You gotta be kidding...

wrote:

A real leader will spend their
down-time learning and when they are called upon to lead, they will
trust their instincts and have faith they will enjoy more success than
failure.

The last part sounds like "trust your gut" W, and the first half sounds
like O.

--
Cut "to the chase" for my email address.

On Thu, 30 Oct 2008 21:30:15 -0500, wrote:

On Thu, 30 Oct 2008 21:44:40 -0400, daytripper
wrote:

On Thu, 30 Oct 2008 17:46:12 -0500, wrote:

It seems that Fox is the only major news outlet making mention of this.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I know, it's Fox, but this is a quote of what Bill
Clinton said:

Clinton told the crowd at a Wednesday night rally with Obama in Florida.
"He said, 'Tell me what the right thing to do is. What's the right thing
for America? Don't tell me what's popular. You tell me what's right --
I'll figure out how to sell it.'"

http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/10...onomic-crisis/

Unfrigginbelievable...and this is the guy who is running commercials
blasting McCain for admitting he didn't know as much as he felt he
should about _economics_, not the _economy_, as Obama is advertising...

I can already hear the spin - he has advisors, he listens to others,
yada, yada, yada, but the fact remains he wanted others to tell him what
to do and he'd just be the guy who "sells it."

Sheesh,
R

Why do Presidents have Cabinets, partisan dumbass?

Ah. So I'm curious, why doesn't he know or at least have a pretty good
idea of "what's right?" I mean, he has been claiming he knows what's
wrong and he has published his super-duper plan that supposedly clearly
explains how he will fix everything, plus he claims he has so many
answers to so many questions, so why does he need to have others "tell
him what's right?" This isn't him saying, "I have a plan, and I'm
pretty sure it's what I'm going to do, but before I commit to it, I want
your advice/input," or even "Here's my thoughts on this, what do you
think - what's your input," it's him saying he wants others to _tell him
what to do_. Are you electing him or to whoever he might turn to "tell
him what to do?" Do you trust him so completely to state here and now
and sign your name that you support whomever he might get to "tell him
what to do?"

And on another level, why does he need others to tell him what's right?
You'd think a person of his supposed intellect and education would have
some basic idea of right and wrong.

You accuse me of being a "partisan dumbass," but answer this question to
yourself: what would your reaction be if anyone other than your precious
St. Barack had said, "You tell me what's right -- I'll figure out how to
sell it."

HTH,
R

/daytripper (double sheesh)

yawn

As you haven't actually seen any actual quote from the actual Obama, you don't
actually have the first clue what might have been actually said, actually.

Answer the question: why do Presidents have Cabinets??

Finally, you are - and have always been - a transparently partisan dumbass -
regardless of how coy you try to be. You haven't been fooling anyone...

/daytripper

On Thu, 30 Oct 2008 21:44:42 -0500, wrote:

On Thu, 30 Oct 2008 21:41:41 -0400, daytripper
wrote:

On Thu, 30 Oct 2008 18:48:41 -0500, wrote:

On 30 Oct 2008 23:05:05 GMT, Scott Seidman
wrote:

wrote in
m:

It seems that Fox is the only major news outlet making mention of
this. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I know, it's Fox, but this is a quote of what
Bill Clinton said:

Clinton told the crowd at a Wednesday night rally with Obama in
Florida. "He said, 'Tell me what the right thing to do is. What's the
right thing for America? Don't tell me what's popular. You tell me
what's right -- I'll figure out how to sell it.'"

http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/10...obama-uncertai
n-economic-crisis/

Unfrigginbelievable...and this is the guy who is running commercials
blasting McCain for admitting he didn't know as much as he felt he
should about _economics_, not the _economy_, as Obama is
advertising...

I can already hear the spin - he has advisors, he listens to others,
yada, yada, yada, but the fact remains he wanted others to tell him
what to do and he'd just be the guy who "sells it."

Sheesh,
R


Wouldn't contacting experts and advisors before formulating a well
reasoned and organized response be called "leadership"?

No, it wouldn't.

Actually, it certainly is.

No, it certainly isn't. That's being a wishy-washy mid-level manager.
When a leader is needed, there is no time for all that feel-good, CYA
bull**** and leaders step up and act - leaders lead, they don't follow.
Of course, sometimes they are wrong and/or make mistakes, but real
leaders don't and can't worry about perfection because they understand
that it is a fruitless pursuit. A real leader will spend their
down-time learning and when they are called upon to lead, they will
trust their instincts and have faith they will enjoy more success than
failure.

Of course, that's a pantload load of crap, but considering the source, it's
hardly a surprise.

Partisan dumbass...

Spoken like someone who has never been, never will be and is totally
unprepared to be anything remotely close to a real leader or know what
one is, does, looks or acts like...

Yeah, sure, whatever you say. snicker

HTH,
R
...here's a hint - there are no "good leaders" or "bad leaders," only
_leaders_...

Well, that's patently absurd - but again, the source...

/daytripper

On Thu, 30 Oct 2008 23:03:37 -0400, daytripper
wrote:

On Thu, 30 Oct 2008 21:30:15 -0500, wrote:

On Thu, 30 Oct 2008 21:44:40 -0400, daytripper
wrote:

On Thu, 30 Oct 2008 17:46:12 -0500, wrote:

It seems that Fox is the only major news outlet making mention of this.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I know, it's Fox, but this is a quote of what Bill
Clinton said:

Clinton told the crowd at a Wednesday night rally with Obama in Florida.
"He said, 'Tell me what the right thing to do is. What's the right thing
for America? Don't tell me what's popular. You tell me what's right --
I'll figure out how to sell it.'"

http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/10...onomic-crisis/

Unfrigginbelievable...and this is the guy who is running commercials
blasting McCain for admitting he didn't know as much as he felt he
should about _economics_, not the _economy_, as Obama is advertising...

I can already hear the spin - he has advisors, he listens to others,
yada, yada, yada, but the fact remains he wanted others to tell him what
to do and he'd just be the guy who "sells it."

Sheesh,
R

Why do Presidents have Cabinets, partisan dumbass?

Ah. So I'm curious, why doesn't he know or at least have a pretty good
idea of "what's right?" I mean, he has been claiming he knows what's
wrong and he has published his super-duper plan that supposedly clearly
explains how he will fix everything, plus he claims he has so many
answers to so many questions, so why does he need to have others "tell
him what's right?" This isn't him saying, "I have a plan, and I'm
pretty sure it's what I'm going to do, but before I commit to it, I want
your advice/input," or even "Here's my thoughts on this, what do you
think - what's your input," it's him saying he wants others to _tell him
what to do_. Are you electing him or to whoever he might turn to "tell
him what to do?" Do you trust him so completely to state here and now
and sign your name that you support whomever he might get to "tell him
what to do?"

And on another level, why does he need others to tell him what's right?
You'd think a person of his supposed intellect and education would have
some basic idea of right and wrong.

You accuse me of being a "partisan dumbass," but answer this question to
yourself: what would your reaction be if anyone other than your precious
St. Barack had said, "You tell me what's right -- I'll figure out how to
sell it."

HTH,
R

/daytripper (double sheesh)

yawn

As you haven't actually seen any actual quote from the actual Obama, you don't
actually have the first clue what might have been actually said, actually.

I haven't? I guess some of Sarge's gay male pros took over CNN while
others went down to Florida dressed as Clinton and Obama to give a stump
speech and fooled everyone:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RC-9PgJfJIw

(Scroll to the end of the video, like the last 30 seconds or so, if you
don't want to watch the whole 10 minutes)

Answer the question: why do Presidents have Cabinets??

To delegate management, not to tell them what to do or how to be
leaders. Again, of course they also provide information and counsel,
but that's not telling him what to do or telling him what's right. IIRC,
you were among the ROFFians raising all sorts of hell about how you
thought Cheney, Rumsfeld, etc., told Bush what to do and/or were really
running the show - how do you reconcile that with Obama acquiescing to
Clinton saying the he (Obama) looked to others to tell him what to do
and what was right?

Finally, you are - and have always been - a transparently partisan dumbass -
regardless of how coy you try to be. You haven't been fooling anyone...

I obviously have fooled a fair number of folks, you included. I'm one
of the least partisan people on ROFF and likely as not, one of the least
partisan people you'll ever encounter.

HTH,
R

/daytripper

wrote:
daytripper wrote:
Finally, you are - and have always been - a transparently partisan dumbass -
regardless of how coy you try to be. You haven't been fooling anyone...

I obviously have fooled a fair number of folks, you included. I'm one
of the least partisan people on ROFF and likely as not, one of the least
partisan people you'll ever encounter.

SPLORK VANG MU !

Whew. I was laughing so much I had a hard time getting all that
coffee wiped off the screen.

Thanks for the laugh.

--
Ken Fortenberry

wrote in message
...
When a leader is needed, there is no time for all that feel-good, CYA
bull**** and leaders step up and act - leaders lead, they don't follow.
Of course, sometimes they are wrong and/or make mistakes, but real
leaders don't and can't worry about perfection because they understand
that it is a fruitless pursuit. A real leader will spend their
down-time learning and when they are called upon to lead, they will
trust their instincts and have faith they will enjoy more success than
failure.
...here's a hint - there are no "good leaders" or "bad leaders," only
_leaders_...

I would vehemently disagree with much of this, but you did title the thread
"you gotta be kidding", RDean......
To suggest that a leader shouldn't rely on others for insights and instincts
beyond his/her own is ludicrous. Furthermore, the idea of a 'one-size fits
all' definition of leadership is dubious. Being POTUS is a leadership role
that demands leadership in so many areas of expertise no one except an
arrogant buffoon would trust his 'instincts' alone. You also gloss over the
key aspect of any type of leadership: the ability to make others agree with
and follow the plan, as a leader(by definition) leads others to a goal or
set of goals. If you(RDean) are so convinced that Obama is not a valid
leader(I would disagree), set out for us how McCain, Barr, Nader or anyone
else on your ballot exceeds the skillset Obama brings to the table.
Tom

On Thu, 30 Oct 2008 21:44:42 -0500, wrote:



No, it certainly isn't. That's being a wishy-washy mid-level manager.
When a leader is needed, there is no time for all that feel-good, CYA
bull**** and leaders step up and act - leaders lead, they don't follow.

In addition to being a real irritating participant in the forum,
you're also an idiot.

On Thu, 30 Oct 2008 23:04:51 -0500, wrote:



Answer the question: why do Presidents have Cabinets??

To delegate management, not to tell them what to do or how to be
leaders.

A minute ago it was about listening to experts before making a
decision, now it's "telling them what to do."

You're an idiot.

On Sun, 02 Nov 2008 01:38:17 -0400, wrote:

In addition to being a real irritating participant in the forum,
you're also an idiot.

But he's not anonymous. Go away and find your identity, little man.