TR: The Swede and the Yankee do New Zealand

Roger We saw around 20 fish from lb5 up to lb15... We got totally
Roger skunked. Even the guide said we did everything right, but to no
Roger avail.

Hi Roger and Myron,

Sounds like you're having a great time and lots of excitement.

As for the nymphing problems... hmm. I'm just throwing these around
for practice and fun, I'm not trying to say you haven't tried these
yet.
- Try the Leisenring lift. Should be absolutely deadly since you can
see the fish.
- Take a net and get a sample of the insects.
- If dead drifting doesn't work, try fishing from upstream. This could
be difficult with the clear water, though. Use a sink tip or enough
lead to get the fly down to the feeding level. Try different
retrieve (swimming) patterns.

Well, those are the first things that come to mind.

Your TRs do make me think once again about our (me and some Finnish
friends) plans to visit NZ. I myself don't mind fishing without
catching big fish, but some of my friends do mind. So while I've heard
that the scene and the fish in NZ are amazing, I have also already
heard earlier that _catching_ the fish them can very
difficult. Looking at your TRs from this point of view, you are past
day 5 and even with
- some prior information
- the climbing and bushwhacking you have done
- a guide
- the skills (I've seen Roger cast),
the largest fish you have landed so far have been lb2-lb2.5
(IIRC). Some would qualify that as pretty difficult fishing.

--
Jarmo Hurri

Commercial email countermeasures included in header email
address. Remove all garbage from header email address when replying,
or just use .

On 1 Feb 2006 23:19:29 -0800, "angler" wrote:

Hi,

I don't know how to describe what I've seen today without you guys
thinking that I'm lying.

snip

Sounds like you guys are having a great time and getting some shots at good
fish. Can't ask for *much* better than that. g Wish I was there, but your
excellent TR's will have to do. Can't wait to see your pictures.
--
Charlie...
http://www.chocphoto.com

"angler" wrote in message
oups.com...
Hi,

I don't know how to describe what I've seen today without you guys
thinking that I'm lying.
We employed a guide today. This guide showed us what it means to sight
fish in a NZ stream with big browns.


We saw around 20 fish from lb5 up to lb15 (one rainbow and the rest
browns) and only a handfull more but smaller. The largest one of those
I had the pleasure of trying for, and let me tell you, it looked like a
friggin' atlantic salmon in size. The feeling, approaching that brown
still sends shivers down my spine.

McIntosh sympathizes---sounds like my experience-- in frustration in trying
to catch one of those submarines I finally hired a guide for 1/2 day.
A perfect cast, a hook up, a downstream run [joe and fish] a breakoff as
guide tries to net the monster with a net about 1/2 the size of the fish!!!
Having seen the Swede" cast I'm sure you will begin to catch soon. Are you
going to South Island.? Drive four miles up [?] river thru the sheep
farm--hike a couple of miles up beside big fast stream- watch really
monster big browns spook away from bank--- you might see one with my
leader, tippett, and hook flowing behind him!!

Thanks for posting these reports guys! You'll obviously keep trying.
What the heck are those fish eating? Are there any bugs in the air?
It seems like there must be mayflies around because of the success
you've had with the copper john. Maybe smaller and buggier would work
on the bigger fish, i.e. size 18 PT with no bead and no flash. They
could be real selective to drift and maybe smaller tippet is the ticket
too. Of course I have no idea and you guys have probably already tried
those things and many many more. It's fun to be an armchair
quarterback though. When I get home after a humiliating trip I can
always think of things I should have tried but didn't. Is flourocarbon
legal in NZ? (G) bh

Nice to hear you are enjoying yourselves. Keep up the reports.

TL
MC

Yes flourocarbon is legal in NZ


--
Tony Bishop
www.bishfish.co.nz
New Zealand

"riverman"

Well, once again I guess I'm in the front line running for "arsehole of the
year" award on ROFF.

I had my time planned to get away from work and spend some time with the
guys but it just didn't pan out. My wife told me the guys had rung but
didn't leave a number and by the time I left the ranch (No cellphone
coverage) and got a contact number they had left. So we never met and never
fished. I am grateful to Sean Andrews at the Fly and Gun Shop in Taupo for
looking after you both and wish I had been able to get away from the people
I fished with to spend some time you with you, hopefully next time. Geeez I
feel like a ****head about not being able to link up.

Following your trip reports it sounds like you had a great time and the info
you got was spot on and I've said it here before, be very careful in taking
information on fly-fishing from New Zealand locals because most of them
haven't got a freaking clue if you take them away from the stream mouths at
night and spawning run fish in the daytime. They will talk about Taupo
tributaries and the "resident" fish they hold and it's all just waffle...
you got your best fishing away from there as your reports outline and that
is exactly how it is... Mohaka, Waipunga etc exactly the places to be and
keep away from Taupo in Summer, it's ok but there are far better options as
you found out, the any reason the locals continue with that crap in the
summer is because they don't know where else to go or the sight of a big
fish caught at 11 o'clock at night is considered a triumph... there is
plenty of dry fly action or nymph at sighted fish in pristine conditions if
you know your stuff to make all that rivermouth night time eight weight
stuff redundant.

To Willi, you are 100% correct the fish do get bigger in the headwaters here
and at odds with else where in the world where they get smaller. The reason
is simply water temperature. Our fish get big because they grow at their
optimal rate throughout 12 months of the year. This isn't supposition, this
is fact based on scientific research by our fisheries managers. The
headwaters are the best environment for trout because although alpine they
still do not freeze in winter and do not become too hot in winter so they
are perfect trout environment. because of this big trout will take up
residence and chase everything else out. In other parts of the world,
outside of spring and fall, these areas are not perfect environs and the
bigger fish will move too look for cooler or warmer water... hence in other
parts of the world most headwaters yield the juveniles post spawning... in
NZ the big fish live there because it is perfect throughout twelve months of
the year. The biggest fish are in the headwaters unless you want to talk
about tributary streams of big lakes where most Kiwis fish on the North
island and most true fly fishermen stay well clear of... the backcountry is
where it is at. I have posted warnings here before about listening to "run
of the mill advise" from Kiwis about fishing the north island and this
reiterates it. The best fishing is off the beaten path and not at stream
mouths in lakes at night.

If I had caught up with Roger and Myron I would have done my level best to
get them drunker than they'd ever been, walked them harder than they'd ever
walked and made them scale rock gorges like they'd ever have believe and I'd
have got them some good fishing. Fortunately they had a great man (and
friend of mine) in Sean Andrews who helped them out and I doubt they'd have
done any better if they had fished with me personally.

I regret deeply a chance to meet fellow roffians and to make personal an
electronic connection but please understand that my work is seasonal and I
was being offered work which will help keep my family for the next (quiet
work wise) few months and had to continue with that when it was there. If I
had a contact number (Prior to clearing my messages on my cellular too late)
I would have. I did e-mail them the contact number of my lodge but never got
the call.

I hope their trip was everything they wanted it to be and everything they
planned it to be and apologies to the group en-masse that I let the side
down in not being able to participate in their adventure. I doubt it would
have changed much anyway. New Zealand is a wonderful fishing destination and
it is misunderstood more by the locals than the visitor which is why I've
have posted several "warnings" here over time. I heard, loud and clear,
Myron's reference to my chance at worldwide publicity here, but I have to
reiterate at risk of starting the next round of "arsehole of the year"
voting, that I am not here to tout for work. I am a busy guide and don't
need to come to these places the get bookings and it's not why I am here. I
am here because I am a fly fisherman and I want people visiting NZ to have a
positive experience. It is so easy to not do so if you follow the wrong
advise from locals here. That might sound like BS but I hope Myron and
Roger's TR helps to put some perspective on that.

In future I hope to be more "accessible" than I was for these guys and if
anyone plans a trip to NZ. please e-mail me as I am only to happy to help
with advise. I learned from this latest trip that I should have put some
advise to paper (e-mail) ahead of time in case we didn't make contact, I
didn't think that would happen but it did.

I'm glad it appears to have all panned ojut in any case.

Regards



Clark Reid
(Arsehole of the Year)