Which comes first?

"JT" wrote in message
...

"Tom Nakashima" wrote in message
...

It was Dave Whitlock who taught me to pick up a rock from the river
and rub the fly in the moss to kill the scent from your hands before
making
a presentation to the fish.

Dries, wet or all flies?

JT

Dave does this on dries, wets and nymphs, so I'm assuming all flies.
I also read it in one of Whitlock's books I have at home, I'll see if I can
dig it up again over the weekend. When I saw Dave at the ISE show I
questioned him on this, and he told me it's a very important step before
the presentation to the fish. Makes good sense to me.

I love reading and talking to experts about fishing techniques, and
sometimes it surprises me the little things that these well established
anglers do.
fwiw,
-tom

"rb608" wrote in message
news:51_Fh.16$mI6.2@trndny08...
"Tom Nakashima" wrote in message news:es9fdk$cj0
Don't get me wrong, I not one who catches fish every time I go out, I
really have to work at it, but I try to give myself the best opportunity
to catch a fish.

Like Tim, I'm in agreement with you all the way, except that I do enjoy a
good cigar from time to time. As for the approach (and I'm anything but a
great fisherman),

As one of my friends at the casting pond says, "We're always learning."
And enjoying the sport as well.

I am usually very patient and stealthy as you descibe.

Yes, I'm a firm believer that patients is the key in fly-fishing.

(and for that I owe a debt of gratitude to Mr. Miller's company on
Wilson's Creek a while back.) Not only to scout out the river, but also
because all of the aspects of the experience are as valuable as the actual
fishing. I'm not there to catch fish, and I'm in no hurry to do so. I'm
there to go fishing, and the streamside observations and approach are part
of that; to be enjoyed, not rushed through. And frankly, if the trout
don't like the smell of a good Montecristo, it doesn't lessen my enjoyment
of either.
Joe F.

I have a friend who really gets ****ed when he doesn't catch fish. Sort of
ruins the whole trip if he's dwelling on it the whole time. Me, I could care
less, I'm still going to eat good. I don't mind how my friends fish, or what
they smoke, or how many fish they catch, or how big the fish is. I sort of
do my own thing and enjoy the sport.

I just met another angler at the Pleasanton show last week, found out we
live near by. We're going to hook up on the Yuba river next week if it isn't
blown out.
fwiw,
-tom

rb608 typed:
snip
I'm there to go fishing,
and the streamside observations and approach are part of that; to be
enjoyed, not rushed through. And frankly, if the trout don't like
the smell of a good Montecristo, it doesn't lessen my enjoyment of
either.

You da man, Joe. Pick up a Hoyo de Monterey Dark Sumatra - the bigger, the
better. You won't be disappointed, and you'll have enough left in your
pocket to buy that club for clubbing the water as you dash into the river
just upstream from Jeff. And if upstream just happens to be upwind, all the
better. ;-)
--
TL,
Tim
-------------------------
http://css.sbcma.com/timj

Tim J. wrote:
Tom Nakashima typed:
snip

I fish a little different from most of my friends. They seem to enjoy
rushing to wader-up, jump right into the water


Okay. . . I'm with you so far . . .

Some even have cigars dangling from their mouths as they forcefully wade
through the water to get to their spot only to blind cast.


Nope. . . I lost you on this one. Do the cigars have something to do with
the sloppiness of the approach?


I like to scout the area first, look for prime fishing areas, and
watch for fish on the rise, even before I get my waders on. I would also
observe the hatch, or surrounding flies that I think fish are hitting on.


Okay, we're back on track, but I like a good cigar in my mouth while doing
so. ;-)

Ah, so you are that Tim J. who posts to that stinky cigar group. ;-)

brians

"Tom Nakashima" wrote in message
...

I don't do cigars because I believe it was our 42nd President who said;
"Cigars are for pussys!"
On a serious note, it's not so much the downwind smoke, but tying your
fly to the tippet after touching the stogie. Fish have a keen sense of
smell.

Some fish have a keen sense of smell. Some don't. Among those that do, it
is by no means always what they key on in deciding whether or not to eat
something.

It was Dave Whitlock who taught me to pick up a rock from the river
and rub the fly in the moss to kill the scent from your hands before
making
a presentation to the fish. What this does is actually pick up a natural
scent from the river. Dave does this everytime he fishes.

This is a very bad idea when using most dry flies.

Even hand tied flies have an odor to them from just the materials used as
he put it.

Well, there's your problem. I always stick to machine tied flies.

fwiw,

You should stop putting that at the end of each post. It belies the brash
certainty with which you present everything. Besides, people will likely
decide for themselves what they think it is worth without coaching.

Wolfgang

Tom Nakashima typed:
"Tim J." wrote in message
...
Tom Nakashima typed:

Okay. . . I'm with you so far . . .
Some even have cigars dangling from their mouths as they forcefully
wade through the water to get to their spot only to blind cast.

Nope. . . I lost you on this one. Do the cigars have something to do
with the sloppiness of the approach?

I don't do cigars because I believe it was our 42nd President who
said; "Cigars are for pussys!"
On a serious note, it's not so much the downwind smoke,

.. . . I smell San Fran bicycle-nut smoking nazi . . .

but tying your
fly to the tippet after touching the stogie. Fish have a keen sense
of smell.

It's probably just crappy fishing technique, but I've never caught more or
less fish after the cigar. Well, maybe less fish, but there's not much doubt
in my mind that I can't blame that on the cigar.
--
TL,
Tim
-------------------------
http://css.sbcma.com/timj

"Tom Nakashima" wrote in message
...
snip

Yes, I'm a firm believer that patients is the key in fly-fishing.
snip

I thought that you worked in high tech. That statement would make more sense
if you were a Dr.or dentist. 8)

Bob Weinberger - Snowed in in La Grande, OR and bored to the point of nit
picking spelling & math errors in posts.

"Tom Nakashima" wrote in message
...

"JT" wrote in message
...

"Tom Nakashima" wrote in message
...

It was Dave Whitlock who taught me to pick up a rock from the river
and rub the fly in the moss to kill the scent from your hands before
making
a presentation to the fish.

Dries, wet or all flies?

JT

Dave does this on dries, wets and nymphs, so I'm assuming all flies.
I also read it in one of Whitlock's books I have at home, I'll see if I
can
dig it up again over the weekend. When I saw Dave at the ISE show I
questioned him on this, and he told me it's a very important step before
the presentation to the fish.

Very important? Unmitigated crap. Billions of fish caught by millions of
people who never rubbed anything on a fly say otherwise.

Makes good sense to me.

A highly subjective and idiosyncratic judgement.

I love reading and talking to experts about fishing techniques, and
sometimes it surprises me the little things that these well established
anglers do.

There is good reason to be surprised by much of what they do.

I have NEVER used anything from a stream to mask whatever scent might be on
a fly. I catch roughly 2.5 times as many fish as Whitlock and 7 times as
many as you.

Wolfgang

Tim J. wrote:

It's probably just crappy fishing technique, but I've never caught more or
less fish after the cigar. Well, maybe less fish, but there's not much doubt
in my mind that I can't blame that on the cigar.

As someone who is known to enjoy a cigarette by the stream, I can
honestly say that my best fish have been caught right after taking a
smoke. When I was in western NC, I adopted the practice of approaching
the stream and sitting down for a smoke before I cast to any really
promising-looking water.

I did it to slow myself down and really savor my surroundings, and
the fish seemed to like it, too. And the fact that I had smoke on my
hands/breath/whatever didn't cause any refusals on their part.

Of course they were just dumb, mountain hillbilly fish, not urbane,
discriminating, west-coast fish, so they probably just didn't know any
better.


Chuck Vance (heck, they probably smoked as well)

"Tom Nakashima" wrote in message
...

Dries, wet or all flies?

JT

Dave does this on dries, wets and nymphs, so I'm assuming all flies.
I also read it in one of Whitlock's books I have at home, I'll see if I
can
dig it up again over the weekend. When I saw Dave at the ISE show I
questioned him on this, and he told me it's a very important step before
the presentation to the fish. Makes good sense to me.


I can see it with wet flies and nymphs, but doing so to a freshly dressed
dry fly would seem to defeat the purpose....


I love reading and talking to experts about fishing techniques, and
sometimes it surprises me the little things that these well established
anglers do.

Yes and very true,
JT