How to tell what size fly?

Still a beginner but trying to venture out without a guide. I know the
tippet/leader/line/rod needs to be sized appropriately to fly size but
I can't tell what size flies are in my box. Can't find anything on the
internet like a hook size chart.

Is there a easy way to tell what size fly while on the stream?


--
gary3594
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On Wed, 16 Jul 2008 11:43:13 -0400, gary3594
wrote:


Still a beginner but trying to venture out without a guide. I know the
tippet/leader/line/rod needs to be sized appropriately to fly size

Er, no. Generally speaking, the rod and the line need to be matched,
and obviously, tippet must be sized such that it is physically
appropriate in size and characteristics to the size of the fly and the
eye of the hook (IOW, a 80-lb test shock tippet won't fit through a fine
wire 32, and even it would, it wouldn't be an appropriate choice), but
the size of the fly in no way correlates directly to the size of the
rest of the tackle, including line, leader, and tippet as do the rod and
line. One could properly use a single size of fly with a large range of
tackle, from a 1-2 wt with a tiny "line-holder" reel, appropriate line
and leader/tippet to a 5-6 with a serious reel and appropriate line,
etc. Generally and within reason, fly size is a function of quarry, its
"food" and what the angler's experience tells them is the "right size."

Generally speaking (and this is somewhat subject to personal choice),
you should match your rod and line to your quarry and conditions. For
example, on a small stream with lots of vegetation around and smaller
quarry, where casts were short, one would likely want a smaller, shorter
rod and lighter reel, whereas on a larger, more open river with larger
quarry and longer casts, to similar species as the small stream, one
would likely want a larger, longer rod and sturdier reel. However, one
might well use the same size fly on both.

but
I can't tell what size flies are in my box. Can't find anything on the
internet like a hook size chart.

Yes and no. You'll probably need to refer to several sources of data to
absolutely size hooks of an unknown specification/size/type. There are
_general_ size charts that give actual sizes of specific hooks, but I've
never seen an actual-size chart that has all hooks in all types/styles
from all makers, much less all of the hooks made over the last 30-50
years that one might encounter. That said, getting charts from Daiichi,
Tiemco, and Mustad would probably get one pretty close, if not dead-on.

If I may, why don't you know what size they are?

Is there a easy way to tell what size fly while on the stream?

Yes. Experience or organization.

TC,
R

Thanks for the quick reply.

A fly fishing oufitter where I picked up my first rod/reel chose some
basic trout flies for me. The names and sizes of the flies went in one
ear and out the next. I just arranged them in the fly box and did not
note the size. Now I no better but don't need to buy flies yet. Don't
have time to tie my own flies.


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On Wed, 16 Jul 2008 14:49:22 -0400, gary3594
wrote:


Thanks for the quick reply.

A fly fishing oufitter where I picked up my first rod/reel chose some
basic trout flies for me. The names and sizes of the flies went in one
ear and out the next. I just arranged them in the fly box and did not
note the size. Now I no better but don't need to buy flies yet. Don't
have time to tie my own flies.

If you happen to have a receipt or list of what you received in the
selection, you can easily figure out what's what. Simply sort by size
and the largest sized hook will be the smallest number and the smallest
hook will the largest number. For example:

If your list shows 5 of each of 16, 18, 22 and you have 15 flies, the
largest hooks are the 16s, the mid-sized are the 18s, and the smallest
hooks are the 22s.

If you don't have a such a list, sort them out and take them to a
flyshop. They ought to be able to tell you what you have in both size
and recipe/pattern.

TC,
R

On Jul 16, 12:49 pm, gary3594
wrote:

basic trout flies for me. The names and sizes of the flies went in one
ear and out the next. I just arranged them in the fly box and did not
note the size.

I'm surprised nobody suggested this yet, but just take your flybox
with you into any flyshop and ask for help. You'll be able to quickly
mark down what you have and in what sizes.

If you look at the fly and can't believe a fish could actually see
your fly much less bother to eat it, it's probably #20 or smaller.

If you look at it and think why would a big fish even bother, it's
probably #16 or #18.

If you look at it and think now that's more like it, then we're
talkin' #12 or #14.

If you look at it and think ooh baby that's gonna bring up the big
ones, it's probably #8 or #10.

If you're thinking a little fish won't even fit it into his mouth, now
you're up to #6 and bigger.

Jon.

wrote in message
...
On Wed, 16 Jul 2008 11:43:13 -0400, gary3594
wrote:


Still a beginner but trying to venture out without a guide. I know the
tippet/leader/line/rod needs to be sized appropriately to fly size
Snip

One could properly use a single size of fly with a large range of
tackle, from a 1-2 wt with a tiny "line-holder" reel, appropriate line
and leader/tippet to a 5-6 with a serious reel and appropriate line,
etc.
Snip
TC,
R

That's only marginally correct. The proper choice of rod/line size is fairly
closely coorelated to fly size. For instance, while quarry of a size that
can quite easily be handled with rod/line sizes of 3wt and less are readily
caught on size 4 hopper patterns, one would want a 5-7wt outfit to cast that
size fly effectively. And, although you could cast a size 28 Trico with an
11wt outfit, it certainly isn't the proper tool for the job. In other
words, while the quarry sought and the conditions under which it is pursued
generally dictate the best choice of rod/line weight, often the primary
factor in making that determination is the fly size and delivery the angler
deems best in pursuing that quarry.

Re being able to tell what size the hooks are in a fly box:
For most trout fishing situations the actual size of the hook is often
somewhat irrevelant. It is the size of the fly that is tied on the hook
rather than the size of the hook itself that is usually important in
determining whether you are properly imitating what the fish will take. For
instance, I commonly tie flies of a size, usually dressed on size 10 and
smaller hooks, on size 4-6 hooks - for very large fish in low clear water
conditions. Of course thats a unidirectional thing, i.e. you can't dress a
fly designed for a very large hook on a much smaller hook.

You will usually be best served by simply picking a fly from your box that
best matches the size of the bugs you are trying to immitate rather than
annaly memorizing a bunch of hook size numbers and their innumerable
permutations ( e.g.size 12, ring eye,1xLong, 2xStout). Also remember, as a
rule of thumb, if in doubt about the size of the bugs you are trying to
immitate, its better to err on the side of being too small.

Bob Weinberger La Grande,OR


** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

On Wed, 16 Jul 2008 12:22:54 -0700, "Bob Weinberger"
wrote:


wrote in message
.. .
On Wed, 16 Jul 2008 11:43:13 -0400, gary3594
wrote:


Still a beginner but trying to venture out without a guide. I know the
tippet/leader/line/rod needs to be sized appropriately to fly size
Snip

One could properly use a single size of fly with a large range of
tackle, from a 1-2 wt with a tiny "line-holder" reel, appropriate line
and leader/tippet to a 5-6 with a serious reel and appropriate line,
etc.
Snip
TC,
R

That's only marginally correct. The proper choice of rod/line size is fairly
closely coorelated to fly size. For instance, while quarry of a size that
can quite easily be handled with rod/line sizes of 3wt and less are readily
caught on size 4 hopper patterns, one would want a 5-7wt outfit to cast that
size fly effectively. And, although you could cast a size 28 Trico with an
11wt outfit, it certainly isn't the proper tool for the job. In other
words, while the quarry sought and the conditions under which it is pursued
generally dictate the best choice of rod/line weight, often the primary
factor in making that determination is the fly size and delivery the angler
deems best in pursuing that quarry.

Your analysis of what I said is marginally correct. Please note your
own use of "the angler deems best." And I don't agree that fly size is
"often" the primary factor in "dictating" rod/line size if you mean
"often" to mean "most often" or "primary" and "dictating" to mean
adhering to rigid objective standard. OTOH, if you mean that it
sometimes can be _a_ factor, then yes, I'd agree. I would certainly
agree that a 28 on an 11 would generally be a mis-match, if for no other
reason that the strength of the tippet sizes usable with a 28 would be
much less than that in context to an 11 wt. rod. And I didn't say that
a 28 would be appropriate on an 11. But you seem to be thinking about
the upper extremes and/or extremes of range rather than the objectively
useful range - IOW, while a 3 wt. or less might be suitable for _a
particular quarry_ and the angler's subjective choice as the "best" fly
for _that quarry_ might be a fly better cast with a 5-7, that doesn't
mean that the 3 or the 7 is "better" for a reasonable and objective size
range.

IAC, I think most would agree that fly "size" (with "size" being the
size of the hook on which the fly is tyed) is not directly related to
rod and line size in the way that rod and line size relate to each other
- IOW, there are no 2, 3, 14, whatever weight flies such that one can
obtain flies based on the AFTMA rating of rods and lines, or even such
that such a "standard" could be developed.

TC,
R



Re being able to tell what size the hooks are in a fly box:
For most trout fishing situations the actual size of the hook is often
somewhat irrevelant. It is the size of the fly that is tied on the hook
rather than the size of the hook itself that is usually important in
determining whether you are properly imitating what the fish will take. For
instance, I commonly tie flies of a size, usually dressed on size 10 and
smaller hooks, on size 4-6 hooks - for very large fish in low clear water
conditions. Of course thats a unidirectional thing, i.e. you can't dress a
fly designed for a very large hook on a much smaller hook.

You will usually be best served by simply picking a fly from your box that
best matches the size of the bugs you are trying to immitate rather than
annaly memorizing a bunch of hook size numbers and their innumerable
permutations ( e.g.size 12, ring eye,1xLong, 2xStout). Also remember, as a
rule of thumb, if in doubt about the size of the bugs you are trying to
immitate, its better to err on the side of being too small.

Bob Weinberger La Grande,OR


** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

"gary3594" wrote in message
...

I know the
tippet/leader/line/rod needs to be sized appropriately to fly size but

No, things are simpler than that.

Light rods (e.g. line weights 6 and smaller can easily cast
fly sizes between # 4 or 6 (e.g. Muddler Minnow about an inch
long) and #18 (smallest size with which you can effectively
"match the hatch" in your first season of fishing.) Lighter rods
can fish effectively even smaller fllies, and heavier ones (e.g.
line weight 7 to 12) are designed for bigger flies, say #14 smallest up
to several inches long. Each has its own range for practical fishing.

Leaders simply taper from (70 per cent of) line tip diameter
down to the tippet, determined by hook size, e.g.
diam. 0.006 inch is best for fly size #16 and possible for #14 and #18
thus diam. 0.007" for size #14
0.008" for #12
0.009" for #10
and use 0.011" for larger flies,
leader length being fixed by function, e.g. only 2 to 4 feet for flies
fished deep on a sinking line, 9 feet or longer for dry flies on smooth
water.

I can't tell what size flies are in my box. Can't find anything on the
internet like a hook size chart.

Try the library. Most book-length guides have a hook size chart,
as do some fishing tackle catalogues, free or on-line.

--
Don Phillipson
Carlsbad Springs
(Ottawa, Canada)

On Wed, 16 Jul 2008 11:43:13 -0400, gary3594
wrote:


Still a beginner but trying to venture out without a guide. I know the
tippet/leader/line/rod needs to be sized appropriately to fly size but
I can't tell what size flies are in my box. Can't find anything on the
internet like a hook size chart.

Is there a easy way to tell what size fly while on the stream?

Follow the advice you have so far received. As a beginner, you will
probably get by with tippet from 3x to 5x.

With 3x, you should be able to cast quite easily size 10, 12, and 14
flies.

With 4x, 12, 14, and 16.

With 5x, 14, 16, and 18.

I use 5x exclusively for trout, and generally use flies from size 14
to 22 without any problems.

There is a hook gauge available for fly tying stations. Most fly
shops should carry it. You could check you flies without buying it,
or ask the fly shop to size them for you.

After awhile, you will be able to look at a fly and tell its hook
size.

Let us know how you make out.

Dave

On Jul 16, 5:43*pm, gary3594 wrote:
Still a beginner but trying to venture out without a guide. *I know the
tippet/leader/line/rod needs to be sized appropriately to fly size but
I can't tell what size flies are in my box. *Can't find anything on the
internet like a hook size chart.

Is there a easy way to tell what size fly while on the stream?


Just look at the flies on the stream, and choose an appropriate size
and colour from your box. In most cases this will work perfectly well,
even if you don´t know what the flies are.

The hook size does not always reflect the fly size. This also depends
on hook pattern.

Flies are dressed on a huge range of hooks nowadays, and the hook
sizes are not standardised anyway.

For casting various flies, and presenting them properly, you need an
appropriate leader and tippet. The advice given by others here is
sound enough. For most trout fishing I also use 5X tippet.

This may be of some help to you;
http://www.mike1.bplaced.net/Wikka/Leaders

TL
MC

http://www.mike1.bplaced.net/Wikka/HomePage