Gudie or No Guide

salmobytes wrote:
When Bob Auger was still managing the semi-famous
DePuy Spring Creek, near Livingston MT,
he once told me he had been studying the booking/report
logs, which showed customers who hired guides averaged
(during July, when the most bugs were hatching)
11 fish per day more than customers who fished alone.

I wouldn't be a bit surprised. Surely the expertise of a guide would
be a factor; but I doubt it's a fraction of the overall difference.
What are the possible differences with vs. without a guide? Waste less
time on less productive water. Better fly selection for the conditions
encountered. I suspect there are also a number of intangibles
difficult to quantify. Do you start your day earlier? Fish later? Take
fewer breaks? Concentrate more? After all, you want to impress the
guy you're not just some newbie with an Orvis credit card.

Then there are the realities that the guide has an undeniable
expectation to ensure you catch fish, not just "enjoy the
experience", because you'll enjoy the experience more if you
don't shell out a few Franklins. So the guide will have you doing
things you might not ordinarily do, not necessarily to make you a
better fisherman, but to better your chances for numbers. And if
numbers are the measurement, the guides will win every time on average.

And speaking of averages, factor in the ambient skills of those who
hire a guide vs. those who don't. I'm not really sure which way
that would sway the numbers. To be sure, there are newbies who need a
guide and experts who prefer a guide; but my unscientific guess is that
the more aggressive "success-based" fishermen, those who spend more
time and money on the sport, are those more likely to consider their
wallet a part of their tackle box.

I don't really have a point; I'm just rambling.

Joe F.

On 27 Oct 2006 12:26:42 -0700, "rb608" wrote:

salmobytes wrote:
When Bob Auger was still managing the semi-famous
DePuy Spring Creek, near Livingston MT,
he once told me he had been studying the booking/report
logs, which showed customers who hired guides averaged
(during July, when the most bugs were hatching)
11 fish per day more than customers who fished alone.

I wouldn't be a bit surprised. Surely the expertise of a guide would
be a factor; but I doubt it's a fraction of the overall difference.
What are the possible differences with vs. without a guide? Waste less
time on less productive water. Better fly selection for the conditions
encountered. I suspect there are also a number of intangibles
difficult to quantify. Do you start your day earlier? Fish later? Take
fewer breaks? Concentrate more? After all, you want to impress the
guy you're not just some newbie with an Orvis credit card.

Then there are the realities that the guide has an undeniable
expectation to ensure you catch fish, not just "enjoy the
experience", because you'll enjoy the experience more if you
don't shell out a few Franklins. So the guide will have you doing
things you might not ordinarily do, not necessarily to make you a
better fisherman, but to better your chances for numbers. And if
numbers are the measurement, the guides will win every time on average.

And speaking of averages, factor in the ambient skills of those who
hire a guide vs. those who don't. I'm not really sure which way
that would sway the numbers. To be sure, there are newbies who need a
guide and experts who prefer a guide; but my unscientific guess is that
the more aggressive "success-based" fishermen, those who spend more
time and money on the sport, are those more likely to consider their
wallet a part of their tackle box.

I don't really have a point; I'm just rambling.

Joe F.

Ramble on, my friend :-)

Perhaps a goodly part of his answer - at least on that particular river -
might be due to the guide spotting actively feeding trout from the bank, and
guiding the cast to same.

Cheers

/daytripper

PRM wrote:
Pretty simple question.

Do you prefer to have a guide or not?

I like to hire a good guide whenever I go to new waters.
If I'm going to fish a stream for 5 or 6 days I'll hire a
guide for the first day and then fish the rest of the week
by myself. I just took a trip on the Eleven Point River in
the Missouri Ozarks intending to fish one day with the guide
and then a couple or three more by myself. The lessons I
learned about reading that river by watching the guide float
it doubtless would have saved many scratches and dings on my
canoe if I had decided to hang around and fish it again.

--
Ken Fortenberry