"rw" wrote


Training collars are not for every dog. My Border Collie, for example,
would probably totally freak out.


although I declared EOT for me, I'll butt in briefly

modern, high quality ( I've product tested for years for the best brand ...
to remain unnamed to avoid spamming ;-) are highly adjustable


The collar I use now can be adjusted down to a level that I can just barely
feel on bare skin .... and at that level 99% of retrievers ( what I know )
don't even look quizical the first time they feel it ( if they do )

The other end of the collars spectrum is seriously uncomfortable ... but not
physically damaging, as many tools can be ... I HAVE shocked myself with it
on high and often do so in front of "love my doggie" new clients, to make a
point

The main ( imho ) reasons for wild overreaction in dogs is simply that Mr
Human WANTS to 'see" the effect ... most of my collar corrections ( teaching
if you read that post ) are not visible to most observers, only those VERY
carefully watching Fido .. ( indeed collars are made, and available, where
the transmitter beeps when a button is pressed ... this is designed
specifically so 'newbies' can TELL when an experienced trainer uses the
tool, i.e. students watching a pro ... otherwise they often can't .. )

..... THOUGHTFUL use of the tool is NOT characterized by the trainer
saying, "****, guess that was too much." ... after the fact


One more thing ... ( let me stick in that IMO ) ... one of the reasons
e-collars are so effective is because dogs don't "understand" the stimulus
.... it's super unnatural

To help you understand, .... everyone knows nearly any stray any dog will
run out of your yard if you pretend to pick up a rock to throw at them ...
even if nobody ever really has !!

This ( IMO ) is simply a genetic understanding of a danger ... passed down
from before that first wolf adopted someone to feed him... they can
'understand' the pain of a flying rock without even feeling it

Hitting a dog with a stick is very similar ... they genetically 'understand'
.... and one being tough, resisting dominance, CAN be physically damaged
BEFORE he'll yield to such "tools" ( watch a real dog fight ... or try to
break one up, if you doubt how fiecely some dogs cling to status ) ASIDE:
since it was mentioned, BS like 'biting an ear' is as sophisticated as
covering yourself with leaches 'cause you have a fever ... few things I know
of, in 'modern american culture' have as wide a spread from extemely subtly
and sophisticated at one end of scale of participants to truly medieval at
the other ... as dog "training" ( in quotes because the one end doesn't
justify the name )

The e-collar is a jolt from the blue .. and THAT, as much or more than
'pain' is it's power ... and another reason to dial it down to a level that
changes behavior, not one that "pleases" a ****ed off human

The e-collar is certainly NOT the tool for most people, but I seriously
doubt that a dog can be found "soft" enough to not be trainable with one ...
and produce a happy, tail wagging result ... remember, HUMAN NATURE, not
dog nature is the biggest problem in dog training ..