On Sat, 14 Nov 2009 15:13:14 -0500, jeff wrote:

wrote:

your article states the following:

"Obama will have no trouble being recognized in China. He's been the
top-ranked foreigner in searches on Baidu, China's leading search engine
— No. 22 as of Thursday morning."

Do you have an opinion as to what that means, and if so, on what personal
knowledge do you base it?

never heard of baidu before your note. wikipedia says Baidu is China's
largest search engine with a market share of more than 62 percent. The
number of Internet users in China rose to 338 million by the end of June
2009, according to a report by the China Internet Network Information
Center. Baidu, the No. 1 search engine in China, has 61.6 percent of
China's market share as of June 2009, according to Analysys International.

so, i reckon it means what it says...obama is a popular subject of
searches by the chinese on baidu, according to the source you cited. the
numbers probably trump your shopgirl statistic with regard to
recognition in china.

OK. How do you know "obama is a popular subject of searches by the chinese on
baidu?" What does being number 22 on a particular day mean? How many distinct
people searched, and for what purpose? Were they even in China? What terms
were 1-21? Maybe Axelrod kept trying to see how his shtick was playing in
Beijing. Maybe a whole bunch of reporters (or wannabe reporters) were trying to
see what Baidu would throw up. Maybe a bunch of shopgirls think he's SOOOOO
dreamy. And do you have any idea of what Baidu charges to, um, skew the numbers
(and they do heavily use "pay to play" - in fact, they've been criticized for
that very thing)? Basically, are you just impressed that "he's number 22 on X
date on Baidu?," or, do you have some knowledge of what it means so that you can
make a case for why his being number 22 on X date means something that would
bolster your case.

The main hit when one searches for "Obama" on Baidu? A local page that informs
the searcher that his name is common in many parts of the world, his father's
tribe in Kenya and what dialect they speak, and lists 4 facts about him - his
father, wife, daughters, and the last of the 4 facts? He has a dog named "bo."
The second hit in the list is BarackObama.com and the third is the text of his
"Victory speech." OTOH, search baidu for "Brad Pitt" and the first hit is the
same type of local baidu page as Obama's. However, you get more than a
reasonable person should care about him - his height, his weight,where he was
born, in what every educational institution "the world's sexiest man" ever set
foot, the history of his "love life," (which links to a similar screed on Jolie,
Aniston, etc.), a rundown of his movies, what he had for lunch each day, where
he shops, what he drives. Where did Obama go to school? Um, well, the baidu
listing is no help. What did he do before 2008? Not a single hint - no law
school, no Senate, nada. OTOH, apparently, the one remaining tidbit baidu found
crucial about (POTUS) Obama is that some pol in Equatorial Guinea is somehow
related by name or something...

Here they a

http://baike.baidu.com/view/1518279.htm?fr=ala0 (Obama)

http://baike.baidu.com/view/491940.htm?fr=ala0 (Pitt)

Yeah, I know it's in Chinese, but the pages could be in ****in' Klingon and the
content amount difference is still obvious.

And as aside - I'd offer that the aforementioned "skewing" by someone(s) is
possible - there are a number of hits in the top ranks for practically (and
thankfully) unknown US loonakook Alex Jones. While anything is possible, I
_seriously_ doubt many Chinese people are interested in obscure US loons raving
about US politics, but hey, ??? I guess if they are, they could always email Da
Sarge...

in fact, your source suggests obama is well-known
as far as being "recognizable" in china. i've not been to china.
whatever personal knowledge i have is based on my limited reading. of
course, i have no idea what prompted any individual search on baidu...


why you think the article, and the bland statements of two giggling
"shop girls" proves your point is a mystery to me...perhaps you can
explain its merit for your contention?

Perhaps you missed these items...maybe your tingling leg distracted you:

nah, alas, i read the whole thing. the reference to my leg was intended
to refer to a possibility you were "pulling my leg" with such a
ridiculous suggestion that the article had any real meaning in our prior
disagreement about who was more recognizable around the world.

"'He's special for the Americans, but definitely not for the Chinese,' said Shen
Dingli, director of the Center for American Studies at Fudan University in
Shanghai. 'On the contrary, we are always influenced by the tone of
government-monitored media.'"

frankly...i don't recall contending the chinese thought obama was
"special". i read this as saying the perception of obama in china is
shaped by the government media, not that he is unknown.

As I recall, your contention, generally, was that Obama has brought a sense of
hope/change/something to much of the world. My contention was, and is, that
much of the world doesn't know (anything of substance) or care about Obama. I'd
agree that if you asked everyone on the planet if they had heard the name
"Obama," a large number would say "yes." The same is true of many names and I
suspect that many entertainment figures would score much higher, as would both
"famous" and "infamous" "leaders." But insofar as the world's population
"knowing" anything about him, caring one way or the other, or having any true
personal feelings, good or bad, about him, the number would shrink by several
orders of magnitude.

IAC, I don't and didn't offer the story as some all-encompassing final verdict
on Obama in China (or the world), I simply saw something I found both amusing
(the flaming Obama and the Oba Mao shirts - and no, I found it amusing, not a
political statement), moderately informative - a view on the "man on the street"
"background atmosphere," and mildly informational - Shen Dingli's comments. And
no, I don't propose that he speaks for all of China - OTOH, I don't dismiss him
completely, either...granted, it's not like he's a Lecturer for a law class or
two at the U of C or something, but hey, it's almost like Paul Krugman said
something...

TC,
R