Best rod/line for ....

For several years I've been trying to improve my performance in one specific
fishing situation. I'm hoping to make this improvement via buying new
stuff as the only other apparent choice would be increased skill ... i.e.
not likely to happen

The Scene: You are sitting in a boat/ kickboat/ float tube and have just
laid out a long ( for me this is about 70 feet or maybe a bit more ... you
can visualize 90 to 110 to suit your skills ) to the "12 O'Clock position
.... floating line, #16 dry fly. A fish starts rising, quickly moving
through your area, at the 3 O'Clock or 9 O'Clock position, again a long cast
away. You need to get your line in the air, it's direction changed, and
a reasonably gentle presentation ( stillwater, very flat, spooky fish ) made
.... and ASAP.

The Question for those of you that keep up with equipment technology: At
this point in time, what specific combination of rod/ line is available that
YOU feel will do this one thing ... pick up a long line and represent it in
a new direction at a distance .... best ( money no object :-) ...or best
( money must be considered as you only do this particular fishing 3 or 4
days/ year )

Rod weight? I'm flexible, but fly size will be #14 to #18, conditions calm
to light breeze, stillwater and spooky fish ... long casts ( for me ) a must

Larry L wrote:
For several years I've been trying to improve my performance in one specific
fishing situation. I'm hoping to make this improvement via buying new
stuff as the only other apparent choice would be increased skill ... i.e.
not likely to happen

The Scene: You are sitting in a boat/ kickboat/ float tube and have just
laid out a long ( for me this is about 70 feet or maybe a bit more ... you
can visualize 90 to 110 to suit your skills ) to the "12 O'Clock position
... floating line, #16 dry fly. A fish starts rising, quickly moving
through your area, at the 3 O'Clock or 9 O'Clock position, again a long cast
away. You need to get your line in the air, it's direction changed, and
a reasonably gentle presentation ( stillwater, very flat, spooky fish ) made
... and ASAP.

That's a tough situation. I'd strip in as fast as possible until I have
maybe 30 or 40 feet of line out, pick up the line and make some false
casts to dry the fly and make double hauls to get the line out (false
casting AWAY from the fish), and then present it as delicately as I
could, aiming right at the last rise form.

The tackle is irrelevant.

--
Cut "to the chase" for my email address.

"rw" wrote


That's a tough situation. I'd strip in as fast as possible until I have
maybe 30 or 40 feet of line out, pick up the line and make some false
casts to dry the fly and make double hauls to get the line out (false
casting AWAY from the fish), and then present it as delicately as I could,
aiming right at the last rise form.

The tackle is irrelevant.

--


Hebgen gulpers is the situation and it can be very tough, as tough as any
fishing I do. On some days, these big fish are "easy" but most days they
require very good casting skills, have very little tolerance for
sloppiness, and have so many naturals to choose from that your fake bug
seems lost in the crowd. I strongly recommend it to anyone, that has a
high tolerance for frustration, and is in the Greater Yellowstone area in
August.

I do what you suggest but they travel through your area fast and you want to
get as many tries to match their rise rhythm / next rise spot as possible as
they slice across your circle of possibilities.

I know that casting skill is the real key, but I suk and am thinking that,
maybe, one of the superfast rods and long taper Weight forward lines might
make it easier ... or maybe, a fast rod and a DT line two sizes "too small"
.... or, maybe, some other magic bullet to make up for the sucking sounds my
casts always make.

Larry L wrote:

I do what you suggest but they travel through your area fast and you want to
get as many tries to match their rise rhythm / next rise spot as possible as
they slice across your circle of possibilities.

This is not the solution you asked for (the technological one),
but it's motivated by my own conviction that at this stage in my
life I would never consider buying more gear to meet a situation
I only encountered "3 to 4 days / year."

Me, I'd just, in my mind, decrease the radius of my "circle of
possibilities." Fish 40 feet away, all right (hell, I'm sitting
in a kickboat for God's sake....). Fish 70 feet away might as
well be in Idaho for all I care. If nothing is rising in, or
moving toward my small world, I sit and watch the larger one....

- JR

"JR" wrote


Me, I'd just, in my mind, decrease the radius of my "circle of
possibilities." Fish 40 feet away, all right (hell, I'm sitting in a
kickboat for God's sake....). Fish 70 feet away might as well be in Idaho
for all I care. If nothing is rising in, or moving toward my small world,
I sit and watch the larger one....



That, sir, is wonderful advice .... I only wish that I had the qualities
required to follow it.

When I was a avid waterfowler, my patience was 'legendary' in my local
circles and I'd pass on possible shot after possible shot until I worked Mr
Duck or Goose into the perfect place. I have friends that still tell
stories about nearly going insane as I, as 'blind boss', kept demanding in
a whisper between grunts into a call, "Stay down, not yet, stay DOWN"

I mention this because it strikes me as an odd quirt of this human's mind.

You see, I was MUCH more into measuring success in numbers when hunting and
was MUCH more competitve about it than I am about fishing. But, I find it
very difficult to not try a 'wing and a prayer" long shot cast on Hebgen.
Logic ( if that applied in any way to human behavior ) would make it seem
I'd be less "needy" to try casts beyond my ability, since my desire to catch
isn't nearly as intense as my hunting desire of the past, but the opposite
seems to be true.

No excuse, but part of the problem is that 75 feet looks like 40 feet when
you're a mile from shore and that nose sipping spinners is clearly attached
to a 20++ inch fish G. It's real common for me to wind up, duck as the
tangled mess of line flutters by my head, and then wonder, "Why the **** did
I even try?"

"JR" wrote

I only encountered "3 to 4 days / year."



oh, yeah

this has all come up as my bride and I discuss the summer to come. we were
married on August 14th and I've been coming home to be with her for a couple
weeks at that time .. this year she may come to visit me in YNP, instead
.... thus much more of gulper time available to me


I agree with both you and rw that tackle isn't my problem ... instead, it's
just that ugly old mirror, again


but then, I bet if I could cast 97 feet the damn fish would cruise by at 101

Larry L wrote:
"rw" wrote


That's a tough situation. I'd strip in as fast as possible until I have
maybe 30 or 40 feet of line out, pick up the line and make some false
casts to dry the fly and make double hauls to get the line out (false
casting AWAY from the fish), and then present it as delicately as I could,
aiming right at the last rise form.

The tackle is irrelevant.

--



Hebgen gulpers is the situation and it can be very tough, as tough as any
fishing I do. On some days, these big fish are "easy" but most days they
require very good casting skills, have very little tolerance for
sloppiness, and have so many naturals to choose from that your fake bug
seems lost in the crowd. I strongly recommend it to anyone, that has a
high tolerance for frustration, and is in the Greater Yellowstone area in
August.

I do what you suggest but they travel through your area fast and you want to
get as many tries to match their rise rhythm / next rise spot as possible as
they slice across your circle of possibilities.

I know that casting skill is the real key, but I suk and am thinking that,
maybe, one of the superfast rods and long taper Weight forward lines might
make it easier ... or maybe, a fast rod and a DT line two sizes "too small"
... or, maybe, some other magic bullet to make up for the sucking sounds my
casts always make.

A long rod is advantageous in a kickboat, and especially in a float tube
when you're sitting low in the water. I think a fast rod helps, too,
because it allows you to get line out faster. Forget about the spey-rod,
snake-roll advice. :-)

I love casting for gulpers on stillwater. One of my most memorable
outings was when I was fishing with Willi on Quake Lake, in Warren's
"Gink Keeps it Up" drift boat (ex George's boat). It was a cloudy and
slightly rainy day and the Callibaetis came off. As I recall, I caught
three good-sized rainbows, which we kept and ate. Maybe it was two.
Willi will catch me on this. :-)

I missed a couple with too-soon strikes.

Quake Lake during a Callibaetis hatch is a good place to be. The dead
trees are surreal. I've never fished Hebgen. It seems too large and
intimidating.

Bruce and Willi and I (and someone else, can't recall who, but I think
Bevin?) went out the next day and did nada. It was a sunny, bluebird day
-- stinks for stillwater fishing.

Stillwater fishing with dries is something when the fish are rising.
They seem to be always just out of reach, or they rise right next to the
boat when you have 70' of line out. That turns into a comic circus.

When you see two rise forms in sequence it's tempting to cast to where
you extrapolate the fish will be next. This is, I believe, a mistake.
Fish feeding on the surface of stillwater move randomly. I cast directly
to the last rise form. If that doesn't get a take I start searching
around it.

--
Cut "to the chase" for my email address.

"rw" wrote


Quake Lake during a Callibaetis hatch is a good place to be. The dead
trees are surreal. I've never fished Hebgen. It seems too large and
intimidating.



Quake is, indeed, a nice place to fish although my feeling about it vs
Hegben is reversed from yours. Most of the time I've spent on Hebgen has
been on the Madison arm and it feels relatively small and easy to access
rowing my kickboat. The one ramp on Quake seems a long pull away from the
inlet area that has given me my best action. All the dead trees certainly
is surreal and a bit spooky, especially if you're slowing kicking backwards
and run into one under the water G


I have an old ( 35 years? ) Scott 10ft 5wt that has been my stillwater rod,
mostly. But it is a slow action. I'd like to try a long, fast, 5 wt
but I've never had the chance.


Not sure what the next seasons will bring to Hebgen. The fire this
summer burned all the trees off one shore of the Madison arm. I don't
know what effect this will have on the fishery but I'm not betting on a good
one :-(

Larry L wrote:
"rw" wrote


Quake Lake during a Callibaetis hatch is a good place to be. The dead
trees are surreal. I've never fished Hebgen. It seems too large and
intimidating.




Quake is, indeed, a nice place to fish although my feeling about it vs
Hegben is reversed from yours. Most of the time I've spent on Hebgen has
been on the Madison arm and it feels relatively small and easy to access
rowing my kickboat. The one ramp on Quake seems a long pull away from the
inlet area that has given me my best action. All the dead trees certainly
is surreal and a bit spooky, especially if you're slowing kicking backwards
and run into one under the water G

The boat ramp on Quake Lake is another spooky thing. It's the old road
before the earthquake buried the rest of it. There are dead people under
there.

Willi and I ran into an interesting and rather strange guy who turned us
on to Quake Lake. He disdained the Madison and instead fished Quake with
mostly orangish streamer-like flies. He said it was the jit. :-)

--
Cut "to the chase" for my email address.

"rw" wrote


When you see two rise forms in sequence it's tempting to cast to where you
extrapolate the fish will be next. This is, I believe, a mistake. Fish
feeding on the surface of stillwater move randomly. I cast directly to the
last rise form. If that doesn't get a take I start searching around it.



On Hebgen, after a few days of heavy hatches, the fish DO become predictable
and you can plot their path and intercept it.

Sure, it never becomes exact, but it gets close enough you can count out
rise times nearly exactly uniform and predict the area ( within a foot or
so ) of the next one. They DO make sudden shifts and direction changes,
but it usually after many 'predictable' rises in a row. I've seen times on
Hebgen when you'll be approached by a dozen fish traveling together in a
group the size of a kickboat, each fish rising ever few seconds ... a moving
Silver Cereek pod ... you toss your fake out in front of this pod and
can't find it in the middle of all the naturals, even with a shortish cast,
exciting stuffG. Anyway, I've seen many fish rise every few feet in a
rhythm for 50 yards or more in a 'straight' line on Hebgen, but never
elsewhere and they don't 'always' do it there ... it takes some time, days,
a week, after they start surface feeding each summer before they really
start 'gulping'

The tactic you suggest ( casting quickly to the last seen rise ) is what
works best for me, most lakes, most days, especially during damsel time when
I'm tossing a nymph and ( I believe ) the plop gets his attention and turns
the fish back.