"Ken Fortenberry" wrote in message
...
I hope you don't mind addressing a dog training problem that has
me befuddled.

Kaylin was doing water retrieves yesterday. I put her in a sit-stay,
throw the dummy on the water, give her the OKAY and she bolts into
the pond, swims to the dummy and brings it back. She's been doing
this reliably for awhile now. Until yesterday.

There were a pair of ducks on the pond. Everything went according to
plan until she got the dummy in her mouth. As soon as she got the
dummy she started swimming hell bent for leather towards the ducks.
She chased them into the air, got out on the other side of the pond,
dropped the dummy and then chased them on foot until I finally got
her back with a recall.

I don't want to discourage an interest in birds but obviously I've
got a problem. Any advice ?

--
Ken Fortenberry


Well, envision a situation like this one. You knock down a duck, the most
prized in your area, say a bull Sprig. It's crippled but K manages to
catch it and is returning with it. As will happen often, you'll find, her
swimming will attract a passing flock and they decoy to her and as they turn
to come back, you pop one. Kay drops the Sprig and swims over to get the,
now more exciting, dead Spoony that just dropped. The Sprig she dropped
is revived enough to dive and you never see it again.

This scenario is not far fetched, and is presented as motivation.

Professional trainers are very serious about commands, 'here' means 'here'
and not "come when you feel like it, or if nothing more interesting is
happening" Pro retriever trainers also force fetch all retrievers and
teach them that retrieving is an ordered task, not just a game. Pro
trainers are also ( or should be ) emotionally very detached and while
'firm' are never angry, and are always open to trying something different if
the first effort shows signs of creating problems .... they also know that
training, to high standards takes lots of time ... it's that knowledge that
makes them appear 'patient'


MOST dog owners do NOT have a relationship with their dog that allows that
owner to tackle problems in a "because I say so, and I don't care if you
like it or not" manner.

Ken, there IS risk involved if you get serious about making her come off of
the ducks ( and I won't even hint at an actual 'how' of doing that ...my way
would take weeks of preparation and would NOT suit you ;-) But, THE most
basic command is 'here' or whatever word you use. As I always tell
clients .. "Even if the SOB won't do anything else right, he should come
when he's called .... if only so you can put him up and stop being
embarrassed by him." G


I suggest you work on 'here' in an ordered way with planned distractions and
planned corrections if she gives in to those distractions. Use your
imagination. Most dogs will use 'having to pee' as and excuse to wait to
obey ... they go all night just fine, they can come when told to, THEN be
released to pee. Having a helper set down a bowl of tasty treats near a
hungry dog as dad calls her is likely to see her give dad the doggy middle
toe ... etc. etc.... make stuff up, 40 years later I 'invent' new things all
the time, it's what makes the biz fun. Oh, as she is returning with one
bumper, make a fuss ( or have a helper do so ) 'heah, heah, heah' and throw
a different one ... teach her she is to ALWAYS continue to deliver the first
one, THEN she will be allowed to get the fresher one ... ( using birds, this
is a commonly used hunt test 'test' ... I believe they call it a 'bulldog'
.... i.e. it is perceived as simulating real hunting conditions well .... but
hunt tests weren't my thing and I can't remember ever seeing it in a trial )

I could go on for pages and pages ... but less is likely better, SINCE, your
creativity and your persistence and your determination are the key. Let me
repeat, I won't comment on actual techniques or tools to 'make' her come
when she rather not, suit yourself. But, consider another thing I deeply
believe ... 'teaching' ends and 'training' begins when Fido knows what we
want, but chooses to not do it because of his own desires ... 'taught' dogs
are a dime a dozen, 'trained' dogs are pretty rare. YOU control ( if
you're wise), the level of distraction making it 'doable' for her, but still
tempting enough to require 'training' Don't make the most common human
error and wait until you're angry to try 'training' .... indeed 'training'
can only be down well with a very cool head.

Larry L ( who will provide two of his favorite doggie quotes)

Delmar Smith ( one the great pointer trainers ) "A man can learn to control
any animal if he first learns to control himself."

Rex Carr ( the best 'trieiver trainer in history, my mentor ) "Repetition,
repetition, repetition, repetition. Now, .... repeat that."