TR for the Bighorn Micro Clave and a Trip to Chas's

Chas Wade wrote:

Darin Minor wrote:

Chums will actually start to darken up faster than pinks, they'll
start in the
salt water. As far as I'm concerned, the smoker isn't even good enough
for
chums. There is a reason they call 'em dog salmon.

Well, one side of me wants to leave this comment alone so there will be
more chums for me, but the other side just couldn't leave it at that.
I caught several bright chums last year on the Sky above Monroe. They
were tasty grilled, no need to smoke them.

As a biological note, the salt/fresh thing isn't involved in the timing
of the fish turning color. They turn in anticipation of spawning, at a
standard interval before the actual spawning starts. If they are
Hoodsport fish, they often change completely in the salt. If they are
Skagit, Sky, or Stilly fish, they change as much as a week or two after
heading up the river. Particularly in the case of chums, the color
alone doesn't tell you they aren't fresh any more. Alaskan fish that
spawn in small creeks that dump straight into the salt often only spend
the last few days of their lives in the fresh water.

I do wonder when the Yukon river kings change color. They have over
2000 miles of fresh water to navigate.

Chas
http://home.comcast.net/~chas.wade/w...ome.html-.html

I just wrote what I'd read at one time, not actual personal experience.
Thanks for clarifying for me.
Just because they'll darken early doesn't mean I won't fish for 'em, I've
heard that they'll take some line.

Darin

Darin Minor wrote:
I just wrote what I'd read at one time, not actual personal experience.
Thanks for clarifying for me.

You're welcome. We need to get together and fish some time.

Just because they'll darken early doesn't mean I won't fish for 'em,
I've
heard that they'll take some line.

I had a 15 pounder at Hoodsport take 50 yards of my packing out to sea
and then jump several times way out there. The guy next to me looked
over and asked, "Is that your fish way out there?". Between the grunts
I said, "You betcha". That was my 10x10 with 15 pound leader and the
drag turned up tight. Kings don't fight any harder pound for pound.
Oh, and that fish was too dark to keep.

Chas
http://home.comcast.net/~chas.wade/w...ome.html-.html

"Warren" wrote

I also noticed something that I haven't seen
before happen. It seemed like in certain areas flocks of
fishermen would congregate on a nice run and fan out for some
combat fishing. The water would be totally open upstream and
downstream for as far as you could see, but people would still
group together like that. We would just keep on going and find
a nice place to ourselves. I still don't understand why that
was happening since there are fish all over the river.


Not that it matters, but I've noticed this for years, and it IS getting more
and more obvious in fly fishing. I have some theories G

Preface:
I am a loner, and have backpacked, hunted and fished alone for all my life,
starting well before I was old enough to drive myself to the Sierra to hike
alone for a week. I'm not a hermit, and I don't "avoid" others, nor do I
dislike being around them, but I don't seek them out, either. I've been
aware of being "different" in this respect since my teen years and before
.... that is probably why I've thought about the "whys" of why people "gang
fish" or "gang hunt" and the very, very obvious trend the last 15 years
towards "foursomes" in fly fishing

Briefly, the theories

(1) Many people, naturally, have a deep "fear" ( can't think of a better
word ) of being alone. In past cultures, time alone was far more common
and more people became comfortable with that aloneness. But this is far
more pronounced in our modern age where many people have had the damn TV or
a radio or a frickin cell phone on nearly every waking moment that they have
not had other humans in sight. ( why do they "need" the cell phone or
walkie talkie?.. often it ain't information sharing, it's to avoid being
alone ) I think our "technoculture" is increasing the level of "aloneness
fear" in many people by very simply never allowing them to practice
aloneness.

(3) More, percentage wise, people are being raised in crowded conditions,
with little or any time really alone. Yesterday I watched the 10 year old
neighbor kid BB gun hunting the counside around here and thought about how
few youngsters today EVER get that far from a crowd and he was only about
1/2 mile from home, but alone

(3) A LOT of people getting into fly fishing the last decade or so have no,
zero, other real outdoors experience, none. From many, mowing the lawn is
a wilderness experience, and big cities are not too crowded.

If you or I head into the backcountry ... alone .... then step off the trail
with the intention of going miles cross country, alone, we will experience,
if only briefly, the emotional attachment the human being has for the
security of other humans and the "man made" ....regardless of our outdoors
experience level. For all of us, to some degree, manmade = secure, Nature =
scary

I KNOW it "sounds stupid" to anyone with real outdoors experience, but I see
people on the stream that seem so uncomfortable outdoors that I bet they are
afraid to enter the "wilderness" between "gang fishers," alone. Heah, think
of the guys that think they need a damn gun to leave the paved road, before
you poo poo the idea G

(4) common ones that have affected all fishermen and hunters at one time
"he's catching let's move over there"
"I don't know the area but everyone seems to be over there, that must be
good"
and the very human
"monkey see, monkey do"

Oh and one more thingG
If, after you "just continued and found a nice place to yourselves" I had
come along, alone, I'd have wondered why you were all in the same damn area
G

Everything depends on perspective.

The picture of everyone in the boat looks pretty claustrophobic to me :-)

Larry L wrote:
Oh and one more thingG
If, after you "just continued and found a nice place to yourselves" I had
come along, alone, I'd have wondered why you were all in the same damn area
G

Everything depends on perspective.

The picture of everyone in the boat looks pretty claustrophobic to me :-)

I fish alone at least 90% of the time, very often in wilderness. One of
the things I really like about the claves is the chance to fish with
other people for a change.

--
Cut "to the chase" for my email address.

"rw" wrote

I fish alone at least 90% of the time, very often in wilderness. One of
the things I really like about the claves is the chance to fish with
other people for a change.

Yes, I know ... recently you posted a TR about a place that required a
decent walk and commented that you never see others there.

I think many people avoid these places, NOT because of the work, but rather
because of fear ... subtle fear, but fear, nonetheless.

I spent a lot of "people watching" time in Jellystone this summer and it was
very obvious that the vast majority of people started to feel uncomfortable
the first step off pavement, and very uncomfortable where the "human track"
ended, even if it was in sight of the car.

One weird thing I noticed was several times as many early morning joggers
running the roads near Madison Junction camp, as running the trail along the
Madison ... there has to be a reason ... these joggers aren't afraid of
exercise, why the road?

And, I've read and envy your posts about cross country sking alone, too.

One of my legs points nearly 90 degrees from the other and I can't track in
skis ... simply can't ... can't walk in snoeshoes without getting tangled
either :-((

I tried getting bindings specially fitted but never succeeded .... At this
point, I'm WAY too obese and old, anyway, but never getting to really "do"
winter mountaineering is one of my regrets. I envy you your location and
health.

I may try a "clave" someday, but, maybe not G

Larry L wrote:

And, I've read and envy your posts about cross country sking alone, too.

I never XC ski alone. At least one of my dogs is always with me. :-) I
typically take them both in the morning, and then leave my rather
elderly Golden, Arlo, at home in the afternoon, and take my Border
Collie, who has boundless energy and wicked speed, for a hard, fast ski
in the afternoon. Arlo, who normally hates to be left alone, watches us
leave the cabin with clear gratitude.

XC skiing has something of the same appeal for me as fishing. It's an
exercise that makes getting out something more than just a walk in the
woods. (Not that there's anything wrong with that.)

BTW, you might try skate skiing. Instead of tracking in a straight line
you angle the skis, kind of like ice skates. And you can go fast! The
only problem is that you need a well groomed trail or hard crust.

--
Cut "to the chase" for my email address.

rw wrote:
Larry L wrote:

Oh and one more thingG
If, after you "just continued and found a nice place to yourselves" I had
come along, alone, I'd have wondered why you were all in the same damn
area
G

Everything depends on perspective.

The picture of everyone in the boat looks pretty claustrophobic to me :-)


I fish alone at least 90% of the time, very often in wilderness. One of
the things I really like about the claves is the chance to fish with
other people for a change.


I echo the sentiment. Fishing with different people is also a good way
to learn new things. In addition to personal differences, I like there
are some regional differences.

Willi

Larry L wrote:


Not that it matters, but I've noticed this for years, and it IS getting more
and more obvious in fly fishing. I have some theories G


I think that part of it has to do with new fly fishermen learning how to
fly fish on famous, very heavily fished waters where the fishing is a
"social event."

Willi

"Larry L" wrote in message
...

I am a loner, and [have a great opinion of myself.....especially
compared to all the pants wetting effete latter day pantywaists I
somehow unaccountably run into in every lonely place I go to].

Well, "Everything depends on perspective", as a wise man once said.

I am not a loner.....except occasionally by happenstance. But in the
past thirty years I've gone on more solo backpacking, hitchhiking,
bicycle touring, day tripping, bird watching, hunting, and fishing
trips than I can count. Spent as much as three weeks out on
backpacking trips, and six or more bike touring or hitchhiking. A lot
of these outings were solo as much because none of my friends were
interested in participating in a particular trip as for any other
reason. It has always been tempting to think of myself as some sort
of hardy outdoor individualists or some such ****, but it's very hard
to carry it off. For you see, like Colin Fletcher (though he said it
better), every time I've found myself at the end of the road or trail,
up against the wall, the last impenetrable thicket beyond which no man
can possibly go, somebody has stepped out from the other side, calmly
dusted him or herself off, nodded a "howdee do", and continued on over
the horizon.

While it is certainly true that there are a lot of people who never
get TO, let alone off, the beaten path, there are millions of others
who routinely do **** that makes my hair stand on end. Your
observations on the multitudes of the fearful and inept you encounter
frequently enough to codify their behavior says at least as much about
your habits as theirs.

Wolfgang