Fishing - Cluuuuck, cluck, cluuuuk

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Cluuuuck, cluck, cluuuuk

On Apr 3, 6:18*pm, wrote:
On Sat, 03 Apr 2010 09:49:41 -0500, Ken Fortenberry

wrote:
Ken Fortenberry wrote:
wrote:
What I find amusing is that he himself, AFAIK, has not said he is or
self-identifies as "black" OR "white." ...

Correct your ignorance then and read his autobiography.

Sorry to respond to my own post but I thought do rdean a favor
and point out a news item so that he doesn't have to read a
whole big book. ;-)

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/04/03/us.../03census.html

Hmmm...the headline says "Asked to Declare His Race, Obama Checks ‘Black’," but
the story itself says he checked "Black, African Am., or Negro." *I wonder why
they didn't say "...Obama checks 'Negro'"...

If you want to take the question and the headline as "proof" of his being
"black," Obama doesn't know who he is. *He himself, at least currently, says
he's "African-American," (and that would be reflected in his answer as "African
Am." is one of the three possible choices), but based upon the wording of the
question, he can only be one of the three, and the NYT apparently chooses to
take his answer to be (only) "Black," not "African Am." or "Negro."

HTH,
R

Idiot.

g

Cluuuuck, cluck, cluuuuk

On Apr 3, 6:03*pm, wrote:
On Fri, 02 Apr 2010 10:30:48 -0500, Ken Fortenberry

wrote:
wrote:
Ken Fortenberry wrote:
wrote:
Does the fact that a couple of "black" folks in NO think this way or that in
this? *No, but it damned sure carries more weight than an Illinois white boy's
opinion.
Obama identifies himself as a black man, he married a black woman and
he has two black kids.

And that damned sure carries more weight than your silly bull****.

Well, gee, if it's just math...and if it is, explain again why he's "black" and
not "white"...

He's black because he says he's black. End of story. You claim
on the one hand that as a bi-racial man Obama can self-identify
any way he wants but on the other hand if he self-identifies as
black then he's a hypocrite. What would your cracker neighbors
down there in Picklejuice, Mississippi have said if Obama had
decided to self-identify as white ?

Er, nope. *He's not a "hypocrite" if he self-identifies as "white" or "black,"
but he might well be one if he attempts to identify, either to himself or
others, himself as a "black American," at least in the sense that he is a
product of the entirety of "black experience" in the US. *And it would appear
that as far as his "family experience" goes, he is more a product of a "white"
family than "black" one. *And as of late, as a presumable mature adult, he
self-identifies (at least as his public position) as "African-American." *I just
find it curious and odd that he says basically, "black folks ask me if I'm black
or white and I answer 'I am African-American'" rather than "folks ask me and I
answer 'I see myself as black." *It is perfectly plausible for someone who can
truthfully claim to be "African-American" and be neither "black" or "white," but
"yellow"/Asian" and even at Obama's age, never had any substantive experience
with either a "white" or "black" person.

What I find amusing is that he himself, AFAIK, has not said he is or
self-identifies as "black" OR "white." ...

Correct your ignorance then and read his autobiography.

I didn't say he has never self-_identified_ as anything, I said
self-_identifies_. *I'm not talking about all the various phases/feelings that a
child, teen, and young adult go through as they stumble toward finding
themselves. *Hell, at one point, many little boys see themselves as cowboys,
doctors, police- and firemen, GI Joe, etc. *Not many young people say, "Ya know,
when I am adult, I think I'd like to be a mid-level manager at a mid-sized
manufacturing company in Omaha who self-identifies as whatever..." *Hell, if
we are to "force-label" him solely from his 15-20 year-old "autobiography," he's
a black radical pot-smoking white Chicano punk rocker Christian Muslim in a
leather-jacketed cheap suit with a particular hard-on for cute light-skinned
multi-racial girls and who, underneath it all, is really a African man just like
his father, except he admits he had no direct familiar relationship with his
father on which to base it and has no real connection with "black" in the US
context. *IOW, he was just like every other 20-something in a lot of the world -
he was trying to find himself. *In fact, let's Obama say it his way:

"At the very least, an autobiography implies a summing up, a certain closure,
that hardly suits someone of my years, still busy charting his way through the
world. I can’t even hold up my experience as being somehow representative of the
black American experience." * - from "Dreams From My Father"

IAC, what we were originally talking about was "outside identification" - what
race others see him - and as to that, it's simple math - he's half "white" and
half "black," if the terms are used in the most commonly used sense in the US.
It was further put forth that I would, for some unspecified reason, be "angry"
at him because he is "black." *I'd not be "angry" with him or anyone else over
anything that they had absolutely no control.

And at least to me, here's an interesting aside: *I don't know anything about
how his father's "people" see themselves (Luo???), but I know many Ethiopians -
yum....kitfo...but I digress - who don't consider themselves "black" or "white."
Many of them would likely consider him "black" based on his father's "people"
and on the color of his skin and features, regardless of his
self-identification, math, or anything else. *OTOH, I also know many "black"
people who would consider him to be more "white" than "black," or at least, not
"truly _black_," again, based solely on his lighter skin. *And then, I know
those who are and consider themselves to be "creole" (in the mixed-race,
"modern" sense), which is kinda-sorta "black," who would consider him to be like
them, i.e., superior to darker-skinned "blacks," again, based solely on his skin
color. *Why is all of this interesting to me? *Two reasons: one, it shows how,
well, goofy it is for someone or some group to attempt to subjectively label
another based solely upon skin color and have _their_ label be seen as
objective, and two, it's just plain goofy to attempt to label people solely via
skin pigmentation.

HTH,

Immensely.

R

Moron

g.

Cluuuuck, cluck, cluuuuk

On Apr 2, 7:46*pm, wrote:
On Fri, 02 Apr 2010 16:53:38 -0400, jeff wrote:
On 4/2/2010 3:26 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 02 Apr 2010 14:12:36 -0400, *wrote:

On 4/2/2010 1:16 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 02 Apr 2010 11:11:07 -0400, * wrote:

Please give me the following, and with the exception of the 25-75 number, all
must be 1-9 - no zeros.:

Any single number/digit in any of your addresses (home, office, PO Box, your
college apartment, ZIP code, I don't care),

any single number from any two of your phone numbers (2 total numbers),

any single number from your bar card (or hell, some shopper's discount card in
your wallet),

the day any of your children were born (i.e., 2 if April 2nd),

pick any number from 1 to 10,

pick another from 25 to 75.

I don't need or want the entire number for any of the above...****, just make up
7 random numbers that'll fit into the above.

Thanks,
R

you're welcome....

OK, then, I'll pick, 9, 8, 7, 6, 5, 4, and 39. *Now, let's see what those
numbers correspond to on your CnP of "why Jeff Miller would vote for Obama
again...as told by others..."...

HTH,
R

you asked for 5 reasons...i gave you a CnP list containing a bunch of
reasons and accomplishments. that you disagree with them, without regard
to the source, and that you would no doubt disagree with any offered, is
expected. imo, you really weren't interested in anything other than
continuing your argument, and more of the tiresome mantra, about obama.

No. *First, last year at this time, many (and you may have been one of them, I
don't recall) said it was too early to expect a lot from him. *Putting aside the
fact that he promised he'd do a bunch basically right away that he backpeddled
on immediately (the lobbyists, for one - but hey, all pols do it to some
extent), fair's fair - see what a year brings, many said. *OK, it's a year
later. *And what? *Any end anywhere remotely in sight as to Iraq and
Afghanistan? *Nope. *The North Koreans and Iranians backing down on the whole
nukes thing? *Nope. *All the world's people swooning in l-u-v love with America
and Americans? *Nope. *World leaders with a new-found respect for "The Commander
in Chief of the whole free world?" *Hardly. *From what I've seen, Putin and the
Chinese, among others, think of him about like some annoying little ****ant who
happens to have access to his parents' checkbook and his dad's gun collection. *

But again, fair's fair. ***** Putin and the Chinese - he is, when he isn't being
Obama The Wonderful, a fairly smart guy and if he quits thinking of himself as
OTW, he might make a pretty fair Prez. *But it's about time he quit explaining
what a great idea he has for ditches and start digging a few himself. *Put other
way, sometimes a good leader has to stick his head up out of the foxhole first
and give those he wishes to lead someone to follow. *If he manages to do that,
and even if he takes an honest hit or two at least trying, then yes, I'd for
Obama the _man_

i like him, you dislike him.

No, actually, when he isn't in OTW mode, he seems like a pretty decent guy.

i'll vote for him, you won't.

You cannot say I won't because I cannot say that. *But I'll grant that if the
election were tomorrow, and he was running against, say, Romney, no, I wouldn't.
OTOH, if it were tomorrow and he were running against Palin, I'd vote for him as
many times as I possibly could, attempt to buy him as many more votes as I
could, and threaten those who couldn't be bought.

my reasons won't convince you;

You're absolutely right as long as your reasons are borrowed from someone else -
on Obama or any other subject.

yours won't convince me.

I gotta say, that's, well, silly, if you mean it as it appears. *Basically, what
it appears to me that you are saying is that no matter how "good" the argument,
no matter what happens, your mind is made up. *Hey, to each their own, I
guess...

futility isn't attractive to me. we went through a similar exercise last year in
which i gave you some of my personal reasons for liking the guy and
my view of his accomplishments at that time.

See above, last year, etc.

btw...you didn't answer: what, if anything, could obama do to earn your
vote?

See above.

TC,
R

Imbecile.

g.

Cluuuuck, cluck, cluuuuk

On Apr 3, 4:03*pm, wrote:
On Fri, 02 Apr 2010 10:30:48 -0500, Ken Fortenberry

wrote:
wrote:
Ken Fortenberry wrote:
wrote:
Does the fact that a couple of "black" folks in NO think this way or that in
this? *No, but it damned sure carries more weight than an Illinois white boy's
opinion.
Obama identifies himself as a black man, he married a black woman and
he has two black kids.

And that damned sure carries more weight than your silly bull****.

Well, gee, if it's just math...and if it is, explain again why he's "black" and
not "white"...

He's black because he says he's black. End of story. You claim
on the one hand that as a bi-racial man Obama can self-identify
any way he wants but on the other hand if he self-identifies as
black then he's a hypocrite. What would your cracker neighbors
down there in Picklejuice, Mississippi have said if Obama had
decided to self-identify as white ?

Er, nope. *He's not a "hypocrite" if he self-identifies as "white" or "black,"
but he might well be one if he attempts to identify, either to himself or
others, himself as a "black American," at least in the sense that he is a
product of the entirety of "black experience" in the US. *And it would appear
that as far as his "family experience" goes, he is more a product of a "white"
family than "black" one. *And as of late, as a presumable mature adult, he
self-identifies (at least as his public position) as "African-American." *I just
find it curious and odd that he says basically, "black folks ask me if I'm black
or white and I answer 'I am African-American'" rather than "folks ask me and I
answer 'I see myself as black." *It is perfectly plausible for someone who can
truthfully claim to be "African-American" and be neither "black" or "white," but
"yellow"/Asian" and even at Obama's age, never had any substantive experience
with either a "white" or "black" person.

What I find amusing is that he himself, AFAIK, has not said he is or
self-identifies as "black" OR "white." ...

Correct your ignorance then and read his autobiography.

I didn't say he has never self-_identified_ as anything, I said
self-_identifies_. *I'm not talking about all the various phases/feelings that a
child, teen, and young adult go through as they stumble toward finding
themselves. *Hell, at one point, many little boys see themselves as cowboys,
doctors, police- and firemen, GI Joe, etc. *Not many young people say, "Ya know,
when I am adult, I think I'd like to be a mid-level manager at a mid-sized
manufacturing company in Omaha who self-identifies as whatever..." *Hell, if
we are to "force-label" him solely from his 15-20 year-old "autobiography," he's
a black radical pot-smoking white Chicano punk rocker Christian Muslim in a
leather-jacketed cheap suit with a particular hard-on for cute light-skinned
multi-racial girls and who, underneath it all, is really a African man just like
his father, except he admits he had no direct familiar relationship with his
father on which to base it and has no real connection with "black" in the US
context. *IOW, he was just like every other 20-something in a lot of the world -
he was trying to find himself. *In fact, let's Obama say it his way:

"At the very least, an autobiography implies a summing up, a certain closure,
that hardly suits someone of my years, still busy charting his way through the
world. I can’t even hold up my experience as being somehow representative of the
black American experience." * - from "Dreams From My Father"

IAC, what we were originally talking about was "outside identification" - what
race others see him - and as to that, it's simple math - he's half "white" and
half "black," if the terms are used in the most commonly used sense in the US.
It was further put forth that I would, for some unspecified reason, be "angry"
at him because he is "black." *I'd not be "angry" with him or anyone else over
anything that they had absolutely no control.

And at least to me, here's an interesting aside: *I don't know anything about
how his father's "people" see themselves (Luo???), but I know many Ethiopians -
yum....kitfo...but I digress - who don't consider themselves "black" or "white."
Many of them would likely consider him "black" based on his father's "people"
and on the color of his skin and features, regardless of his
self-identification, math, or anything else. *OTOH, I also know many "black"
people who would consider him to be more "white" than "black," or at least, not
"truly _black_," again, based solely on his lighter skin. *And then, I know
those who are and consider themselves to be "creole" (in the mixed-race,
"modern" sense), which is kinda-sorta "black," who would consider him to be like
them, i.e., superior to darker-skinned "blacks," again, based solely on his skin
color. *Why is all of this interesting to me? *Two reasons: one, it shows how,
well, goofy it is for someone or some group to attempt to subjectively label
another based solely upon skin color and have _their_ label be seen as
objective, and two, it's just plain goofy to attempt to label people solely via
skin pigmentation.

HTH,
R- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Wilber, You are one ****ing nutty cracker.
Dave