Best rod/line for ....

Just another point there which bears repeating. Most people I see
trying to change direction when casting, do it by making a number of
false casts. This is pointless. Although it may be counterintuitive,
the line will go where the rod tip goes, regardless of where it was
before. It is neither necessary nor sensible to make incremental
changes of direction by false casting.

If you make large direction changes, 90° or more, you will feel the
rod "twisting" in your hand. This will also work with any rod, but
some slow rods will give a very odd "feel" when you do it. It takes a
little getting used to.

The back cast should be out behind the rod, with no slack, immediately
before you cast to the new direction. It is easier to practice this a
little at shorter distances before you try lifting and changing
direction with a long line.

TL
MC

This single skill is probably the most important of all when fishing
to cruising fish on still water. Even if you don´t get any other gear,
it is worth practising this with what you have.

Also, something that RW wrote struck a chord. Although it may seem
that fish are cruising randomly, they rarely are, although this may
happen on occasion. Usually they patrol quite well defined routes, and
if you can get your fly on to their route, you will usually hook them.
Casting into a rise form may work sometimes, but usually the fish has
merely continued its patrol route, and is nowhere near your fly when
it lands. It usually pays off a lot more often to make your best
guess regarding the direction the fish is travelling, and place your
fly ahead of where you think it might be. If you can observe a
cruising fish, this should be somewhat easier.

Fish tend to swim in straight lines, only veering off course to take
an insect etc. They will also often simply ignore insects which are
too far off that course. This is doubtless an energy conservation
mechanism.

Lastly, and this rather depends on how badly you want to catch the
twenty incher! In such conditions, a floating muddler minnow
retrieved fairly fast, and leaving a good wake, will often elicit
savage strikes from such cruising fish. Worth a try when nothing else
is working, or when you have messed up the fifth dry fly cast in
succession

TL
MC

On Dec 28, 5:01 am, Steve wrote:

Larry, in my NSHO, this isn't an equipment issue, it's a casting
issue.
A "super fast" rod is definitely not the answer as one can only throw
in a limited arc and that isn't to one's advantage 2 feet off the
deck.
I think it's time to learn a few spey casting techniques...snake rolls
especially.

A limited casting arc is actually desirable when distance casting.
Translational movement, ( linear movement of the hand while the rod is
loaded), and haul length and speed are the most important factors.

MC

On Thu, 27 Dec 2007 17:03:17 -0800, rw
wrote:

Larry L wrote:
For several years I've been trying to improve my performance in one specific
fishing situation. I'm hoping to make this improvement via buying new
stuff as the only other apparent choice would be increased skill ... i.e.
not likely to happen

The Scene: You are sitting in a boat/ kickboat/ float tube and have just
laid out a long ( for me this is about 70 feet or maybe a bit more ... you
can visualize 90 to 110 to suit your skills ) to the "12 O'Clock position
... floating line, #16 dry fly. A fish starts rising, quickly moving
through your area, at the 3 O'Clock or 9 O'Clock position, again a long cast
away. You need to get your line in the air, it's direction changed, and
a reasonably gentle presentation ( stillwater, very flat, spooky fish ) made
... and ASAP.

That's a tough situation. I'd strip in as fast as possible until I have
maybe 30 or 40 feet of line out, pick up the line and make some false
casts to dry the fly and make double hauls to get the line out (false
casting AWAY from the fish), and then present it as delicately as I
could, aiming right at the last rise form.

The tackle is irrelevant.

I like this solution. It would be difficult to pick up 70+ feet of
line and cast from 12 to 3 in one move.

I believe, however, the the Winston BIIx rod (the longer the better)
would be of help in this situation.

My only concern would be setting the hook at such a distance. I was
fishing for brook trout in Labrador a couple of years ago and the only
way to get them was to cast 70 feet to rising fish. At first I had
trouble setting the hook, but with practice I managed quite well. I
doubt I could set it at 100 feet, however.

Of course this Winston isn't cheap, but it *is* a wonderful rod.

Dave

"rw" wrote


Quake Lake during a Callibaetis hatch is a good place to be. The dead
trees are surreal. I've never fished Hebgen. It seems too large and
intimidating.



Quake is, indeed, a nice place to fish although my feeling about it vs
Hegben is reversed from yours. Most of the time I've spent on Hebgen has
been on the Madison arm and it feels relatively small and easy to access
rowing my kickboat. The one ramp on Quake seems a long pull away from the
inlet area that has given me my best action. All the dead trees certainly
is surreal and a bit spooky, especially if you're slowing kicking backwards
and run into one under the water G


I have an old ( 35 years? ) Scott 10ft 5wt that has been my stillwater rod,
mostly. But it is a slow action. I'd like to try a long, fast, 5 wt
but I've never had the chance.


Not sure what the next seasons will bring to Hebgen. The fire this
summer burned all the trees off one shore of the Madison arm. I don't
know what effect this will have on the fishery but I'm not betting on a good
one :-(

"rw" wrote


When you see two rise forms in sequence it's tempting to cast to where you
extrapolate the fish will be next. This is, I believe, a mistake. Fish
feeding on the surface of stillwater move randomly. I cast directly to the
last rise form. If that doesn't get a take I start searching around it.



On Hebgen, after a few days of heavy hatches, the fish DO become predictable
and you can plot their path and intercept it.

Sure, it never becomes exact, but it gets close enough you can count out
rise times nearly exactly uniform and predict the area ( within a foot or
so ) of the next one. They DO make sudden shifts and direction changes,
but it usually after many 'predictable' rises in a row. I've seen times on
Hebgen when you'll be approached by a dozen fish traveling together in a
group the size of a kickboat, each fish rising ever few seconds ... a moving
Silver Cereek pod ... you toss your fake out in front of this pod and
can't find it in the middle of all the naturals, even with a shortish cast,
exciting stuffG. Anyway, I've seen many fish rise every few feet in a
rhythm for 50 yards or more in a 'straight' line on Hebgen, but never
elsewhere and they don't 'always' do it there ... it takes some time, days,
a week, after they start surface feeding each summer before they really
start 'gulping'

The tactic you suggest ( casting quickly to the last seen rise ) is what
works best for me, most lakes, most days, especially during damsel time when
I'm tossing a nymph and ( I believe ) the plop gets his attention and turns
the fish back.

"Wayne Knight" wrote



Winston 91/2' BIIx 5wt and the SA Sharkskin line.



You know anyone doing subprime loans for tackle G


actually this is the exact selection I had dreamed of, from reading the
adman hype, but I've never cast either the rod or the line

"Mike" wrote



A 9´ TCR #5 http://www.sageflyfish.com/default.asp?p=24

.with a #6 XXD line http://www.sexyloops.com/tackle/xxd.shtml


reading these two pages makes me want to try this combo, but phrases like "a
skilled caster can" pop up all over them and I'm not one.

in YOUR opinion, can an average caster benefit from such tools, or will they
just be wasted $, or worse, magnify his errors ?

Larry L wrote:
"rw" wrote


Quake Lake during a Callibaetis hatch is a good place to be. The dead
trees are surreal. I've never fished Hebgen. It seems too large and
intimidating.




Quake is, indeed, a nice place to fish although my feeling about it vs
Hegben is reversed from yours. Most of the time I've spent on Hebgen has
been on the Madison arm and it feels relatively small and easy to access
rowing my kickboat. The one ramp on Quake seems a long pull away from the
inlet area that has given me my best action. All the dead trees certainly
is surreal and a bit spooky, especially if you're slowing kicking backwards
and run into one under the water G

The boat ramp on Quake Lake is another spooky thing. It's the old road
before the earthquake buried the rest of it. There are dead people under
there.

Willi and I ran into an interesting and rather strange guy who turned us
on to Quake Lake. He disdained the Madison and instead fished Quake with
mostly orangish streamer-like flies. He said it was the jit. :-)

--
Cut "to the chase" for my email address.

On Dec 28, 6:11 pm, "Larry L" wrote:
"Mike" wrote

A 9´ TCR #5 http://www.sageflyfish.com/default.asp?p=24
.with a #6 XXD line http://www.sexyloops.com/tackle/xxd.shtml

reading these two pages makes me want to try this combo, but phrases like "a
skilled caster can" pop up all over them and I'm not one.

in YOUR opinion, can an average caster benefit from such tools, or will they
just be wasted $, or worse, magnify his errors ?

That is a very difficult question to answer, as one would also have to
define "average". Let me put it this way, unless you have a certain
level of ability, the gear will be fairly useless to you, certainly in
regard to the situation you originally described. But so will any
other gear. Even the best gear available for any particular purpose
will not give you any more casting or other skills, although you might
be able to cast a few yards further with it, simply because it is
better suited to that.

If you really want my opinion on the situation as a whole, then look
for a good pro, and take a couple of lessons. It must be a good
certified instructor, and you don´t want to go fishing with the guy,
just have him sort out your casting until you are satisfied. You might
be very surprised indeed by the results of only one or two lessons.

This is not meant to sound insulting or provoking or anything like
that, but I assume you are also one of the many people who have
basically taught themselves everything, mainly by actually going
fishing, and you have probably reached the maximum skill level you can
personally reach by this means ( indeed you probably did a long time
ago), and unless you learn something new or better you will never be
any better than you are now. The only way to change that is to take
some lessons. This will allow you to reach another level of skill. It
is also the only sensible way. Buying new gear wont help you much at
all.

I only answered as I did because you specifically asked about the gear
for a specific situation. The gear described is about optimal, but I
have no way of knowing whether you can use it properly, and if you can
´t it will be useless. Indeed, worse than useless, as it will cause
you even more frustration than simply limity yourself to forty foot
casts, which somebody else suggested, and I think most people do.

TL
MC