Carp on the Fly

Doug Kanter wrote:

"Ken Fortenberry" wrote in message
. com...

Doug Kanter wrote:

snip
... Carp's physiology is no
different from that of a trout or a bass.

Of course carp physiology is different. That's why carp are found
in warm, muddy backwaters and trout are not. If you're trying to
say that carp recover from stress, or not, in the same way that
trout and bass do, I would question that assumption as well.

--
Ken Fortenberry



I simply meant that they have enough in common with other fish that if it's
your goal to release one in healthy condition, there's no logical reason to
treat it differently.

True, but i've seen carp survive for days in a shallow, warm water pool
that they have dug for themselves. Occasionally they get stranded in a
local pond, and have devised a way to keep alive till the pond fills
back up. Sometimes it works, but many times they end up crispy.

I'm pretty sure a carp is tougher than a trout, or even bass.

brians

wrote:

I peronally make sure all fish are revived before I walk away....I use
barbless hooks . Most of the fish I catch I release. Mike



and i have no doubt each of those fish would send a thank you card,
mike...if only...well, you know. you're a grand fellow and worthy of
the admiration of men, women, children, vertebrates, and invertebrates
the world over.

jeff

Greg Pavlov wrote:
By "large," Herman, I was thinking of carp at least 30 lbs in weight.
We have a fair number of them in the Niagara River and I caught one
once by accident.

Speaking of carp, I was fishing on the Niagara one day when a
large musky swam by slowly, about 12 feet from shore in 4 - 5
feet of water, trailed by 5 carp in single file, all at over
15 lbs. They passed by me heading upstream and about 10 minutes
later they all came by, still in single file, heading downstream.
Anyone have any idea what that was about ?

Why they were following the muskie I wouldn't know, but carp do swim
certain feeding routes, which hardly change except in cases of
disturbance or overfishing.
Over here carpfishing is very popular, and making groundbait in the form
of hard-boiled doughballs (aka boilies) has turned into an 'art form' in
itself. Proteines, vitamines, taste- and odor additives are added to
create the most perfect carpfood. Especially odor additives can disturb
carp populations, because after a number of them are caught the reaction
to that odor changes from curiosity to panic when they smell it. Because
of that feeding routes change, and can even lead to the situation where
certain foodrich area's are ignored because of fishing and feeding
pressure.
It is a slightly bizarre situation at the moment. The carp record is
broken on a yearly basis now, imho not because the techniques or the
fishermen are getting better, but because of excessive feeding with
high-proteine doughballs.. We create our own records.

--
Herman

"Herman Nijland" itself. Proteines, vitamines, taste-
and odor additives are added to
It is a slightly bizarre situation at the moment. The carp record is
Herman

IJ types--the carp we have loosed in our golf course ponds to eat the algae
are sterile. But once a year they get highly excited and roar around the
ponds . They dash around and chase each other for a day or two and often one
will splash up on bank to escape? her ? paramour ?
a bizarre situation

"Doug Kanter" wrote in message
...

You should try eating pike sometime. It's a bit more work to get it ready
for cooking, what with the overabundance of slime coat and bones, and
having
to remove the bullet from wherever it hit the fish, but it's really worth
the effort.


That's funny about the bullet. Dman, those guys are fun to catch.

Actually, I have eaten pike several times. The first was in Montana, where I
went fishing with my dad and his oldest friend. (Turned out to be the last
time I saw my dad alive. Too bad we spent the entire weekend fuming at each
other...) But anyway, the Northern Pike I had there, which I fried in a
light breadcrumb batter, tasted like a piece of cardboard soaked in instant
milk and cooked in blah sauce. Almost tasteless.

The most recent time was in Northeast Finland, where I latched onto a huge
pike. Remembering the one from Montana, I wrapped this one in a garlic
paste, added some basil, thyme and butter, wrapped it in foil, and roasted
it in the coals. It tasted like a piece of cardboard soaked in instant milk,
wrapped in garlic, basil, thyme, butter and charcoal.

It might take a handier cook than me (and I'm rumored to be pretty handy) to
get some flavor out of a pike!

--riverman
(who might be missing something, but not for lack of trying)

"brians" wrote in message
...
True, but i've seen carp survive for days in a shallow, warm water pool
that they have dug for themselves. Occasionally they get stranded in a
local pond, and have devised a way to keep alive till the pond fills
back up. Sometimes it works, but many times they end up crispy.

I'm pretty sure a carp is tougher than a trout, or even bass.



God, that reminds me of a story! I was guiding a handful of yahoos from
Rutgers (the state college of new joisy) on the Rio Grande in south Texas in
canoes one incredibly hot summer, and we were about 2 weeks into the trip
with a couple more days to go. I was getting weary of these boys and their
inability to appreciate the finer aspects of the lower canyons of the Rio
Grande (everything was 'gimme a beeya, its hot out heeya' and 'hey Vinnie,
dat jacuzzi in da hotel looks pretty good about now, eh? Git me offa dis
****ing rivva' and 'Mario, whoze idea was dis. Daniel Boone?'), so I decided
to let out the stops and take them on a long hike up a side canyon to a
place where it closed down into a mini-grand canyon with pristine turquoise
pools of cool water for swimming, nice shady ledges for napping, and
beautiful silence with echoing drips of water and distant bird songs. Most
clients didn't get there because it was a long hike, but these boys were
pretty beefy and I figured it might make them see the world a bit
differently.

Along the hike, I was getting them in the mood by pointing out different
things, like a certain rare and delicate outcropping of some crystals, or
the ruins of an old soap factory on the hillside that hadn't been touched
for a hundred years, or a certain cactus in bloom that only makes flowers
once every 50 years. We were following a dry river wash, and at one point,
at a corner of the wash under an overhanging cliff, we came across a tiny
pool; no larger than a bathtub, with a HUGE carp in it, maybe close to 5
pounds. The fish had obviously gotten stranded in the river when the water
started dropping, and had found the shade and worked its ass off making a
small depression for itself. You could see where it had kicked out rocks
about as big as your fist all around, making a little berm, and it was just
lying in this puddle, waiting and surviving. There were wet tracks were we
had scared off some peccaries that were drinking as we approached. The guys
and I stood around, in awe of its survival instinct, said a few words of
praise and amazement, then continued to hike on up to the pool.

At the swimming pools, these boyos were pretty loud and exuberant, so after
a few hours when it was time to head back, I let them get a head start and
took a few minutes to enjoy the silence. Then I started walking along the
wash, following their footsteps. At the outcrop with the minerals, I could
see where they had picked some out for souvenirs. I was pretty ****ed off.
At the old soap factory, I could see where they had kicked some rock walls
down and left cigarette butts lying around. I was very ****ed off. But the
worst (you already see it coming) was at the carp puddle. They had stood
around the fish, and bombarded it with rocks until they had killed it, then
dragged it out of the puddle and tossed it into the sun. When I got there,
it was already covered with flies and starting to dry out. The puddle was
decimated, all mudded up, and I was absolutely outraged. I was going to
carry the fish back, give it to them, and tell them to clean it and cook it
for their dinner, because I was done with them. But the fish was too smelly
and destroyed to even carry, so I hiked back without it.

When I got to camp, they had gone into the cooler (in the hot sun) and
raided it for munchies. I stomped up to them, took the food they were eating
out of their hands, threw it in the river, and chewed their asses out for a
half hour about what they had done. I told them that, if they wanted to eat
dinner that night, they could damn well hike back up the wash and get the
fish they had killed, because I was not cooking anything for them for dinner
or for breakfast, and if they were able to develop any sense of remorse for
what they had done, I might be calmed down enough by lunchtime to feed them
something by then.

They spent that night and the next day in silence, but I could overhear
little snippets of conversations like "What's he so bothered about? It's
only a fukkin fish." Later, one by one, they came to me with long faces and
a lukewarm apology. By the next day, I was cooled off enough to get back to
being professional, but when they gave me a hundred dollar tip each at the
end of the trip, I handed it back to them each and said that they were
welcome to keep their money in exchange for never taking another trip with
our outfitter again, and never recommending any of their friends to come on
a trip with us either. We didn't want their type, as they had not only
ruined that trip for me, but had even ruined future trips because I could
not hike that side canyon any more without thinking of how they had killed
that fish after it had made such herculean efforts at survival, and for no
reason at all but simple destructiveness.

Trips like that were rare, but they happened.

--riverman

"riverman" wrote

God, that reminds me of a story!

(tragic narrative snipped)

some folks just aren't worth shootin.

yfitons
wayno

Wayne Harrison wrote:

"riverman" wrote

God, that reminds me of a story!


(tragic narrative snipped)

some folks just aren't worth shootin.

yfitons
wayno




With all due respect, counselor, I beg to differ.


Tom

I appreciate that comment..LOL MIKE

Jeff Miller wrote:

wrote:

I peronally make sure all fish are revived before I walk away....I use
barbless hooks . Most of the fish I catch I release. Mike



and i have no doubt each of those fish would send a thank you card,
mike...if only...well, you know. you're a grand fellow and worthy of
the admiration of men, women, children, vertebrates, and invertebrates
the world over.

jeff

--
Grab your pig’s feet, bread, and gin,
there’s plenty in the kitchen.
I wonder what the poor people are eating
tonight?
Albert J."Fats" Waller

once in an evergreen impoundment at lake mattamuskeet, jim and i watched
huge carp leaping out of the water like mullet... interesting to see
such fat butt-ugly fish doing lovely air ballet...

jeff

Joe McIntosh wrote:
"Herman Nijland" itself. Proteines, vitamines, taste-
and odor additives are added to

It is a slightly bizarre situation at the moment. The carp record is
Herman


IJ types--the carp we have loosed in our golf course ponds to eat the algae
are sterile. But once a year they get highly excited and roar around the
ponds . They dash around and chase each other for a day or two and often one
will splash up on bank to escape? her ? paramour ?
a bizarre situation