So, OK, he's for change, he gives Chris Mathews a feeling "up his leg," and...

"rb608" wrote in message
news:uUeuj.5784$zo3.4883@trndny04...

I've been avoiding most of this latest round of Kerry-hate and rebuttal;
but I am a bit uninformed as to when these supposed lies took place. Are
you talking about the better-known Fulbright hearing on 4/22/71, or was
there another time he testified under oath about this stuff?

Joe F.

Joel,

At this point in time, I don't remember which hearing it was. I just
remember watching his testimony on, I believe, CNN and staring at the tube
in disbelief upon hearing him swear to what I knew to be lies.

Bob Weinberger

Bob Weinberger wrote:
"rb608" wrote:
... Fulbright hearing on 4/22/71,

At this point in time, I don't remember which hearing it was. I just
remember watching his testimony on, I believe, CNN and staring at the tube
in disbelief upon hearing him swear to what I knew to be lies.

CNN made its first broadcast on June 1, 1980.

--
Ken Fortenberry

Dave LaCourse wrote:
On Sun, 17 Feb 2008 17:02:59 -0700, salmo bytes wrote:

The guy I met in 1968 (Doug Peacock, the inspiration for Hay Duke in
the Monkey Wrench Gang) was a green beret medic, at Lang Vei
I believe. Now that I think about it, he told stories about
Khe Sahn, but never said he was there. At Lang Vei he was
....unless I (like Andy Petitte the other day) "miss-heard."

You do know that Khe Sahn was a seige, don't you? The three
battalions of III Marines were under seige for about two months or so.
Six thousand against 20,000 NVA. There was no hand to hand combat, no
atrocities of civilians because the only ones inside the wire were
wives of the SVN Army troops that fought with the Marines. No
atrocities occured at Khe Sahn. If he wasn't there, how the hell
does he know what happened? Your story is poor bull****.

Dave


I'm still waiting for that blood vessel video Bob. I think it's great
idea. We're talking about what happened 40 years ago. What what's his
name (Hay Duke) said about Khe Sahn wasn't what happened reports,
it had to do with his constiracy theory about why we risked those
marine lives in the first place...recreating Dien Ben Fu in an
unwinnable way. He thought the military wanted to have 6000 lives
threatened, so they'd have an excuse to ask permission for the use
of tactical nuclear weapons. The first hand stories he told we about
the places he'd actually been. Take a deep breath and get a life.

On Feb 17, 6:41*pm, "Bob Weinberger"
wrote:
I
acknowledged *that many if not all those atrocities likely occurred. *Even
if they all did, it is immaterial to the fact that he lied when he said he
witnessed them.

Now, you say with apparent conviction that Kerry lied when he says he
witnessed atrocities, but you don't remember when he said that. You
acknowledge that atrocities occurred, but will state categorically
that Kerry is a liar for having said he saw some. From here, your
allegations are looking long on hatred but short on facts. I do
uinderstand the visceral hatred some vets have for their perceptions
of his betrayal of them; but I'm not, no could I, address that
conflict. But the "Kerry lied under oath" meme is itself a lie not
worthy of men of honor.

I asked about the Fulbright hearing because that's the only time I am
aware of where Kerry testified under oath (There may well be more, I'm
really not that deep into this whole thing). Here's a link to the
transcript.
http://facultystaff.richmond.edu/~eb...Testimony.html
Find an instance in that testimony whre John Kerry told a lie under
oath.

Joe F.

On Mon, 18 Feb 2008 06:42:27 -0700, salmo bytes wrote:

Take a deep breath and get a life.

Translation: "I don't know what the eff I'm talking about, Dave."

d;o)

rb608 wrote in
:

I asked about the Fulbright hearing because that's the only time I am
aware of where Kerry testified under oath (There may well be more, I'm
really not that deep into this whole thing). Here's a link to the
transcript.
http://facultystaff.richmond.edu/~eb...rryTestimony.h
tml Find an instance in that testimony whre John Kerry told a lie
under oath.


Joe--

I don't know why you'd sentence poor Bob to read pages and pages of Kerry
testimony. Even the current Supreme Court would call that cruel and
unusual. In fact, banning it should be an amendment to the anti-
waterboarding bill.


--
Scott
Reverse name to reply

rb608 wrote:
"Bob Weinberger" wrote:
I
acknowledged that many if not all those atrocities likely occurred. Even
if they all did, it is immaterial to the fact that he lied when he said he
witnessed them.

Now, you say with apparent conviction that Kerry lied when he says he
witnessed atrocities, but you don't remember when he said that. You
acknowledge that atrocities occurred, but will state categorically
that Kerry is a liar for having said he saw some. From here, your
allegations are looking long on hatred but short on facts. I do
uinderstand the visceral hatred some vets have for their perceptions
of his betrayal of them; but I'm not, no could I, address that
conflict. But the "Kerry lied under oath" meme is itself a lie not
worthy of men of honor.

I asked about the Fulbright hearing because that's the only time I am
aware of where Kerry testified under oath (There may well be more, I'm
really not that deep into this whole thing). Here's a link to the
transcript.
http://facultystaff.richmond.edu/~eb...Testimony.html
Find an instance in that testimony whre John Kerry told a lie under
oath.

You can listen to Kerry's testimony he

http://www.democracynow.org/2004/2/2...errys_historic

Not that Swiftboat Bob or Chief Louie are ever gonna let actual
facts get in the way of their anti-Kerry slanders. They saw it
with their own eyes on CNN. ;-)

--
Ken Fortenberry

On Mon, 18 Feb 2008 06:42:27 -0700, salmo bytes wrote:

I'm still waiting for that blood vessel video Bob. I think it's great
idea. We're talking about what happened 40 years ago. What what's his
name (Hay Duke)

said about Khe Sahn wasn't what happened reports,

That sentence makes little sense.

it had to do with his constiracy theory about why we risked those
marine lives in the first place...recreating Dien Ben Fu in an
unwinnable way.

Well, in the first place it is Dien Bien Phu. Those 6000 Marines and
RVA troops held at bay 20,000 NVA troops who could have been doing
lots of damage elsewhere during Thet. Giap wanted another Dien Bien
Phu but did not count on the firepower three batalians of U.S. Marines
could bring forth. It was a losing proposition for Giap to begin
with. It was not an "unwinnable way". Giap got his ass kicked. It
was a brilliant tactical move to have only 3 batalians hold off two
divisions (provided you know the difference between a batalian and a
division, of course. Hint: several batalians make up a brigade and a
division is made up of several brigades.) d;o) Pretty neat trick for
three batalians to hold off two divisions, but the tactical aspect of
that is certainly lost with your jaundiced brain.

He thought the military wanted to have 6000 lives
threatened, so they'd have an excuse to ask permission for the use
of tactical nuclear weapons.

Absolutely bull****. Where did you find this guy? His first mistake
was "he thought". Lots of wannabes out there.

Dave

On Feb 17, 9:48*pm, wrote:
Yes, I knew exactly what I was writing,

Yes, I knew that.

but you're flat wrong about the
meaning and what I meant. *

No. I'm not.

The term "jungle fever" has nothing to do
with the character, education, or amount of respect shown the black guy
in question, it's a comment directed solely at white folks. *

In your context, it's a racist red flag highlighting Obama's African
ancestry and trivializing the respect he deserves for his
accomplishments, and in particular, his acceptance and endorsement by
a white woman. But you knew that.


In fact,
there would not even need to be an actual black person involved. *

Well, that's just laughable.


I have
no idea what race the person who coined the term was, but I've heard it
more from black folks than white (usually good-naturedly gigging white
folks),

Yeah, I hear the n-word used when good-naturedly gigging folks too.
Why don't you just cut the obfuscation and go right to how you feel.

I've never heard a black person say they were offended by it,
and it was popularized by a black guy -

A movie was made by Spike Lee that examined the racial conflicts
inherent in the phrase. That's a big difference from popularizing of
the racist use of the phrase itself.


Spike Lee (Ossie Davis and Ruby
Dee, not to mention Sam Jackson and Wesley Snipes, seemingly didn't take
offense, either, and if Davis and Mrs. Dee didn't have a problem with
it, that's good enough for me). *

So you've spoken with them and understand their feelings as black
professionals on the derogatory use of the phrase, or are you just
assuming that their appearance as actors in a social critique are all
the insight you require?

Joe F.

On Feb 18, 8:55*am, Scott Seidman wrote:
I don't know why you'd sentence poor Bob to read pages and pages of Kerry
testimony. *

:-)

When this came up a while back, I looked up the Kerry testimony as
part of my usual fact-check whenever I get a "send this to everyone
you know" message. Apparently it was "common knowledge", or at least
often repeated that Kerry had lied in his testimony, so I checked. He
didn't.

Not only that, I thought it was a pretty good read and a relevant
lesson for what we're now doing in Iraq. He was spot on in most of
his analysis, and without the benefit of the 20-20 hindsight we now
enjoy almost four decades years later.

Joe F.