TR

On Fri, 23 Nov 2007 04:41:14 GMT, Ken Fortenberry
wrote:

daytripper wrote:

I'm sorry, I can't let you have the last words on this topic if they are going
to be dishonest. Not after all these years of being the target of your abuse.

I paid Ken for the room at the Fall Ball, he confirmed it for all to see. ...

Nobody at Fall Ball paid for a room. The total cost of the lodging
was divided by the number of *beds*, not by the number of rooms. I
don't exactly remember why you two ended up in the same room but I
can confirm that both of you paid for your beds.

If this longstanding animus between you two is in any way related
to confusion over room vs. bed at Fall Ball then I'm the one who
should apologize for not being more clear.

And this just goes to show why I will never again be a Clavemeister.

I guess I was the inaccurate culprit, I should have said "bed" and not "room".

But let us be honest and realistic: this has nothing to do with Dave's
problem...and shouldn't have anything to do with your Clavemeister status -
past or future.

Cheers

/daytripper

On Thu, 22 Nov 2007 23:14:11 -0600, wrote:

On Fri, 23 Nov 2007 03:51:36 GMT, Ken Fortenberry
wrote:

Mike wrote:
... Mr.Fortenberry,

I can not change what is, or what has been, but I can at least attempt
to change your perceptions of it, indeed, I constantly try to change
my own, as otherwise I would learn nothing. ...

You're not gonna change my perception of your vicious, foul-mouthed
personal attacks. It's like I said in another thread, you ride the
prevailing winds of roff and at this holiday moment the winds are
blowing towards sweetness and light. I'm guessing it won't be long
before sweetness and light is forgotten and you revert to form.

Now, see 'tripper, here's where a "grow the **** up" is not only
appropriate, but well-earned and much-deserved...so, on that note:

Ken, grow the **** up.

YFCOTGC,
R

First, Richard, I never said "grow the **** up". Accuracy counts.

Second, you continue to treat these things as some form of sport. Your
constant interjections into the Mike/Dave/Ken affair, in particular, are
particularly telling in that regard, and you really ought to consider they are
not taken as humorous, but instead, as goading.

Third, that is why I said - and you deserve - "grow up", to you...

/daytripper

On Thu, 22 Nov 2007 23:22:33 -0600, wrote:

On Thu, 22 Nov 2007 17:53:58 -0500, Dave LaCourse
wrote:

On Thu, 22 Nov 2007 13:10:05 -0500, daytripper
wrote:

Do you really not understand, Dave?

Mike has never rained the litany of foul, hate-filled lying invectives you
have laid on me for years.

But yet he is as guilty as any for the hate-filled lies published on
these pages. You and I have had our differences and it all stems from
those two claves. I do not appreciate paying for the room both times,
nor for all of the gas except one fill-up. There were *no* lies,
Dave, concerning those claves, and you know it. I talked to Tom Brown
and he confirms the amount of beer we bought for *everyone*, not just
you.

That, in all its simplicity, is the difference...

Right. I get the blame for all the hate on roff and your buddies Ken,
Wolfgang, and Mikey go scott free. Like I said, your slip is showing.

Hope your wife and family enjoy the start of the Holidays...

Had the kids and all the grandkids plus a fishing buddy and his wife
for dinner. Thank you for your good will sentiment. Hope you and
yours are well.

Well, **** me running...hey, it's a start...now grow some hair, kiss
each other, and think about if a tank of gas or whatever other
chicken-**** nonsense was worth it...and if either of you can honestly
say "yes," print this post out and show it to someone who will have the
common sense to slap the **** out of you...

HTH,
R

Call me a cynic, but I sincerely doubt you have or had any intentions of HTH.

And, no, this had nothing to do with gasoline, and if you have two brain cells
still functioning, you know that as well as anyone...

/daytripper

Dave LaCourse wrote:
On Thu, 22 Nov 2007 23:26:45 -0500, daytripper
wrote:


I paid Ken for the room at the Fall Ball, he confirmed it for all to see.
I paid you for the room at the Spring Fling, *you* confirmed it for all to see
- though you trimmed the truth there as well, claiming I didn't pay you the
whole price.


If you paid Fortenberry, *why* did you answer "no" when I asked you if
you paid? You didn't pay Walt for the room at the Spring Fling, or at
least that is what you said. That room cost me $250; I asked you for
$100 and you paid. It seems, therefore, that you owe Walt $250, and I
owe you $100.

That makes no sense at all.

As long as I've known you, LaCourse, which is some number of years,
you've been embroiled in these petty squabbles about who owes what to
whom (always you, it seems).

My advice to anyone in ROFF who ever has the misfortune to share with
LaCourse a room or a meal or gasoline or anything else that requires
dough -- get a notarized receipt.

--
Cut "to the chase" for my email address.

On Fri, 23 Nov 2007 11:04:06 -0500, Dave LaCourse
wrote:

On Thu, 22 Nov 2007 23:26:45 -0500, daytripper
wrote:

I paid Ken for the room at the Fall Ball, he confirmed it for all to see.
I paid you for the room at the Spring Fling, *you* confirmed it for all to see
- though you trimmed the truth there as well, claiming I didn't pay you the
whole price.

If you paid Fortenberry, *why* did you answer "no" when I asked you if
you paid? You didn't pay Walt for the room at the Spring Fling, or at
least that is what you said. That room cost me $250; I asked you for
$100 and you paid. It seems, therefore, that you owe Walt $250, and I
owe you $100. The beer story is true, as confirmed by Tom Brown. And
Tom will also confirm that neither of us drank five cases of beer. He
recently called me about that. This was after you accused me of
drinking "your" beer. A beer! A buck? You would deny me a beer?

Driving down we could not find a hotel because of graduation exercises
at colleges along the I81 corridor. So we stopped at my
brother-in-law's place. Without it, we would have spent a miserable
night in the car. While we were only two or three hours to clave
central, both of us were too beat to continue - if you remember it was
about 3 or so in the a.m., and we had been driving about 11 hours.
You didn't seem to have much trouble falling asleep if I remember
correctly.

There are no lies, Dave. I know you would like everyone to think I am
the villian in this story, but I was and still am the victim of that
moment and now of your lies.

Go ahead, have the last word.

Dave

Somehow I doubt there will be a last word, until one of us is pushing daisies.

I'm going to state the truth, claim by claim, below. If you ever bring this
crap up again, I will simply post the Google url to this post, and be done
with it, short and sweet, so I don't have to waste any more time than that.


We were less than two hours from the conclave, as anyone with a mapping
program could easily figure out for themselves. You were exhausted, but the
younger of us could have easily driven the rest, and told you so. And you know
that. But you didn't want to let me drive, so you made the "executive
decision" to barge in on those poor folks in the middle of the night. And, no,
I didn't fall right to sleep on that couch, I spent more time sitting on the
front stoop smoking cigarettes than I did sleeping.

You recently you came up with the bull**** claim that I was the one that
wanted to stop, to add to all the other bull**** stories you've cooked up,
YEARS after these conclaves. I'm not sure what the heck you are conceding to
on this point now, but we both know the truth. One of these days you should
simply admit it, and get it over with.


I paid what Ken asked me for the *bed* (emphasis added on Ken's behalf) at the
Fall Ball, when he asked. As I had no innate knowledge of the cost, I could
only expect he asked me for the true cost, which apparently was the case.
YEARS after the event, you cooked up the bull**** claim that I didn't pay
anything for that *bed*. Ken clearly put an end to that, and one of these days
you should simply admit this was just another one of your bull**** stories and
get it over with.


I paid what you asked me for the *bed* at the Spring Fling, when you asked. I
was prepared to pay whatever the cost of the *bed* was, but as I had no innate
knowledge of the cost, I could only expect you asked me for my fair share.

YEARS after the event, you cooked up the bull**** claim I didn't pay you
*anything* for the *bed* at the Spring Fling. Then, earlier this year, you
conceded I *did* pay you - but then you trimmed the truth by claiming I didn't
pay you what you asked. NOW you're saying I didn't pay you the full cost
because YOU DIDN'T ASK for the full cost? What the hell?

Insomuch as I specifically remember paying you $125, you're still not telling
the truth, but it sure looks like you're trying to sneak up to it. Why not end
the damned drama and just admit you were lying all this time, and get it over
with - because this latest version of your bull**** story makes no sense at
all.


Before we left Massachusetts, you promised to stay for the entire Spring
Fling, knowing I would not accompany you down there if you said otherwise.
But within minutes of Wayno's departure early in the week, you suddenly
decided you had to leave because you were "sick". That was patent bull**** -
and you were called on it by me and others. I'll never know if that was your
plan from the start, but you yourself provided ample reason to believe that
was the case, by relating your spouse's business plans for that week, and how
you felt you should have been there with her. Apparently, a promise means
little to you, something others may well take into account. We still left well
before the end of the conclave, but at least I got a couple of days of fishing
in.


As for the fricken' beer saga: I don't even know what the hell I might be
apologizing for any longer. First you said I resented you drinking one of the
beers *I* bought, which - considering my past contributions to the alcohol
pools at these events, doesn't sound like me at all. Now you are saying I
said something about you drinking one of beers *you and/or Tom* purchased.

I don't recall saying anything to you about *anything* to do with beer -
seriously or in jest, before or after your public melt-down, before or after I
stopped drinking beers at that conclave (when I came down with a mean case of
the hives). And where did "five cases of beer" come in, anyway, and what does
*that* mean? I have *no* idea what the heck you're talking about - I swear you
are becoming even more incoherent with each telling of your tales.

If I allow the absolute *worst* case possibility you have claimed on this
point, that I said something negative to you about your drinking a beer
*anyone* purchased, then *fine* - whether that happened or not - whether it
was after your ridiculous hissy fit or before - I am willing to take that
completely off the table with my apology, as in any case it is a mote of dust
on the mountain of lies you concocted in a futile attempt to somehow damage
me.


With regards to the goddamned premium gasoline mistake, it is beyond the pale
that you put such import into something that was clearly a harmless, innocent
error on my part. I hadn't owned or even driven a car that preferred premium
fuel since I sold my '67 GTO - 30 years prior to the Spring Fling. It simply
didn't register that your rather modestly engined Audi preferred premium,
there was nothing on the dash board or fuel filler door to indicate that, and
you didn't bother to mention it to me when I *offered* to fill up the car at
the very first fuel stop.

As a reading of your owner's manual allowed for the safe use of regular, at a
commensurate decrease in performance and as automatically compensated by the
engine management system - a fact that you've mentioned yourself on the Audi
usenet group - it seems your eye-popping public melt-down was, at the very
least, totally uncalled for. And in fact, probably was rooted in something
completely unrelated to gasoline, beds, beers, etc. And I think I know exactly
what that actually was. Should I say - or should you?


And now, we come to your most heinous lie of all: recently - and YEARS after
the Spring Fling - you came up with the bull**** story that I tried to get you
to put me into the Spring Fling raffle without my having provided an item to
contribute! This lie was the worst piece of filth you've cooked up to date,
and I can't even come up with the words to express my resentment, it is that
extreme. For you to conjure up such a twisted tale reveals just how sick in
the head you had become. How you can even look at yourself in the mirror
without sufficient remorse to apologize for this is as inconceivable as the
construct itself. Thank god herownself I don't have to live with that - but
you do. Enjoy?


Ok, that's the worst of it all - at the very least, more than enough.

Those that know me outright know it is not in my makeup to have acted in any
such manner as all those lies purport - and those that don't know me have
never heard *anyone* else *ever* make any similar claims against me.

Now, grow back a penis and man-up to it all, and take whatever lumps you so
richly deserve. Yeah, it might hurt a wee bit, but frankly your image here is
already about as far from stellar as it could get.

And you never know - others might throw a "Kum Ba Yah" moment for you if you
come completely clean - my bet is folks here saw through your lies as being
ridiculous on their own merits from the very start, as has been expressed by
those that insisted on bringing it up to me. At the very least you'll be able
to look yourself in the mirror without feeling ill about it all - and that has
to count for something, right?


/daytripper

On Fri, 23 Nov 2007 17:47:06 -0800, rw
wrote:

My advice to anyone in ROFF who ever has the misfortune to share with
LaCourse a room or a meal or gasoline or anything else that requires
dough -- get a notarized receipt.

Screw you, Girly Man. If you remember correctly, but I doubt you
will, I paid for the entire meal at the Henrys Fork Clave, with the
exception of you, Willi, and those people I wanted to buy dinner for.
You know nothing about the situation between Tatosian and me.

I have been more than generous over the years at *every* clave I have
attended, volunteering as clave meister (twice), hat meister (3 or 4
times, (*always* at a loss), giving away trips to Lakewood (twice),
saving Zimbo's fly rod from the midget and then giving it away in the
raffle (Dan'l got it) at Penns Creek after selling chances for it and
using that money and my own to fly Warren to the clave and pay for his
room. Buying everyone pizza at the San Juan Clave during the tying
session. Just about every clave I have been to except a couple, I
have cooked meals, and even provided a bed or two.

Now, tell me, Sister Boy San, what have you done, except bitch and
moan because Bush is president?

LaCourse

Dave LaCourse wrote:

You know nothing about the situation between Tatosian and me.

I know a great deal about it because you won't shut your pie hole about
it. I believe Daytripper's version, not only because it has the ring of
truth, but because you have a long and proven record as a lying cheapskate.

--
Cut "to the chase" for my email address.

On Fri, 23 Nov 2007 22:44:37 -0500, daytripper
wrote:

Somehow I doubt there will be a last word, until one of us is pushing daisies.

I'm going to state the truth, claim by claim, below. If you ever bring this
crap up again, I will simply post the Google url to this post, and be done
with it, short and sweet, so I don't have to waste any more time than that.


We were less than two hours from the conclave, as anyone with a mapping
program could easily figure out for themselves. You were exhausted, but the
younger of us could have easily driven the rest, and told you so. And you know
that. But you didn't want to let me drive, so you made the "executive
decision" to barge in on those poor folks in the middle of the night. And, no,
I didn't fall right to sleep on that couch, I spent more time sitting on the
front stoop smoking cigarettes than I did sleeping.

We could have left earlier that we did. I wanted to leave in the
morning and could easily have driven to Boone (I have driven non-stop
to Georgia, Western NC which are farther than Boone). It was after
two in the morning and we were both tired. Your claim that I am too
old to drive is bull****.

You recently you came up with the bull**** claim that I was the one that
wanted to stop, to add to all the other bull**** stories you've cooked up,
YEARS after these conclaves. I'm not sure what the heck you are conceding to
on this point now, but we both know the truth. One of these days you should
simply admit it, and get it over with.

We both wanted to stop. We were both tired. You probably didn't want
to stop at a motel because it would have cost you something. You were
more than happy to stop at my brother-in-laws home, humble as it was.
I got up to take a leak about an hour after we went to bed. You were
sound asleep, not out on the porch smoking.


I paid what Ken asked me for the *bed* (emphasis added on Ken's behalf) at the
Fall Ball, when he asked. As I had no innate knowledge of the cost, I could
only expect he asked me for the true cost, which apparently was the case.
YEARS after the event, you cooked up the bull**** claim that I didn't pay
anything for that *bed*. Ken clearly put an end to that, and one of these days
you should simply admit this was just another one of your bull**** stories and
get it over with.

Then *WHY* did you tell me you paid him nothing? WHY? If you had
told me you paid him, I would not have asked you for your share. And
also, if you hadn't been so cheap as to put 86 octane in a brand new
Audi V8, none of this would have happened. I once asked wayno what he
would do if someone screwed him. He said it would never happen again.
I was not going to let you screw me again. You may have "innocently"
put 86 octane in the car, but you never paid for gas after that.
Twenty two hundred miles for $22 - not bad.


I paid what you asked me for the *bed* at the Spring Fling, when you asked. I
was prepared to pay whatever the cost of the *bed* was, but as I had no innate
knowledge of the cost, I could only expect you asked me for my fair share.

YEARS after the event, you cooked up the bull**** claim I didn't pay you
*anything* for the *bed* at the Spring Fling. Then, earlier this year, you
conceded I *did* pay you - but then you trimmed the truth by claiming I didn't
pay you what you asked. NOW you're saying I didn't pay you the full cost
because YOU DIDN'T ASK for the full cost? What the hell?

Insomuch as I specifically remember paying you $125, you're still not telling
the truth, but it sure looks like you're trying to sneak up to it. Why not end
the damned drama and just admit you were lying all this time, and get it over
with - because this latest version of your bull**** story makes no sense at
all.

You paid $100 for the Spring Fling room. Just about everyone *knew*
how much it cost because they paid Waldo in advance or when they
arrived. You were prepared to move right in without paying anyone. I
asked for $100 because that was close enough for me. Hell, if I asked
for an addition $25 you would have gone into a catatonic fit!


Before we left Massachusetts, you promised to stay for the entire Spring
Fling, knowing I would not accompany you down there if you said otherwise.
But within minutes of Wayno's departure early in the week, you suddenly
decided you had to leave because you were "sick". That was patent bull**** -
and you were called on it by me and others. I'll never know if that was your
plan from the start, but you yourself provided ample reason to believe that
was the case, by relating your spouse's business plans for that week, and how
you felt you should have been there with her. Apparently, a promise means
little to you, something others may well take into account. We still left well
before the end of the conclave, but at least I got a couple of days of fishing
in.

I *was* sick. I spent at least one day in bed and all I could eat was
crackers. I vomited several times, once over the railing onto the
grass where Joe did his juggling. I believe I warned him about it.
We left on Saturday morning at the end of the clave. We were there as
long as anyone else.

As for the fricken' beer saga: I don't even know what the hell I might be
apologizing for any longer. First you said I resented you drinking one of the
beers *I* bought, which - considering my past contributions to the alcohol
pools at these events, doesn't sound like me at all.

I had one of your beers when we first arrived. The next day Tom and I
replenished the big cooler with five cases of beer - he bought 3 and I
bout 2 (although I remember buying only 1 1/2, but Tom says
different). I then picked up one of the beers I just bought, strolled
out onto the rear deck, and you said, "When are you going to buy your
own?* Nice! I told you it was *my* beer, and you replied, "Oh".
That was when you confirmed just how ****in' cheap you really are.

Now you are saying I
said something about you drinking one of beers *you and/or Tom* purchased.

I don't recall saying anything to you about *anything* to do with beer -
seriously or in jest, before or after your public melt-down, before or after I
stopped drinking beers at that conclave (when I came down with a mean case of
the hives). And where did "five cases of beer" come in, anyway, and what does
*that* mean? I have *no* idea what the heck you're talking about - I swear you
are becoming even more incoherent with each telling of your tales.

See above. Call Tom.

If I allow the absolute *worst* case possibility you have claimed on this
point, that I said something negative to you about your drinking a beer
*anyone* purchased, then *fine* - whether that happened or not - whether it
was after your ridiculous hissy fit or before - I am willing to take that
completely off the table with my apology, as in any case it is a mote of dust
on the mountain of lies you concocted in a futile attempt to somehow damage
me.

No lies, Dave. You are cheap and will get out of any expense you can.


With regards to the goddamned premium gasoline mistake, it is beyond the pale
that you put such import into something that was clearly a harmless, innocent
error on my part. I hadn't owned or even driven a car that preferred premium
fuel since I sold my '67 GTO - 30 years prior to the Spring Fling. It simply
didn't register that your rather modestly engined Audi preferred premium,
there was nothing on the dash board or fuel filler door to indicate that, and
you didn't bother to mention it to me when I *offered* to fill up the car at
the very first fuel stop.

It wasn't that you filled it with 86 octane - the car will run on
*any* octane - it was the fact that you got out of buying gas the
cheapest possible way you could. You"offered" to fill up at the first
stop? Wow, how generous of you. You should have paid for two more
fill-ups but didn't. Tom Brown once gave me a ride to go fishing with
Waldo. I paid for ALL the gas. I recently fished the Penobscot with
a friend from town. He drove - I paid for all the gas. I drove him
to Lakewood last year. He paid for all the gas. And the 4.2L Audi is
not a "modest" engine. It works best on high test, as does your Audi
which *does* have a modest engine.

As a reading of your owner's manual allowed for the safe use of regular, at a
commensurate decrease in performance and as automatically compensated by the
engine management system - a fact that you've mentioned yourself on the Audi
usenet group - it seems your eye-popping public melt-down was, at the very
least, totally uncalled for. And in fact, probably was rooted in something
completely unrelated to gasoline, beds, beers, etc. And I think I know exactly
what that actually was. Should I say - or should you?

I told you at the time that the Audi engine would compensate for your
mistake. It would just get poor mileage and would not perform as
well. But, no damage would result from its use. It was your
*cheapness* that I was angry at, and you confirmed that cheapness at
the clave by complaining that I was drinking your beer, complaining
that you won a $10 gift at the drawing while having paid $20 for the
one you gave. You say you didn't want to get into the drawing, but
when it was revealed that only those that enter the drawing would be
eligible for Zimbo's boo and two other fly rods, plus a number of
other pricey items, you got together with Walt and bought a reel that
Walt gave you a deal on. I will never forget your face when you won
those two first aid kits. Priceless! I offered to exchange my gift
for yours, but you refused. Yeah, a Strilene hat for two first aid
kits would not have been a good deal for you.


And now, we come to your most heinous lie of all: recently - and YEARS after
the Spring Fling - you came up with the bull**** story that I tried to get you
to put me into the Spring Fling raffle without my having provided an item to
contribute!

I never did that, Dave. I *did*, however, tell you that you would not
be elegible for the fly rods and reels and trips unless you entered
the raffle.

This lie was the worst piece of filth you've cooked up to date,

That would be true *if* I had done that. I did not.

and I can't even come up with the words to express my resentment, it is that
extreme. For you to conjure up such a twisted tale reveals just how sick in
the head you had become. How you can even look at yourself in the mirror
without sufficient remorse to apologize for this is as inconceivable as the
construct itself. Thank god herownself I don't have to live with that - but
you do. Enjoy?

You're a liar. You entered into the raffle only because *you had to*.
True, you didn't want to, but when I and others said you wouldn't be
eligible, you reluctantly conceded, and Uncle Wally helped you with a
gift. You could have given a $10 gift; you chose a $20 one, if I
remember correctly. But there was no coercion on my part. Not tickee
no playee. Simple. You entered on your own volotion with the hopes
of winning a great prize. You got got two first aid kits which was a
helluva lot more than I got. You should have been happy, not all
bitchy and mean.


Ok, that's the worst of it all - at the very least, more than enough.

Those that know me outright know it is not in my makeup to have acted in any
such manner as all those lies purport - and those that don't know me have
never heard *anyone* else *ever* make any similar claims against me.

Now, grow back a penis and man-up to it all, and take whatever lumps you so
richly deserve. Yeah, it might hurt a wee bit, but frankly your image here is
already about as far from stellar as it could get.

Gee, that would be my advice to you. But you can't can you?
I could shiv a git about images. Yours is less than stellar too,
because if just a little bit of what I claim is believed, it sure is
not the behavior of a stand up man. You're cheap, Dave. Face it.
Cheap!


And you never know - others might throw a "Kum Ba Yah" moment for you if you
come completely clean - my bet is folks here saw through your lies as being
ridiculous on their own merits from the very start, as has been expressed by
those that insisted on bringing it up to me. At the very least you'll be able
to look yourself in the mirror without feeling ill about it all - and that has
to count for something, right?

"Others" know that I am not cheap, but generous with my time and
money. You are not. I look myself in the mirror without any trouble,
Dave, because I have nothing to be ashamed of as far as you are
concerned. I spoke the truth above, and before. You are cheap as
cheap can get.

And yeah, I sleep well each night too.

BTW, two can play the google game. You post - I post. It'll be known
as the 100 years war on usenet. Well, I have maybe five years left,
so it will be known as the 5 years war on usenet. d;o)

And, I too was serious when I wished you and yours a Happy
Thanksgiving, and I took yours seriously.

Cheers,

Dave

On Nov 24, 8:29 am, Dave LaCourse wrote:
On Fri, 23 Nov 2007 22:44:37 -0500, daytripper

wrote:
Somehow I doubt there will be a last word, until one of us is pushing daisies.

I'm going to state the truth, claim by claim, below. If you ever bring this
crap up again, I will simply post the Google url to this post, and be done
with it, short and sweet, so I don't have to waste any more time than that.

We were less than two hours from the conclave, as anyone with a mapping
program could easily figure out for themselves. You were exhausted, but the
younger of us could have easily driven the rest, and told you so. And you know
that. But you didn't want to let me drive, so you made the "executive
decision" to barge in on those poor folks in the middle of the night. And, no,
I didn't fall right to sleep on that couch, I spent more time sitting on the
front stoop smoking cigarettes than I did sleeping.

We could have left earlier that we did. I wanted to leave in the
morning and could easily have driven to Boone (I have driven non-stop
to Georgia, Western NC which are farther than Boone). It was after
two in the morning and we were both tired. Your claim that I am too
old to drive is bull****.



You recently you came up with the bull**** claim that I was the one that
wanted to stop, to add to all the other bull**** stories you've cooked up,
YEARS after these conclaves. I'm not sure what the heck you are conceding to
on this point now, but we both know the truth. One of these days you should
simply admit it, and get it over with.

We both wanted to stop. We were both tired. You probably didn't want
to stop at a motel because it would have cost you something. You were
more than happy to stop at my brother-in-laws home, humble as it was.
I got up to take a leak about an hour after we went to bed. You were
sound asleep, not out on the porch smoking.



I paid what Ken asked me for the *bed* (emphasis added on Ken's behalf) at the
Fall Ball, when he asked. As I had no innate knowledge of the cost, I could
only expect he asked me for the true cost, which apparently was the case.
YEARS after the event, you cooked up the bull**** claim that I didn't pay
anything for that *bed*. Ken clearly put an end to that, and one of these days
you should simply admit this was just another one of your bull**** stories and
get it over with.

Then *WHY* did you tell me you paid him nothing? WHY? If you had
told me you paid him, I would not have asked you for your share. And
also, if you hadn't been so cheap as to put 86 octane in a brand new
Audi V8, none of this would have happened. I once asked wayno what he
would do if someone screwed him. He said it would never happen again.
I was not going to let you screw me again. You may have "innocently"
put 86 octane in the car, but you never paid for gas after that.
Twenty two hundred miles for $22 - not bad.







I paid what you asked me for the *bed* at the Spring Fling, when you asked. I
was prepared to pay whatever the cost of the *bed* was, but as I had no innate
knowledge of the cost, I could only expect you asked me for my fair share.

YEARS after the event, you cooked up the bull**** claim I didn't pay you
*anything* for the *bed* at the Spring Fling. Then, earlier this year, you
conceded I *did* pay you - but then you trimmed the truth by claiming I didn't
pay you what you asked. NOW you're saying I didn't pay you the full cost
because YOU DIDN'T ASK for the full cost? What the hell?

Insomuch as I specifically remember paying you $125, you're still not telling
the truth, but it sure looks like you're trying to sneak up to it. Why not end
the damned drama and just admit you were lying all this time, and get it over
with - because this latest version of your bull**** story makes no sense at
all.

You paid $100 for the Spring Fling room. Just about everyone *knew*
how much it cost because they paid Waldo in advance or when they
arrived. You were prepared to move right in without paying anyone. I
asked for $100 because that was close enough for me. Hell, if I asked
for an addition $25 you would have gone into a catatonic fit!

Before we left Massachusetts, you promised to stay for the entire Spring
Fling, knowing I would not accompany you down there if you said otherwise.
But within minutes of Wayno's departure early in the week, you suddenly
decided you had to leave because you were "sick". That was patent bull**** -
and you were called on it by me and others. I'll never know if that was your
plan from the start, but you yourself provided ample reason to believe that
was the case, by relating your spouse's business plans for that week, and how
you felt you should have been there with her. Apparently, a promise means
little to you, something others may well take into account. We still left well
before the end of the conclave, but at least I got a couple of days of fishing
in.

I *was* sick. I spent at least one day in bed and all I could eat was
crackers. I vomited several times, once over the railing onto the
grass where Joe did his juggling. I believe I warned him about it.
We left on Saturday morning at the end of the clave. We were there as
long as anyone else.



As for the fricken' beer saga: I don't even know what the hell I might be
apologizing for any longer. First you said I resented you drinking one of the
beers *I* bought, which - considering my past contributions to the alcohol
pools at these events, doesn't sound like me at all.

I had one of your beers when we first arrived. The next day Tom and I
replenished the big cooler with five cases of beer - he bought 3 and I
bout 2 (although I remember buying only 1 1/2, but Tom says
different). I then picked up one of the beers I just bought, strolled
out onto the rear deck, and you said, "When are you going to buy your
own?* Nice! I told you it was *my* beer, and you replied, "Oh".
That was when you confirmed just how ****in' cheap you really are.

Now you are saying I
said something about you drinking one of beers *you and/or Tom* purchased.

I don't recall saying anything to you about *anything* to do with beer -
seriously or in jest, before or after your public melt-down, before or after I
stopped drinking beers at that conclave (when I came down with a mean case of
the hives). And where did "five cases of beer" come in, anyway, and what does
*that* mean? I have *no* idea what the heck you're talking about - I swear you
are becoming even more incoherent with each telling of your tales.

See above. Call Tom.



If I allow the absolute *worst* case possibility you have claimed on this
point, that I said something negative to you about your drinking a beer
*anyone* purchased, then *fine* - whether that happened or not - whether it
was after your ridiculous hissy fit or before - I am willing to take that
completely off the table with my apology, as in any case it is a mote of dust
on the mountain of lies you concocted in a futile attempt to somehow damage
me.

No lies, Dave. You are cheap and will get out of any expense you can.



With regards to the goddamned premium gasoline mistake, it is beyond the pale
that you put such import into something that was clearly a harmless, innocent
error on my part. I hadn't owned or even driven a car that preferred premium
fuel since I sold my '67 GTO - 30 years prior to the Spring Fling. It simply
didn't register that your rather modestly engined Audi preferred premium,
there was nothing on the dash board or fuel filler door to indicate that, and
you didn't bother to mention it to me when I *offered* to fill up the car at
the very first fuel stop.

It wasn't that you filled it with 86 octane - the car will run on
*any* octane - it was the fact that you got out of buying gas the
cheapest possible way you could. You"offered" to fill up at the first
stop? Wow, how generous of you. You should have paid for two more
fill-ups but didn't. Tom Brown once gave me a ride to go fishing with
Waldo. I paid for ALL the gas. I recently fished the Penobscot with
a friend from town. He drove - I paid for all the gas. I drove him
to Lakewood last year. He paid for all the gas. And the 4.2L Audi is
not a "modest" engine. It works best on high test, as does your Audi
which *does* have a modest engine.



As a reading of your owner's manual allowed for the safe use of regular, at a
commensurate decrease in performance and as automatically compensated by the
engine management system - a fact that you've mentioned yourself on the Audi
usenet group - it seems your eye-popping public melt-down was, at the very
least, totally uncalled for. And in fact, probably was rooted in something
completely unrelated to gasoline, beds, beers, etc. And I think I know exactly
what that actually was. Should I say - or should you?

I told you at the time that the Audi engine would compensate for your
mistake. It would just get poor mileage and would not perform as
well. But, no damage would result from its use. It was your
*cheapness* that I was angry at, and you confirmed that cheapness at
the clave by complaining that I was drinking your beer, complaining
that you won a $10 gift at the drawing while having paid $20 for the
one you gave. You say you didn't want to get into the drawing, but
when it was revealed that only those that enter the drawing would be
eligible for Zimbo's boo and two other fly rods, plus a number of
other pricey items, you got together with Walt and bought a reel that
Walt gave you a deal on. I will never forget your face when you won
those two first aid kits. Priceless! I offered to exchange my gift
for yours, but you refused. Yeah, a Strilene hat for two first aid
kits would not have been a good deal for you.





And now, we come to your most heinous lie of all: recently - and YEARS after
the Spring Fling - you came up with the bull**** story that I tried to get you
to

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Just curious. Do you squeek when you walk//

On Sat, 24 Nov 2007 09:11:01 -0800 (PST), BJ Conner
wrote:

Just curious. Do you squeek when you walk//

No, but I do give a helluva lot of money away, and I am quite generous
too. d;o) If you were the clave meister and I attended, I'd even
bring *you* a gift. Imagine that. d;o)

Didja give any money to Harry for Myron's flies?