Newbie Question: How many fly sizes & colors to tie for next season?
 

On Oct 13, 7:25 pm, Dave LaCourse wrote:
On Sat, 13 Oct 2007 23:57:32 -0000, mdk77
wrote:

Hey, I have Ken F. to watch my back. He's just a hop, skip & a jump
East of Bloomington where I live :-)

Oh no! You have gone over to the dark side! Beware, beware! Strange
things happen in that neck of the woods.

Dave

Living in a place like Central Illinois is the dark side :-)

When I fly fish here, folks look at me with pity and ask why I'm cane
pole fishing with plastic line (serious). They are convinced I'm a
penniless chap who can't afford a "real" fishing pole with "real"
fishing line :-)

Living here has probably pushed poor Ken over the edge. Frankly I
went over years ago...

Newbie Question: How many fly sizes & colors to tie for next season?
 

Living in a place like Central Illinois is the dark side :-)

When I fly fish here, folks look at me with pity and ask why I'm cane
pole fishing with plastic line (serious). They are convinced I'm a
penniless chap who can't afford a "real" fishing pole with "real"
fishing line :-)

Living here has probably pushed poor Ken over the edge. Frankly I
went over years ago...

So I'm guessing that Nebraska looks like Nirvana compared to that
place.
Frank Reid

Newbie Question: How many fly sizes & colors to tie for nextseason?
 

Frank Reid wrote:
Living in a place like Central Illinois is the dark side :-)

When I fly fish here, folks look at me with pity and ask why I'm cane
pole fishing with plastic line (serious). They are convinced I'm a
penniless chap who can't afford a "real" fishing pole with "real"
fishing line :-)

Living here has probably pushed poor Ken over the edge. Frankly I
went over years ago...

So I'm guessing that Nebraska looks like Nirvana compared to that
place.

It's not all *that* bad. I mean it's all warmwater fishing
but I've got several nice little smallmouth streams over in
Vermillion county plus an old strip mine over there that
they flooded back in the '50's and is now full of largemouth.
Then there's the little farm ponds and the little state park
impoundment lakes full of bluegill. You need a watercraft of
some sort but there's plenty of good fly fishing from my canoe.

I avoid the big water like Clinton Lake and Lake Shelbyville
but they fish pretty well if you can dodge all the big honkin'
metal flake bass boats.

It's not all that far to find trout either. I'm 3-4 hours from
the SE Wisconsin, SW Minnesota driftless area, 6-7 hours from
the trout waters of Michigan's UP and the Au Sable holy waters.

So no, Nebraska doesn't look like Nirvana from here, it just
looks like Nebraska, you know Kansas but with better football. ;-)

--
Ken Fortenberry

Newbie Question: How many fly sizes & colors to tie for next season?
 

On Oct 13, 11:48 am, Dave LaCourse wrote:
David, if you are going to be serious about tying, you should purchase
Ted Leeson's and Jim Schollmeyer's book "The Fly Tier's Benchside
Reference". Anything you ever wanted to know about fly tying is in
this book. It's a wonderful reference manual with step by step
illustrations on hundreds of techniques and dressing styles.

When it first came out in 1998, many of us rushed to the book store to
buy it for $100. Today you can buy it on Amazon.com for $63. I saw
it in a fly shop recently for $60. Great buy.

Dave

Dave, I did pick up "The Fly Tier's Benchside Reference" by Leeson &
Schollmeyer. I also picked up "Trout Flies - The Tier's Reference" by
Dave Hughes. These two books, along with my two beginner books ("Fly
Tying for Beginners" and "The Fly-Tying Bible" both books by Peter
Gathercole) should serve me well for many years. I can't wait to dive
into the the two new books. I'm also going to ask the gentleman who
taught me how to tie, if he will spend some more time with me over the
Winter, and help me with some more advanced techniques/flies.

I really feel at peace when I tie flies. I'm a slow tier, but I savor
the peace and tranquility as I tie. Our world seems so hectic, fast
paced and stressful, but when I tie (and certainly when I fish) I can
feel at perfect peace.

- Dave K.

Hot flies (was Newbie Question: How many ...)
 

"rw" wrote


In heavily fished water, like the San Juan, I can believe that a radically
new nymph pattern could really work, for awhile at least.



I agree with the above sentence and often ponder what it says about trout,
how do they learn and/or communicate. I believe every angler has
experienced times when virtually any new fly would catch a fish or two then
become useless.

Just last month I was crossing Kilpatrick Bridge on the way back to the
trailer. I heard my name over the roar and clatter of my old diesel and
stopped to see if I really had or was going more insane. It was Jim
Curran ( you may know him is why I use his name ) just ending a morning in
the tubing area down from the bridge. He was sitting by the bridge in his
tube casting to those fish that are always there. Soon he caught one and
then commented, "You can catch these fish, but you have to use a fly they
haven't seen lately. To catch another one I'd have to change patterns."
Jim is one hell of a fly fisherman and that comment therefore has weight.

IF our patterns really did what we tend to want to think ... i.e. closely
imitate naturals ... they would work over and over, year after year, for
fish eating that natural. But few meet that standard.

Another example. Twenty+ years ago when the only commercial spinner
patterns available were dull "poly winged" I stumbled onto organza. I tied
trico spinners with it and for a couple years could very nearly catch Silver
Creek fish at will in trico time ... I really mean nearly every cast
produced a take and often you'd see fish move over out of their normal lane
to take my pattern over naturals. I was in heaven and, frankly, a hero in
my own mind G

Then "sparkley winged" spinners came to every fly shop. NOW, the above
hero pattern fishes at a mediocre level and each time I encounter tricos I'm
back to trying experiments. Clearly, if the old pattern had really been a
"perfect imitation" it would still work and, at least, get taken as well as
naturals.

_______
________

Back to big and ugly. While at the famous crik over the hill from you a
couple weeks ago, I went to the trailer and tied a big, ugly (very) mouse
fly and a couple Dahlberg Diver/ Maraboo Muddler hybrids with the intention
of night fishing during last months full moon. Between you, me, and the
cottonwood tree, there are some very big Browns up d crik to spawn ...very
big. I never got around to trying it, I'm not really much of a fisherman
more of a "nature lover that uses fishing as an excuse to get out," but I
do believe it was a good idea for someone more motivated by the catching,
less put off by thoughts of stumbling around in the dark and being cold.

Newbie Question: How many fly sizes & colors to tie for next season?
 

Dave LaCourse wrote in
:


David, if you are going to be serious about tying, you should purchase
Ted Leeson's and Jim Schollmeyer's book "The Fly Tier's Benchside
Reference". Anything you ever wanted to know about fly tying is in
this book. It's a wonderful reference manual with step by step
illustrations on hundreds of techniques and dressing styles.

When it first came out in 1998, many of us rushed to the book store to
buy it for $100. Today you can buy it on Amazon.com for $63. I saw
it in a fly shop recently for $60. Great buy.

Dave




Excellent suggestion. Leeson and Schollmeyer also now have a book that's
similarly organized, but geared for beginners, that is also appealing.

The one thing you won't get from the Benchside Reference is patterns-- just
about every technique, but no patterns.

Another good book would be anything written by Skip Morris.

--
Scott
Reverse name to reply

Newbie Question: How many fly sizes & colors to tie for next season?
 

"Willi" wrote


Where do the big, garish, cartoony, improbable and successful foam flies
fit in with the above?



It occurred to me to point out that my original intent was to reply to a
self declared newbie's question about "How many fly sizes & colors to tie
for next season?"

When 'I' read that post I envisioned him tying a dozen each of the Humpies
given in my example earlier ... i.e. 66 dozen Humpies. That is one hell of
a "populated" fly box and most of the population would be, at best, common
in performance.

My suggestion was to concentrate on "fly sizes & colors" that fall into the
middle range of food items trout see often. I never said, "Don't tie big,
garish flies." OR "Don't waste your time on #28s." Indeed I suggest that
all fishermen have a special corner in their box for "experiments," flies
well out of the "normal" zone,

.... or variations on standards.

I like examples, so here is one. I fish a #18 yellow Sparkle Dun more
often than any other single pattern ... thanks Craig and John for coming up
with this great tie. BUT, I'm constantly trying slight variations ...
maybe using one of the very shiny dubbings teased out to replace the Zelon,
maybe adding a tuft of maraboo under the Zelon, maybe a biot abdomen, maybe
dyed deer or young elk instead of deer. I do NOT tie these "in quantity"
until they prove themselves.

I believe the population of anyone's fly boxes should consist mostly of
patterns/sizes/variations that EXPERIENCE has proven. THAT is the major
message I had for the original poster. Fish can be caught on nearly any
pattern, some time or place. I once caught a trout on a bare hook to win a
bet ( planter ), but I do NOT, therefore, carry a dozen each of 12 sizes and
3 styles of bare hooks in my fly boxes G.


--------
--------


Now for a more all inclusive discussion than "newbie advice." As I say
trout eat all sorts of stuff, I'm sure you have watched them sample twigs
and such from the drift. Trout likely "eat" for several reasons, hunger,
'anger,' 'territory defense,' and yes I'd guess 'curiosity' ... i.e. his
mouth is his major tool to experiment with new things in the drift.

To ME, it makes more sense to concentrate efforts on trying to induce a
'feeding' response than the others .. most of the time, the exceptions
clearly exist ... and, to ME, that implies an effort to suggest food forms
the fish has seen and eaten recently.

Sure, various Disaster Area Ant patterns will catch 'some' fish, 'sometimes'
lots of them. But, I ask you, Willi, this. Given a hypothetical
situation where you are climbing into a drift boat for a full day during
Salmon Fly time ( a classic big, garish time) and are given a choice ...
take a box of wildly colored foam Disaster Area Ants ... or take a box of
attractors that more closely resemble Salmon Flies ( Stimulators and such )
..... are YOU really going to take the DAAs ? Or, even if the choice is
between very garish, wildly colored ( no orange :-) DAAs and a box that
holds only #18 Royal Ws, #18 PTs and #18 Brassies ... would YOU choose the
DAAs over the smaller, more "common food like" ties? Remember your whole,
long, day of drifting you are stuck with the decision G

Newbie Question: How many fly sizes & colors to tie for next season?
 

On Sun, 14 Oct 2007 13:50:34 -0000, mdk77
wrote:

Our world seems so hectic, fast
paced and stressful, but when I tie (and certainly when I fish) I can
feel at perfect peace.

I know how you feel. I tie to soft background jazz and the time
passes quickly without stress of any kind.

Dave

Newbie Question: How many fly sizes & colors to tie for nextseason?
 

Larry L wrote:
"Willi" wrote


Where do the big, garish, cartoony, improbable and successful foam flies
fit in with the above?




It occurred to me to point out that my original intent was to reply to a
self declared newbie's question about "How many fly sizes & colors to tie
for next season?"

Turns out the guy does 98% of his fishing for for warm water fishes!!

Willi

Newbie Question: How many fly sizes & colors to tie for next season?
 

"Lazarus Cooke" wrote in message
news:121020072114288918%lazaruscooke@britishlibrar y.invalid...
In article , Tom Nakashima
wrote:


You also might want to keep this in mind when selecting flies to use.
In order:
1. First think size
2. Then pattern
3. Then color
-tom

I think that this, like most of the things I've read on this thread, is
very good advice.


One thing I forgot to mention, is after my catch I always take a glance into
the fish's mouth before I release. I would say about 30% of the time I
found some type of feed.
-tom