What to do with my retrieve?

Hi All,

I "finally" got a chance to get out on my river
for an hour after work yesterday. (There is
a trout somewhere in that river bragging to his
friends over my fly he is now sporting in
his lip.)

The spot of water I was targeting was a stretch of
moderate rapids with lots of rocks, vortexes,
hydraulic cushions that trout could practice
their Kármán gaiting.

The one hit I did get was about three feet away
from me on my retrieve. Got to see his head
for a second or so while he threw water over
me and took off with my fly. (Moral of the
story: retie your flies every so often.)

Anyway, the experience got me to thinking about
what to do with my retrieve. I really never
thought much about it before. Usually I am intent
on executing the perfect drift. I know I
got it right when my line moves slower than the top
water and I can feel my split shot occasionally
thumping the rocks on the bottom. Tons of fun!

I fish the drift, not the hatch. This means I
nymph with a lure selection of whatever invertebrate
is currently living in the water and is "clumsy".
I really do not care what is going through a
"metamorphosis" (also known as "the hatch")
I target trout that are Kármán gaiting, as that
is where they are when they are harvesting the
drift.

Anyway, I will typically drift about 40 to 80 feet
at a time, depending on the water. So I really
can not just pick up my line and recast it
when it hits the bottom of my drift (about 20
to 40 feet below me). I like to position
myself in the middle (and side) of my drift.

Question: what do I do with my retrieve?
Steady or bursts? Fast or slow? What does
the group advise?

Many thanks,
-T

On 3/26/2010 7:42 PM, Todd wrote:
Hi All,

I "finally" got a chance to get out on my river
for an hour after work yesterday. (There is
a trout somewhere in that river bragging to his
friends over my fly he is now sporting in
his lip.)

The spot of water I was targeting was a stretch of
moderate rapids with lots of rocks, vortexes,
hydraulic cushions that trout could practice
their Kármán gaiting.

The one hit I did get was about three feet away
from me on my retrieve. Got to see his head
for a second or so while he threw water over
me and took off with my fly. (Moral of the
story: retie your flies every so often.)

Anyway, the experience got me to thinking about
what to do with my retrieve. I really never
thought much about it before. Usually I am intent
on executing the perfect drift. I know I
got it right when my line moves slower than the top
water and I can feel my split shot occasionally
thumping the rocks on the bottom. Tons of fun!

I fish the drift, not the hatch. This means I
nymph with a lure selection of whatever invertebrate
is currently living in the water and is "clumsy".
I really do not care what is going through a
"metamorphosis" (also known as "the hatch")
I target trout that are Kármán gaiting, as that
is where they are when they are harvesting the
drift.

Anyway, I will typically drift about 40 to 80 feet
at a time, depending on the water. So I really
can not just pick up my line and recast it
when it hits the bottom of my drift (about 20
to 40 feet below me). I like to position
myself in the middle (and side) of my drift.

Question: what do I do with my retrieve?
Steady or bursts? Fast or slow? What does
the group advise?

Many thanks,
-T

Yes, whatever works. And if it's not working, do it differently.......
If it IS working, TRY it differently once and a while anyway.


(obligatory fishing story follows)

A buddy of mine and I were fishing Rocky Ford Creek this past February
which is one of the few places in Washington state that has
semi-reliable dry fly fishing in the dead of winter. There wasn't much
of a hatch so the fish were being totally non-cooperative in taking our
midges and assorted what-not offerings.

After a few hours of fruitless casting various drys, I switched to a
'bugger and a full sink line out of boredom. I fished that for about 15
minutes with no action whatsoever as more or less expected. I'd been
using my usual technique of casting, counting down for depth and
stripping in with a slow pulsing strip right along the bottom. That's
how you fish 'buggers, right?

Hah!

Anyway, one miscast was almost right into an outfall screen at the
diversion dam and I hastily stripped line in right on the surface to get
my 'bugger out of danger. A huge bow (nose?) wake came up behind the
fly, a huge mouth appeared, and I almost lost my rod before my 4X leader
snapped. The fish looked to be in the 6 to 8 pound range, which is a
nice trout even at Rocky Ford.

Now, that fish has probably been caught dozens of times, but he'd taken
a 'bugger being stripped in so fast it was almost leaving a v-wake. A
totally wrong technique.

Oh. Hmmm......

So... I tied on a new 'bugger, cast to the side a bit and stripped it in
as fast as I could. Bingo, a 20" (not particularly large for Rocky
Ford) rainbow came up and slammed my fly.

The fast strip 'sort of' worked throughout the rest of the day there,
but was not reliable so I started changing up my retrieve speeds and
styles with regularity hoping to confuse or anger fish into striking. At
the very least I was finally getting a little action, and it kept things
a bit more interesting when I wasn't.

So. Did I get strikes because of a different presentation of the same
fly? Did some fish want a faster retrieve? Who knows.

But it does seem we shouldn't get wedded to any one technique.

my $.02

\s

--
"There is no use in your walking five miles to fish when you can depend
on being just as unsuccessful near home." M. Twain

On 03/26/2010 09:57 PM, Steve M wrote:
I'd been
using my usual technique of casting, counting down for depth and
stripping in with a slow pulsing strip right along the bottom. That's
how you fish 'buggers, right?

Just out of curiosity, is this the same way you would fish a Muddler?


Hah!

A huge bow (nose?) wake came up behind the
fly, a huge mouth appeared

This is one of the reasons I do a retrieve, instead of pick up
and recasting. It is total fun when a trout follows your retrieve,
bow wake and all. As one may debate which is more fun: a dry fly hit
on the surface or a slam on a nymph in the drift, nothing competes
with a trout following your fly on a retrieve. The things that
race through your head: faster, slower, when will he see me.
And the awesome spectacle of looking down a trout mouth when he
finally decides to take. Total fun!

-T

On 3/27/2010 1:06 PM, Todd wrote:
On 03/26/2010 09:57 PM, Steve M wrote:
I'd been
using my usual technique of casting, counting down for depth and
stripping in with a slow pulsing strip right along the bottom. That's
how you fish 'buggers, right?

Just out of curiosity, is this the same way you would fish a Muddler?


Pretty much, except when I don't. I find that (at least when I get
started) I'm a creature of habit. If it worked the last time or works
most of the time, that's what I start out doing.. After a while though I
get bored. And it doesn't matter if I'm catching trout or not. I just
need to do something different after a while.

Heh.

A few years ago I was fishing one of my favorite streams in Idaho (which
SHALL remain nameless) and getting plenty of action with west slope
cut-throat. This was like 3 hours into the day and I'd already brought
in excess of 20 trout to hand, so I was not trying something different
out of desperation.

Anyway, I decided what the hell and put on a #10 Acardo Round Dinny
popper (in orange). Now, west slopes are not downstream ivy league fish
concerned about 'nuance' anyway, but it was amazing to watch them slash
at that popper. I'd caught 3 with it and missed a bunch in the first few
minutes.... and then I hooked a really big one.

Yep, it was big. When I got the fish in a little closer it turned out to
be a Bull Trout. Not a real big bull trout at around 20 inches, but a
Bull Trout.

Which, as everyone knows, are not surface feeders.

So, I took a picture of the fish when I got it into shallow water
(popper stuck in it's lips) for proof, managed to extract the popper
without touching it and shooed it back into deeper water where it should
have stayed in the first place.

Silly char, poppers are for trout.


\s

--
"There is no use in your walking five miles to fish when you can depend
on being just as unsuccessful near home." M. Twain

On 03/30/2010 02:56 AM, Steve M wrote:

Silly char, poppers are for trout.

Love it! Thank you for sharing. :-)
-T

On 03/26/2010 09:57 PM, Steve M wrote:

Anyway, one miscast was almost right into an outfall screen at the
diversion dam and I hastily stripped line in right on the surface to get
my 'bugger out of danger. A huge bow (nose?) wake came up behind the
fly, a huge mouth appeared, and I almost lost my rod before my 4X leader
snapped. The fish looked to be in the 6 to 8 pound range, which is a
nice trout even at Rocky Ford.

Now, that fish has probably been caught dozens of times, but he'd taken
a 'bugger being stripped in so fast it was almost leaving a v-wake. A
totally wrong technique.

Oh. Hmmm......

So... I tied on a new 'bugger, cast to the side a bit and stripped it in
as fast as I could. Bingo, a 20" (not particularly large for Rocky Ford)
rainbow came up and slammed my fly.

Love the story. I can picture it in my mind. Thank you
for sharing!

-T

On 2010-03-26 22:42:29 -0400, Todd said:

I fish the drift, not the hatch. This means I
nymph with a lure selection of whatever invertebrate
is currently living in the water and is "clumsy".
I really do not care what is going through a
"metamorphosis" (also known as "the hatch")
I target trout that are Kármán gaiting, as that
is where they are when they are harvesting the
drift.

HUH? Fish the drift? "Clumsy?" I've been tying flies a helluva long
time, but I am gonna hafta learn how to tie "clumsy" into my nymphs.
I'll tie a clumsy nymph and call it the Full Reid.

Nice tro.......uh, read, Todd.

Dave

On 03/27/2010 05:53 AM, David LaCourse wrote:

HUH? Fish the drift? "Clumsy?" I've been tying flies a helluva long
time, but I am gonna hafta learn how to tie "clumsy" into my nymphs.
I'll tie a clumsy nymph and call it the Full Reid.

Hi Dave,

Here is a tip. Stoneflies live as nymphs for up to three years
before metamorphosis (the hatch). When the nymph gets "clumsy" and
gets caught in the drift (trout food), he floats up-side-down
with his legs outstretched. Next stonefly you tie, tie it
up-side-down. You can called it your "Clumsy Stone". (If you
catch a lot of fish on it, might I suggest "T's Clumsy Stone"?)

The "drift" is a whole different way of thinking than
the hatch. Turn over a submerged rock: what you find crawling
about is what you imitate.

Fishing the hatch is fun too. So whatever works for you.

-T

On 2010-03-27 16:13:29 -0400, Todd said:

On 03/27/2010 05:53 AM, David LaCourse wrote:

HUH? Fish the drift? "Clumsy?" I've been tying flies a helluva long
time, but I am gonna hafta learn how to tie "clumsy" into my nymphs.
I'll tie a clumsy nymph and call it the Full Reid.

Hi Dave,

Here is a tip.

Here is a tip: You are on a flyfishing group with people who have been
*successfully* fishing nymphs/dries/wets/streamers for many, many years.
Stoneflies live as nymphs for up to three years
before metamorphosis (the hatch). When the nymph gets "clumsy" and
gets caught in the drift (trout food), he floats up-side-down
with his legs outstretched.

Yeah, sort of like me when I get "clumsy".


Next stonefly you tie, tie it
up-side-down. You can called it your "Clumsy Stone". (If you
catch a lot of fish on it, might I suggest "T's Clumsy Stone"?)

But surely stones aren't the only iddybiddies that get "clumsy".
Should I tie ALL my nymphs up-side-down? When you tie up-side-down,
how do you prevent the blood from rushing to your head and blurring
your sight?

The "drift" is a whole different way of thinking than
the hatch.

I can only imagine.

Turn over a submerged rock: what you find crawling
about is what you imitate.

How deep is this submerged rock? I've fallen over many a submerged
rock and would love to go back and smash the sobs, never mind turning
them over.

What can you possibly mean by fishing the "drift". There is no drift.
I do believe that you are either pulling our collective leg or know
absolutely nothing about fly fishing. I have been turning over
submerged rocks for 50 years. I know what is under them. And, I am a
very successful nymph (those iddybiddy things under the rock) fisherman
for too many years to count. I am NOT a drift fisherman. (???)

Fishing the hatch is fun too. So whatever works for you.

Yeah, the hatch is a lot of fun, as long as you don't sit in the grass
Pennsylvania-style waiting for it. Man, that can be a bummer,
especially when some smart assed Yankee comes up to the pool and starts
catching fish on iddybiddies.

But there is also the wet fly and streamer, and we mustn't forget the
all important terrstrial, grasshoppers, flying ants, etc. Now I am
confused as to which ones I should tie up-side-down (or should I fish
them up-side-down?).

Dave, in wonderment in wonderland

On 03/27/2010 02:26 PM, David LaCourse wrote:
What can you possibly mean by fishing the "drift". There is no drift. I
do believe that you are either pulling our collective leg or know
absolutely nothing about fly fishing.

Hi Dave,

Hmm. Is this the first time you have heard the term
"fishing the drift"? I would think with your experience,
you'd be correcting me on particulars aspect of the drift.

It is a simple concept: trout are Kármán gaiting in a
feeding lie. You drift a fake invertebrate past them
in the current. You are fishing "the drift". Sounds
like you do it all the time.

-T