Thanks for filling me in on the Chagnon flap, Wolfgang.

.... his enthnography, "Yanomamo: The Fierce People." The book was hugely popular..

I can understand why. Two of my kids took his course and so the book
was lying around here, and I read it. Fascinating!

...the first to outsell Margaret Mead's "Coming of Age in Samoa,"

In that case, the cheap ******* could have afforded to buy cigarets
and beer for all of us!

(If I may digress even further off topic, you reminded me of a
humorous tale: When that book appeared--if that's the one in which
she argued that all social roles are culturally learned-- an older
anthropologist, perhaps Franz Boas, wrote a very brief book review in
one of the journals. I quote it in full: "It is a very nice book,
Margaret, but do you know any societies in which the men have the
babies?")

I notice you used the spelling "Yanomami" --ending in i--which I
recall seeing elsewhere. In his book, Chagnon uses the "o" ending.
Why are two different spellings used?

If you're interested, a Google search on Chagnon.....

I just did. A goldmine!

I'm not familiar with Redfield, Childe or Polanyi. I'll keep an eye out for
them.....

For Redfield, I recommend his _Primitive World and its
Transformations_, and a paper on the "Folk Society," an "ideal type"
construct. I encountered it as a reprint published by Bobbs-Merrill,
IIRC.

And that reminds me of _The Preindustrial City_ by Gideon Sjoberg,
another interesting discussion of "pre-modern" society. (I suppose an
anthropologist would be horrified by that term.)

Childe: A general intro to achaeology whose title I don't recall, and
_The Bronze Age_.

Polanyi: _The Great Transformation_ , Some of which Robert Heilbroner
adopted for his _Making of Economic Society_ ( like _The Worldly
Philosophers_ and _The Quest for Wealth_), a wonderful non-technical
intro to economics, and later his basic economics textbook, _The
Economic Problem_. Also, _Trade and Market in Ancient Empires_.

I still have a bit of uncovered floor space somewhere. :(

Wolfgang

You still have a few years to go. When you have reached my age, you
will no longer have that problem.

vince

Even more interesting than her analysis of Japanese national character
(still controversial, but highly respected nevertheless), I think, is
Benedict herself as a harbinger of great changes to come in American
culture. It was quite a step forward for a woman to be entrusted with the
critically important task of assessing such a formidable enemy as the
Japanese in WWII.

I would guess she was selected on the basis of her _Patterns of
Culture_, which I understand was a landmark.

I began teaching (as a "T.A.") in 1958. For about the first ten
years or so, when I asked my classes (mostly juniors and seniors) if
they had read_Patterns of Culture_ in some other course, dang near
every student raised his or her hand.

So it was still "standard reading" in the middle 50s and beyond,
although it was written back in the '30s.

(Actually, I don't think many Americans understand our own national character.)

Perhaps understanding one's own national character is especially
difficult. Bobbie Burns said something like "Would the Lord the
giftie gie us, to see ourselves as others see us."

The only studies of American national character by Americans that I
can recall, offhand, are Frederick Jackson Turner's Frontier in
American History and David Potter's People of Plenty. Are there any
others?

vince

On 7/9/05 4:52 PM, in article , "Wolfgang"
wrote:


If you're interested, a Google search on Chagnon, Neel (who died recently, I
believe), Jacques Lizot (a French anthropologist and Chagnon rival working
in the same area at the same time.....and a serious whack-job if Tierney is
to be believed), Tierney, and Terence Turner (another major Chagnon critic)
should turn up millions of hits. Good luck! :)

Or ask a reference librarian, who can probably find you four or five bits to
read that will nicely summarize all of the above. :-)

Bill
(that is, unless you *want* to slog through millions of hits...)
(not that there is anything wrong with that :-)

"vincent p. norris" wrote in message
...
Thanks for filling me in on the Chagnon flap, Wolfgang.

.... his enthnography, "Yanomamo: The Fierce People." The book was hugely
popular..

I can understand why. Two of my kids took his course and so the book
was lying around here, and I read it. Fascinating!

I thought so too, when I first read it. After reading "Darkness in El
Dorado" I found and bought another copy but haven't done any more than
glance through it. The whole mess is interesting enough as an example of
academic infighting, science gone ape-****, etc., but my interest in
anthropology per se has waned over the years, and a detailed analysis of the
original work vs. Tierney's criticism is a lot more than I care to bite off.

...the first to outsell Margaret Mead's "Coming of Age in Samoa,"

In that case, the cheap ******* could have afforded to buy cigarets
and beer for all of us!

Judging by descriptions of the resources available to him in the Amazon
basin, the cheap ******* could have afforded to buy a tobacco company and a
brewery. Which, incidentally, brings to mind another of the nefarious
characters who has played a major role in the skullduggery, a decidedly
shady individual named Charles Brewer Carias. Brewer (as Tierney usually
refers to him) appears to be worthy of a book or two all by himself.
Cigarettes, for what it's worth, are listed with seven page references in
the index of Tierney's book. :)

(If I may digress even further off topic, you reminded me of a
humorous tale: When that book appeared--if that's the one in which
she argued that all social roles are culturally learned-- an older
anthropologist, perhaps Franz Boas, wrote a very brief book review in
one of the journals. I quote it in full: "It is a very nice book,
Margaret, but do you know any societies in which the men have the
babies?")

California. I believe the governator once bore a child.

I notice you used the spelling "Yanomami" --ending in i--which I
recall seeing elsewhere. In his book, Chagnon uses the "o" ending.
Why are two different spellings used?

I have no idea. I've wondered about that myself. I don't recall whether or
not Tierney made mention of the difference or whether I've seen any other
reference. As far as I recall virtually every source I've seen aside from
Chagnon uses the "i" spelling as opposed to the "o".

If you're interested, a Google search on Chagnon.....

I just did. A goldmine!

I'm not familiar with Redfield, Childe or Polanyi. I'll keep an eye out
for
them.....

For Redfield, I recommend his _Primitive World and its
Transformations_, and a paper on the "Folk Society," an "ideal type"
construct. I encountered it as a reprint published by Bobbs-Merrill,
IIRC.

And that reminds me of _The Preindustrial City_ by Gideon Sjoberg,
another interesting discussion of "pre-modern" society. (I suppose an
anthropologist would be horrified by that term.)

Childe: A general intro to achaeology whose title I don't recall, and
_The Bronze Age_.

Polanyi: _The Great Transformation_ , Some of which Robert Heilbroner
adopted for his _Making of Economic Society_ ( like _The Worldly
Philosophers_ and _The Quest for Wealth_), a wonderful non-technical
intro to economics, and later his basic economics textbook, _The
Economic Problem_. Also, _Trade and Market in Ancient Empires_.

I still have a bit of uncovered floor space somewhere. :(

Wolfgang

You still have a few years to go. When you have reached my age, you
will no longer have that problem.

About a year and a half ago I took a bit of vacation time and did a tour of
small town libraries in Wisconsin. It didn't occur to me at the time but at
my present rate of accumulation, and long before I reach your age (assuming
I don't starve or get crushed by falling books), I will someday BE a small
town library. :(

Wolfgang

"William Claspy" wrote in message
...

...ask a reference librarian...

Be careful what you wish for, bookworm! :(

Wolfgang
so, what can you tell me about the "u.s. ex. ex."? :)

On 7/10/05 9:54 AM, in article , "Wolfgang"
wrote:


"William Claspy" wrote in message
...

...ask a reference librarian...

Be careful what you wish for, bookworm! :(

Now, I didn't say "ask THIS reference librarian." Heck, you ask me, all
I'll give you is a wry grin and a shrug of the shoulders.

Wolfgang
so, what can you tell me about the "u.s. ex. ex."? :)

Nix nix. Though you did ask nice...

Speaking of which (u.s. ex. ex., not asking nice), I'm thinking of doing a
display, similar to the fishing books display I did last year, of the
multivolume collection of reports of the railroad planning expeditions of
the 1840s-1850s. Those fascinate me and the volumes are impressive. In
fact, I ought to look through the southern route volumes and see if there is
mention of the Gila trout.

B

"William Claspy" wrote in message
...
On 7/10/05 9:54 AM, in article , "Wolfgang"
wrote:


"William Claspy" wrote in message
...

...ask a reference librarian...

Be careful what you wish for, bookworm! :(

Now, I didn't say "ask THIS reference librarian." Heck, you ask me, all
I'll give you is a wry grin and a shrug of the shoulders.

Wolfgang
so, what can you tell me about the "u.s. ex. ex."? :)

Nix nix. Though you did ask nice...

Speaking of which (u.s. ex. ex., not asking nice), I'm thinking of doing a
display, similar to the fishing books display I did last year, of the
multivolume collection of reports of the railroad planning expeditions of
the 1840s-1850s. Those fascinate me and the volumes are impressive. In
fact, I ought to look through the southern route volumes and see if there
is
mention of the Gila trout.

B


Some of the art work from those expiditions is amazing. Hand tinted etc..
There is(was?) a book/map store on a backstreet of Georgetown that sells
originals of this stuff pulled from disassembled books.

Sidenote: As a junior officer, Civil War General McClellan's reports of his
explorations of the middle Cascades, North of the Columbia/South of Raineer,
in that series, suggest he wasn't above a little "dry lab-ing", ie making up
****.

Dave