Trout behavior

Ok, first of all, I'm not a fly guy... but I am an 'ultralight' tackle
guy. I have a question about trout - and thier behavior - and I
thought I'd ask the 'trout experts' instead of the general fishing
public.

I have been hitting the local streams (rockland county NY) - stocked
every year with browns, brookies and rainbows for a couple of years
now.

It's been a cool spring. I started this year in mid June using small
spinners, and was very happy, catching several trout in a couple hours
at a time.

However, the month of July has been a different story. The
temperature has risen considerably. I went out on a couple of these
days, but soon realized that it was futile. I would cast upstream and
pull though, slowly, exploring pockets and riffles that had yeilded
before, but came up empty. As I made my way upstream, I could see
trout scatter in all directions. They were there, but were just not
interested.

I wrote it off to the heat. I tried another time until darkness, but
no luck. The other day I thought I had an opening. It had been
raining all night, but had stopped in the AM. The sky was cloudy and
the air was damp and cool. I headed out. The water was noticably
cooler but remained crystal clear. I spent the first two hours under
overcast skies, with no results. They were acting the same - hiding
under rocks. After a couple weeks, I began to remember their
hideouts. I changed lures, went as light as I could, tried worms,
etc.

Eventually I crept up to one of the larger pools and stared down
trough the clear water. In there had to be 20 trout all swimming
around and around the pool, as if playing some sort of "trout soccer".
Back and forth they went, swarming, and bumping into each other.
There were some mighty fine looking fish in there but I couldn't
interest them in anything. Eventally I even stopped limiting my
movments, because they seemed oblivious to my presence.

As I moved on, I continued to see fish, ignore my lures, plastic
thingies, worms, etc. Strangly enough, as the sun began to break
through and the fog fall away, I caught a nice 10 inch brown.

So I guess my questions are two-fold. Any idea what these fish
"soccer" fish were doing? And also, what kind of strategies would you
guys reccomend for the summer months?

Thanks,
Sam Matthews

So I guess my questions are two-fold. Any idea what these fish
"soccer" fish were doing? And also, what kind of strategies would you
guys reccomend for the summer months?

Thanks,
Sam Matthews

Match the hatch, and if that doesnt work, throw a big weighted black
wollybugger right in the face of the fish. Woolies always catch fish. But
then again. Its hard to fish flies on spinning tackle. /


Thank you
Thomas

On 6 Jul 2004 08:48:15 -0700, (Sam Matthews) wrote:

Ok, first of all, I'm not a fly guy... but I am an 'ultralight' tackle
guy. I have a question about trout - and thier behavior - and I
thought I'd ask the 'trout experts' instead of the general fishing
public.

I have been hitting the local streams (rockland county NY) - stocked
every year with browns, brookies and rainbows for a couple of years
now.

It's been a cool spring. I started this year in mid June using small
spinners, and was very happy, catching several trout in a couple hours
at a time.

However, the month of July has been a different story. The
temperature has risen considerably. I went out on a couple of these
days, but soon realized that it was futile. I would cast upstream and
pull though, slowly, exploring pockets and riffles that had yeilded
before, but came up empty. As I made my way upstream, I could see
trout scatter in all directions. They were there, but were just not
interested.

I wrote it off to the heat. I tried another time until darkness, but
no luck. The other day I thought I had an opening. It had been
raining all night, but had stopped in the AM. The sky was cloudy and
the air was damp and cool. I headed out. The water was noticably
cooler but remained crystal clear. I spent the first two hours under
overcast skies, with no results. They were acting the same - hiding
under rocks. After a couple weeks, I began to remember their
hideouts. I changed lures, went as light as I could, tried worms,
etc.

Eventually I crept up to one of the larger pools and stared down
trough the clear water. In there had to be 20 trout all swimming
around and around the pool, as if playing some sort of "trout soccer".
Back and forth they went, swarming, and bumping into each other.
There were some mighty fine looking fish in there but I couldn't
interest them in anything. Eventally I even stopped limiting my
movments, because they seemed oblivious to my presence.

As I moved on, I continued to see fish, ignore my lures, plastic
thingies, worms, etc. Strangly enough, as the sun began to break
through and the fog fall away, I caught a nice 10 inch brown.

So I guess my questions are two-fold. Any idea what these fish
"soccer" fish were doing? And also, what kind of strategies would you
guys reccomend for the summer months?

Thanks,
Sam Matthews
Buy a fly rod and start to fish nymphs. Not to be a smart ass, there
just aren't any spinning lures to my knowledge that adequately imitate
nymphs. Something else to remember is that the water can be too hot
for trout to feed.They actually enter a torpid state. Also anything
above 70 degress or so puts any trout you do catch at risk of death by
stress. Better to give the salmonids a rest during hot weather and
find some bass.


g.c.

In article ,
says...

Eventually I crept up to one of the larger pools and stared down
trough the clear water. In there had to be 20 trout all swimming
around and around the pool, as if playing some sort of "trout soccer".
Back and forth they went, swarming, and bumping into each other.

So I guess my questions are two-fold. Any idea what these fish
"soccer" fish were doing? And also, what kind of strategies would you
guys reccomend for the summer months?


Next time you are at the stream, try spending some time picking up
rocks and weeds from the stream bottom and look real close at the
bugs crawling around on them (this is especially fun if you have
assistance from a small child or two.) In a typical trout stream,
you will probably find several different kinds of mayfly nymphs,
caddis larvae, stonefly nymphs, dragonfly and damselfly nymphs,
scuds (freshwater shrimp), crayfish, snails, assorted small worms
and leeches, and probably lots of other stuff too. When you see trout
feeding on or near the bottom, they are probably feeding on any or all
of the above. Sometimes they key in on one particular type of insect,
and it takes some experimenting to find out exactly what they want.

In addition to aquatic insects, there will probably be a lot of
ants, beetles, grasshoppers, crickets, etc. drifting in the current.
An ant or a beetle imitation is always a good fly to try in the summer.

One thing all these have in common is that they are small. Too small
to cast with a spinning rod -- so you will either have to learn to
fly fish (which isn't nearly as hard as it looks,) or use a casting
bubble or some split shot on your line.

You can find all kinds of good books to teach you how to fly fish for
trout, and a lot of the information would be useful to a spinfisher as
well. "Prospecting for Trout" by Tom Rosenbauer has a lot of good ideas
on what to do when the fish aren't actively feeding.

Kevin

On Tue, 6 Jul 2004, Sam Matthews wrote:

So I guess my questions are two-fold. Any idea what these fish
"soccer" fish were doing?

Are these fish that were stocked this year? I've seen stocked fish
eagerly snap at anything you throw at them for the first couple of days.
Then they get a little more selective. Eventually the little guys
seem to just huddle up in anticipation of starvation.

And also, what kind of strategies would you
guys reccomend for the summer months?

Deep water. Fish early in the AM. Try live minnows if it is legal. I
like the aberdeen style, light wire Tru-turn cam shank hooks for this sort
of use. Hook them lightly below the dorsal fin. Do not use minnow
species which are not native to the watershed.

You could try spending about 12 continuous hours watching those fish in
the pool. They may begin feeding at certain times. Turn over some rocks
upstream from the pool and look for bugs. Throw some of these bugs into
the pool and see if you can get a response.

__________________________________________________ _____________________
\ Mu Young Lee
remove all dashes and underscores in reply address

Sam Matthews wrote:

So I guess my questions are two-fold. Any idea what these fish
"soccer" fish were doing?

Spawning?

And also, what kind of strategies would you
guys reccomend for the summer months?

Terrestrial dry flies.

--
Cut "to the chase" for my email address.

On 6 Jul 2004 08:48:15 -0700, (Sam Matthews) wrote:
Sam

I've seen this "soccer" behaviour before in young stockers who were
chasing large hatching mayflies. Since you're not into fly fishing,
you may not have noticed a hatch in progress. In my case, I've seen
upwards of five or six trout racing around a pool, trying to be the
first to the bug. Obviously, they were disturbing all of the other
fish there as well. Since I was viewing them from a shallow angle
rather than from above, they at first appeared to be one large fish,
till I recognized them as being five or six small ones constantly
jostling for position.

When trout are keyed in one one bug, they tend not to feed on anything
else so we have to "match the hatch" to have a chance. And of course,
trout can get lockjaw just like any other fish.

You can try casting a dry fly on ultralight spinning gear by using a
casting float or bubble but your odds of success are not going to be
great unless you get very lucky. Fly fishing gear evolved
specifically because it was the best for this sort of job. If you
want to go after these fish on a regular basis, I'd suggest you check
in to getting the right gear for the job.



Peter

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Thanks to all responses. That's some great stuff to chew on. I look
foward to spending some time looking for bugs, nymphs, fuzzy boogers,
etc.

I know that spinning is not fly-fishing, but with the setup I use, I
feel that it's "almost" there. I have a 5 foot super ultra-light rod
and reel. On that I have braided 4lbs test - which is about as thin
as a spider's web. No, I can't cast a weightless fly, but almost. I
have several books on fly fishing, and will definately get into it
sooner than later. I maxed out the "hobby" budget this year with the
purchase of a fishing kayak.

I readily admit that I have no idea how you folks arrive at "matching
the hatch". I've spent a considerable amount of time on the water,
and I've never seen anything hatching or swarming - save gnats. How
do you guys figure that stuff out? Honestly, I thougt earthworms was
the ultimate trout bait. I was wrong

I agree that when it's too hot it's probably better to leave them
alone and go torture the bluegills and perch...make fish-sticks out of
them. Kids love'm!

Sam

Thanks to all responses. That's some great stuff to chew on. I look
foward to spending some time looking for bugs, nymphs, fuzzy boogers,
etc.

I know that spinning is not fly-fishing, but with the setup I use, I
feel that it's "almost" there. I have a 5 foot super ultra-light rod
and reel. On that I have braided 4lbs test - which is about as thin
as a spider's web. No, I can't cast a weightless fly, but almost. I
have several books on fly fishing, and will definately get into it
sooner than later. I maxed out the "hobby" budget this year with the
purchase of a fishing kayak.

I readily admit that I have no idea how you folks arrive at "matching
the hatch". I've spent a considerable amount of time on the water,
and I've never seen anything hatching or swarming - save gnats. How
do you guys figure that stuff out? Honestly, I thougt earthworms was
the ultimate trout bait. I was wrong

I agree that when it's too hot it's probably better to leave them
alone and go torture the bluegills and perch...make fish-sticks out of
them. Kids love'm!

Sam

Sam Matthews wrote:

... Honestly, I thougt earthworms was
the ultimate trout bait. I was wrong
...

No you weren't. For most of us fly fishing isn't about using
"the ultimate bait." As for what fly fishing IS about, we all
figure that out in our own way. Try it, you'll like it.

--
Ken Fortenberry