Egg patterns
 

Is an egg pattern cheating? (Glo-bugs as we call them in N.Z)

Egg patterns
 

From: Buxc

Is an egg pattern cheating? (Glo-bugs as we call them in N.Z)

No.


George Adams

"All good fishermen stay young until they die, for fishing is the only dream of
youth that doth not grow stale with age."
---- J.W Muller

Egg patterns
 

From: Buxc

Is an egg pattern cheating? (Glo-bugs as we call them in N.Z)

No.


George Adams

"All good fishermen stay young until they die, for fishing is the only dream of
youth that doth not grow stale with age."
---- J.W Muller

Egg patterns
 

Buxc wrote:

Is an egg pattern cheating? (Glo-bugs as we call them in N.Z)

Cheating at what ? It's not cheating on your wife or cheating
at cards. It does have more in common with bait fishing than
fly fishing, if that's what you mean.

--
Ken Fortenberry

Egg patterns
 

Buxc wrote:

Is an egg pattern cheating? (Glo-bugs as we call them in N.Z)

Cheating at what ? It's not cheating on your wife or cheating
at cards. It does have more in common with bait fishing than
fly fishing, if that's what you mean.

--
Ken Fortenberry

Egg patterns
 

"Ken Fortenberry" wrote in message
m...
Buxc wrote:

Is an egg pattern cheating? (Glo-bugs as we call them in N.Z)

Cheating at what ? It's not cheating on your wife or cheating
at cards. It does have more in common with bait fishing than
fly fishing, if that's what you mean.

--
Ken Fortenberry

Why does using an egg pattern have more in common with bait fishing than fly
fishing? Is because one is using a pattern that resembles something used by
bait fishermen? If so, would using a hopper pattern have more in common with
bait fishing than fly fishing?

Or is it because the egg pattern is drifted below the surface?

Tim Lysyk

Egg patterns
 

"Ken Fortenberry" wrote in message
m...
Buxc wrote:

Is an egg pattern cheating? (Glo-bugs as we call them in N.Z)

Cheating at what ? It's not cheating on your wife or cheating
at cards. It does have more in common with bait fishing than
fly fishing, if that's what you mean.

--
Ken Fortenberry

Why does using an egg pattern have more in common with bait fishing than fly
fishing? Is because one is using a pattern that resembles something used by
bait fishermen? If so, would using a hopper pattern have more in common with
bait fishing than fly fishing?

Or is it because the egg pattern is drifted below the surface?

Tim Lysyk

Egg patterns
 

Tim Lysyk wrote:
"Ken Fortenberry" wrote:
Buxc wrote:
Is an egg pattern cheating? (Glo-bugs as we call them in N.Z)

... It does have more in common with bait fishing than
fly fishing, if that's what you mean.

Why does using an egg pattern have more in common with bait fishing than fly
fishing? Is because one is using a pattern that resembles something used by
bait fishermen? If so, would using a hopper pattern have more in common with
bait fishing than fly fishing?

Or is it because the egg pattern is drifted below the surface?

A hopper is constructed of fur and feathers and is fished like
a fly. An egg pattern, no matter how constructed, is fished
exactly the same way you would fish an actual egg plucked straight
out of the jar. Not that using an egg pattern is "cheating" (where
legal), it's perfectly acceptable for those who want to fish
that way, but it is more like bait fishing than fly fishing and
some fly fishermen, me included, eschew it.

It's strictly a personal choice, not "cheating" at all (where legal).

--
Ken Fortenberry

Egg patterns
 

Tim Lysyk wrote:
"Ken Fortenberry" wrote:
Buxc wrote:
Is an egg pattern cheating? (Glo-bugs as we call them in N.Z)

... It does have more in common with bait fishing than
fly fishing, if that's what you mean.

Why does using an egg pattern have more in common with bait fishing than fly
fishing? Is because one is using a pattern that resembles something used by
bait fishermen? If so, would using a hopper pattern have more in common with
bait fishing than fly fishing?

Or is it because the egg pattern is drifted below the surface?

A hopper is constructed of fur and feathers and is fished like
a fly. An egg pattern, no matter how constructed, is fished
exactly the same way you would fish an actual egg plucked straight
out of the jar. Not that using an egg pattern is "cheating" (where
legal), it's perfectly acceptable for those who want to fish
that way, but it is more like bait fishing than fly fishing and
some fly fishermen, me included, eschew it.

It's strictly a personal choice, not "cheating" at all (where legal).

--
Ken Fortenberry

Egg patterns
 

From: Ken Fortenberry

A hopper is constructed of fur and feathers and is fished like
a fly. An egg pattern, no matter how constructed, is fished
exactly the same way you would fish an actual egg plucked straight
out of the jar.

Not that using an egg pattern is "cheating" (where
legal), it's perfectly acceptable for those who want to fish
that way, but it is more like bait fishing than fly fishing and
some fly fishermen, me included, eschew it.

Below the surface, trout feed on a number of creatures...the larval and pupal
forms of aquatic insects, aquatic worms, small fish, and fish eggs. Most of the
above, when properly fished, are fished in the same manner as bait. Here in MA,
in late April, I'll often be fishing a Hendrickson nymph, dead drift, bouncing
off the bottom in anticipation of the impending hatch. A couple of weeks later,
I'll be fishing sucker egg imitations in the same place, and in the same
manner. No difference, IMO.

If the distinction is the construction of the "fly", my midge larva imitations
would likely be considered less of a fly than my egg imitations.

It's strictly a personal choice, not "cheating" at all (where legal).

Agreed, but I don't know of any water in the Northeast where a Glo-Bug or
similar imitation would be illegal. The "glue gun" or bead type eggs might be
considered a lure, but not a fly, under some definitions.



George Adams

"All good fishermen stay young until they die, for fishing is the only dream of
youth that doth not grow stale with age."
---- J.W Muller

Egg patterns
 

From: Ken Fortenberry

A hopper is constructed of fur and feathers and is fished like
a fly. An egg pattern, no matter how constructed, is fished
exactly the same way you would fish an actual egg plucked straight
out of the jar.

Not that using an egg pattern is "cheating" (where
legal), it's perfectly acceptable for those who want to fish
that way, but it is more like bait fishing than fly fishing and
some fly fishermen, me included, eschew it.

Below the surface, trout feed on a number of creatures...the larval and pupal
forms of aquatic insects, aquatic worms, small fish, and fish eggs. Most of the
above, when properly fished, are fished in the same manner as bait. Here in MA,
in late April, I'll often be fishing a Hendrickson nymph, dead drift, bouncing
off the bottom in anticipation of the impending hatch. A couple of weeks later,
I'll be fishing sucker egg imitations in the same place, and in the same
manner. No difference, IMO.

If the distinction is the construction of the "fly", my midge larva imitations
would likely be considered less of a fly than my egg imitations.

It's strictly a personal choice, not "cheating" at all (where legal).

Agreed, but I don't know of any water in the Northeast where a Glo-Bug or
similar imitation would be illegal. The "glue gun" or bead type eggs might be
considered a lure, but not a fly, under some definitions.



George Adams

"All good fishermen stay young until they die, for fishing is the only dream of
youth that doth not grow stale with age."
---- J.W Muller

Egg patterns
 

"Ken Fortenberry" wrote in message
...

snip

some fly fishermen, me included, eschew it.

It's strictly a personal choice,



Some fly fishers are so stuck up that to them, only a dry fly is considered
fly fishing.

It's strictly a personal choice.

But since it has been proven that fish dine mostly on subsurface food items,
he who only fishes dries, misses a lot of fish!!



------------------------------------------------
"If we don't succeed, we run the risk of failure."
- Dan Quayle

Egg patterns
 

Good question, and a debate that has raged for years here in NZ.

I'll put Ken's comments aside because he's got his elitist blinkers on
again.

The Glo-Bug is an attractor fly in many instances and a roe imitation in
others. In most instances it is used on fish running the rivers from the
lakes on their spawning migration in New Zealand, and for that matter, the
rest of the world. So mainly it is a roe imitation.

The principle I have often used is to go right to heart of what fly-fishing
is generally about for many. Fooling a feeding trout with a constructed
imitation of the current food source. To be considered a "fly" by most
flytiers this would require the use of tying thread, natural or synthetic
furs and yarns and or hackle if appropriate. In the case of "Glo-Bugs" in NZ
it obviously fits the category.

Now a trout sitting in a spring creek sipping down emerging mayflies is
fished to by the fly fisherman with an imitation of that as best can be
created by the fly tiers art. A trout waiting in a Tongariro pool is picking
up drifting eggs for a number of reasons, least of all food, but for the
moment is probably ingesting very little else. The "Glo-Bug" is an imitation
of that. The parallels are obvious, the differences somewhat lost on me.
Some may perceive differences, I personally don't see any. The angler is
simply imitating what the trout is feeding on at that moment.

However, that is my thoughts in defense of the fly. The technique of the
heavy Bomb fly, dropper and Glo-bug attached to a heavy leader and fished
with a budgie sized indicator is, at best a *******ization of fly-fishing. I
practice that technique myself at times on the winter fishery, but try to
stay well aware that what I am doing is not really fly-fishing even though
many on the big river would believe it is in light of having experienced
very little else in terms of real" flyfishing.

So to sum up my thoughts, I think the "Glo-Bug" is very definitely a fly,
but the techniques often associated with it are not always fly-fishing.

Clark Reid
www.dryflynz.com


"Buxc" wrote in message
...
Is an egg pattern cheating? (Glo-bugs as we call them in N.Z)

Egg patterns
 

Good question, and a debate that has raged for years here in NZ.

I'll put Ken's comments aside because he's got his elitist blinkers on
again.

The Glo-Bug is an attractor fly in many instances and a roe imitation in
others. In most instances it is used on fish running the rivers from the
lakes on their spawning migration in New Zealand, and for that matter, the
rest of the world. So mainly it is a roe imitation.

The principle I have often used is to go right to heart of what fly-fishing
is generally about for many. Fooling a feeding trout with a constructed
imitation of the current food source. To be considered a "fly" by most
flytiers this would require the use of tying thread, natural or synthetic
furs and yarns and or hackle if appropriate. In the case of "Glo-Bugs" in NZ
it obviously fits the category.

Now a trout sitting in a spring creek sipping down emerging mayflies is
fished to by the fly fisherman with an imitation of that as best can be
created by the fly tiers art. A trout waiting in a Tongariro pool is picking
up drifting eggs for a number of reasons, least of all food, but for the
moment is probably ingesting very little else. The "Glo-Bug" is an imitation
of that. The parallels are obvious, the differences somewhat lost on me.
Some may perceive differences, I personally don't see any. The angler is
simply imitating what the trout is feeding on at that moment.

However, that is my thoughts in defense of the fly. The technique of the
heavy Bomb fly, dropper and Glo-bug attached to a heavy leader and fished
with a budgie sized indicator is, at best a *******ization of fly-fishing. I
practice that technique myself at times on the winter fishery, but try to
stay well aware that what I am doing is not really fly-fishing even though
many on the big river would believe it is in light of having experienced
very little else in terms of real" flyfishing.

So to sum up my thoughts, I think the "Glo-Bug" is very definitely a fly,
but the techniques often associated with it are not always fly-fishing.

Clark Reid
www.dryflynz.com


"Buxc" wrote in message
...
Is an egg pattern cheating? (Glo-bugs as we call them in N.Z)

Egg patterns
 

Buxc wrote in news:kqrMc.4290$N77.270565
@news.xtra.co.nz:

Is an egg pattern cheating? (Glo-bugs as we call them in N.Z)


Some consider it cheating but I reckon thats tripe. Some that scowl at
an egg fly are quite happy to get into the runners with a Robin or wet
Red Tag (as you probably know both have eggy butts) and that's ok!? A
more pertinent question is whether or not spawning run fish should be
targetted (by any means) in the first place. The answer to that will
vary greatly with species and location.

I remember when I first blundered into this place being taken aback at
persons fishing for salmon and steelhead on their run. When else can you
fish for them? Go to sea and net the buggers? Should you be able to fish
for them? Of course. There are species that feed on the roe and flesh of
dying salmon, should the flesh fly and egg fly be banned in prospecting
for those species? Is that cheating? In those far flung lands of course
not. Actually you see a lot of smaller fish hanging about just down
stream of redds here. Could an argument could be made for allowing them
to be fished for? Of course. Can the mojority of anglers be trusted to do
the right thing? Of course. It is the few that are the problem, and it
has ever been thus.

Personally, I think here in ANZ in 99% of cases running fish should be
left alone as the fish are accessible to anglers during the season.
There are exceptions of course. But!! We hear about you lot fishing
Muppets(?) (egg fly bombs) and small unweighted nymphs in tandem on the
Tongariro. Some fish are taken on the muppets but most on the small
nymph. Is it ethical to attract running fish heading to a spawning ground
with something like an egg? The Tongariro run is analagous to the sea-
running species of the Northern Hem. Unless you are prepared to join a
picket-fence these fish are generally only accessible during the run.
Even then, there is an upstream limit (i.e. spawning water starts) on
the T. beyond which it is illegal to fish and the fish are 'protected'.

It's not the flys, its the nut behind the but.

Steve

Egg patterns
 

Buxc wrote in news:kqrMc.4290$N77.270565
@news.xtra.co.nz:

Is an egg pattern cheating? (Glo-bugs as we call them in N.Z)


Some consider it cheating but I reckon thats tripe. Some that scowl at
an egg fly are quite happy to get into the runners with a Robin or wet
Red Tag (as you probably know both have eggy butts) and that's ok!? A
more pertinent question is whether or not spawning run fish should be
targetted (by any means) in the first place. The answer to that will
vary greatly with species and location.

I remember when I first blundered into this place being taken aback at
persons fishing for salmon and steelhead on their run. When else can you
fish for them? Go to sea and net the buggers? Should you be able to fish
for them? Of course. There are species that feed on the roe and flesh of
dying salmon, should the flesh fly and egg fly be banned in prospecting
for those species? Is that cheating? In those far flung lands of course
not. Actually you see a lot of smaller fish hanging about just down
stream of redds here. Could an argument could be made for allowing them
to be fished for? Of course. Can the mojority of anglers be trusted to do
the right thing? Of course. It is the few that are the problem, and it
has ever been thus.

Personally, I think here in ANZ in 99% of cases running fish should be
left alone as the fish are accessible to anglers during the season.
There are exceptions of course. But!! We hear about you lot fishing
Muppets(?) (egg fly bombs) and small unweighted nymphs in tandem on the
Tongariro. Some fish are taken on the muppets but most on the small
nymph. Is it ethical to attract running fish heading to a spawning ground
with something like an egg? The Tongariro run is analagous to the sea-
running species of the Northern Hem. Unless you are prepared to join a
picket-fence these fish are generally only accessible during the run.
Even then, there is an upstream limit (i.e. spawning water starts) on
the T. beyond which it is illegal to fish and the fish are 'protected'.

It's not the flys, its the nut behind the but.

Steve

Egg patterns
 

George Adams wrote:
From: Ken Fortenberry
A hopper is constructed of fur and feathers and is fished like
a fly. An egg pattern, no matter how constructed, is fished
exactly the same way you would fish an actual egg plucked straight
out of the jar.
Not that using an egg pattern is "cheating" (where
legal), it's perfectly acceptable for those who want to fish
that way, but it is more like bait fishing than fly fishing and
some fly fishermen, me included, eschew it.

Below the surface, trout feed on a number of creatures...the larval and pupal
forms of aquatic insects, aquatic worms, small fish, and fish eggs. Most of the
above, when properly fished, are fished in the same manner as bait.

I will readily concede that most subsurface "fly fishing" is more
closely related to bait fishing than fly fishing. Among the naturals
you mention, bugs, worms, fish and eggs, the only one I'm willing to
acknowledge as fly fishing, for me personally, is fish, aka streamers.

Nymphing is the art of catching fish when you should be doing something
else, like drinking beer, making love to your SO, playing catch with
your dog or taking a nap until the dries start coming off.

YMMV, and I'd bet one of Wolfie's shiny new nickels that it does. ;-)

--
Ken Fortenberry

Egg patterns
 

yes

Egg patterns
 

yes

Egg patterns
 

"Ken Fortenberry" wrote in message
gy.com...

I will readily concede that most subsurface "fly fishing" is more
closely related to bait fishing than fly fishing. Among the naturals
you mention, bugs, worms, fish and eggs, the only one I'm willing to
acknowledge as fly fishing, for me personally, is fish, aka streamers.

Nymphing is the art of catching fish when you should be doing something
else, like drinking beer, making love to your SO, playing catch with
your dog or taking a nap until the dries start coming off.

YMMV, and I'd bet one of Wolfie's shiny new nickels that it does. ;-)

--
Ken Fortenberry


Streamers?!?!?! BAIT ! ! ! ! !

Nothing like soaking a minnow under a float, eh?

Or how about a dry fly? BAIT ! ! ! !

Nothing like floating a cricket on top, eh?



------------------------------------------------
"If we don't succeed, we run the risk of failure."
- Dan Quayle

Egg patterns
 

"Ken Fortenberry" wrote in message
gy.com...

I will readily concede that most subsurface "fly fishing" is more
closely related to bait fishing than fly fishing. Among the naturals
you mention, bugs, worms, fish and eggs, the only one I'm willing to
acknowledge as fly fishing, for me personally, is fish, aka streamers.

Nymphing is the art of catching fish when you should be doing something
else, like drinking beer, making love to your SO, playing catch with
your dog or taking a nap until the dries start coming off.

YMMV, and I'd bet one of Wolfie's shiny new nickels that it does. ;-)

--
Ken Fortenberry


Streamers?!?!?! BAIT ! ! ! ! !

Nothing like soaking a minnow under a float, eh?

Or how about a dry fly? BAIT ! ! ! !

Nothing like floating a cricket on top, eh?



------------------------------------------------
"If we don't succeed, we run the risk of failure."
- Dan Quayle

Egg patterns
 

no

--


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"detoor" wrote in message
...
yes

Egg patterns
 

no

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"detoor" wrote in message
...
yes

Egg patterns
 

I agree with Clark. In fact I go one step further. If there are dries on
the surface, and fish are rising, I think that using nymphs is a travesty.
They don't know what fly fishing is about!

I was recently getting ready to get into a lake whee the fish were rising
all over the place. At the same time, 3 guys were leaving the lake in
disgust saying "the bite is off" They had been there for three days and
hadn't caught anything...the bite was off. I asked them what they had been
fishing with......You guessed it..nymphs!

Re eggs, I put them in the same category a San Juan worms, and streamers.
As long as they are artificial, have no aroma, and the line is the weight
for carrying the lure to the water, go to it. However, I usualyy try for a
couple of hours swinging wet flies before I go to the eggs, eggs should be
dead drifted, which is a boring way to fish.

--


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"Clark Reid" wrote in message
...
Good question, and a debate that has raged for years here in NZ.

I'll put Ken's comments aside because he's got his elitist blinkers on
again.

The Glo-Bug is an attractor fly in many instances and a roe imitation in
others. In most instances it is used on fish running the rivers from the
lakes on their spawning migration in New Zealand, and for that matter, the
rest of the world. So mainly it is a roe imitation.

The principle I have often used is to go right to heart of what
fly-fishing
is generally about for many. Fooling a feeding trout with a constructed
imitation of the current food source. To be considered a "fly" by most
flytiers this would require the use of tying thread, natural or synthetic
furs and yarns and or hackle if appropriate. In the case of "Glo-Bugs" in
NZ
it obviously fits the category.

Now a trout sitting in a spring creek sipping down emerging mayflies is
fished to by the fly fisherman with an imitation of that as best can be
created by the fly tiers art. A trout waiting in a Tongariro pool is
picking
up drifting eggs for a number of reasons, least of all food, but for the
moment is probably ingesting very little else. The "Glo-Bug" is an
imitation
of that. The parallels are obvious, the differences somewhat lost on me.
Some may perceive differences, I personally don't see any. The angler is
simply imitating what the trout is feeding on at that moment.

However, that is my thoughts in defense of the fly. The technique of the
heavy Bomb fly, dropper and Glo-bug attached to a heavy leader and fished
with a budgie sized indicator is, at best a *******ization of fly-fishing.
I
practice that technique myself at times on the winter fishery, but try to
stay well aware that what I am doing is not really fly-fishing even though
many on the big river would believe it is in light of having experienced
very little else in terms of real" flyfishing.

So to sum up my thoughts, I think the "Glo-Bug" is very definitely a fly,
but the techniques often associated with it are not always fly-fishing.

Clark Reid
www.dryflynz.com


"Buxc" wrote in message
...
Is an egg pattern cheating? (Glo-bugs as we call them in N.Z)

Egg patterns
 

I agree with Clark. In fact I go one step further. If there are dries on
the surface, and fish are rising, I think that using nymphs is a travesty.
They don't know what fly fishing is about!

I was recently getting ready to get into a lake whee the fish were rising
all over the place. At the same time, 3 guys were leaving the lake in
disgust saying "the bite is off" They had been there for three days and
hadn't caught anything...the bite was off. I asked them what they had been
fishing with......You guessed it..nymphs!

Re eggs, I put them in the same category a San Juan worms, and streamers.
As long as they are artificial, have no aroma, and the line is the weight
for carrying the lure to the water, go to it. However, I usualyy try for a
couple of hours swinging wet flies before I go to the eggs, eggs should be
dead drifted, which is a boring way to fish.

--


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"Clark Reid" wrote in message
...
Good question, and a debate that has raged for years here in NZ.

I'll put Ken's comments aside because he's got his elitist blinkers on
again.

The Glo-Bug is an attractor fly in many instances and a roe imitation in
others. In most instances it is used on fish running the rivers from the
lakes on their spawning migration in New Zealand, and for that matter, the
rest of the world. So mainly it is a roe imitation.

The principle I have often used is to go right to heart of what
fly-fishing
is generally about for many. Fooling a feeding trout with a constructed
imitation of the current food source. To be considered a "fly" by most
flytiers this would require the use of tying thread, natural or synthetic
furs and yarns and or hackle if appropriate. In the case of "Glo-Bugs" in
NZ
it obviously fits the category.

Now a trout sitting in a spring creek sipping down emerging mayflies is
fished to by the fly fisherman with an imitation of that as best can be
created by the fly tiers art. A trout waiting in a Tongariro pool is
picking
up drifting eggs for a number of reasons, least of all food, but for the
moment is probably ingesting very little else. The "Glo-Bug" is an
imitation
of that. The parallels are obvious, the differences somewhat lost on me.
Some may perceive differences, I personally don't see any. The angler is
simply imitating what the trout is feeding on at that moment.

However, that is my thoughts in defense of the fly. The technique of the
heavy Bomb fly, dropper and Glo-bug attached to a heavy leader and fished
with a budgie sized indicator is, at best a *******ization of fly-fishing.
I
practice that technique myself at times on the winter fishery, but try to
stay well aware that what I am doing is not really fly-fishing even though
many on the big river would believe it is in light of having experienced
very little else in terms of real" flyfishing.

So to sum up my thoughts, I think the "Glo-Bug" is very definitely a fly,
but the techniques often associated with it are not always fly-fishing.

Clark Reid
www.dryflynz.com


"Buxc" wrote in message
...
Is an egg pattern cheating? (Glo-bugs as we call them in N.Z)

Egg patterns
 

From: "Sierra fisher"

I was recently getting ready to get into a lake whee the fish were rising
all over the place. At the same time, 3 guys were leaving the lake in
disgust saying "the bite is off" They had been there for three days and
hadn't caught anything...the bite was off.

I asked them what they had been
fishing with......You guessed it..nymphs!

If there was a hatch on, and these guys were fishing with nymphs and not
catching anything, then they didn't know what they were doing.


George Adams

"All good fishermen stay young until they die, for fishing is the only dream of
youth that doth not grow stale with age."
---- J.W Muller

Egg patterns
 

From: "Sierra fisher"

I was recently getting ready to get into a lake whee the fish were rising
all over the place. At the same time, 3 guys were leaving the lake in
disgust saying "the bite is off" They had been there for three days and
hadn't caught anything...the bite was off.

I asked them what they had been
fishing with......You guessed it..nymphs!

If there was a hatch on, and these guys were fishing with nymphs and not
catching anything, then they didn't know what they were doing.


George Adams

"All good fishermen stay young until they die, for fishing is the only dream of
youth that doth not grow stale with age."
---- J.W Muller

Egg patterns
 

you're right! But that is where the novice is led these days. Fly fishing
has become a numbers game. "Fish spend 90% of their time eating nymphs so
you'll catch X times more fish using nymphs". "Boy, I had a great
day..caught 40 fish (the method doesn't count)"

I took a 75 year old doctor fishing one day. When arrived at the water, we
found a hatch. I put on a dry fly for him, and hequickly caught a few fish.
Then he said "lets put on a nymph, I want to catch a lot of fish!"

I find tht this attitude prevails amoungst a lot of fishermen(?) and there
are few people who teach differently

--


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"George Adams" wrote in message
...
From: "Sierra fisher"

I was recently getting ready to get into a lake whee the fish were rising
all over the place. At the same time, 3 guys were leaving the lake in
disgust saying "the bite is off" They had been there for three days and
hadn't caught anything...the bite was off.

I asked them what they had been
fishing with......You guessed it..nymphs!

If there was a hatch on, and these guys were fishing with nymphs and not
catching anything, then they didn't know what they were doing.


George Adams

"All good fishermen stay young until they die, for fishing is the only
dream of
youth that doth not grow stale with age."
---- J.W Muller

Egg patterns
 

you're right! But that is where the novice is led these days. Fly fishing
has become a numbers game. "Fish spend 90% of their time eating nymphs so
you'll catch X times more fish using nymphs". "Boy, I had a great
day..caught 40 fish (the method doesn't count)"

I took a 75 year old doctor fishing one day. When arrived at the water, we
found a hatch. I put on a dry fly for him, and hequickly caught a few fish.
Then he said "lets put on a nymph, I want to catch a lot of fish!"

I find tht this attitude prevails amoungst a lot of fishermen(?) and there
are few people who teach differently

--


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"George Adams" wrote in message
...
From: "Sierra fisher"

I was recently getting ready to get into a lake whee the fish were rising
all over the place. At the same time, 3 guys were leaving the lake in
disgust saying "the bite is off" They had been there for three days and
hadn't caught anything...the bite was off.

I asked them what they had been
fishing with......You guessed it..nymphs!

If there was a hatch on, and these guys were fishing with nymphs and not
catching anything, then they didn't know what they were doing.


George Adams

"All good fishermen stay young until they die, for fishing is the only
dream of
youth that doth not grow stale with age."
---- J.W Muller

Egg patterns
 

So to sum up my thoughts, I think the "Glo-Bug" is very definitely a fly,
but the techniques often associated with it are not always fly-fishing.

Clark Reid
www.dryflynz.com

Well Clark I'm not sure I understand, calling it a fly but if you were
using this fly to fish with you would not be fly fishing hmmmm.
My take on the whole thing is this, in the best part of the fishing
season when fish are rising freely to mayfly, caddis and terrestrials
imitations well I don't tie on a Glo-bug. By the same token in the
middle of winter when nothing is rising and I am desperate to get my
fishing fix I don't tie on a delicate mayfly pattern.
After all part of the aim for me and I'm sure others of going fishing is
to catch fish. Because of this I do not have any ethical dilemmas when I
tie on a glo-bug behind a tungsten bead nymph and indicator.
My choice of indicator is for egg yarn - no longer than half an inch,
and a small metal split ring or sheep wool that I collect off barbed
wire fences, not budgies.
Honestly if I had a choice it would be dry fly time all year round, but
as that's not the case and I still want to get a bend in my rod and a
scream from my reel in winter I'll use a glo-bug on my fly rod and go
fly fishing

Not cheating fly fishing to the conditions.

Cheers
Andrew

P.S do you give them to clients when you are guiding Clark?

Egg patterns
 

So to sum up my thoughts, I think the "Glo-Bug" is very definitely a fly,
but the techniques often associated with it are not always fly-fishing.

Clark Reid
www.dryflynz.com

Well Clark I'm not sure I understand, calling it a fly but if you were
using this fly to fish with you would not be fly fishing hmmmm.
My take on the whole thing is this, in the best part of the fishing
season when fish are rising freely to mayfly, caddis and terrestrials
imitations well I don't tie on a Glo-bug. By the same token in the
middle of winter when nothing is rising and I am desperate to get my
fishing fix I don't tie on a delicate mayfly pattern.
After all part of the aim for me and I'm sure others of going fishing is
to catch fish. Because of this I do not have any ethical dilemmas when I
tie on a glo-bug behind a tungsten bead nymph and indicator.
My choice of indicator is for egg yarn - no longer than half an inch,
and a small metal split ring or sheep wool that I collect off barbed
wire fences, not budgies.
Honestly if I had a choice it would be dry fly time all year round, but
as that's not the case and I still want to get a bend in my rod and a
scream from my reel in winter I'll use a glo-bug on my fly rod and go
fly fishing

Not cheating fly fishing to the conditions.

Cheers
Andrew

P.S do you give them to clients when you are guiding Clark?

Egg patterns
 

"Salmo Bytes" wrote in message
om...
Buxc wrote in message
...
Is an egg pattern cheating? (Glo-bugs as we call them in N.Z)

RE round hot glue eggs.

It's easier to thread a translucent plastic bead
onto the tippet and then to snell a small egg
hook on the end of the leader...the whole rig
makes a great trailer to a WoollyBugger, FleshFly
or Egg Sucking Leech.

Is it cheating? Yes...according to purists.
But making purists squirm a little is half
the fun.

:)
Hi Salmo,
Met two guys this last week. (uhh. . .actually met a few more folks, but
not relevant here) One a shop owner, the other a previous guide in the Vail,
Colorado area. One of them only fished dry flies, and the other only fished
one dry fly pattern for all fishing (Irresistible), so he said.
Kinda like to keep my options open :)
But, I do have yarn eggs, McFlyFoam eggs, and glue gun eggs in some of my
fly boxes. (seems I use them for Kokanee salmon mostly)

And heck . . .I even catch a fish every now and then, by having such a
variety of patterns . . .and methods . . .who woulda thunk that could
happen? (bedazzling)
BestWishes,
DaveMohnsen
Denver

Egg patterns
 

"Salmo Bytes" wrote in message
om...
Buxc wrote in message
...
Is an egg pattern cheating? (Glo-bugs as we call them in N.Z)

RE round hot glue eggs.

It's easier to thread a translucent plastic bead
onto the tippet and then to snell a small egg
hook on the end of the leader...the whole rig
makes a great trailer to a WoollyBugger, FleshFly
or Egg Sucking Leech.

Is it cheating? Yes...according to purists.
But making purists squirm a little is half
the fun.

:)
Hi Salmo,
Met two guys this last week. (uhh. . .actually met a few more folks, but
not relevant here) One a shop owner, the other a previous guide in the Vail,
Colorado area. One of them only fished dry flies, and the other only fished
one dry fly pattern for all fishing (Irresistible), so he said.
Kinda like to keep my options open :)
But, I do have yarn eggs, McFlyFoam eggs, and glue gun eggs in some of my
fly boxes. (seems I use them for Kokanee salmon mostly)

And heck . . .I even catch a fish every now and then, by having such a
variety of patterns . . .and methods . . .who woulda thunk that could
happen? (bedazzling)
BestWishes,
DaveMohnsen
Denver

Egg patterns
 

Salmo Bytes wrote:

Buxc wrote:
Is an egg pattern cheating? (Glo-bugs as we call them in N.Z)

RE round hot glue eggs.
snip
Is it cheating? Yes...according to purists.
But making purists squirm a little is half
the fun.

And at least half the fun of being a purist is looking over the
top of your half-rims and softly reassuring the unpure that if
catching a fish is THAT important to you, I'm sure it's OK.

--
Ken Fortenberry

Egg patterns
 

If using streamers (immitating bait fish) is ok, then egg patterns are ok.
Whatever is on the trouts menu is ok, including all the mayflies, caddis,
stoneflies, etc in their nymphal stage is ok. If I am fishing and there are no
rising trout, no hatch, I will nymph, or in early spring chuck a streamer. I
prefer dry flies, but I know that they are only a small part of a trout's diet,
so I nymph when there is no hatch.

There is no such thing as a purist, just the uninformed, those that are not
willing to learn something new. My only objection to *kind* of fly fishing is
multiple fly rigs. I have fished drys with a nymph dropper, or a couple of
nymphs. But, I would prefer to fish only with one fly (dry, wet, nymph,
streamer) at a time. I know of one man on these pages who uses three nymphs
strung in a row. I'm sure it is a bitch to cast, but he seems happy with it,
so whatthehey.....

Only a pompous ass, like one who has passed before us, would look down is nose
at the fly of a fellow angler.

BTW,. nymphing is the most difficult of the ways to fish, far more difficult
than drifting a dry where you can see the drag. With dry fly fishing,. you
can *see* what they are eating. Not so with nymphing. You make an educated
guess by what you think may be ready to hatch. If you guess right, have your
drift down for that particular water (depth, speed, obstacles), you will catch
fish. It is much easier, however, to do the same thing with a dry.

On the Big Horn a year or so ago, I spotted a very nice brown sitting in a
current. I passed a hopper over him, and several nymphs were drifted by his
nose. I went to a smaller FC tippet and drifted another nymph by him. He
wouldn't touch anything. I finally tied on a nymph and on an imperfect cast,
the fish moved several feet to take the nymph. To me that was more exciting
than any dry fly fishing I've ever done.
Dave

http://hometown.aol.com/davplac/myhomepage/index.html

Egg patterns
 

If using streamers (immitating bait fish) is ok, then egg patterns are ok.
Whatever is on the trouts menu is ok, including all the mayflies, caddis,
stoneflies, etc in their nymphal stage is ok. If I am fishing and there are no
rising trout, no hatch, I will nymph, or in early spring chuck a streamer. I
prefer dry flies, but I know that they are only a small part of a trout's diet,
so I nymph when there is no hatch.

There is no such thing as a purist, just the uninformed, those that are not
willing to learn something new. My only objection to *kind* of fly fishing is
multiple fly rigs. I have fished drys with a nymph dropper, or a couple of
nymphs. But, I would prefer to fish only with one fly (dry, wet, nymph,
streamer) at a time. I know of one man on these pages who uses three nymphs
strung in a row. I'm sure it is a bitch to cast, but he seems happy with it,
so whatthehey.....

Only a pompous ass, like one who has passed before us, would look down is nose
at the fly of a fellow angler.

BTW,. nymphing is the most difficult of the ways to fish, far more difficult
than drifting a dry where you can see the drag. With dry fly fishing,. you
can *see* what they are eating. Not so with nymphing. You make an educated
guess by what you think may be ready to hatch. If you guess right, have your
drift down for that particular water (depth, speed, obstacles), you will catch
fish. It is much easier, however, to do the same thing with a dry.

On the Big Horn a year or so ago, I spotted a very nice brown sitting in a
current. I passed a hopper over him, and several nymphs were drifted by his
nose. I went to a smaller FC tippet and drifted another nymph by him. He
wouldn't touch anything. I finally tied on a nymph and on an imperfect cast,
the fish moved several feet to take the nymph. To me that was more exciting
than any dry fly fishing I've ever done.
Dave

http://hometown.aol.com/davplac/myhomepage/index.html

Egg patterns
 

Dave LaCourse wrote:
If using streamers (immitating bait fish) is ok, then egg patterns are ok.

Streamers are made of fur and feathers, but yeah egg patterns are OK
(where legal) if that's what you want to do.

BTW,. nymphing is the most difficult of the ways to fish, far more difficult
than drifting a dry where you can see the drag. ...

Pure, unalduterated caca. Nymphing is so easy I've been in places
where if you go three drifts without catching a fish you know that
you've got moss on your fly. Been there, done that, but no more.
Anybody who says catching fish consistently with nymphs is more
difficult than catching fish consistently with dries doesn't know
jack **** about fishing either.

--
Ken Fortenberry

Egg patterns
 

Ken Fortenberry writes:

Dave LaCourse wrote:
If using streamers (immitating bait fish) is ok, then egg patterns are ok.

Streamers are made of fur and feathers, but yeah egg patterns are OK
(where legal) if that's what you want to do.

It's what they are immitating, not what they are made of. I have streamers
that have neither fur nor feather on them. They immitate bait fish. An egg
pattern also immitates another entree on the trout's menu.


BTW,. nymphing is the most difficult of the ways to fish, far more
difficult
than drifting a dry where you can see the drag. ...

Pure, unalduterated caca. Nymphing is so easy I've been in places
where if you go three drifts without catching a fish you know that
you've got moss on your fly. Been there, done that, but no more.
Anybody who says catching fish consistently with nymphs is more
difficult than catching fish consistently with dries doesn't know
jack **** about fishing either.

My, my, my. I seem to have hit a nerve, which indicates I was right on target.
Try nymphing in a moss and slime covered bottom (i.e. a tailwater which you
just *hate* to fish) stream like the Big Horn or Henry's Fork without getting
your hook fouled. *That* is part of the fishing, and if you can't do it (you
obviously can not), then ya ain't gonna catch fish. On three of my four trips
to Idaho and Montana, you wouldn't have caught jack **** because you didn't
know how. The dry fly is a wonderful way to fish, my preferred method, but
you, like a certain departed friend, are too stubborn to realize it. BTW, a
dry fly "purist" who goes steelheading is a hypotcrite. But, that's ok too.
d;o)


Dave

http://hometown.aol.com/davplac/myhomepage/index.html

Egg patterns
 

Ken Fortenberry wrote in
gy.com:

Anybody who says catching fish consistently with nymphs is more
difficult than catching fish consistently with dries doesn't know
jack **** about fishing either.


A good fisherman with nymphs and dries in his ammo box will catch more fish
than a good fisherman with only dries.

This doesn't mean nymphing is easier-- its tougher because you can't see
your fly, and there's more currents to deal with. This doesn't make it
impossible, and I think the added fishing time when a hatch isn't going,
and a little experience, more than makes up for the added difficulty.

Scott

Egg patterns
 

Nymphs are what you use when you have dry fly fishing for about 3 hours and
haven't caught anything. It is one step above going home!

--


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"Dave LaCourse" wrote in message
...
Ken Fortenberry writes:

Dave LaCourse wrote:
If using streamers (immitating bait fish) is ok, then egg patterns are
ok.

Streamers are made of fur and feathers, but yeah egg patterns are OK
(where legal) if that's what you want to do.

It's what they are immitating, not what they are made of. I have
streamers
that have neither fur nor feather on them. They immitate bait fish. An
egg
pattern also immitates another entree on the trout's menu.


BTW,. nymphing is the most difficult of the ways to fish, far more
difficult
than drifting a dry where you can see the drag. ...

Pure, unalduterated caca. Nymphing is so easy I've been in places
where if you go three drifts without catching a fish you know that
you've got moss on your fly. Been there, done that, but no more.
Anybody who says catching fish consistently with nymphs is more
difficult than catching fish consistently with dries doesn't know
jack **** about fishing either.

My, my, my. I seem to have hit a nerve, which indicates I was right on
target.
Try nymphing in a moss and slime covered bottom (i.e. a tailwater which
you
just *hate* to fish) stream like the Big Horn or Henry's Fork without
getting
your hook fouled. *That* is part of the fishing, and if you can't do it
(you
obviously can not), then ya ain't gonna catch fish. On three of my four
trips
to Idaho and Montana, you wouldn't have caught jack **** because you
didn't
know how. The dry fly is a wonderful way to fish, my preferred method,
but
you, like a certain departed friend, are too stubborn to realize it.
BTW, a
dry fly "purist" who goes steelheading is a hypotcrite. But, that's ok
too.
d;o)


Dave

http://hometown.aol.com/davplac/myhomepage/index.html