Best rod/line for ....

"Mike" wrote in message
...
You could just use this;

http://www.fedflyfishers.org/Default.aspx?tabid=4465

TL
MC


Thanks,

I know a certified instructor that is a hell of a nice guy, maybe I'll talk
to him about a lesson or two.

I have, and admit to, a certain 'irrational' fear of learning just enough to
get really screwed up. As it is, I manage to get the fly where I want it
often enough to catch enough fish to keep me playing the game. I fear that
if I get all self-conscious about little bodily motion details I'll no
longer be able to fish as well and will become a total clutz instead of a
self-taught poor caster that can only blame his teacher.

I'm sure this makes no sense, but heah, I've never seen "make sense" as a
rule of ROFFian posting G

"rw" wrote



Maybe, but I'm skeptical.


I would be too if I hadn't seen it a few times. When the Hebgen fish
really get into "gulpering" ( which is different than merely rising for
food ) it is often very clear where a fish is likely to rise next. But,
don't assume that makes it "easy" even at short ranges, as they are huge
spinner falls and many times your fly will be an inch or 3 from the one the
fish actually chooses next. Craig Matthews has described it as "the most
frustrating thing known to anglers" or something close to that. I've not
seen this in fish elsewhere to any thing like the same degree .... if I
manage to be there mid-August I'll try and remember and let you know when
it's "happening" Note: early in August and in Late July ( average of
course) there will be lots of risers but not "real gulpers" .... i.e.
crusing fish feeding in a pattern ... when you ask long term locals about
Hebgen they will make a clear distinction at this eary time and say
something like, "There are lots of rising fish, but they haven't started
gulping yet." ... it's easy to believe you are being sold a line of BS, but
imho "real gulpers" are a 'must see and do" experience for any serious fly
fisher to put on his B4 I Die list

One other Hebgen note for those that might go there ....if the wind blows
hard one day, don't bother the next even if it's dead flat ... seems the
waves churn up everything and upset the fish for a day or two, not just
during the actual blow ( you can still catch fish in more normal stillwater
ways, but you won't see gulpers )

"Wayne Knight" wrote


I know you don't want to buy into it but it's not hype on that fly line.
For $40 more than a standard premium line it had better not be. I'm a slow
action caster and most of my graphite trout rods were designed to mimic
cane and for fishing less than 60' away. But I can shoot that line within
10' of the backing with an old Winston IM6. As far as fishing, if that
line floated any higher it would be hovering. But the texture is really
different and the noise it makes going through the guides casting takes
some getting used to but it is a very good fly line. Personally I'd start
there..


I'll get one the next time I shop for a new line ... I'm cheap, but I DO
believe that the fly line and leader are the two most important pieces of
tackle. As you say $40 ain't much if it's a big, real, improvement in a fly
line.



, that's why I suggested the
BIIx instead. It's really is a nice rod if one wants a rod that is capable
of casting just as well up close as it does at a distance and very good as
a fishing tool, especially protecting light tippets.

I've heard nothing but raves about the rod, and from many different people.
I already have a stop in Twin Bridges ( right? I remember seeing the place
and think that is where ) planned for the summer to test the rod. I
hope to fish the Beaverhead, Big Hole, Poindexter and the Ruby more than I
have in past 'name collecting' trips and stay in that area for some time
this summer.

On Dec 28, 11:25 pm, "Wayne Knight" wrote:

e and very good as a
fishing tool, especially protecting light tippets.

That is also a very good point. Quite a few people don´t like the TCR
´s ( even overlined) because they say they are too stiff/fast, wont
protect fine tippet at all, and are "poor" fishing tools. I don´t
agree with this, I have used a couple of them for fishing, and cast a
couple more. Although the models within the range vary widely in their
precise action and properties ( i.e. a TCR #6 is not just a more
powerful version of a TCR #5 ), they basically do what it says on the
tin.

They are extremely difficult to load at close range with the rated
lines, and I would not even consider using them for close range dry
fly fishing for instance, or indeed any other close range fishing.
There are many rods much better suited. For general still water and
large river fishing, allowing quite a number of methods, they are
excellent rods.

Unfortunately I don´t know anything at all about the Winstons, or the
other line which has been mentioned, but I would tend to accept
Mr.Knights´s take on it, especially in view of his past reviews and
comments on various equipment. Always with the proviso that I would
not buy any equipment at all without trying it first myself, and I
certainly would not advise anybody else to do so either. His
recommendation for a specific purpose would get a rod on my short list
though, were I in the market for one.

Something which is very rarely mentioned at all, and never by various
manufacturers, is the simple fact that not only the objective "feel"
of a rod varies widely, but it also varies very widely among casters
for the same rod, and this is also because casting capabilities vary
very widely from abysmal to expert.

A really good caster can cast more or less anything, and he will
always be better than lesser casters, regardless of the equipment. He
will mostly prefer equipment suited to his style and type of fishing,
and he will likely use the best of that type available for his
fishing. Many intermediate casters are only really happy with or able
to use one particular type of rod, in a certain way.

There are lots of other reasons for some of these variations as well
of course. The pure cost of buying the very best equipment may deter
some, and they will compromise to suit their pockets.

One of the main reasons I built a fair number of blanks myself at one
time, was to try and obtain an optimum set of rods for my own fishing.
many of the commercial offerings, regardless of price, just did not
suit me for one reason or another. Up until fairly recently I still
used at least five of those rods regularly, and have still not found
anything better in the commercial ranges for my particular purposes,
although of course I have not tried them all, but more or less all of
the top models available here at least.

There is no such thing as a universal rod. Some are almost ideal for
some purposes, and completely lousy for others. But all of them depend
for optimum performance in any given situation on the caster´s/ angler
´s skill. NONE of them will improve your casting/catching beyond your
current abilities. The ONLY way to achieve that is to improve your
abilities.

TL
MC

On Dec 28, 11:29 pm, "Larry L" wrote:
"Mike" wrote in message

...

You could just use this;

http://www.fedflyfishers.org/Default.aspx?tabid=4465

TL
MC

Thanks,

I know a certified instructor that is a hell of a nice guy, maybe I'll talk
to him about a lesson or two.

I have, and admit to, a certain 'irrational' fear of learning just enough to
get really screwed up. As it is, I manage to get the fly where I want it
often enough to catch enough fish to keep me playing the game. I fear that
if I get all self-conscious about little bodily motion details I'll no
longer be able to fish as well and will become a total clutz instead of a
self-taught poor caster that can only blame his teacher.

I'm sure this makes no sense, but heah, I've never seen "make sense" as a
rule of ROFFian posting G


I understand completely. It is quite common. Many years ago now,
after a fly-dressing demo, I met Jack Martin for the first time. His
first question was , "You dress nice flies, do you think you can put
them where they need to be?" ( which was actually in response to
something somebody else had said). " I do all right" I replied. He
merely handed me the rod he was holding, and indicated the obstacle
course set up on the pond we were at. I got round it with a lot of
messing on, and when he took the rod back off me at the end of it, he
said "Very promising", would you like me to show you how I do it?".
He went on to do a perfect round with extreme speed and elegance. He
gave me a few lessons after that, allowed me to use some of his large
number of rods for various things, and I never looked back. Of course
I practised a bit as well.

The self-conciousness only lasts as long as it takes to imbue the new
muscle memory. It is merely a matter of training yourself to do
something slightly differently, and iron out a few ingrained mistakes.
This is much easier to do if you have a good instructor. As you are
indeed a long term "self-taught" caster, you will doubtless be more
than surprised at your own abilities once you get a new angle on some
things. Often the improvements in such cases are immediate and quite
massive. In a very short time, you simply "forget" how you used to do
things, and the improved ability actually allows you to concentrate
MORE on the game, and less on the equipment. You will even be able to
recreate the mistakes you were making unconsciously before, and did
not even realise were mistakes, at will.

Try it. Do yourself a massive favour, and save yourself a lot of time,
frustration, and money! Of course, it might cost you money as well,
as you might well want other gear after it!

TL
MC

On Dec 28, 11:29 pm, "Larry L" wrote:
"rw" wrote



Maybe, but I'm skeptical.

I would be too if I hadn't seen it a few times. When the Hebgen fish
really get into "gulpering" ( which is different than merely rising for
food ) it is often very clear where a fish is likely to rise next.

We call that "Hoovering" ( which is the standard British term for
using a vacuum cleaner. Hoover´s advertising was so successful that
"Hoover" became the generic name for vacuum cleaners, and even for the
action, "hoovering up".).

There are not many places where it happens, and not very regularly
either. Can happen with buzzers ( chironomids), rarely with some spent
spinners, and I have seen it happen a couple of times in a massive ant
fall, and once to a massive fall of beetles. It is common for daphnia
feeders, which just move through a cloud of daphnia ( small mostly
planktonic crustaceans, often an orangey colour when en-masse),gulping
them down, and are notoriously difficult to tempt. (Some swear by a
large bright green lure under such circumstances).

I would have thought that the main problem in such a case as you
describe would be detecting a take?

Setting the hook is not such a problem as many would have you
believe. I have caught plenty of fish on very light gear at a range of
over three hundred feet, watching a special float through binoculars
for take indication. Pulls your eyes out of their sockets, but it
works all right!

TL
MC

As the sharkskin is basically a modified XXD it is undoubtedly an
excellent line for some things. May also be of interest;

http://www.sexyloops.co.uk/cgi-bin/t...5;t=7005;&#top

I read a few of the reviews extant, mostly positive, and agreed
largely with Mr.Knight´s brief review.

http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=sa+...GGL_en___DE230

( the first URL I posted also happened to be the first review on the
search list)

One major reason for my trying this line would be the reduced line
flash, and I would go for the charcoal coloured line as well.

TL
MC

"Mike" wrote


...We call that "Hoovering" ( which is the standard British term for
using a vacuum cleaner.


I like that, more descriptive than 'gulping' imho

Larry L wrote:
"Mike" wrote


..We call that "Hoovering" ( which is the standard British term for

using a vacuum cleaner.



I like that, more descriptive than 'gulping' imho

I guess I've never seen hoovering, or gulping for that matter, on
stillwater. Sounds exciting. I've seen it in slow-moving currents with
heavy hatches of tiny flies. A good Trico hatch on Silver Creek is the
best example I can think of.

--
Cut "to the chase" for my email address.

"rw" wrote


I guess I've never seen hoovering, or gulping for that matter, on
stillwater. Sounds exciting. I've seen it in slow-moving currents with
heavy hatches of tiny flies. A good Trico hatch on Silver Creek is the
best example I can think of.



Hebgen can, at times, be much like a giant Silver Creek ... that is a good
comparison

Think of those SC fish that sit in pods "chomp, chomp, chomp, chomp" ... you
can actually hear them smacking their lips .... move them to a big lake,
have the pods moving themselves ... cool stuff G The audible "chomp,
chomp, chomp, chomp" is the origin of the "gulping" term


I see that PBS's 'NOW' program tonight is about the controversy over the
wonderful lands around Stanley ... I looked to see if you were shown, but
didn't recognize you if you were