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Madison Clave 2005 Questions
Okay, some questions from someone that's never been to the Western Clave.
1. Are we or aren't we having a raffle? I've seen both. 2. How many drift boats will be there and how do I hook a ride? 3. Where on the Madison will we be fishing? Next to the campground? Upstream, down??? 4. Will we be fishing in Yellowstone? 5. How far do you guys range on a standard day? 6. Do you have to go to a state store to buy booze in MT or are there liquor stores on every corner? Beer? 7. Do I really need to tie size 20 and 22 PMD's? 7.A. Are the wings on a PMD dun grey or white? 7.B. Shoud I fish the above with a 7X tippet? Inquiring minds wanna know. -- Frank Reid Euthanize to respond |
On Wed, 15 Jun 2005 10:26:26 -0400, "Frank Reid" wrote:
Okay, some questions from someone that's never been to the Western Clave. 1. Are we or aren't we having a raffle? I've seen both. Warren's email said there would be one, and he's hosting the event. 2. How many drift boats will be there and how do I hook a ride? 3. Where on the Madison will we be fishing? Next to the campground? Upstream, down??? Across from the campground is OK, but downstream is a lot better, by Reynold's bridge, 3 Dollar Bridge, etc. The campground is between Hebgen Lake and Quake Lake. 4. Will we be fishing in Yellowstone? I will be and I'm sure some others will be as well. The 15th is opening day on the Yellowstone in the park and, while it is kind of a zoo, there are big hungry cutthroats that haven't seen a fly in a while. 5. How far do you guys range on a standard day? Varies with the guy. g 6. Do you have to go to a state store to buy booze in MT or are there liquor stores on every corner? Beer? 7. Do I really need to tie size 20 and 22 PMD's? 7.A. Are the wings on a PMD dun grey or white? 7.B. Shoud I fish the above with a 7X tippet? Inquiring minds wanna know. -- Charlie... http://www.chocphoto.com |
Frank Reid wrote:
[snip to get to one question I can answer] 6. Do you have to go to a state store to buy booze in MT or are there liquor stores on every corner? Beer? Dunno if it's like this all over, but when we were there, the grocery store we went to in W. Yellowstone had a liquor store inside of it. They locked the liquor store on Sunday, but you could still buy beer as it was in the "grocery" section of the store. Chuck Vance (who sometimes can answer the really important stuff) |
In article ,
says... Okay, some questions from someone that's never been to the Western Clave. 2. How many drift boats will be there and how do I hook a ride? Be the owner of the cooler filled with the most and best beer. 6. Do you have to go to a state store to buy booze in MT or are there liquor stores on every corner? Beer? State store for liquor, any gas station or grocery for beer or wine. 7. Do I really need to tie size 20 and 22 PMD's? I've always gotten by with 16 and 18 PMDs. You might want 20 and 22 tricos and baetis, though. 7.A. Are the wings on a PMD dun grey or white? Grey. Be sure you tie some Sparkle Duns: http://www.westfly.com/patterns/dry/sparkledun.shtml The Madison is full of crayfish -- I bet you could do some serious damage with the famed Frank's Fighting Crawfish. Kevin -- reply to: kevin dot vang at minotstateu dot edu |
4. Will we be fishing in Yellowstone? I will be and I'm sure some others will be as well. The 15th is opening day on the Yellowstone in the park and, while it is kind of a zoo, there are big hungry cutthroats that haven't seen a fly in a while. 15th of June or July? -- Frank Reid Euthanize to respond |
2. How many drift boats will be there and how do I hook a ride?
Be the owner of the cooler filled with the most and best beer. Time to break out the cream ale. 7. Do I really need to tie size 20 and 22 PMD's? I've always gotten by with 16 and 18 PMDs. You might want 20 and 22 tricos and baetis, though. Size friggen 22!!!??? Can I use it as the second fly behind a size 12 Royal Wulff? And no way I'll see that past 5 yards. 7.A. Are the wings on a PMD dun grey or white? Grey. Be sure you tie some Sparkle Duns: http://www.westfly.com/patterns/dry/sparkledun.shtml Will tie some tonight. What sizes, 18-20? The Madison is full of crayfish -- I bet you could do some serious damage with the famed Frank's Fighting Crawfish. What color? Standard tan or are they greenish, olive or brown? I'll tie some size 10s. Most trout like the little guys. -- Frank Reid Euthanize to respond |
4. Will we be fishing in Yellowstone?
I will be and I'm sure some others will be as well. The 15th is opening day on the Yellowstone in the park and, while it is kind of a zoo, there are big hungry cutthroats that haven't seen a fly in a while. 15th of June or July? Just looked it up. We're leaving on the 16th and will be in Ennis on the 15th, so this probably won't happen for some of us Marylanders. By the way, did all ya'll realize that Maryland will be the most represented (and probably most reprehensible) state at the Western Clave? There's a message in there somewhere. -- Frank Reid Euthanize to respond |
Kevin Vang wrote in news:MPG.1d1a03bbd49e206a989714
@news.individual.net: Don't be afraid to up to a size 2 -- there's big, big browns out there, and they like a mouthfull. How do those size 2's turn over on a 7x? ;) Scott |
I'll take a shot:
1. Yes - Wednesday (?) 2. I'll have my (new) raft and likely will be floating most every day but I'm bringing two friends also. You should be able to get a float and if we float upstream of W Fork Madison, where you're not allowed to fish from the boat, I can float 4 people. 3. Mostly between Ennis and Quake Lake ; -) although there's lots of other good water within two hours. You'll stay busy, and you can wet wade almost everything (take waders into the park for the Yellowstone River, ahem) so nobody will notice if your hat is wet. 4. You might want to. Some folks, like Lou T, concentrate mostly on the park. 5. 5-100 miles 6. No problem in MT 7. If you do, I'll be out of luck. I will have lots of PTs 7a. That's a good question. I bet the fish don't know! 7b. 3X for me, but I'll have some 4X just in case. bruce h |
Don't be afraid to up to a size 2 -- there's big, big browns out there,
and they like a mouthfull. How do those size 2's turn over on a 7x? ;) Real well, then again, I braid about 60 strands of 7X together. -- Frank Reid Euthanize to respond |
Bruce's answers inline with the questions. I forgot which question was
which, so I had to tie them together. Okay, some questions from someone that's never been to the Western Clave. 1. Are we or aren't we having a raffle? I've seen both. 1. Yes - Wednesday (?) 2. How many drift boats will be there and how do I hook a ride? 2. I'll have my (new) raft and likely will be floating most every day but I'm bringing two friends also. You should be able to get a float and if we float upstream of W Fork Madison, where you're not allowed to fish from the boat, I can float 4 people. 3. Where on the Madison will we be fishing? Next to the campground? Upstream, down??? 3. Mostly between Ennis and Quake Lake ; -) although there's lots of other good water within two hours. You'll stay busy, and you can wet wade almost everything (take waders into the park for the Yellowstone River, ahem) so nobody will notice if your hat is wet. 4. Will we be fishing in Yellowstone? 4. You might want to. Some folks, like Lou T, concentrate mostly on the park. 5. How far do you guys range on a standard day? 5. 5-100 miles 6. Do you have to go to a state store to buy booze in MT or are there liquor stores on every corner? Beer? 6. No problem in MT 7. Do I really need to tie size 20 and 22 PMD's? 7. If you do, I'll be out of luck. I will have lots of PTs 7.A. Are the wings on a PMD dun grey or white? 7a. That's a good question. I bet the fish don't know! 7.B. Shoud I fish the above with a 7X tippet? 7b. 3X for me, but I'll have some 4X just in case. -- Frank Reid Euthanize to respond |
"Frank Reid" 1. a raffle? Count on me for a local fly shop gift certificate... 2. drift boats Now that sounds like fun, must put on list 4. Will we be fishing in Yellowstone? At the least I will sightsee there, and maybe another day cruising Montana. 6. Do you have to go to a state store to buy booze in MT or are there liquor stores on every corner? Beer? Stocking up on the way in from Bozeman New Question. Will there be anything to smoke if I run out of cigarettes? john |
Sorry John I'm not going
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Mike wrote:
Sorry John I'm not going I am. Stop by my camper, John, if you're there early in the week. -- Cut "to the chase" for my email address. |
Frank Bring your Cicada flies. They should be great if a Salmonfly hatch is on. IMHO you can do good by fishing a Para Adams until 2:30 PM and switching to a Grey Wolfe for the rest of the day. Regular Caddis flies are good to have also. "Yellowstone opens July 15" means the river not the park. There are a lot of other streams in the park open. Rather than midges, I switch to things like Turkes Tarantulas, Trudes, Chenobyl Ants, Stimulators, etc. Also did very well one time with SJ worm. I'd start with a Caddis fly if I were fishing the Gardiner close to the park entrance. |
Yeah RW, glad you might make it!
bruce h a pretty safe camper. bevin will give us a run for our money. |
On 16 Jun 2005 04:49:02 -0700, "lou t" wrote:
"Yellowstone opens July 15" means the river not the park. I said "*the* Yellowstone opens", FWIW. g -- Charlie... http://www.chocphoto.com |
Frank Reid wrote:
Okay, some questions from someone that's never been to the Western Clave. 1. Are we or aren't we having a raffle? I've seen both. 2. How many drift boats will be there and how do I hook a ride? warren usually brings the gink/xink boat, and each time i've been i've noticed at least two others with boats. if there, you'll have no problem being offered a ride. some like the boats, others don't. 3. Where on the Madison will we be fishing? Next to the campground? Upstream, down??? everywhere from ennis to yellowstone... 4. Will we be fishing in Yellowstone? most definitely...my favorite streams are in the park. 5. How far do you guys range on a standard day? varies... not unusual to do a 100 miles though. 6. Do you have to go to a state store to buy booze in MT or are there liquor stores on every corner? Beer? montana is quite civilized in its alcohol distribution system... the grocery store in west yellowstone has a liquor store section in it...and the bars are superb everywhere. 7. Do I really need to tie size 20 and 22 PMD's? no...unless of course you do. 7.A. Are the wings on a PMD dun grey or white? yes 7.B. Shoud I fish the above with a 7X tippet? um...which of the above? Inquiring minds wanna know. you'll get over this problem soon enough...the experience will be both addictive and mind-numbing. jeff (uh oh...i just read northwest is heading toward a strike or bankruptcy - and all my plane fares are already purchased...) |
"Charlie Choc" wrote in message "Yellowstone opens July 15" means the river not the park. I said "*the* Yellowstone opens", FWIW. g -- Charlie... http://www.chocphoto.com Indian Joe suggests you might of said "some Portions Of the Yellowstone open--- don't want everyone invading Jeff"s private spot. Even an elderly indian fishing with a red ass cadis caught nice fish there last year.! |
rw wrote:
Mike wrote: Sorry John I'm not going I am. Stop by my camper, John, if you're there early in the week. i thought you bagged this year's gathering? is willi reconsidering too? always good to have the stalwarts around. any chance you might want to hike into bechler for a day? i've sorta got soda butte, bechler, and the lamar on my list of "would like to fish" streams as i've not yet seen or fished them. the park streams are my favorites out there, although that one creek we visited with dan'l - where you pulled up 3 or 4 fish from the pool by the big rock - was a blast too. jeff |
"Jeff Miller" wrote in message news:gOese.21412$%Z2.11854@lakeread08... rw wrote: Mike wrote: Sorry John I'm not going I am. Stop by my camper, John, if you're there early in the week. i thought you bagged this year's gathering? is willi reconsidering too? always good to have the stalwarts around. any chance you might want to hike into bechler for a day? i've sorta got soda butte, bechler, and the lamar on my list of "would like to fish" streams as i've not yet seen or fished them. the park streams are my favorites out there, although that one creek we visited with dan'l - where you pulled up 3 or 4 fish from the pool by the big rock - was a blast too. About half a mile from the point at which the Soda Butte enters the Lamar, where a side channel re-enters the main stream, along the right bank (as you face downstream), http://www.topozone.com/map.asp?z=12...83&layer=DRG25 there was a two foot long cutthroat 12 or 13 years ago. It should be at least two yards by now. :) Wolfgang and it likes letort hoppers. |
On Thu, 16 Jun 2005 12:55:57 GMT, "Joe McIntosh"
wrote: "Charlie Choc" wrote in message "Yellowstone opens July 15" means the river not the park. I said "*the* Yellowstone opens", FWIW. g -- Charlie... http://www.chocphoto.com Indian Joe suggests you might of said "some Portions Of the Yellowstone open--- don't want everyone invading Jeff"s private spot. Even an elderly indian fishing with a red ass cadis caught nice fish there last year.! I stand corrected.g -- Charlie... http://www.chocphoto.com |
Jeff Miller wrote:
i thought you bagged this year's gathering? is willi reconsidering too? always good to have the stalwarts around. any chance you might want to hike into bechler for a day? The Bechler is very marshy and full of mosquitoes until September. -- Cut "to the chase" for my email address. |
Wolfgang wrote:
"Jeff Miller" wrote: ... i've sorta got soda butte, bechler, and the lamar on my list of "would like to fish" streams as i've not yet seen or fished them. ... About half a mile from the point at which the Soda Butte enters the Lamar, Clavers wanting to fish the Lamar should check with one of the fly shops in West Yellowstone before driving all the way over there. Half a drop of rain on the Mirror Plateau and the Lamar is too muddy to fish for days. -- Ken Fortenberry |
On Thu, 16 Jun 2005 08:10:46 -0600, rw wrote:
Jeff Miller wrote: i thought you bagged this year's gathering? is willi reconsidering too? always good to have the stalwarts around. any chance you might want to hike into bechler for a day? The Bechler is very marshy and full of mosquitoes until September. And don't forget the biting flies. g -- Charlie... http://www.chocphoto.com |
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On Thu, 16 Jun 2005 10:19:36 -0500, Kevin Vang wrote:
In article , says... On Thu, 16 Jun 2005 08:10:46 -0600, rw wrote: The Bechler is very marshy and full of mosquitoes until September. And don't forget the biting flies. g and rattlesnakes, and grizzly bears. I hear Bear Trap Canyon is a good hike for rattlesnakes. I may give that a try after the clave. -- Charlie... http://www.chocphoto.com |
4. Will we be fishing in Yellowstone?
most definitely...my favorite streams are in the park. Uh, I'm bringing my 5wt rods. Would there be a need for a lighter weight rod for little creeks? jeff (uh oh...i just read northwest is heading toward a strike or bankruptcy - and all my plane fares are already purchased...) Ruh roh George! Gotta check with whom I've made my reserves. -- Frank Reid Euthanize to respond |
On Thu, 16 Jun 2005 12:04:22 -0400, "Frank Reid" wrote:
4. Will we be fishing in Yellowstone? most definitely...my favorite streams are in the park. Uh, I'm bringing my 5wt rods. Would there be a need for a lighter weight rod for little creeks? A 3 or 4wt would be good for a lot of streams there. jeff (uh oh...i just read northwest is heading toward a strike or bankruptcy - and all my plane fares are already purchased...) Ruh roh George! Gotta check with whom I've made my reserves. -- Charlie... http://www.chocphoto.com |
On Thu, 16 Jun 2005 09:05:25 -0400, Jeff Miller
wrote: i've sorta got soda butte, bechler, and the lamar on my list of "would like to fish" streams as i've not yet seen or fished them. I might be up for the Lamar, but it's supposedly one of the last to clear up from runoff so if may still be clouded up - Warren said the snowfall has been pretty good. Soda Butte was blown out when Lou T took me there last year and I'd like to give it a shot this year. -- Charlie... http://www.chocphoto.com |
On Thu, 16 Jun 2005 13:27:08 -0400, Charlie Choc
wrote: On Thu, 16 Jun 2005 09:05:25 -0400, Jeff Miller wrote: i've sorta got soda butte, bechler, and the lamar on my list of "would like to fish" streams as i've not yet seen or fished them. I might be up for the Lamar, but it's supposedly one of the last to clear up from runoff so if may still be clouded up - Warren said the snowfall has been pretty good. Soda Butte was blown out when Lou T took me there last year and I'd like to give it a shot this year. The Lamar can get dirty from a thunder strom up in the Valleys and may take a few days to clear. There is a green drake like fly that comes off in early July who's name escapes me.. |
wrote in message oups.com... I'll take a shot: 7b. 3X for me, but I'll have some 4X just in case. bruce h 3X?? Are you serious? Danl |
Danl wrote:
wrote in message oups.com... I'll take a shot: 7b. 3X for me, but I'll have some 4X just in case. bruce h 3X?? Are you serious? 3x is way overkill for a 5wt rod, or anything lighter, unless maybe you expect to get snagged a lot. I never go below 4x for ordinary trout fishing, and rarely below 5x. -- Cut "to the chase" for my email address. |
"rw" wrote in message ... 3x is way overkill for a 5wt rod, or anything lighter, unless maybe you expect to get snagged a lot. I never go below 4x for ordinary trout fishing, and rarely below 5x. -- Cut "to the chase" for my email address. My question was whether Bruiser normally uses 3x on the Madison (for instance). I don't think 3x is particularly overkill for a 5 wt. I would use the largest leader/tippet I could , limited by when the fish start to care too much. The larger the line, the easier on me, easier on the fish, easier on my terminal tackle/fly budget. As some have avered, the fooling of the fish is the most of the game; the playing and landing are not so large a part of the fun. Danl |
Yes I use 3X on the Madison - Cabela's Tectan in a similar size but
basically 3X. Pretty sure that I have no idea what I'm doing but my hottest streak ever on that river was last year with two nymphs and 3X all the way to the end. I've been using 3X lately with my 3 weight with stimulators tied by RW himself! It's a wild world. That won't work for me later in the season. Lately there's been stoneflies crawling all over me and 3X works great so what the hell. Good for getting the fly out of trees too! bruce h |
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I am on my last one of those Stimulators and the eye was crowded on
maybe 2 of apprx 25 you gave me. Mostly I critiqued the oversized front hackle : -) I have caught lots of fish with those flies and with each fish I like the big hackle more and more! And with every fish I'm reminded that I'm a dork (G). bh |
rw wrote:
Danl wrote: wrote in message oups.com... I'll take a shot: 7b. 3X for me, but I'll have some 4X just in case. bruce h 3X?? Are you serious? 3x is way overkill for a 5wt rod, or anything lighter, unless maybe you expect to get snagged a lot. I never go below 4x for ordinary trout fishing, and rarely below 5x. I think 3 or 4X is a good choice if you're going to be fishing the big salmonflies using either dries or nymphs. 5X or smaller is going to twist with the air resistant dries and not turn over well with either the heavy nymphs or the bushy dries. And I don't understand why 3 or 4X would be overkill for a 5 weight or lighter rod. (I know you did an "experiment" that, IMO, didn't relate to real fishing). On a boisterous river like the Madison below Quake Lake there's seldom any reason to go lighter than 4X. I'd also be interested in doing a test of your 7X is as good as 2X with a 5 weight on the Madison. I'll make you the same offer I made Peter "I'll buy you dinner and drinks if you land a fish over 18" in a couple(two or three) minutes or just land a fish over 20" on 7X tippet." Willi |
wrote:
I am on my last one of those Stimulators and the eye was crowded on maybe 2 of apprx 25 you gave me. Mostly I critiqued the oversized front hackle : -) I have caught lots of fish with those flies and with each fish I like the big hackle more and more! And with every fish I'm reminded that I'm a dork (G). bh Where have you been fishing that wasn't blown out? Everything around here is raging and you guys had some big snowpack down there. Willi |
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