"Bob Patton" wrote in message
...

Don't "punish" kids by suspending them and sending them home to empty
houses. Find things that need to be done at the school and make them do
that. For example, make them clean the bathrooms - with toothbrushes if
the offense is bad enough.

http://tinyurl.com/85td9

"Wolfgang" wrote in message
...

Yet another load of unmitigated (as well as unsubstantiated) horse****
from
our resident psychopath in the great northwest.

Wolfgang
who knows that have offspring, knowing a teacher or two, and being retired
from the public tit does not an authority make.



Well you don't know much.

1. Most of my working life I owned and or managed private firms, so your
public tit comment is gratuitous.

2. As a part of my work Ive visited, observed, evaluated, consulted,
trained, advised etc in more schools, educational programs and classrooms
and shops than you or Knight will ever see or drive by, including urban
systems where you would most likely wet yourself within a half hour.

3. Ive spent a bit of time in hospitals, worked in one for a short time in
college, and hung out for about 6 months at a nursing home while my father
died. Turns out I seem to have a pretty high pain threshold. Doesn't make me
an expert, but I observed that men were bigger whiners and complainers when
sick than women. Why don't you ask some of the nurses, or maybe a few
mothers. Most men get queasy if they see their own blood, or even have to
clean up a little ****. And if you don't know that I know you have not been
around little kids much, and apparently don't like to get out of the lab
much.

4. Ive also worked with more than a few Older worker employment programs and
on a few class actions. In my personal experience, two occupational groups
stand out as being noticeably more well adjusted and "happy" in retirement:
Teachers, and surprising to me, highway patrol men.

For someone who works in the 5% difference drug realm, you sure play fast
and loose with the word "unsubstantiated."

Dave

"Wayne Knight" wrote in message
...


Well I don't have a clue what your point is.

I stand by my statement that from what I have seen in life and in my work,
teachers are an uncommonly dedicated lot, and seem to me to be generally
happy in retirement and uncommonly satisfied with how they have spent their
lives.

Wayne, I hope you are not holding up hospitals as bastions of efficiency and
cost effectiveness. And your comment about surgeons? . . . Noble would not
be my choice of adjectives. To me they are more like fighter pilots, same
kind of egos, reflexes etc. Definitely needed, interesting and talented . .
.. but noble? Sorry.

Dave
Dave

"David Snedeker" wrote in message
...

Well I don't have a clue what your point is.

I stand by my statement that from what I have seen in life and in my work,
teachers are an uncommonly dedicated lot, and seem to me to be generally
happy in retirement and uncommonly satisfied with how they have spent
their
lives.

Teachers are not the only uncommonly dedicated lot David. You can put them
on a pedestal if you like, I won't. .

Wayne, I hope you are not holding up hospitals as bastions of efficiency
and
cost effectiveness.

No but I try everyday to make them that way. Like the education *system*,
they're a tough nut to bring to reality and make them work right.

"David Snedeker" wrote in message
...

"Wolfgang" wrote in message
...

Yet another load of unmitigated (as well as unsubstantiated) horse****
from
our resident psychopath in the great northwest.

Wolfgang
who knows that have offspring, knowing a teacher or two, and being
retired
from the public tit does not an authority make.



Well you don't know much.

Unlike you, I never claimed to.

1. Most of my working life I owned and or managed private firms, so your
public tit comment is gratuitous.

Most? To how many decimal places?

2. As a part of my work Ive visited, observed, evaluated, consulted,
trained, advised etc in more schools, educational programs and classrooms
and shops than you or Knight will ever see or drive by,

And you calculated that......how?

including urban
systems where you would most likely wet yourself within a half hour.

Urban systems? Yeah, I don't see much of that

3. Ive spent a bit of time in hospitals, worked in one for a short time in
college,

Well......gosh......I won't try to match that.

and hung out for about 6 months at a nursing home while my father
died. Turns out I seem to have a pretty high pain threshold.

What.....they put thumbscrews on you?

Doesn't make me an expert,

We agree on that much.

but I observed that men were bigger whiners and complainers when
sick than women.

And you know how impressive your observations are......right?

Why don't you ask some of the nurses, or maybe a few
mothers.

Mainly because I have no reason to suspect that any I am familiar with would
have any idea of or interest in your observations. There are other reasons,
but I suspect that one will suffice.

Most men get queasy if they see their own blood, or even have to
clean up a little ****.

You've traveled more widely than I suspected. I wasn't aware that you were
intimately familiar with most men.

And if you don't know that I know you have not been
around little kids much, and apparently don't like to get out of the lab
much.

Well, you don't know much.

4. Ive also worked with more than a few Older worker employment programs
and
on a few class actions.

Well......gosh.

In my personal experience, two occupational groups
stand out as being noticeably more well adjusted and "happy" in
retirement:
Teachers, and surprising to me, highway patrol men.

And one could hardly ask for better evidence than your personal experience,
huh?

For someone who works in the 5% difference drug realm, you sure play fast
and loose with the word "unsubstantiated."

O.k., why don't you see if you can point out what you have
substantiated......and how?

For that matter, why don't you see if you can elucidate for us just what any
of the self-congratulatory twaddle above has to do with the claim that
teaching is "possibly the most noble of the professions" or anything that
Wayne said in response to Mr. Ellis?

Good luck! :)

Wolfgang

um...well...since i'll be in a symbiotic if not parasitic position with
you in September, we'll simply have to disagree on this one right now
and i'll reserve my own special brand of diatribe for October when i'm
safely home in carolina land. G

but, about the only thing i'm able to do is raise a glass in the bar i'm
in... i think the alcohol tax benefits the schools and i'm doing my
part. g

jeff (who thinks 29k for a good teacher is simply unconscionable; and,
i'll bet i sent just as big a check to uncle as you did)

Wayne Knight wrote:

You want to raise teacher salaries? Raise the bar to get in.

Wayne
I might have left this alone if I wasn't writing checks to the IRS and
state today after receiving my property tax bill yesterday. :(

"Wolfgang" wrote in message
...

Wolfgang, all I really needed to cite was your demonstrated whininess, and
the overwhelming weight of that by gender would alone tip the balance to the
male population. You have all the displaced cynicism of one of those who
lives far too close to the 5% significant difference rule. Kissy Kissy

Dave
Who confesses he gets far too much fun from poking dis cheesehead monkey.

"Jeff" wrote in message
ink.net...
um...well...since i'll be in a symbiotic if not parasitic position with
you in September, we'll simply have to disagree on this one right now and
i'll reserve my own special brand of diatribe for October when i'm safely
home in carolina land. G

No you'll get the chance the first weekend of the show. We're meeting a
friend for beer and brats, Friday night or breakfast Sat morning. He takes
almost every summer off and fishes/guides the UP. And fwiw, he's a middle
school math teacher :). That's how he gets the summer off. Except when he
does insurance adjusting for the summer out in the rockies.

but, about the only thing i'm able to do is raise a glass in the bar i'm
in... i think the alcohol tax benefits the schools and i'm doing my part.
g

And michigan alcohol taxes are higher than most.

jeff (who thinks 29k for a good teacher is simply unconscionable; and,

I think 29K for most anything good is unconsiconable. .

i'll bet i sent just as big a check to uncle as you did)

The size of your check of no concern to me. However I applaud the proper use
of tax planning. Why some folks plan on getting a refund is beyond me.

"David Snedeker" wrote in message
...

"Wolfgang" wrote in message
...

Wolfgang, all I really needed to cite was your demonstrated whininess, and
the overwhelming weight of that by gender would alone tip the balance to
the
male population. You have all the displaced cynicism of one of those who
lives far too close to the 5% significant difference rule. Kissy Kissy

All you had to do was cite my demonstrated whininess.
Well......dang......that sure does sound like it means something. O.k.,
with your demonstrated expertise in teaching, it should be very simple for
you to explain, even to one with my limited capacity to comprehend, exactly
what that means.


Dave
Who confesses he gets far too much fun from poking dis cheesehead monkey.

Keep on enjoying! :)

Wolfgang

Wayne Knight wrote:

"Jeff" wrote in message
ink.net...

um...well...since i'll be in a symbiotic if not parasitic position with
you in September, we'll simply have to disagree on this one right now and
i'll reserve my own special brand of diatribe for October when i'm safely
home in carolina land. G


No you'll get the chance the first weekend of the show. We're meeting a
friend for beer and brats, Friday night or breakfast Sat morning. He takes
almost every summer off and fishes/guides the UP. And fwiw, he's a middle
school math teacher :). That's how he gets the summer off. Except when he
does insurance adjusting for the summer out in the rockies.

well allrighty then... however, i suspect we'll need a third on my side
of the argument though, just in case we are forced to convince you of
the rightness of our position. g will he be fishing with us?



The size of your check of no concern to me. However I applaud the proper use
of tax planning. Why some folks plan on getting a refund is beyond me.

didn't think it was...but, it didn't affect my opinion about teachers or
salaries in the same manner, hence my silly comment. ...and, btw, isn't
it the truth that most salaried folks - esp. teachers - get a refund
because they know they haven't the ability or discipline to save, don't
make enough to save and pay expenses of living, and won't have the funds
to pay the tax due on april 15, so they select all the withholding
possible...? my planning as a quarterly estimated tax payer is simply to
send what i can spare when i can spare it and hope/pray it all works out
by april 15. it rarely does... now, enough of this unpleasantness.
soon come the u.p. and there's a mystery to solve. i (obviously and
admittedly) need more clues.

jeff