On 14 Mar 2007 13:20:43 -0700, "Wolfgang" wrote:

On Mar 14, 1:40 pm, "Bob Weinberger"
wrote:
"Larry L" wrote in message

...
snip I post this for two reasons,
(1) to pat myself on the back a bit as I take pride in my little efforts
to reduce my impact, and
(2) to encourage others to make a small change or two. You won't notice
it by itself, but if we all save a bit of gas, coal, or heating fuel or
take care to walk a little more lightly on the Earth in other ways the
total result will be noticed .... by our kids and grandkids and the
seventh generation.

I applaud you for trying to lesssen your use of fossil fuel. But something
I always wonder about when I hear about this type of action - Have you
actually reduced your life cycle fossil fuel usage by installing such things
as solar panels on a travel trailer.. How long would you need to run your
generator to reach the break even point of the added fuel usage of your
vehicle due to the added weight and air resistance of the panels. Also how
about the energy expended to produce solar panels. I am assuming that you
would still have the generator as a backup.
I'm not asking this to bust your chops. It is something I'd really like to
know (but have been too lazy to research). Given the large number of experts
(at giving opinions) in ROFF, I'm sure that I'll get a lot of feed back.

I've never owned a house or any kind of vehicle that would make solar
panels of any use to me, but I've known a lot of people with one or
the other....or both....and have, for the last 30 years or so, made
periodic forays with them into the labyrinthine world of cost/benefit
analyses for alternate energy sources. I have learned that you can
pick whatever numbers you like and then, with a minimum of effort
(especially since the advent of the internet), go out and find ample
justification for them. I have not yet given up hope that some sort
of accessible and useable truth lies out there somewhere......but wish
good luck to anyone looking for it.

Without going into detail (much of which is predicated on gut feeling,
anyway), it seems to me that direct conversion of sunlight into
electricity doesn't look nearly as attractive and promising as it did
20 or 30 years ago. One of the fundamental problems, I suspect, is
that materials that are economically and environmentally cheap to
produce, and that stand up well to years of exposure to sunlight and
weather (say, concrete, for example), are thoroughly useless precisely
because they are so stable......they don't react appreciably to the
energy in sunlight. Materials that ARE useful are so precisely
because they DO react to that energy and they pay the price for
considerably less than 100 % efficiency of conversion in
deterioration.....and consequent reduced efficiency. They also happen
to be relatively expensive to produce.

Wind power, which depends on very mature technologies....metallurgy,
turbines, vane design, generators, etc....and abundant
materials.....aluminum is the most common metal (and third most common
element) in the planet's crust and is virtually infinitely recyclable,
and iron is right behind.....seems like a no brainer for large scale
electrical power generation.

But then, that doesn't help a bit for an RV, does it?

Wrong on many counts and levels. Concrete, stone, and other "stable"
materials are useful as solar energy collectors, and they do "react" in
sunlight. Ever stepped barehooved on directly-in-the-sun concrete or
asphalt in the summer? And why would you guess cities are generally
warmer than their surrounding areas? Moreover, the main failure of
properly-constructed and framed solar panels, IME, is from physical
damage, not "deterioration." I have a set of old Solarex 110s that
spend many years in the West Texas sun (on a well) and are still going
strong. IAC, technology is vastly improving in that area, making cost
per watt cheaper and cheaper.

Wind power is great in certain applications, but there are still
maintenance, damage, and wear issues on large systems. If you've ever
seen just one of the big GE blades being moved, you'd soon realize that
it ain't just a matter of crushing a few beer cans into shape and
FedEx'ing it to where it needs to go.

And wind power is both used and readily available for boats and RVs. Go
into any West Marine store (or online) and for around a grand, you can
get a complete set-up for such usage. With a little looking and a bit
of tinkering, most folks can come out for a lot less. Heck, take an old
windmill, a genset, and an RPM regulation system, and ta-da, wind power.

Don't really give a **** if this helps,
Dickie

Wolfgang