OT .. Thanks Forty & Frank ...

I bought RosettaStone Spanish ( Latin America) based largely on your
suggestions. I have a lifelong history of being terrible at learning
languges, and was very concerned parting with so much money when I'm such a
dolt.

I'm several lessons into the program ... and there is no certainty of my
success,
BUT,
this is the most powerful approach to learning language I've ever seen. I'm
progressing and having fun doing so.

On Thu, 17 Apr 2008 17:49:07 GMT, "Larry L"
wrote:

I'm several lessons into the program ... and there is no certainty of my
success,
BUT,
this is the most powerful approach to learning language I've ever seen. I'm
progressing and having fun doing so.

I'd appreciate it if you kept me posted on your progress. I deal with
Spanish speaking folks two days a week, and although most of them
speak English, it would be nice to communicate in their language.

Dave

Larry

Keep studying
When you go there and speak it you will still make errors but people will be
much more frendly if you make the effort to speak thieir language in their
country
When I go to a Spanish speaking country ojn business I can make my
presentation about our products in Spanish-
after that for all I know they are saying to throw the bum oput as they
speak too fast to understand their reaction .but as I am usually succesful I
know that they appreciate the attempt to speak their language in their
country as many people living here should speak ourr languager in our
country

Good luck.
When you start to think in that language which you will, as you use, it
thats when you can truly speak it
Spaniish luckily is not that difficult esp when younger
For me - now - It would be mmuch more difficult

Fred

Fred

On Thu, 17 Apr 2008 19:33:45 GMT, wrote:

Larry

Keep studying
When you go there and speak it you will still make errors but people will be
much more frendly if you make the effort to speak thieir language in their
country
When I go to a Spanish speaking country ojn business I can make my
presentation about our products in Spanish-

Ooh! Ooh! Do it here! Do it here!

after that for all I know they are saying to throw the bum oput as they
speak too fast to understand their reaction .

Um, really? I mean, how fast can anyone say "que la chinga?"...(yeah,
yeah, yeah, Chuck...it's just a joke, not a Spanish class...)

but as I am usually succesful I
know that they appreciate the attempt to speak their language in their
country as many people living here should speak ourr languager in our
country

Ever tried any half-assed US high school French in, oh, say, France...?

Good luck.
When you start to think in that language which you will, as you use, it
thats when you can truly speak it
Spaniish luckily is not that difficult esp when younger

Howsabout English?

For me - now - It would be mmuch more difficult

Oh, nonsense - I have faith in ya, boy - you could mangle the begeebers
out of any language you attempted, and at any age...

Fred

Fred

Is that "Fred" in Spanish?
R

wrote in message
...
On Thu, 17 Apr 2008 19:33:45 GMT, wrote:

Larry

Keep studying
When you go there and speak it you will still make errors but people will
be
much more frendly if you make the effort to speak thieir language in their
country
When I go to a Spanish speaking country ojn business I can make my
presentation about our products in Spanish-

Ooh! Ooh! Do it here! Do it here!

after that for all I know they are saying to throw the bum oput as they
speak too fast to understand their reaction .

Um, really? I mean, how fast can anyone say "que la chinga?"...(yeah,
yeah, yeah, Chuck...it's just a joke, not a Spanish class...)

but as I am usually succesful I
know that they appreciate the attempt to speak their language in their
country as many people living here should speak ourr languager in our
country

Ever tried any half-assed US high school French in, oh, say, France...?

Good luck.
When you start to think in that language which you will, as you use, it
thats when you can truly speak it
Spaniish luckily is not that difficult esp when younger

Howsabout English?

For me - now - It would be mmuch more difficult

Oh, nonsense - I have faith in ya, boy - you could mangle the begeebers
out of any language you attempted, and at any age...

Fred

Fred

Is that "Fred" in Spanish?

Hey! There you are! Weren't we having a nice little discussion? Where'd
you go?

Wolfgang

Larry L wrote:
I bought RosettaStone Spanish ( Latin America) based largely on your
suggestions. I have a lifelong history of being terrible at learning
languges, and was very concerned parting with so much money when I'm such a
dolt.

I'm several lessons into the program ... and there is no certainty of my
success,
BUT,
this is the most powerful approach to learning language I've ever seen. I'm
progressing and having fun doing so.

Glad to hear it, Larry. I wish you continued success with your
language learning.

Perhaps you can return the favor and recommend a book or books
on dog training. I'm going to get my first ever pure bred dog
in a few weeks and I'm going to train her myself. I've never
had any dog that wasn't a shelter mutt and I loved them dearly
but this time I went with a Labrador Retriever with a pedigree.

I'm getting my dog from these folks:

http://www.britishlabradors.com/

And the training program they have is this one:

http://www.britishretrievertraining.com/index.html

I like it because they stress not using e-collars, which is
something I won't do. (I'm sure e-collars are fine in the
right hands, but my hands are far too inexperienced.)

Any advice or pointers appreciated.

--
Ken Fortenberry

On Thu, 17 Apr 2008 15:04:40 -0500, Ken Fortenberry
wrote:

Larry L wrote:
I bought RosettaStone Spanish ( Latin America) based largely on your
suggestions. I have a lifelong history of being terrible at learning
languges, and was very concerned parting with so much money when I'm such a
dolt.

I'm several lessons into the program ... and there is no certainty of my
success,
BUT,
this is the most powerful approach to learning language I've ever seen. I'm
progressing and having fun doing so.

Glad to hear it, Larry. I wish you continued success with your
language learning.

Perhaps you can return the favor and recommend a book or books
on dog training. I'm going to get my first ever pure bred dog
in a few weeks and I'm going to train her myself. I've never
had any dog that wasn't a shelter mutt and I loved them dearly
but this time I went with a Labrador Retriever with a pedigree.

Elitist.

I'm getting my dog from these folks:

http://www.britishlabradors.com/

Why do you hate America?

And the training program they have is this one:

http://www.britishretrievertraining.com/index.html

I like it because they stress not using e-collars, which is
something I won't do. (I'm sure e-collars are fine in the
right hands, but my hands are far too inexperienced.)

Any advice or pointers appreciated.

Pointer_S_? Lemme guess - French ones...greedy elitist...

TC,
R

wrote:
Ken Fortenberry wrote:
... I'm going to get my first ever pure bred dog
in a few weeks and I'm going to train her myself. I've never
had any dog that wasn't a shelter mutt and I loved them dearly
but this time I went with a Labrador Retriever with a pedigree.

Elitist.

Yeah, I'm feeling a little bit of liberal white guilt. ;-)

It's hard to adopt a puppy from our local shelter. The puppies
are adopted so quickly you have to visit the shelter two or
three times a week to be sure you're one of the first to see
them. If you do happen to go to the shelter on the day the
puppies arrive you're only going to get a half hour or so in
a socializing room to make a decision you have to live with
for 11-12 years. We were lucky with Kipper the Hound but this
time around I wanted the predictability of a pedigree.

--
Ken Fortenberry

"Ken Fortenberry" wrote


Any advice or pointers appreciated.



Consistency is far more important than specific 'method' ... attitude
(trainer's ) is more important than technique

Honestly, I haven't read a book on training in years
but
you asked so here ya go, some thoughts

1) The first step in training is the hardest and the most important. It
is to decide EXACTLY what you want the dog trained to do! Don't laugh,
I've trained hundreds for hundreds of people and none of those people
started with a clear, precise, detailed, idea of what they wanted ( I always
ask ).

Define everything as detailed as you can ... example, if she is to ride in
the canoe ... where?, in what posture?, on what command?, facing what
direction?, is she allowed to move when a fish is flopping near by about to
be landed? what command releases her to get out? before you and other
humans, or after? etc etc ... decide BEFORE the first time she gets in one
( on dry ground so it ain't too scary ;-) and train basics BEFORE that day
too ( say the 'down' command, )

The more detailed a picture of your ideal dog you get in your minds eye the
better off you are .. and for ALL her tasks ... decide NOW what areas of the
house she can access, what furniture she can climb on, and be consistent
from "Day One." ( oh, and those urgent 3AM calls from her will require a
trip outside and be truly urgent ;-)

If you have questions what a 'good hunting dog" should do, try to find a
Hunt Test to go see, you'll get some ideas, but, mainly, decide for yourself
.... each hunter has different needs and desires ( why I hate training gun
dogs and prefer the much more demanding work of trial dogs where, at least,
I'm certain what the goal is in advance )

2) The more steps you can break down getting from where you are... to where
you want to be, ...the better. Much like my RosettaStone,, the steps
should be nearly invisible, ie "seemless" to the student. Simple example
.... she should learn to sit/stay while you walk away 2 feet before you try
4 feet !!

Doh, you say! But assuming a dog understands what it really doesn't is
the single biggest cause of training problems. I've seen guys ( henceforth
referred to as 'morons' ) that couldn't even get Fido to sit stay in the
backyard during minor distractions, erupt in fury when Fido broke to shot
out hunting, thinking the poor beast understood 'stay" ... each tiny step
is a NEW step to a dog ... they do NOT extrapolate well ... remember that
to keep things pleasant ( I wrote part of a book one time, to be
called "A Pleasant Journey" about training ... the title suggests my
philosophy ( although I'm very demanding and use an e-collar ) and training
CAN be very pleasant for both animals involved, 99.8% of the time, if you
keep progress seemless and demands consistent

3) While training, look at your dog constantly at the same time keeping a
mental image of what you're aiming for, in your mind. IF your efforts are
making the real dog look a little more like that ideal, continue ( only has
to be a little each day ... another way to say seemless steps ... but a
little is essential ) .

BUT, if not, do NOT continue to do the same old thing, over and over
(regardless if it's in the book or not ) ... invent something new, or look
for a new added 'step,' a new way to try and help her understand both what
you want and that she must do it. "More of the same" when the "same"
isn't working is **** poor dog training or other form of leadership .. Don't
be a Republican. G

4) If you have specific questions or problems ( remember I specialzed in
Field Trial retrievers, we recently got my first 'pet/ house dog' in 50
years .. my 'general' training experience is limited ) .. feel free to
ask,



Larry L

OH ... one thing ... a hunting dog should NEVER be allowed to jump on
anybody ... period, no exceptions, not in your house, not when she's glad
you're home from work, NEVER ... a 12 gauge and a jumping dog is a bad mix

Larry L wrote:
"Ken Fortenberry" wrote:
Any advice or pointers appreciated.

Consistency is far more important than specific 'method' ... attitude
(trainer's ) is more important than technique
snip
OH ... one thing ... a hunting dog should NEVER be allowed to jump on
anybody ... period, no exceptions, not in your house, not when she's glad
you're home from work, NEVER ... a 12 gauge and a jumping dog is a bad mix

Thanks Larry. She will be a gun dog, both upland and waterfowl
retriever but she'll also have a dog bed in front of the fireplace,
free access to the couch and our bed upstairs. (Training a dog is
a piece of cake compared to training a wife. ;-)

We did OK with the basic obedience training with Kipper, he was
smart and we were kind and consistent. The instructors at the
dog training club were impressed that a hound dog could be trained
much at all. (Prejudice is what I call it. ;-) But a few roffians
have met Kipper and can attest that he was pretty well behaved.

I guess I'm just freaking out at having my first "hunting dog"
to train. I hope my new puppy is of the forgiving sort.

--
Ken Fortenberry