Knot to replace Blood Knot?

http://www.geocities.com/roo_two/Zeppelin.html

I just tried it on two pieces of 4x, and it seems very strong and is
quite easy to tie. Its not as simple as the Surgeons Knot, but it has
the advantage that it leaves a linear knot, and its much easier than a
Blood Knot.

What do others think...is this a good leader-tippet or tippet-tippet
knot? I wonder if its even worth doing two or more passes through
rather than the one.

--riverman

riverman wrote:
http://www.geocities.com/roo_two/Zeppelin.html

I just tried it on two pieces of 4x, and it seems very strong and is
quite easy to tie. Its not as simple as the Surgeons Knot, but it has
the advantage that it leaves a linear knot, and its much easier than a
Blood Knot.

What do others think...is this a good leader-tippet or tippet-tippet
knot? I wonder if its even worth doing two or more passes through
rather than the one.

I just tested it against a Surgeon's Knot in Rio 5x. It failed before
the Surgeon's did.

--
Cut "to the chase" for my email address.

riverman wrote:
http://www.geocities.com/roo_two/Zeppelin.html

I just tried it on two pieces of 4x, and it seems very strong and is
quite easy to tie. Its not as simple as the Surgeons Knot, but it has
the advantage that it leaves a linear knot, and its much easier than a
Blood Knot.

What do others think...is this a good leader-tippet or tippet-tippet
knot? I wonder if its even worth doing two or more passes through
rather than the one.

--riverman

I just did a very non technical test on that knot. I tied it leaving me
with a loop 15 lb. test mono. I stuck a screw drive handle in each end
of the loop and pulled. It snapped at the knot every time. I did the
same test with a 5 turn blood knot. It also snapped at the knot, but
with a significantly higher tension needed. I realize this is about as
basic of a test as you can get, but the difference was enough, that I
could easily feel it.

Most of time I use a double surgeon's knot. It's easy to tie, and if
tied correctly(must be seated evenly), it's close to a 100% knot.

brians

briansfly wrote:

I just did a very non technical test on that knot. I tied it leaving me
with a loop 15 lb. test mono. I stuck a screw drive handle in each end
of the loop and pulled. It snapped at the knot every time. I did the
same test with a 5 turn blood knot. It also snapped at the knot, but
with a significantly higher tension needed. I realize this is about as
basic of a test as you can get, but the difference was enough, that I
could easily feel it.

An easy way to get an objective comparison between knots is to tie both
knots in one strand of tippet and pull to failure. That's what I did to
compare this knot with a double Surgeon's. The Surgeon's won. (One trial.)

--
Cut "to the chase" for my email address.

rw wrote:

briansfly wrote:


I just did a very non technical test on that knot. I tied it leaving
me with a loop 15 lb. test mono. I stuck a screw drive handle in each
end of the loop and pulled. It snapped at the knot every time. I did
the same test with a 5 turn blood knot. It also snapped at the knot,
but with a significantly higher tension needed. I realize this is
about as basic of a test as you can get, but the difference was
enough, that I could easily feel it.


An easy way to get an objective comparison between knots is to tie both
knots in one strand of tippet and pull to failure. That's what I did to
compare this knot with a double Surgeon's. The Surgeon's won. (One trial.)

Yup, i've done that too. All I had at my desk was 15 to 40 lb Trilene
Big Game mono(I use this to make my striper leaders). I figured tying it
in a loop would be a lot easier way to break it.

Back to Myron's question about multiple passes on the Zeppelin knot. I
tried it. The knot is very hard to seat properly, and it becomes bulky.
It did seem to have a higher break strength.

brians

There are three variations of ways to tie a Surgeon's knot that I know
of. The easy and quick way is to make a very large overlap between the
two lines, form a very large loop, and pull the strands through together
with your fingers. This wastes a lot of tippet and leader material,
which I don't like.

A more material-efficient way is to use a relatively small overlap, make
a small loop, and thread the strands through one at a time. This takes a
lot longer.

I've converged on an intermediate method. I make an intermediate size
loop and use my hemostat instead of my fingers to pull the strands
through together.

--
Cut "to the chase" for my email address.

On 3 Aug 2006 09:34:00 -0700, "riverman" wrote:

I just tried it on two pieces of 4x, and it seems very strong and is
quite easy to tie. Its not as simple as the Surgeons Knot, but it has
the advantage that it leaves a linear knot, and its much easier than a
Blood Knot.

What do others think...is this a good leader-tippet or tippet-tippet
knot? I wonder if its even worth doing two or more passes through
rather than the one.

I use a tool on all the knots I tie. Otherwise, I have trouble with
my sore and stiff fingers. I use the double (sometimes triple)
surgeons knot and have very few, if any, failures. The best part
about using a tool (besides giving my fingers a break) is that I can
tie the knots much faster than most folks can - not that there is a
race....... it's just easier to use the tool.

What Tool???
Sunny_B

"Dave LaCourse" wrote in message
...
On 3 Aug 2006 09:34:00 -0700, "riverman" wrote:

I just tried it on two pieces of 4x, and it seems very strong and is
quite easy to tie. Its not as simple as the Surgeons Knot, but it has
the advantage that it leaves a linear knot, and its much easier than a
Blood Knot.

What do others think...is this a good leader-tippet or tippet-tippet
knot? I wonder if its even worth doing two or more passes through
rather than the one.

I use a tool on all the knots I tie. Otherwise, I have trouble with
my sore and stiff fingers. I use the double (sometimes triple)
surgeons knot and have very few, if any, failures. The best part
about using a tool (besides giving my fingers a break) is that I can
tie the knots much faster than most folks can - not that there is a
race....... it's just easier to use the tool.

On Thu, 03 Aug 2006 19:23:00 GMT, "Sunny_B"
wrote:

What Tool???
Sunny_B

If it has a name, I have long ago forgotten it. It is the brass tool
demonstrated at the fly shows. To tie the clinch knot, thread the
fly, make a loop, stick the tool in the loop and twist around the loop
5 or 6 times, then reach through the loop with the tool, grasp the
bitter end of the tippet and pull it through the looop. Release the
tool, wet the knot and pull tight.

For the double surgeon's knot, make a loop with the end of the leader
and one end of the tippet held together. Reach through the loop and
make two (or three) twists. Then, grab the longest end of the tippet
and the short end of the leader with the tool, pull completely through
the loop. Tighten by pulling on all four parts of the knot (leader
and tippet, short ends of leader and tippet).

The same knots can be tied with your forceps using the instructions
above. If I lose my tying tool (every couple of years or so), I use
my forceps.

There are other knots that can be tied with this tool, but the two
mentioned above are all I need.

Dave

"Dave LaCourse" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 03 Aug 2006 19:23:00 GMT, "Sunny_B"
wrote:

What Tool???
Sunny_B

If it has a name, I have long ago forgotten it.

Can you take it picture of it or find it on the web...we would like to see
it.
-tom