OT GM bailout

In article
,
"~^ beancounter ~^" wrote:

" major components are warrantied for life. "

life of the car, or life of the company ??

Point taken. But jeep is very profitable.

Piper wrote:
In article
,
"~^ beancounter ~^" wrote:

" major components are warrantied for life. "

life of the car, or life of the company ??

Point taken. But jeep is very profitable.

Of the Chrysler products lines, Jeep will probably survive before any of
the others. Its the only interesting thing Chrysler has (other than
some retro-styled toys).

"Dave LaCourse" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 18 Nov 2008 19:12:28 GMT, "Larry L"
wrote:

One of the great things about ROFF is that I can spout off about things I
don't know much about .... and fit right in G


I, personally, don't want to see GM 'bailed out' via my money. Let 'em
go
BK and restructure. Their business model is dead ... bury the damn
corpse,
don't keep it on a heart lung machine pretending it's still alive


YOMV


They made their deals with the unions. Now let them live with it. Do
you think the unions would give up 1 cent to help the big three
automakers. No way. The stupid spineless ceos have let the unions
run rough shod over them for as long as I can remember. AND, Detroit
makes crap to boot.

I have been employed since I was 12. Paid my taxes on time. Always
have paid my bills and have paid my own way since I was 18. There are
millions of folks just like me. We have had two or three mortgages
in our lifetimes and have never missed a payment. Most of the same
people have saved for their future so they will not become a dredge on
society. I have been saving since I was a E4 in the Navy, making but
a few dollars every week just so I would not be a dredge on society.
Many of us have served our country faithfully. and some of us still
are. Why the hell should MY taxes, OUR taxes, go to bail out
ANYTHING? I should think that those good taxpayers who have
never defaulted on a loan, have never cheated anyone, have been
faithful to their mortgage payments and to their government deserve to
be "bailed out" a helluva lot more that the automakers, aig, or any of
the banks. Screw 'em if they can't keep up. Screw the unions, Barney
Frank, Chris Dodd, et al.

And before you open your yap, Ken, eff you too.

Dave



Dave you ol' pirate...

You are being just a little too hard on the unions - you exhibit the
behavior of one who always wanted a union but never had one...

I worked for the 'guvner' and had a union and am glad I did...to the point.
But I do agree that some glaring, obvious mistakes were made...non funded
pension plans, lack of market competition...and so forth

....but they only thing to blame is the love of mamon...or is in
mammon....anyhow, if you get it fresh at the farmers market it's not too
bad...

john

On Sat, 22 Nov 2008 18:59:48 -0800, "asadi"
wrote:

Dave you ol' pirate...

You are being just a little too hard on the unions - you exhibit the
behavior of one who always wanted a union but never had one...

I worked for the 'guvner' and had a union and am glad I did...to the point.
But I do agree that some glaring, obvious mistakes were made...non funded
pension plans, lack of market competition...and so forth



John, I grew up with unions. Every kid in my neighborhood had a
father or mother working for the unions. Westinghouse in East
Springfield was the big employer. My dad was a Teamster and HAD to
belong to the union or he didn't work. Today the state is a right to
work state. It wasn't then. My dad got absolutely nothing from the
Teamsters except a pin each year saying how many safe miles he'd
driven. They took his money and gave him a pin. Who benefited from
all that dues? Hoffa and his hacks. Not my dad.

Westinghouse would go on strike every Nov/Dec. They'd be unemployed
for five or six weeks and finally settle the strike for pennies
more/hour. I can remember my dad shaking his head and calling them
fools. The only people that made out were the union bigwigs. The
little people certainly didn't. I have hated the unions ever since.

I've never worked for a union shop (thankfully), but I have had to do
business with them when I worked for Honeywell Electro Ops (infra red
dectectors). I worked on the AN/AAD5 FLIR and had to take a couple of
units to a factory in a nearby town for vibration testing. What a
cluster **** that was. What would have taken me two maybe three hours
to do took TWO days by these union heehaws. It brought back memories
from my childhood.

Glad you liked/needed them. Guess that's why we have chocolate and
vanilla. If GM can renegotiate the union contracts, get rid of the
ridiculous "job bank", build a better product at lower cost than
Toyota, Nissan, Honda, Subaru, Hyndai, and yes, even Kia, they may
survive after restructuring. But right now, they need to be shot and
put out of their misery. They shoot horses, don't they?

" wrote in news:39f198cc-88ac-40a6-
:

It's a demographics problem, the government has been aware of and
ignoring
it for decades. Greenspan had been warning about the unsustainability
of
the SS and healthcare systems since the early 1980s.

Republicans and Democrats alike have been feeding at the trough of the
short-term surplus.
- Ken


When the Republicans address the notion that they handed Bush the reins and
watched as he ****ed up everything he touched, they can start trying to be
a viable party again.

--
Scott
Reverse name to reply

On 22-Nov-2008, Dave LaCourse wrote:

If GM can renegotiate the union contracts, get rid of the
ridiculous "job bank", build a better product at lower cost than
Toyota, Nissan, Honda, Subaru, Hyndai, and yes, even Kia, they may
survive after restructuring. But right now, they need to be shot and
put out of their misery. They shoot horses, don't they?


The foreign auto makers are so far superior to the GM autos that there is no
way, in this lifetime , i would ever by another US built Ford or GM
We buy Toyotas
IWe have a 1997 Ford F250 pickup as a farm vehicle
Not the best even when it was new!
We will buy a Tundra when this dies.

Good riddance to GM

A bailout?
A total waste of money anda crime perpertrated upon the US taxpayer!
The unions esp the UAW have long ago sold out and become ineffective and
even counter productuve

If this happens
I will secede forom the union

IMP
This is the kind of industry that should go to foreign shores

Fred

On Sun, 23 Nov 2008 18:32:38 GMT, "Fred"
wrote:

This is the kind of industry that should go to foreign shores


Whoooooa, big hoss. Don't say that. Fortenberry and Barnard will
never speak to you again. d;o)

On Nov 19, 8:36*am, Scott Seidman wrote:
"Calif Bill" wrote innews:0tednZVQzsW9P77UnZ2dnUVZ_uydnZ2d@earthlink. com:

The major difference is the GM has about 2 retirees for every worker.
Those payments about double the labor costs.

One would think that a responsible company would properly endow pension
plans as they went along. *Isn't that the only tenable way to do this??

--
Scott
Reverse name to reply

That presumes management responsibility & failure, but as we all know,
it's really all the unions' fault.


My father's company did marketing research for GM during the 60's and
70's. It was his account, so he had to go to Detroit every once in a
while to meet with senior execs. He always scheduled meetings for the
morning, because he learned pretty quickly that once these guys went
out for lunch the rest of the day was shot. And trying to tell them
that anything substantive should be changed in what GM produced and
sold and how it went about doing so (other than trying some new twist
on an ad campaign) was ****ing in the wind.

On Nov 19, 12:00*pm, " wrote:
...... *Boomers weren't smart enough to save
for their retirement.


All 80 million of them, eh?

On Nov 19, 4:39*pm, " wrote:

Health care is only a part of the problem. *Having the government
in charge of healthcare scares me about as much as having them
in charge of my retirement.


You got a good point there, we shoulda let Bear Sterns run the SS
system, we'd all be in much better shape.