The Wrist In The Cast
 

As a semi-newbie who is still trying to cast well consistently, I
thought I'd go out tonight to the local park for a little practice.
There was a Little League practice going on and I was puttering around
with my usual inconsistency off to the side. Then the practice ended
and I heard the voice, "Want to know what you're doing wrong?"
It turns out the guy was a coach. "You're not using your wrist.
Think snap, dead stop." Then he proceeded to false cast about 50' of
line effortlessly like it was nothing to demonstrate. He watched me for
a while, we introduced ourselves, I thanked him, then he left.
My casting improved more in that 15 minutes than it has in 2 years.
Why do so many instructors tell you to keep the wrist straight? It
seems much easier to generate line speed by snapping the wrist to a dead
stop. I guess there really is no substitute for personal instruction,
even if it is only for 15 minutes.

The Wrist In The Cast
 

On Wed, 19 May 2004 22:19:27 -0400, (tmon) wrote:

As a semi-newbie who is still trying to cast well consistently, I
thought I'd go out tonight to the local park for a little practice.
There was a Little League practice going on and I was puttering around
with my usual inconsistency off to the side. Then the practice ended
and I heard the voice, "Want to know what you're doing wrong?"
It turns out the guy was a coach. "You're not using your wrist.
Think snap, dead stop." Then he proceeded to false cast about 50' of
line effortlessly like it was nothing to demonstrate. He watched me for
a while, we introduced ourselves, I thanked him, then he left.
My casting improved more in that 15 minutes than it has in 2 years.
Why do so many instructors tell you to keep the wrist straight? It
seems much easier to generate line speed by snapping the wrist to a dead
stop. I guess there really is no substitute for personal instruction,
even if it is only for 15 minutes.

Don't feel bad, some of us took a lot longer than 2 years to figure out the
wrist could actually bend while casting a fly line.

I was introduced to the "Microsecond Wrist" by Doug Swisher hisownself - who
demonstrated it out in a parking lot with my 7 foot 2 weight.

First cast, Ziiiiing! He laid out a good fifty feet of line and leader with
half the arm movement of my own humble casting stroke. He did a slow-motion
walk-through showing his wrist actually breaking (gasp!) and the rest is
history.

That was in 1990, iirc. I'd been flyfishing for 26 years, using the classic
"hammer stroke", which requires one hell of a lot more energy to do and asks
precious little of the rod...

/daytripper (you pay for the rod, so make *it* do the work! ;-)

The Wrist In The Cast
 

tmon wrote:

Why do so many instructors tell you to keep the wrist straight?

Actually, you're also supposed to hold a Bible between your elbow and
your ribs. :-)

The only things that matter, from the perspective of physical dynamics,
are the forces and the torques on the rod grip. I think a good caster
can achieve those with either a passive or an active wrist.

--
Cut "to the chase" for my email address.

The Wrist In The Cast
 

From: (daytripper)

Don't feel bad, some of us took a lot longer than 2 years to figure out
the wrist could actually bend while casting a fly line.

I would think that the reason some instructors tell you initially to
keep your wrist straight is to prevent the rod from going back to 2 or 3
o'clock. If you can snap your wrist and than stop at 12 or 1 o'clock it
is much easier to cast and requires less arm motion and energy. At
least in my case.

I was introduced to the "Microsecond Wrist" by Doug Swisher hisownself
- who demonstrated it out in a parking lot with my 7 foot 2 weight.
First cast, Ziiiiing! He laid out a good fifty feet of line and leader
with half the arm movement of my own humble casting stroke. He did a
slow-motion walk-through showing his wrist actually breaking (gasp!) and
the rest is history.

Have you ever watched Joan Wulff's "The Dynamics Of Fly Casting"? She
repeats the mantra over and over, loading move, power snap of the wrist,
drift on the backcast. Then the same. Loading move, power snap of the
wrist, drift on the forward cast.

That was in 1990, iirc. I'd been flyfishing for 26 years, using the
classic "hammer stroke", which requires one hell of a lot more energy to
do and asks precious little of the rod...

I use the "hammer stroke" the 3 or 4 times a year I golf. That's why
I'm lucky to break 90. :-)

/daytripper (you pay for the rod, so make *it* do the work! ;-)

I only learned that lesson tonight. It was a revelation.

The Wrist In The Cast
 

Hi "tmon",

Casting comes easy for some and hard for others but there is no substitute
for some good help.

I think why many fly casting instructors, videos and books on fly casting
say "don't bend your wrist" is because many only bend their wrist to cast.
If you only plan on casting on smaller streams, "wrist casting " (only
bending your wrist and not using your arm) will work well for you. I have
seen some of the finest fly fishers in the world 'wrist cast' on smaller
water. It is an efficient way to cast for shorter distances. If you plan on
fly casting on open water like lakes, steelhead rivers or the tropical flats
you will have to use your entire arm to cast. Kind of like throwing a
baseball.

If you watch Doug Swishers 3M video "Basic Fly Casting", he will talk about
the "micro wrist". He is trying to verbalize about using your wrist to
'snap' some speed into the end of the casting stroke and then come to a
complete stop. He means for you to give the rod a little/short "kick" or
"snap" and the end of the front and back stroke of your cast.

Doug Swisher did comment that we have lots of great fly casters now but we
also have lots of bad ones too. He said with all the short line high stick
indicator fishing in streams and all the trolling in float tubes and
pontoons boats, that many never have to lean to fly cast to catch a lot of
big fish.

I worked for Fenwick, Orvis and Mel Krieger fly casting schools over the
years as an assistant casting instructor. We always had a head instructor
that ran the schools and then several assistant instructors. I would
recommend that anyone who is starting into the sport or anyone who is not
happy with their casting to find a goods instructor or school. Some times
just an hour or two can make a lot of difference (maybe even 15 minutes?).

After you learn to cast consistently with ease, then you can move on much
more easily to fly fishing.

Fly fishing guides really are happy if we can send them a customers that has
taken the time to learn how to cast first. It makes it much easier for the
guide to get that angler into some fish.




--
Bill Kiene

Kiene's Fly Shop
Sacramento, CA, USA

Web site: www.kiene.com


"tmon" wrote in message
...

As a semi-newbie who is still trying to cast well consistently, I
thought I'd go out tonight to the local park for a little practice.
There was a Little League practice going on and I was puttering around
with my usual inconsistency off to the side. Then the practice ended
and I heard the voice, "Want to know what you're doing wrong?"
It turns out the guy was a coach. "You're not using your wrist.
Think snap, dead stop." Then he proceeded to false cast about 50' of
line effortlessly like it was nothing to demonstrate. He watched me for
a while, we introduced ourselves, I thanked him, then he left.
My casting improved more in that 15 minutes than it has in 2 years.
Why do so many instructors tell you to keep the wrist straight? It
seems much easier to generate line speed by snapping the wrist to a dead
stop. I guess there really is no substitute for personal instruction,
even if it is only for 15 minutes.

The Wrist In The Cast
 

From: (Bill=A0Kiene)

Hi "tmon",
Casting comes easy for some and hard for others but there is no
substitute for some good help.

Hi Bill, that's true.

I think why many fly casting instructors, videos and books on fly
casting say "don't bend your wrist" is because many only bend their
wrist to cast. If you only plan on casting on smaller streams, "wrist
casting " (only bending your wrist and not using your arm) will work
well for you. I have seen some of the finest fly fishers in the world
'wrist cast' on smaller water. It is an efficient way to cast for
shorter distances. If you plan on fly casting on open water like lakes,
steelhead rivers or the tropical flats you will have to use your entire
arm to cast. Kind of like throwing a baseball.

I'm in New England, so I'm not used to the big water you know out west.
But before you incorporate the arm for the big water, the wrist is more
important, no?

If you watch Doug Swishers 3M video "Basic Fly Casting", he will talk
about the "micro wrist". He is trying to verbalize about using your
wrist to 'snap' some speed into the end of the casting stroke and then
come to a complete stop. He means for you to give the rod a little/short
"kick" or "snap" and the end of the front and back stroke of your cast.

Joan Wulff says the same thing basically except I couldn't apply it
until it was demonstrated to me.

Doug Swisher did comment that we have lots of great fly casters now but
we also have lots of bad ones too. He said with all the short line high
stick indicator fishing in streams and all the trolling in float tubes
and pontoons boats, that many never have to lean to fly cast to catch a
lot of big fish.

I'm a wader so I'll have to learn how to cast. -:)

I worked for Fenwick, Orvis and Mel Krieger fly casting schools over
the years as an assistant casting instructor. We always had a head
instructor that ran the schools and then several assistant instructors.
I would recommend that anyone who is starting into the sport or anyone
who is not happy with their casting to find a goods instructor or
school. Some times just an hour or two can make a lot of difference
(maybe even 15 minutes?).

This is excellent advice. The learning curve with personal instruction
is tremendous.

After you learn to cast consistently with ease, then you can move on
much more easily to fly fishing.
Fly fishing guides really are happy if we can send them a customers that
has taken the time to learn how to cast first. It makes it much easier
for the guide to get that angler into some fish.

Do you really get any people who have never picked up a flyrod?

The Wrist In The Cast
 

From: (rw)

Actually, you're also supposed to hold a Bible between your elbow and
your ribs. :-)

That actually might help to catch fish though, and it has nothing to do
with casting. :-)

The only things that matter, from the perspective of physical dynamics,
are the forces and the torques on the rod grip. I think a good caster
can achieve those with either a passive or an active wrist.

But doesn't the use of the wrist make it easier to load the rod?

The Wrist In The Cast
 

tmon wrote:

From: (rw)

The only things that matter, from the perspective of physical dynamics,
are the forces and the torques on the rod grip. I think a good caster
can achieve those with either a passive or an active wrist.

But doesn't the use of the wrist make it easier to load the rod?

Sloooowly I turn, step by step, inch by inch..........

JR

The Wrist In The Cast
 

There is a very good video out by George Roberts at
http://www.whitemouseflyfishing.com/swfc.html that shows you how and when to
bend your writs. It also discusses what other authors say abut bending, not
breaking, your wrists. I see that he now offers his video on some sort of
return if not satisfied conditon.

--


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"tmon" wrote in message
...
As a semi-newbie who is still trying to cast well consistently, I
thought I'd go out tonight to the local park for a little practice.
There was a Little League practice going on and I was puttering around
with my usual inconsistency off to the side. Then the practice ended
and I heard the voice, "Want to know what you're doing wrong?"
It turns out the guy was a coach. "You're not using your wrist.
Think snap, dead stop." Then he proceeded to false cast about 50' of
line effortlessly like it was nothing to demonstrate. He watched me for
a while, we introduced ourselves, I thanked him, then he left.
My casting improved more in that 15 minutes than it has in 2 years.
Why do so many instructors tell you to keep the wrist straight? It
seems much easier to generate line speed by snapping the wrist to a dead
stop. I guess there really is no substitute for personal instruction,
even if it is only for 15 minutes.

The Wrist In The Cast
 

"Sierra fisher" wrote in message
...
There is a very good video out by George Roberts at
http://www.whitemouseflyfishing.com/swfc.html that shows you how and when
to
bend your writs. It also discusses what other authors say abut bending,
not
breaking, your wrists.

Why does this suddenly sound like another lawyer thread?

--riverman

The Wrist In The Cast
 

Im in line with Bill K here. The problem is that most new casters are using
their wrist too much
and basically end up with a 9am-3pm stroke which doesnt load the rod at
all. To get around this
its easier to have them try not to use the wrist as a first approach and
then later add the finishing
touches.

The Wrist In The Cast
 

Greg Pavlov wrote in message ...
On Thu, 20 May 2004 10:57:08 -0700, Svend Tang-Petersen
wrote:

Im in line with Bill K here. The problem is that most new casters are
using
their wrist too much
and basically end up with a 9am-3pm stroke which doesnt load the rod at
all. To get around this
its easier to have them try not to use the wrist as a first approach and
then later add the finishing
touches.

There is another reason: "snap" the wrist a bit too much while
casting a heavier rod, say a 10 wt, at the age of a sedentary
50+ yrs, and it is likely to hurt like hell and may end your
fishing day right then and there.


Once I used a 10 weight rod without the fighting butt attached, and after
long distance flats casting for an hour or so, my inner forearm was visibly
bruised from the reel seat continually whacking into my arm with a heavy
reel attached. Each cast got more painful than the last ~ it was that bad
that I never ever fished with that rod again without its fighting butt
attached.

Another time I remember blistering my hand from trying to fish a 9 weight
rod with something like a 5 weight line (all that was available) ~ was
really hard work to cast that silly combo, and it took the skin off my
hands.

The Wrist In The Cast
 

tmon wrote:


I also use my wrist but more often and pronounced with lighter outfits
especially when trying to execute "finesse" casts.

Interesting that most people seemed to favor the use of the wrist. The
last time this was brought up on ROFF, not many people expressed that in
the face of Mike C's pronouncement that the wrist should never be used -
broken.

Willi

The Wrist In The Cast
 

"Willi" wrote in message

Interesting that most people seemed to favor the use of the wrist. The
last time this was brought up on ROFF, not many people expressed that in
the face of Mike C's pronouncement that the wrist should never be used -
broken.

Willi




A most remarkable attribution, and quite untrue.

"Using" the wrist, is not at all the same thing as allowing it to "break".

Apart from which, "using" the wrist properly becomes progressively more
difficult, the heavier the gear. Most people will merely end up damaging
themselves "using" their wrists with heavy, too long, or otherwise
inappropriate gear. The same thing will occur with uncontrolled "breaking".

Many beginners have a major problem casting at first, because they
allow their wrists to break uncontrollably. This simply results in poor
stops, uncontrolled timing, and a number of other errors.

Not using the wrist at all, makes it is easier to learn the basic
principles.

Once you know them, you can use your wrist as much as you like. Indeed, if
you want to be a really good caster, you must do so. Trying to do it
beforehand usually results in failure. This is why many instructors advocate
casting with a locked wrist, and the elbow at the side to begin with. This
automatically prevents a large number of errors from occurring, and suffices
for the distances required in normal river fishing.

If you do not bend your wrist, you can not make any of the mistakes
associated with doing so, and you can not hurt yourself either.

TL
MC

The Wrist In The Cast
 

Mike Connor wrote in message ...

Not using the wrist at all, makes it is easier to learn the basic
principles.



I totally agree that for someone to start learning to cast, then the wrist
should be rigid, and the butt may even be tied to the forearm to assist
this. The most common first error for new casters is the 9 - 3 o'clock
aerial loop-snake, and it is due to uncontrolled flexing of the wrist. It
is much easier for the beginner to first learn to use the forearm's action
in casting.

The Wrist In The Cast
 

Mike Connor wrote:


I'm not interested in getting in a ****ing match but you do tend to make
dogmatic statements that seem straight forward to me but maybe I'm not
interpreting them correctly. Here's a few you made in the past about
using the wrist:


A most remarkable attribution, and quite untrue.

Once you know them, you can use your wrist as much as you like. Indeed, if
you want to be a really good caster, you must do so.


"I do not use any wrist at all when casting, it is locked."

"Most anglers suffer from the severe disadvantage that they use their
wrists when casting. This really is a major fault, and quite unnecessary."

"If you learn to lock your wrist completely, you will be absolutely
amazed at the results, believe me. Everything immediately improves, and
quite dramatically at that, distance, accuracy, power, control,
smoothness, etc etc."


Willi

The Wrist In The Cast
 

"Willi" wrote

I'm not interested in getting in a ****ing match

Well aim somewhere else.