Speaking of yaks . . .

Peter,

I sent to Mokai for their video. Got a dvd today. I am sold on the damn
thing. The video shows it in some pretty rough water and it looks very stable.
With things like they are concerning the Rapid, I don't know whether to buy it
or not. Have to check with the Chief of Naval Ops, I guess. It could easily
climb through the Currents into Wing Dam, and upstream through Chubs, probably
all the way to the dam. Sure would open Chubs Pool which I have never really
fished heavily, and trips to The Spawning Beds could be accomplished very
quickly (15 mph) with the 6 hp 4 stroke water jet engine. No rudder to worry
about either.

Could we use in in Ontario?
Dave

http://hometown.aol.com/davplac/myhomepage/index.html

On 04 Mar 2004 22:04:08 GMT, irate (Dave LaCourse)
wrote:

Peter,

I sent to Mokai for their video. Got a dvd today. I am sold on the damn
thing. The video shows it in some pretty rough water and it looks very stable.
With things like they are concerning the Rapid, I don't know whether to buy it
or not. Have to check with the Chief of Naval Ops, I guess. It could easily
climb through the Currents into Wing Dam, and upstream through Chubs, probably
all the way to the dam. Sure would open Chubs Pool which I have never really
fished heavily, and trips to The Spawning Beds could be accomplished very
quickly (15 mph) with the 6 hp 4 stroke water jet engine. No rudder to worry
about either.

Could we use in in Ontario?
Dave

http://hometown.aol.com/davplac/myhomepage/index.html


Depends on the river, on the Saugeen, so far, yes. But that could
change.

Peter

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Dave LaCourse wrote:

I sent to Mokai for their video. Got a dvd today. I am sold on the damn
thing. The video shows it in some pretty rough water and it looks very stable.
With things like they are concerning the Rapid, I don't know whether to buy it
or not. Have to check with the Chief of Naval Ops, I guess. It could easily
climb through the Currents into Wing Dam, and upstream through Chubs, probably
all the way to the dam. Sure would open Chubs Pool which I have never really
fished heavily, and trips to The Spawning Beds could be accomplished very
quickly (15 mph) with the 6 hp 4 stroke water jet engine. No rudder to worry
about either. ...

You get up in arms when "corporate executives" want to build a condo
in the area but you don't have a problem with buzzing up and down your
favorite trout stream in a goddamn $3000 peewee jet ski ?

Remember this picture ?

http://www.flyrodreel.com/conservation112k.html

--
Ken Fortenberry

On Thu, 4 Mar 2004 01:24:33 +0100, "riverman"
wrote:



Let me try, Peter, and repay you for your gentle introduction to roff a few
years ago.

First, note that kayaks have decks, and sprayskirts to keep the water out of
your lap. This applies to high-volume touring boats as well as smaller
playboats, which is not what you are interested in. This gives you an
'inside' for your gear, but it is not quickly accessible, or conducive for a
long rod. SOTs, OTOH, are like sitting on a surfboard, so there is no
'inside' for your gear: it sits on top with you. That makes it easy to get
at, but also easy to fall out or for stuff to fall overboard.

Kayaks turn over pretty easily, and beginners always swim when they do.
This goes for SOTs also, so expect to lose some fishing gear when that
happens. Kayaks are inherenly less stable than canoes, ride lower in the
water so they swamp easier if you don't have the skirt on, are harder to
steer straight, and get very antsy in moving water. Working the blade can be
a bit uninstinctual, especially if you are panicking. You also sit closer to
the surface, have no place to put your paddle when you are casting (and
having it drift off is a bad thing), they are quite hard to get in and out
of when you are on a steep shore, and you cannot take a **** out of them
easily.

Canoes, OTOH, are very stable, do not tip over easily (at least, as easily
as a yak), you can stand to cast if you want, have a spacious 'inside' for
your gear, including a fully-rigged rod, beach easily, can be turned over
for a table, and you can take a friend. You can put your paddle and gear in
it quickly and easily, can carry lunch, your gear won't wash overboard if
you drop it, and you can even carry extra rods easily.

The only real advantage to a yak is the weight for putting it on the roof of
your car. However, some canoes (kevlar ones) are incredibly lightweight,
although they are incredibly expensive, and there are many tricks for
loading any canoe on a roof.

Your best bet is to try each one a few times. I could not imagine trying to
fish out of a yak, nor could I imagine any portable boat more appropriate
and versatile than a canoe.

--riverman


Thanks for all of the info (though I don't remember what I did to
deserve it. )

I haven't made up my mind by a long shot. I've noticed that even some
of the cheaper canoes on these links are lighter than the yaks
(Royalex Vagabond at 42 lbs. vs. a RIDE SOT at 58 lbs.) The SOT or
one of the small canoes would probably be the choice - whatever works
for me. The prices are about the same.

We'll see what happens when Greg takes me for my dunkin'.





Peter

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"Peter Charles" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 4 Mar 2004 01:24:33 +0100, "riverman"
wrote:



Let me try, Peter, and repay you for your gentle introduction to roff a
few
years ago.


Thanks for all of the info (though I don't remember what I did to
deserve it. )



Let me refresh your memory, then.
http://makeashorterlink.com/?T2E612D97 and go to the top of the thread.

--riverman

On Thu, 4 Mar 2004 22:15:09 +0100, "riverman"
wrote:


"Peter Charles" wrote in message
.. .
On Thu, 4 Mar 2004 01:24:33 +0100, "riverman"
wrote:



Let me try, Peter, and repay you for your gentle introduction to roff a
few
years ago.


Thanks for all of the info (though I don't remember what I did to
deserve it. )



Let me refresh your memory, then.
http://makeashorterlink.com/?T2E612D97 and go to the top of the thread.

--riverman


ahh yes, I think it was the last line that was the clincher.

ta



Peter

turn mailhot into hotmail to reply

Visit The Streamer Page at http://www.mountaincable.net/~pcharl...ers/index.html

"riverman" wrote in message
...

"Peter Charles" wrote in message
om...
Ken Fortenberry wrote in message
. com...
Peter Charles wrote:

... It would seem to beat the canoe alternative.

Why ? I mean for people of close to average proportions who can
walk and chew gum at the same time, why does a sit-on-top kayak
beat a solo canoe ?

Getting in and out, control, ease of beaching, weathercocking, ease of
putting on top of car, won't swamp. I'm neither an expert at canoes
or yaks but given my physical limitations, a yak seems better. I'm
prepared to be proven wrong.

Let me try, Peter, and repay you for your gentle introduction to roff a
few
years ago.

First, note that kayaks have decks, and sprayskirts to keep the water out
of
your lap. This applies to high-volume touring boats as well as smaller
playboats, which is not what you are interested in. This gives you an
'inside' for your gear, but it is not quickly accessible, or conducive for
a
long rod. SOTs, OTOH, are like sitting on a surfboard, so there is no
'inside' for your gear: it sits on top with you. That makes it easy to get
at, but also easy to fall out or for stuff to fall overboard.

Kayaks turn over pretty easily, and beginners always swim when they do.
This goes for SOTs also, so expect to lose some fishing gear when that
happens. Kayaks are inherenly less stable than canoes, ride lower in the
water so they swamp easier if you don't have the skirt on, are harder to
steer straight, and get very antsy in moving water. Working the blade can
be
a bit uninstinctual, especially if you are panicking. You also sit closer
to
the surface, have no place to put your paddle when you are casting (and
having it drift off is a bad thing), they are quite hard to get in and out
of when you are on a steep shore, and you cannot take a **** out of them
easily.

Canoes, OTOH, are very stable, do not tip over easily (at least, as easily
as a yak), you can stand to cast if you want, have a spacious 'inside' for
your gear, including a fully-rigged rod, beach easily, can be turned over
for a table, and you can take a friend. You can put your paddle and gear
in
it quickly and easily, can carry lunch, your gear won't wash overboard if
you drop it, and you can even carry extra rods easily.

The only real advantage to a yak is the weight for putting it on the roof
of
your car. However, some canoes (kevlar ones) are incredibly lightweight,
although they are incredibly expensive, and there are many tricks for
loading any canoe on a roof.

Your best bet is to try each one a few times. I could not imagine trying
to
fish out of a yak, nor could I imagine any portable boat more appropriate
and versatile than a canoe.

--riverman


I have a Klepper Aerius that doesn't turn over easily. You can in fact set
on the gunwals and it will not flip over, you may fall out but it will
remain upright. When your done paddling it knocks down into three bags
which fit in the trunk of the car.

Cannoes are just another way to take a bath, alway carry some soap and a
towel ( in a plastic bag) -never miss the opportunity for a bath.
Canoes are inherently unstable if you need more proof heres some heavy
physics for you.
http://ntl.bts.gov/DOCS/narmain/naintro.html

In a canoe you cg is to high and the angle phee in the diagram goe into the
runaway mode damm quick.
If you want historical references goggle up the Vasa, the Mary Rose, Crab
boats in Alaska or numerous 3 rd world ferry capsizing tragedys.

"Ken Fortenberry" wrote in message
om...
Peter Charles wrote:

... It would seem to beat the canoe alternative.

Why ? I mean for people of close to average proportions who can
walk and chew gum at the same time, why does a sit-on-top kayak
beat a solo canoe ?

--
Ken Fortenberry

"B J Conner" wrote in message
In a canoe you cg is to high and the angle phee in the diagram goe into
the
runaway mode damm quick.

Stop, stop; you're killin' me. :-)

Joe F.

On Thu, 04 Mar 2004 02:58:38 GMT, "rb608"
wrote:


"B J Conner" wrote in message
In a canoe you cg is to high and the angle phee in the diagram goe into
the
runaway mode damm quick.

Stop, stop; you're killin' me. :-)

"Just when I think you've said the stupidest thing ever, you keep talking"

/daytripper (Hank Hill, used without permission. Eff 'im ;-)