

Yet you lose no opportunity to denigrate a decorated combat veteran, while
fawning over a no show phony who was born on third base and thought he hit a
triple. Seems like you got a serious hitch in your jingoism?

/daytripper (Maybe an education would have been a good thing after all? :-P

Speaking of yaks . . .
 

Yet you lose no opportunity to denigrate a decorated combat veteran,

How am I denigrating a combat veteran. *You're* the one that called him
over-the-hill,and dried-up.

When you misspeak, Dave, you can hurt those around you. And, yes, I have
misspoken and have hurt others, but I try to apologize for it. You,
otoh,...........

Dave

http://hometown.aol.com/davplac/myhomepage/index.html

Speaking of yaks . . .
 

Dave LaCourse wrote:

How am I denigrating a combat veteran. ...

Say WHAT ?!? Are you senile already ? You don't remember denigrating
both John Kerry and Max Cleland just a few short days ago ? Your
"waving his limbs around" crack was about as low a cheap shot as
any I've ever heard from a poorly educated jingo ****head.

--
Ken Fortenberry

Speaking of yaks . . .
 

Fortenberry writes:

Say WHAT ?!? Are you senile already ? You don't remember denigrating
both John Kerry and Max Cleland just a few short days ago ? Your
"waving his limbs around" crack was about as low a cheap shot as
any I've ever heard from a poorly educated jingo ****head.

Guilty as charged and I admitted that I was wrong. But the thread about yaks
contained no denigration, just a comparison. I guess it is ok for Tatosian to
be mean spirited about my cancer but not about Kerry's. Kerry suffered the
same cancer as I did, and Tatosian is making fun of it. That is all I was
saying.

Poorly educated? Yeah, I guess so. But I think I'm a little more tolerant
that you, and others.
Dave

http://hometown.aol.com/davplac/myhomepage/index.html

Speaking of yaks . . .
 

"riverman" wrote in message ...
"B J Conner" wrote in message
...

I have a Klepper Aerius that doesn't turn over easily. You can in fact set
on the gunwals and it will not flip over, you may fall out but it will
remain upright. When your done paddling it knocks down into three bags
which fit in the trunk of the car.


Ahh, there's a boat I've always been interested in! Tell me more about it,
BJ. Can you stand up in it, how durable is the skin (puncture proof as well
as abrasion proof), how heavy is it when it is packed, does it always pack
to the original size (so many things never seem to fit back into the damn
box), and how much does it cost? Can you do home repairs on it, and how
stiff is it once its set up?

--riverman

Ours weighs about 75- 80 lbs, it's an older one the packs in three
bags (new ones are two).
The bottom is Hypalon and pretty tough. We have never made a habit of
running over sharp rocks but it has stood up well to rocks, branches,
oysters, barb wire and sand ( a few scrapes with barbed wire was the
worst thing we encountered. The factory patch kit fixed it right up).
Ours is 25 years old and still in good shape. I put duct tape on the
keels every year.
Putting it together and back in the bag is easy. You have to develope
a routine so you get every part back in. leaving one of the ribs or
bulkheads on the beach would sure spoil a trip. There are no small
parts like screws to loose. The dealer will make you put it together
and back a couple of times before you leave the store.
The frame flexs and creeks a little but you get use to it. People
surf with them. We have been in rivers but not in any extream rapids.
The whole thing is extreamly well made, if you haven't seen one go
find one look it over. The are remarkabley well made ( two I know of
are in museusms )
The real advantage to it is that it fits in a car. We use to always
have it the back of the car or truck. If you see some little pond or
swamp you want to explore in about 15 minutes your in the water. We
use it for fishing, watching birds and animals and just general
exploring.
I have stood up in. Don recommed it. A friend has stood up in it
twice and fell out, Each time the boat remained upright. Like most
kayaks the seat will turn out to be harder than you butt after a few
hours.

Heres their link
http://www.klepper.com/
I saving up for a new expedition model. I've seen them in baggage at
airports.

Speaking of yaks . . .
 

Dave LaCourse wrote:
Fortenberry writes:


Say WHAT ?!? Are you senile already ? You don't remember denigrating
both John Kerry and Max Cleland just a few short days ago ? Your
"waving his limbs around" crack was about as low a cheap shot as
any I've ever heard from a poorly educated jingo ****head.


Guilty as charged and I admitted that I was wrong.

Yep. You took full responsibility and wiped the slate clean.

But the thread about yaks
contained no denigration, just a comparison. I guess it is ok for Tatosian to
be mean spirited about my cancer but not about Kerry's. Kerry suffered the
same cancer as I did, and Tatosian is making fun of it. That is all I was
saying.

I can tell that you're really, really mad when you start calling
Daytripper by his real name. You do the same thing with me, just before
you get to the "putz" phase and the subsequent apology.

Don't you ever learn, Dave? Before this is over, you'll be apologizing
once again.

--
Cut "to the chase" for my email address.

Speaking of yaks . . .
 

rw writes:

Don't you ever learn, Dave? Before this is over, you'll be apologizing
once again.

I have nothing to apologize for because I have said nothing to offend anyone.
OTOH, if *I* had made fun of Tatosian's cancer, I think the uproar from you and
Fortenberry would be heard around the world. I was and am simply comparing my
cancer ordeal with Kerry's.

As far as calling him by his name, if you check back, I usually refer to him as
Dave T., DT, etc, and hardly ever as Day Tripper. That is almost as silly as
Royal Wulff.
Dave

http://hometown.aol.com/davplac/myhomepage/index.html

Speaking of yaks . . .
 

Almost forgot: For all you folks out there approaching 55 or so, chances are
you will have prostate cancer before too long. If caught early it can be cured
by removing the organ and leaving certain nerve endings that are necessary so
you will not be incontinent and can get/maintain an erection. Sex is better
afterwards because you are "dried up" just as Tatosian says, and you don't have
to worry about the wet spot.

It is NO joking matter regardless who has it. Most of you will be in the same
situation as I am. Get your PSAs checked and a DRE at least once a year. Like
I said, caught early, it can be cured with very little after affects.
Dave

http://hometown.aol.com/davplac/myhomepage/index.html

Speaking of yaks . . .
 

On 05 Mar 2004 15:39:34 GMT, irate (Dave LaCourse)
wrote:

I have nothing to apologize for because I have said nothing to offend anyone.
OTOH, if *I* had made fun of Tatosian's cancer,

I missed that part. What did DT say about your cancer?
--
Charlie...

Speaking of yaks . . .
 

Charlie Choc wrote in message . ..
On Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:22:43 +0100, "riverman"
wrote:

Anyway, SOTs, DPCs, Kayaks etc all leave your butt too close to the water
for a good cast, IMNSHO.

Those pictures of "double-paddle" canoes (and the acronyms above) sure
blur the line between what's a kayak and what's a canoe. My curious
mind wants to know -- what features distinguish one from the other?

that it's harder to cast sitting down that makes it more difficult
from a kayak, not having your butt at water level.

You're right -- for about 70% of it. I'd still put 30% for the
level and manner at which you are sitting. Certainly sitting on
a canoe seat with your legs below you (and braced on the sides)
rather than straight out makes casting easier.

When I'm wading butt-deep in water, I'm rarely trying to make
long casts -- I'm probably chucking nymphs into the deep water in
front of me. On a lake, covering water is essential, and
anything to help cast longer is worth it. I agree with riverman
about standing -- I'm almost always standing in our canoe when
casting. I wouldn't buy a solo boat that I couldn't stand up
and cast in.

I'd still buy the boat below if I was looking and had $1000 to
spa

http://www.springcreekprams.com/stillwat.htm

Jon.

Speaking of yaks . . .
 

"Charlie Choc" wrote in
message ...
On 05 Mar 2004 15:39:34 GMT, irate (Dave LaCourse)
wrote:

I have nothing to apologize for because I have said nothing to
offend anyone.
OTOH, if *I* had made fun of Tatosian's cancer,

I missed that part. What did DT say about your cancer?

Absolutely nothing. Merely another fugue state.

Wolfgang

Speaking of yaks . . .
 

In article ,
says...


Those pictures of "double-paddle" canoes (and the acronyms above) sure
blur the line between what's a kayak and what's a canoe. My curious
mind wants to know -- what features distinguish one from the other?

That's a matter of some debate. One article I read finally settled
on rolling as the criterion. If you can roll it, it's a kayak. If
you can't, it's a canoe.


I'd still buy the boat below if I was looking and had $1000 to
spa

http://www.springcreekprams.com/stillwat.htm


If you have a few basic tools, a gallon of epoxy and two sheets of
1/4" plywood, you can build this in a couple of weeks of part-time
work:

http://www.instantboats.com/nymph.htm

Kevin

Speaking of yaks . . .
 

Jonathan Cook wrote:


When I'm wading butt-deep in water, I'm rarely trying to make
long casts -- I'm probably chucking nymphs into the deep water in
front of me.

The opposite is often true for me especially on larger rivers. When I
wade that deep, I'm usually trying to reach a fish or a holding area
that's some distance away. For stream and river fishing I try to fish as
close as possible in order to get the greatest control over the drift.
However, there are a couple of techniques that work well, sometimes
better, with a long cast. Like Charlie said, if you keep your back cast
up, wading deep shouldn't hurt your cast.

Willi

Speaking of yaks . . .
 

Charlie Choc wrote:
On 05 Mar 2004 15:39:34 GMT, irate (Dave LaCourse)
wrote:


I have nothing to apologize for because I have said nothing to offend anyone.
OTOH, if *I* had made fun of Tatosian's cancer,


I missed that part. What did DT say about your cancer?

I missed that, too.

--
Cut "to the chase" for my email address.

Speaking of yaks . . .
 

Charlie Choc wrote:

Dave LaCourse wrote:

I have nothing to apologize for because I have said nothing to offend anyone.
OTOH, if *I* had made fun of Tatosian's cancer,

I missed that part. What did DT say about your cancer?

Only LaCourse made mention of cancer in this thread and the first
reference was a petulant reply to 'tripper's hope that folks could
manage to fish the Rapid without resorting to peewee jet skis.

Only in the perverse mind of LaCourse is there a connection between
prostate cancer and 'tripper's remarks on peewee jet skis.

I guess another apology is in order.

--
Ken Fortenberry

Speaking of yaks . . .
 

Fortenberry writes:

Only LaCourse made mention of cancer in this thread and the first
reference was a petulant reply to 'tripper's hope that folks could
manage to fish the Rapid without resorting to peewee jet skis.

Only in the perverse mind of LaCourse is there a connection between
prostate cancer and 'tripper's remarks on peewee jet skis.

I guess another apology is in order.

--
Ken Fortenberry

Wrong. I was referring to another thread. Tatosian knows which one. He
called me an "over the hill, dried-up, ex-sorta-military". The over the hill
refers to my age, the dried-up refers to my inability to ejaculate because of
cancer (but not my inability to reach orgasm, ima), and the ex-sort-military
refers to my 20 years in the military.

And he's also wrong about the Rapid, as you are. There have been outboards on
the river from Wing Dam Pool to Lower Dam for the past 50 years.

I should think both you and Tatosian owe me an apology, but I can hardly expect
one.
Dave

http://hometown.aol.com/davplac/myhomepage/index.html

Speaking of yaks . . .
 

"Jarmo Hurri" wrote in message
...

For YOU maybe. My backcasts slap the water when I'm standing ankle
deep.

Charlie You need to work on your backcast. Make sure the rod tip is
Charlie still going up when you do the 'speed up and stop' and your
Charlie backcast will stay above the water.

Yes indeed.

No slack, smooth acceleration until the very end, then a final
powerful acceleration ending in a sudden stop. And, as noted above,
make sure that when the rod unbends after the stop, it does not
project the line downwards.

Myron, if you email me your mail address, I can mail you some
photocopies with good pieces of text and illustrations. Assuming that
the mail system still (or now?) works in that part of the world...

--
Jarmo Hurri


Sure, Jarmo. You don't have my email?? Its firstnamelastname at yahoo dot
com. No spaces between the names, all lowercase. For the record, my last
name is buck and you know my first name.

--riverman
(the things we do to avoid bots. Weird, isn't it?)

Speaking of yaks . . .
 

On 05 Mar 2004 18:41:06 GMT, irate (Dave LaCourse)
wrote:

the dried-up refers to my inability to ejaculate because of
cancer (but not my inability to reach orgasm, ima),

You can't be serious? I have heard things described as dried-up, over
the hill for years. I think you are trying way too hard to be
offended.
--
Charlie...

Speaking of yaks . . .
 

"Dave LaCourse" schrieb im Newsbeitrag
...

Posting intimate details of yourself here is asking for trouble.

If you really want to be offended, you will be offended by practically
anything.

Blessed be he who expecteth nothing, for rarely will he be disappointed.

TL
MC

Speaking of yaks . . .
 

Some of what Ken Fortenberry wrote:
Perhaps I'd get used to it in time, but I don't
like the way you sit in a kayak...

I feel like I'm WEARING a kayak as opposed to paddling
it, which is a good thing I suppose if you want to squirt
around in white water, but that's not my thing.

This is the one of the most glaring misconceptions about modern day kayaks.
Folks either see some video footage or witness some playboaters in the
whitewater and assume that ALL kayaking is like that. This is just not true.
most of today's recreation class kayaks have large, easily accessible
cockpits that give plenty of room for entry and exit, stowing gear,
stripping line, etc. Rec boats have hulls that are wider and more "stable"
than their touring/sea kayak counterparts. Their hulls are also longer and
have more of a keel than whitewater boats, so they track more straight and
have better forward speed in still water paddling.

riverman wrote:
Kayaks turn over pretty easily, and beginners always swim when they do.

Kayaks are inherently less stable than canoes, ride lower in the
water so they swamp easier if you don't have the skirt on, are harder to
steer straight, and get very antsy in moving water.

Canoes, OTOH, are very stable, do not tip over easily (at least, as easily
as a yak)

The above statements couldn't be further from the truth. Sorry, riverman, I
am going to have to disagree with you. I thought you were a guide and
paddler, so your above statements surprise me.

The primary advantage of a kayak over a canoe is lower center of gravity.
The biggest fear of first time kayakers is that they are going to get wet
because of a rollover. The reality is that you are more likely to take a
highside spill out of a canoe, because (as far as weight distribution goes)
you basically sit "on top of " a canoe instead of inside it. Next, consider
the surface area of the sides of a canoe, even a low profile model, compared
to a kayak. The kayak is closer to the water and is not as easily affected
by the wind. In a good blow, the canoe sides act as a sail and push you most
likely where you do not want to go. Certain models of kayaks have waterproof
bulkheads and deck hatches for dry storage. In a canoe, you have to use dry
bags that are going to go drifting away when you take that spill mentioned
earlier. The best advice to heed is what someone mentioned earlier: go to an
outfitter's demo day and paddle several boats and make your own judgment.
The best boat (canoe or kayak) is the one that suits you and your needs
best.

C Ya,
Mikey



---
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Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.515 / Virus Database: 313 - Release Date: 9/1/2003

Speaking of yaks . . .
 

Mike Connor writes:

Posting intimate details of yourself here is asking for trouble.

I have never posted anything about myself that I thought was "intimate".
Tatosian knows that I had prostate cancer and he knows which method I used to
defeat it. I didn't have to post anything here.

And, besides, if I can help anyone as to prostate cancer, I am more than
willing. There is nothing intimate about it, nor anything to be ashamed of.
Dave

http://hometown.aol.com/davplac/myhomepage/index.html

Speaking of yaks . . .
 

"Dave LaCourse" wrote...
Mike Connor writes:
Posting intimate details of yourself here is asking for trouble.

I have never posted anything about myself that I thought was "intimate".
Tatosian knows that I had prostate cancer and he knows which method I used to
defeat it. I didn't have to post anything here.

Yeah, but we've all seen the pictures of you in your BVDs, and, well, the
thought of you with an erection (your mention, not mine) in the same outfit is a
bit scary. ;-)

And, besides, if I can help anyone as to prostate cancer, I am more than
willing. There is nothing intimate about it, nor anything to be ashamed of.

Certainly not. I'm not yet to the 55 limit, but I'm thinking it couldn't hurt
(much) to have that checked at the next physical.
--
TL,
Tim
------------------------
http://css.sbcma.com/timj

Speaking of yaks . . .
 

On 05 Mar 2004 19:25:37 GMT, irate (Dave LaCourse)
wrote:

I have never posted anything about myself that I thought was "intimate".
Tatosian knows that I had prostate cancer and he knows which method I used to
defeat it. I didn't have to post anything here.

And unless he says that's what he meant by "dried-up" I'll keep
thinking you're the only one who thought that. Not everything on roff
is about your dick, you know. g
--
Charlie...

Speaking of yaks . . .
 

Dave LaCourse wrote:

Wrong. I was referring to another thread. Tatosian knows which one. He
called me an "over the hill, dried-up, ex-sorta-military".

And what on earth does that thread have to do with what Dave said
about powerboats on the Rapid ? Like others have said, you go WAY
out of your way to pretend to be the offended party.

And he's also wrong about the Rapid, as you are. There have been outboards on
the river from Wing Dam Pool to Lower Dam for the past 50 years.

You're off base here, too. I did not presume that you would drive
a peewee jet ski on the Rapid even if it were illegal, I assumed
it WAS legal. I questioned why someone who cares about a trout stream
so much that they try to mobilize opposition to a zoning change would
buzz that same trout stream with a peewee jet ski. And you're the
one who's wrong about 4 strokes. They pollute LESS, and they make
LESS noise, but they are not emission free, pollution free nor noise
free.

I should think both you and Tatosian owe me an apology, but I can hardly expect
one.

What's written above is all the apology you'll ever get from me and
if you expect more you should change your expectations.

--
Ken Fortenberry

Speaking of yaks . . .
 

Tim J. writes:

Certainly not. I'm not yet to the 55 limit, but I'm thinking it couldn't hurt
(much) to have that checked at the next physical.

Do it. And it doesn't hurt. Doesn't feel good either, but it doesn't hurt.
Dave

http://hometown.aol.com/davplac/myhomepage/index.html

Speaking of yaks . . .
 

Charlie Choc writes:


And unless he says that's what he meant by "dried-up" I'll keep
thinking you're the only one who thought that. Not everything on roff
is about your dick, you know. g

Why don't you ask him, Charlie.
Dave

http://hometown.aol.com/davplac/myhomepage/index.html

Speaking of yaks . . .
 

Ken Fortenberry writes:

You're off base here, too. I did not presume that you would drive
a peewee jet ski on the Rapid even if it were illegal, I assumed
it WAS legal. I questioned why someone who cares about a trout stream
so much that they try to mobilize opposition to a zoning change would
buzz that same trout stream with a peewee jet ski.

Who said anything about "buzzing" around the trout stream? Certainly not me.
You do not know of what you speak, Ken. Boats have been used for 50 years to
traverse 2nd current (deep enough) to get to the Wing Dam Pool (very deep and
unfishable except it's edges). This jet kayak would be ideal for such an
application. Also, to go down-river (across Pond in the River), it would be
ideal, and would impact the river no more or less than what is now being done.

And you're the
one who's wrong about 4 strokes. They pollute LESS, and they make
LESS noise, but they are not emission free, pollution free nor noise
free.

Where did I say they were pollution free? Of all the engines out there, they
do pollute less (if at all), and they make less noice. Given the choice
between a two stroke outboard and a 4 stroke one, the 4 has far less of an
impact on the ecology.

I should think both you and Tatosian owe me an apology, but I can hardly
expect
one.

What's written above is all the apology you'll ever get from me and
if you expect more you should change your expectations.


I would never expect an apology for your personal insults, Ken. It just isn't
in your nature, and I know that. Nor would i expect one from Tatosian. So
much for the progressive, tolerant, left wingers.

Dave

http://hometown.aol.com/davplac/myhomepage/index.html

Speaking of yaks . . .
 

In article , Mikey
Darden wrote:

as easily
as a yak)

The above statements couldn't be further from the truth. Sorry, riverman, I
am going to have to disagree with you. I thought you were a guide and
paddler, so your above statements surprise me.

The primary advantage of a kayak

Thanks Mikey. I've been struggling through this typically cantankerous
thread wondering what the Thibetan pack animals had to do with it.
Dubbed yak fur?

Now I know.

L

--
Remover the rock from the email address

Speaking of yaks . . .
 

On 05 Mar 2004 20:06:47 GMT, irate (Dave LaCourse)
wrote:

Charlie Choc writes:


And unless he says that's what he meant by "dried-up" I'll keep
thinking you're the only one who thought that. Not everything on roff
is about your dick, you know. g

Why don't you ask him, Charlie.

Like I said, I'll keep believing you're the only one thinking that
until advised otherwise.
--
Charlie...

Speaking of yaks . . .
 

Charlie Choc writes:

Like I said, I'll keep believing you're the only one thinking that
until advised otherwise.
--

Ask him, Charlie. You have doubt. I don't. Ask him.
Dave

http://hometown.aol.com/davplac/myhomepage/index.html

Speaking of yaks . . .
 

On 05 Mar 2004 20:36:42 GMT, irate (Dave LaCourse)
wrote:

Charlie Choc writes:

Like I said, I'll keep believing you're the only one thinking that
until advised otherwise.
--

Ask him, Charlie. You have doubt. I don't. Ask him.

I don't have doubt.
--
Charlie...

Speaking of yaks . . .
 

Dave LaCourse wrote:
Charlie Choc writes:

Like I said, I'll keep believing you're the only one thinking that
until advised otherwise.

Ask him, Charlie. You have doubt. I don't. Ask him.

Oh fer christ's sake, Louie, you're positively delusional !! How
many people besides doctors and those who've had prostate surgery
even know such physiological arcana ? I sure as hell didn't, and
frankly I'd have been quite happy in that ignorance.

I made an ewww, ick remark about your pee stained tighty whiteys
being too close to my breakfast for comfort and you went totally
ballistic on me claiming that I was making fun of your surgically
induced "dribble factor" when all I was really doing was being
grossed out. It never occurred to me, and I'm sure it never occured
to 'tripper, that you'd take those remarks as cruel taunting about
prostate cancer.

You must have a very low opinion of both of us.

--
Ken Fortenberry

Speaking of yaks . . .
 

On 05 Mar 2004 18:41:06 GMT, irate (Dave LaCourse) wrote:

Fortenberry writes:

Only LaCourse made mention of cancer in this thread and the first
reference was a petulant reply to 'tripper's hope that folks could
manage to fish the Rapid without resorting to peewee jet skis.

Only in the perverse mind of LaCourse is there a connection between
prostate cancer and 'tripper's remarks on peewee jet skis.

I guess another apology is in order.

--
Ken Fortenberry

Wrong. I was referring to another thread. Tatosian knows which one. He
called me an "over the hill, dried-up, ex-sorta-military". The over the hill
refers to my age, the dried-up refers to my inability to ejaculate because of
cancer (but not my inability to reach orgasm, ima), and the ex-sort-military
refers to my 20 years in the military.

"Dave, you ignorant slut."

Tried to slide another Big Lie by, but by God the gang all spotted you for
what you have become. And Dave, it ain't pretty. Nope. Ugly, in fact.

You couldn't be more laughable than you are now - and with your track record
that's going way the heck off the edge of the chart - where only paranoid
decisional lurk (and once again - do enjoy your stay.)

Believe me when I say that "dried-up" comment had absolutely nothing to do
with any or all forms of any cancer that afflicted, afflicts, or may inflict
you in the future. Period.

Further, I stipulate that I couldn't care less about the state of your naughty
bits - vestigial nub with raisins *or* robustly functional.

Whatever - it makes no difference to me. And in fact, imagery being what it
can be, the much less said, the better.

The reason the above statements are true: It has never, ever even occurred to
me to somehow make fun of someone suffering from the same disease that killed
a FAR BETTER MAN THAN YOU.

OK? You getting all this, you flaming, whiney, hypocrite bitch?

And for future reference: when someone calls you "Numbnuts", they aren't
talking below your waist, they're talking above your head.

/daytripper (Back to you, Numbnuts...)