"Ken Fortenberry" wrote ...
Daniel-San wrote:
"Ken Fortenberry" wrote ...
snip

We could end illegal
immigration tomorrow if we really wanted to. All it would
take is to make the hiring of an illegal a felony punishable
by 10 years in jail for each illegal hired.


After 12 years of corporate (chain -- puke) restaurant management, I am
convinced that nothing could be less feasible. ...

How are you gonna do this? Short of a national ID system, akin to the
"tofu sticks" video you posted here a while ago (and sure seemed opposed
to, btw), it is not possible.

Better IDs? Maybe, but while I never knowingly hired an illegal, I'm
pretty darned sure I did at some point. I checked the green card, checked
the social security card, and filled out the I-9 for each hire. I signed
the little statement at the end of the form indicating that in essence,
the IDs looked real to me. Was I supposed to be the ID police? I should
go to prison because of a good fake?

I live in a college town and fake IDs are no excuse.

I've been thrown out of a few of those bars....

If the
police find underage drinkers in the bar both the patron and
the bar get fines no matter how good the fake IDs.

Not entirely true. I'm not sure if Chambana has some sort of local
ordinance, but Illinois state law is that a fake ID is an affirmative
defense, provided the bar can prove that they checked the ID, and that it
looked real, etc.

"However, no agent or employee of the licensee or employee [...] shall be
disciplined or discharged for selling or furnishing liquor to a person under
21 years of age if the agent or employee demanded and was shown, before
furnishing liquor to a person under 21 years of age, adequate written
evidence of age [...] including but not limited to a motor vehicle
operator's license, [...] This paragraph, however, shall not apply if the
agent or employee accepted the written evidence knowing it to be false or
fraudulent."

(http://www.ilga.gov/legislation/ilcs...023500050K6-16)


If there
was incentive enough, that is punishment enough, all illegal
immigrants would be out of work tomorrow and we wouldn't have
to ship them back, they'd be out of here on the next bus if
they didn't have work.


And so would many legal residents. If I was gonna go to jail for accepting a
fake green card, I would accept *no* green cards. Now we've replaced the
problem -- no one with a green card will be hired.


The best enforcement I ever saw (and I saw a bit -- restaurants are
extreme INS/ICE targets, probably rightfully so) was a very simple one.
Every "X" months, corporations with over "Y" employees were required to
turn the SSNs over to the IRS for a check. Fakes, ones that showed up in
multiple geographic locales, ones belonging to the recently deceased,
etc., 'bounced' back, and the employer was required to either verify (and
show supporting documentation) or send the employee packing.

Where there's a will there's a way.

Agreed, but I don't think punishing employers who make an effort to comply
is the right answer. Again, short of a national ID system akin to the tofu
sticks video, it can't be done at the employer level.

Dan