Sunken 'float'

The klinkhammer photo reminded me of Brook's 'tied in the round' theory.

This would probably be more on topic over at the tying list but

Does anybody have thoughts and ideas on ways to make sure that two tone
nymph patterns actually 'float' near the bottom top side up?

Nymph patterns with backstraps of PT ( or other) and bellies of fur or other
look great in the vise, but tumbling in the currents?

Related query: good ways to build 'wide bodied' nymphs .... rhithrogena
for instance are very wide and thin, round is not an accurate body shape.
I'm think that one of you bright lads or ladies might have practical ideas
that would make it easy to both improve the shape of clinger/crawler nymph
ties and stabilize their 'float' right side up at the same time?


Sandy? Littleton? other sharp tacks out there ?

"Larry L" wrote in message
...
The klinkhammer photo reminded me of Brook's 'tied in the round' theory.

This would probably be more on topic over at the tying list but

Does anybody have thoughts and ideas on ways to make sure that two tone
nymph patterns actually 'float' near the bottom top side up?

Flies will naturally tend to ride top side up by virtue of the fact that
whatever materials are used have a lower density than the steel of the hook.
The bend and point, being bare, also experience less drag and will tend to
keep the whole thing upright.

Nymph patterns with backstraps of PT ( or other) and bellies of fur or
other look great in the vise, but tumbling in the currents?

Tumbling in currents, artificals will do pretty much what naturals
do.....tumble.

Related query: good ways to build 'wide bodied' nymphs .... rhithrogena
for instance are very wide and thin, round is not an accurate body shape.
I'm think that one of you bright lads or ladies might have practical
ideas that would make it easy to both improve the shape of clinger/crawler
nymph ties and stabilize their 'float' right side up at the same time?

Don't remember any specific references, but a lot of the old pros
experimented with strips of various materials for a shaped underbodies.
I've done a little of this myself. There is a virtually infinite selection
of plastics to choose from these days, so materials aren't a real problem.
The trouble has always been proper shaping and, more importantly, firm
attachment to the hook and covering with the material of choice without
undue deformation. Interesting stuff to mess around with but, quite
frankly, generally not worth the trouble in terms of productivity. The same
kinds of effects can also be arrived at with putties, epoxies, caulk, and
other liquids or semi-liquids......with similar results and caveats.

Not surprisingly, discussions of such techniques usually lead to unpleasant
exchanges about what constitutes "fly fishing."

Wolfgang

"Larry L" wrote in
:

Related query: good ways to build 'wide bodied' nymphs ....
rhithrogena for instance are very wide and thin, round is not an
accurate body shape. I'm think that one of you bright lads or ladies
might have practical ideas that would make it easy to both improve
the shape of clinger/crawler nymph ties and stabilize their 'float'
right side up at the same time?


When I weave nymphs, I go out of my way to make sure the materials being
woven line up on the sides of the hook when tied down. This, with some
underbody thread work, plus the idea of the knots along the sides of the
weave slightly widening things, make a nice flat fly.

Also, you can use lead as many usually do, and just squash it flat with
pliers.

Then, Wolfie's suggestion of tying materials along the sides just for shape
makes a lot of sense.

There are also commercially available nymph bodies, I think.

--
Scott
Reverse name to reply

"Wolfgang" wrote



Tumbling in currents, artificals will do pretty much what naturals
do.....tumble.

LIVING naturals would tend to try and resist tumbling I'd think ( I would if
I were one ;-) and use their legs and such to fight for uprightedness



Interesting stuff to mess around with but, quite frankly, generally not
worth the trouble in terms of productivity.


I firmly believe that "having fun" is a major product of any hobby ( or good
job,ftm ) and nothing is as much fun as learning. Thus, "interesting
stuff" implies "fun" and "fun" infers "productive" when a major product is
having a good time ! I meet many people im my travels that seem to limit
the goal of fly fishing to the "fun of catching fish" .... there are many,
Many, MANY ways to increase the "productivity" of the sport beyond that
narrow view.



Not surprisingly, discussions of such techniques usually lead to
unpleasant exchanges about what constitutes "fly fishing."


Crap, we started by talking about nymphing, so we're already beyond the
realm of 'real' fly fishing :-)

Oh, and, it IS possible to separate discuss from unpleasant ... honest g

"Larry L" wrote in message
...

"Wolfgang" wrote



Tumbling in currents, artificals will do pretty much what naturals
do.....tumble.

LIVING naturals would tend to try and resist tumbling I'd think ( I would
if I were one ;-) and use their legs and such to fight for uprightedness

Doubtless. When I take a step onto something that isn't there, I do my
damndest to resist gravity.

Interesting stuff to mess around with but, quite frankly, generally not
worth the trouble in terms of productivity.


I firmly believe that "having fun" is a major product of any hobby ( or
good job,ftm ) and nothing is as much fun as learning. Thus,
"interesting stuff" implies "fun" and "fun" infers "productive" when a
major product is having a good time ! I meet many people im my travels
that seem to limit the goal of fly fishing to the "fun of catching fish"
.... there are many, Many, MANY ways to increase the "productivity" of the
sport beyond that narrow view.

O.k.

Not surprisingly, discussions of such techniques usually lead to
unpleasant exchanges about what constitutes "fly fishing."


Crap, we started by talking about nymphing, so we're already beyond the
realm of 'real' fly fishing :-)

Oh, and, it IS possible to separate discuss from unpleasant ... honest g

You're welcome.

Wolfgang

"Larry L" wrote in
:

LIVING naturals would tend to try and resist tumbling I'd think ( I
would if I were one ;-) and use their legs and such to fight for
uprightedness


A swimming nymph might have a shot, but a clinger or digger would just
tumble, I think.

--
Scott
Reverse name to reply

On Apr 6, 8:45 am, "Larry L" wrote:


Does anybody have thoughts and ideas on ways to make sure that two tone
nymph patterns actually 'float' near the bottom top side up?

...snipt
ties and stabilize their 'float' right side up at the same time?

Sandy? Littleton? other sharp tacks out there ?

Tying nymphs as Bankrobbers is one way to keep them right-side up.
This is a technique
that originally had big stonefly nymphs in mind. But it's worth
mentioning

http://montana-riverboats.com/Pages/...ankrobber.html

"salmobytes" wrote

"Many is the time I've drifted the last few hours of a long float without
any flies to cast to fish."


shudder ... I'm going to have nightmares over that one :-(





Seriously, the Bank Robber is a strong idea, Sandy, I AM going to experiment
with it. Thanks.

"Scott Seidman" wrote



When I weave nymphs,


I like they way some of those woven patterns look, but I don't have that
kind of patience and detxiertyi ( **** it's hard typing with all these
thumbs )



Also, you can use lead as many usually do, and just squash it flat with
pliers.


I have a Humphreys video where he wraps lead over cotton and then flattens
the mess, as an underbody. He uses flat lead foil, I tried it with round
fly shop not-lead and didn't have results that pleased me

I have a Humphreys video where he wraps lead over cotton and then flattens
the mess, as an underbody. He uses flat lead foil, I tried it with round
fly shop not-lead and didn't have results that pleased me

Your local golf course or golf supply store will probably have some
flat lead made for wrappping on clubs.

vince