PMWS pork entering food chain

Jim Webster wrote:
wrote in message
oups.com...


I only wish that it was true but unfortunately there is nothing to make
up about all the horrible cruelty associated with factory farming.

but the only evidence you have is what comes from those who make a living
out of selling that story
These who somehow neglect to mention that all farms get cross compliance
inspections from government agencies on a regular basis, and also they
neglect to mention that if they have a case, then the RSPCA will be round
there pretty damn quick to deal with it, and the RSPCA enthusiastically
prosecutes.
So how many of these cases they have produced have resulted in RSPCA
prosecutions, or any sort of prosecution?

They are purely scam artists conning a gullible public for their own
financial gain

Count me as one of the gullible public. There is a big difference
between what the government with meat industry input considers cruel
and what most people of reasonable caring does. The very nature of
factory farming is cruel and I for one will never support it and will
continue to support those who are making an effort to improve their
condition. There was a time when the only reason why I would not eat
meat was because of cruelty of factory farming. Realizing as how
difficult it is to change the practices of an industry protected by
wink-wink government regulations, I decided not to eat any meat no
matter how it was produced.

In article , pearl
wrote:
"Jim Webster" wrote in message news:50m60pF1fu3
...

One instance. Your sort of business has put millions in an early grave.

Jim's sort of business has fed millions of people in cities who would
otherwise have gone hungry - or worse.

A colossal part of the Earth's land surface has been devoted to pasture,

Because a colossal part of the Earth's land surface will not grow any crop
suitable for human consumption. Sheep, for example, can roam many acres of
upland grass and convert a very thin supply of nutrient into a form that
humans can eat.

We've done this one to death many times Pearl (Lotus). Jim even offered you
the use of enough of his land to demonstrate your principles and show him,
and the rest of the farming community, where they were going wrong.

You declined then when you realised the impossibility of the task you had
set yourself and so Jim has continued to graze that same land extensively
(look it up - Lotus, don't guess) and to convert its product into food.

Consult google or one of the other usenet archives if your memory is faulty.

Cheerio,

--


http://www.farm-direct.co.uk/

"Jim Webster" wrote in message ...

"pearl" wrote in message
...
"Jim Webster" wrote in message
...

fortunately most people out there know that the sort of person who digs
up
your granny if you don't agree with them is not the sort of person you
can
trust to tell you the truth on anything else either

One instance. Your sort of business has put millions in an early grave.

except that the rest of the world doesn't believe you

The rest of the world increasingly knows that "I" am correct.

and the amount of meat being eaten is increasing steadily

By some. I knew what the outcome would be when I first heard
that mc'murder were in China, for example. Image ... addiction.

The rest of the world isn't going to let their diet be dictated to by a tiny
minority in Europe and America

Many already are - it's starvation if they have been dispossessed
and/or can't afford to buy food, and glitzy façade for the slaves.

so there it is
tough
get out there and get a real life

Jim Webster

Get a job that doesn't involve killing, disease, and destruction.

"pearl" wrote in message
...
"Jim Webster" wrote in message
...

"pearl" wrote in message
...
"Jim Webster" wrote in message
...

fortunately most people out there know that the sort of person who
digs
up
your granny if you don't agree with them is not the sort of person you
can
trust to tell you the truth on anything else either

One instance. Your sort of business has put millions in an early
grave.

except that the rest of the world doesn't believe you

The rest of the world increasingly knows that "I" am correct.


except that they are still eating more and more meat

And I hardly think the Chinese shopper who buys a live chicken and takes it
home and wrings the neck of the animal themselves is going to worry about
whether it was killed in a heartless and industrialised fashion

These people are eating more meat, Chinese government planners are ensuring
that they have the output to supply people what they want

Jim Webster

wrote in message
oups.com...
Jim Webster wrote:
wrote in message
oups.com...


I only wish that it was true but unfortunately there is nothing to make
up about all the horrible cruelty associated with factory farming.

but the only evidence you have is what comes from those who make a living
out of selling that story
These who somehow neglect to mention that all farms get cross compliance
inspections from government agencies on a regular basis, and also they
neglect to mention that if they have a case, then the RSPCA will be round
there pretty damn quick to deal with it, and the RSPCA enthusiastically
prosecutes.
So how many of these cases they have produced have resulted in RSPCA
prosecutions, or any sort of prosecution?

They are purely scam artists conning a gullible public for their own
financial gain

Count me as one of the gullible public.

fair enough

There is a big difference
between what the government with meat industry input considers cruel
and what most people of reasonable caring does.

except the democratically elected government acts on the behalf of the
public in this matter
Perhaps you just think that most people don't care

Jim Webster

"Elaine Jones" wrote in message
...
Quoting from message
posted on 11 Jan 2007 by Jim Webster
I would like to add:


wrote in message
oups.com...


I only wish that it was true but unfortunately there is nothing to make
up about all the horrible cruelty associated with factory farming.

but the only evidence you have is what comes from those who make a living
out of selling that story
These who somehow neglect to mention that all farms get cross compliance
inspections from government agencies on a regular basis, and also they
neglect to mention that if they have a case, then the RSPCA will be round
there pretty damn quick to deal with it, and the RSPCA enthusiastically
prosecutes.

What percentage of the national herd/flock is reared intensively
(don't see how Herdwicks or Welsh Blacks,for instance, could be
"factory farmed")

exactly,
It is very difficult to come across any examples of sheep being factory
farmed in the UK
But doubtless we will be swamped with argentinian examples ;-(

Jim Webster.

Quoting from message
posted on 11 Jan 2007 by Jim Webster
I would like to add:


wrote in message
oups.com...


I only wish that it was true but unfortunately there is nothing to make
up about all the horrible cruelty associated with factory farming.

but the only evidence you have is what comes from those who make a living
out of selling that story
These who somehow neglect to mention that all farms get cross compliance
inspections from government agencies on a regular basis, and also they
neglect to mention that if they have a case, then the RSPCA will be round
there pretty damn quick to deal with it, and the RSPCA enthusiastically
prosecutes.

What percentage of the national herd/flock is reared intensively
(don't see how Herdwicks or Welsh Blacks,for instance, could be
"factory farmed")

--
..ElaineJ. Briallen Gifts/Cards catalogue at http://www.briallen.co.uk
..Virtual. Corn Dollies, Cards, Coasters, Mousemats, Kids' Tshirts
StrongArm Jones' Pages at http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/ejones
..RISC PC. Corwen, North Wales; Steam Traction;CMMGB&Yukon Volunteers.

On Thu, 11 Jan 2007 13:06:31 -0000, "Jim Webster"
wrote:


wrote in message
roups.com...
Jim Webster wrote:
wrote in message
oups.com...


I only wish that it was true but unfortunately there is nothing to make
up about all the horrible cruelty associated with factory farming.

but the only evidence you have is what comes from those who make a living
out of selling that story
These who somehow neglect to mention that all farms get cross compliance
inspections from government agencies on a regular basis, and also they
neglect to mention that if they have a case, then the RSPCA will be round
there pretty damn quick to deal with it, and the RSPCA enthusiastically
prosecutes.
So how many of these cases they have produced have resulted in RSPCA
prosecutions, or any sort of prosecution?

They are purely scam artists conning a gullible public for their own
financial gain

Count me as one of the gullible public.

fair enough

There is a big difference
between what the government with meat industry input considers cruel
and what most people of reasonable caring does.

except the democratically elected government acts on the behalf of the
public in this matter
Perhaps you just think that most people don't care


You weren't so keen on democracy when the hunt ban was brought in, or
when your farming handouts were cut etc.!

On Thu, 11 Jan 2007 13:18:23 GMT, Elaine Jones
wrote:

Quoting from message
posted on 11 Jan 2007 by Jim Webster
I would like to add:


wrote in message
oups.com...


I only wish that it was true but unfortunately there is nothing to make
up about all the horrible cruelty associated with factory farming.

but the only evidence you have is what comes from those who make a living
out of selling that story
These who somehow neglect to mention that all farms get cross compliance
inspections from government agencies on a regular basis, and also they
neglect to mention that if they have a case, then the RSPCA will be round
there pretty damn quick to deal with it, and the RSPCA enthusiastically
prosecutes.

What percentage of the national herd/flock is reared intensively
(don't see how Herdwicks or Welsh Blacks,for instance, could be
"factory farmed")

Oh the joys of being sheep!

Sheep and lambs
People see sheep in the driving rain and snow or in scorching heat and
think it’s all perfectly natural. But wild animals do not stand about
in fields in fierce weather as sheep are forced to do; they take cover
but there is invariably no shelter for sheep. Nor can they rely upon
enough feed, or even sufficient drinking water.

In addition, ewes are forced into producing more lambs at the ‘wrong’
time of year. Every year some four million newborn lambs - about one
in five of the total - die within a few days of birth, mostly from
disease, exposure or malnutrition. Contrary to what some farmers say
(in an attempt to justify the barbarity of fox hunting), fox predation
is not responsible for the loss of so many lambs. Official figures
show that foxes take less than one per cent and those they do take are
likely to be already ailing. The high losses are due to neglect by
farmers, working in an industry that exploits animals at every stage.

As a result of the burdens put on sheep, they suffer endemic lameness,
miscarriage, infestation and infection. Each year, around one in 20
adult sheep die of cold, starvation, sickness, pregnancy complications
or injury before they can be slaughtered. Often, they will die before
a farmer even realises anything is wrong. Lambs who do survive are
usually killed for food at around four months old.

The suffering of farmed sheep
The following statement from a Ruthin, Denbighshire vet, M.W. Allen,
quoted in The Times January 6, 2000, speaks volumes about the modern
British sheep industry (the 'small furry creature' referred to at the
end of the impassioned statement is the fox).

"There are few more pitiful sights on a night call into the hills in
January than a small lamb caught in the headlights, hunched up against
sleet in a field with no shelter in sight. I find it perverse that,
when every year millions of lamb deaths are due to the mind boggling
absurdity of lambing in the worst time of year (December to February),
to poor hygiene and overstocking in sheds, and to ewes not producing
enough good-quality colostrum because they are in poor condition, so
much vitriol should be expended in the direction of this small furry
creature [the fox]."

Lamb deaths: the shepherd not the fox
In other words, fox predation is not responsible for the loss of so
many lambs. Official figures show foxes take less than 1 per cent -
and those they do take are likely to be already ailing. The high
losses are due to exploitation and neglect by farmers themselves.


Some four million newborn lambs - about one in five of the total - die
every year within a few days of birth, mostly from disease, exposure,
or malnutrition. (Henderson, Lamb Survival, Farming Press). And about
a million adult breeding animals (out of about 17.5 million) also die
in the fields annually.

Victims of fierce weather
Farmers often talk contemptuously of sheep looking for any old excuse
to drop down dead. In fact sheep are forced to endure floods, storms,
blizzards and drought. In addition, they are pressed into producing
more lambs at the "wrong" time of year. As a result of these burdens,
they suffer endemic lameness, miscarriage, infestation and viral and
bacterial infection. Often they will die before a farmer will know
that something is wrong.

People see sheep in the driving rain and snow or in scorching heat and
think it's all perfectly natural. But wild animal do not stand about
in fields in fierce weather - as sheep are forced to do. Wild animals
take cover in burrows, in forests, or in nests. There is invariably no
shelter for sheep. Nor can they rely upon enough feed, or even
sufficient drinking water in the summer months.

Size of the industry
The UK has the highest sheep population in Europe, with a 2003 flock
size of 35.7 million. Roughly half were breeding animals and the other
half were lambs under one year of age. About 15.8 million were
slaughtered in 2003. (Defra, Agriculture In The UK 2003).

Like other branches of livestock farming, the sheep industry has been
sucked into a self-defeating spiral in which more traditional farming
methods have been abandoned for the short term allure of
intensification. This trend has been fuelled by massive public
subsidies and compensation packages. About 30% of the sheep farmers'
total income of £1007 million is from the taxpayer.


More sheep, fewer shepherds
But while the number of sheep has increased, the number of trained
shepherds has not. Among the results is a high incidence of serious
foot problems and dirty wool around the tails - the last of which can
lead to devastating infestations.

More pregnancies and multiple births
Under natural conditions sheep will reproduce every spring after a
five month pregnancy. Ewes are physiologically designed to produce a
single lamb with each gestation (twins would naturally be relatively
rare). But genetic selection and intensive feeding have created a
situation whereby twins and even triplets are commonplace.

Lambing time has also been manipulated. Instead of taking place in
spring, between 10% and 15% of the annual lamb 'crop' is now produced
between December and the end of February (Government Parliamentary
Question 04.07.95). The aim is to get the lambs to market ahead of
competition. Within days of their birth, many of the surviving
youngsters are turned out to face the winter weather.

Drugs are used to bring the ewes into season as much as six weeks
early and to ensure that a flock (or a proportion of it) ovulates all
at once. The latter is for the convenience of the farm workers, not
the ewes.

Ewes are 'serviced' by a ram or, increasingly, subjected to artificial
insemination (AI). AI is an especially invasive procedure for ewes.
One development in AI requires surgical intervention. The ewe is
up-ended on a rack and the semen inserted directly into her womb.
Embryo transfer takes interference in the reproductive process one
stage further. Fertilised embryos are 'flushed' out of a 'quality'
donor animal and inserted into a lower-value 'recipient'.


To obtain semen for AI, or to sample a ram's breeding potential, the
farmer masturbates the animal by hand. Alternatively, an electric
probe is inserted into the ram's anus and directed downwards so that
it bears upon his prostate gland. A button is pushed and an electric
shock administered to make the ram ejaculate. "I have often seen the
ram off his feet and writhing in agony having had this done," a North
Wales veterinary assistant told Animal Aid. (Silence of the Lambs,
Animal Aid, 1995.)

Routine mutilations - castration and 'tail-docking'
Shortly after birth, lambs are subjected to two painful mutilations:
castration and tail-docking. Males are castrated in order to prevent
unplanned breeding (even though many lambs are slaughtered before they
reach sexual maturity), and to reduce aggression. It is also believed
that castration ensures quicker growth and better carcass quality. The
castration technique most commonly used is to restrict blood supply to
the testicles through the use of a tight rubber ring, causing them to
wither and drop off within a few weeks.

The same method is used with tail docking. A rubber ring is fitted,
designed to restrict the blood supply to the lower half of the tail.
Farmers perform this mutilation to prevent "fly-strike" or "blow fly",
an infestation which occurs in faeces that gathers around the tail.
This problem has increased with the higher ratio of sheep to
shepherds.

Unless carried out with caution, these mutilations - castration
especially - can lead to serious, even fatal injuries. And if
performed too soon after birth, the distress suffered by the lambs may
be so great that they stop suckling for a few hours. This contributes
to high rates of early mortality.

Diseases
"The health of the British sheep flock is declining... This is true
for diseases caused by viruses, bacteria and ecto(skin)parasites."

(Dr Gerald Coles, senior research fellow in veterinary medicine,
Bristol University, The Sheep Farmer, March 1995.)


A range of "preventive" drugs for a wide range of external and
internal parasites are either injected, poured down the throat, or
applied through whole-body immersion of the entire flock.

The government's official agricultural advisory body, the Farm Animal
Welfare Council, has said it is concerned that "there are many cases
of incorrect and inappropriate treatments" (Farm Animal Welfare
Council Report on the Welfare of Sheep, April 1994) of what are often
powerful and toxic compounds. Needles and syringes are rarely cleaned
or replaced, even after use on dozens or perhaps hundreds of animals.
This leads to abscesses and other complications.

A percentage of animals also fall prey to viral diseases, scrapie,
mastitis, rotting teeth, fallen womb (prolapse), lameness and
blindness.

Sheep dipping is directed against two devastating conditions known as
scab and blowflies. The latter more easily takes root when animals get
soaked to the skin and mud caked. It can result in maggots eating the
sheep alive. Until July 1992, dipping to combat this condition was
compulsory. It was undertaken with a solution containing
organophosphate pesticides (OPs). Following widespread reports of
farmers suffering serious dipping-related illnesses, the Ministry of
Agriculture now require that anyone using OPs must first obtain a
certificate of competence.

The negative impact of dipping on sheep themselves is rarely
discussed, even though the animals are totally immersed in the toxic
solution with their heads held under with a broom or crook. An October
1994 article in The Sheep Farmer listed the "uncontrolled nervous
signs" that can result from accidental ingestion or the use of the
wrong concentration. These included "excessive salivation and tears,
frequent urination, vomiting, difficulty in breathing, muscle
twitching developing to incoordination, paralysis, collapse and
death". Dipping is also associated with an increased risk of bacterial
infection.

British sheep, additionally, harbour various "slow virus" diseases
(conditions with a long incubation period without symptoms). One of
these is scrapie, believed by Government scientists to be one of the
likely sources of BSE in cattle - the latter having been fed infected
sheep meat.


In 2001, more than 6 million farmed animals were killed and burnt or
buried to stop the spread of foot and mouth disease, a highly
infectious illness that affects sheep, pigs, cattle and goats. The
disease was said to have originated on a filthy pig farm. It very
quickly spread as animals were transported to markets and
slaughterhouses round the country. At the time of the epidemic,
livestock markets were suspended for fear of spreading the disease
further. These markets have since been re-opened. However, basic
biosecurity rules are not being adhered to, which means the risk of
another disease epidemic is current and substantial. See Animal Aid's
report, A Dirty Business (published May 2004).

Forced adoption
Around 10% of all lambs born in the lowlands (where most of the high
tech manipulation of sheep flocks takes place) are from triplet
births. Because ewes have just two teats, the "spare" triplet must
quickly be found a lactating ewe with an unused teat. If the selected
adult doesn't readily accept the young interloper - frequently the
case - she will be tethered by a rope, or held by the neck inside what
is called an adopter box. These look rather like medieval stocks and
allow the orphan free access to the adult's milk. The ewe may remain
in this contraption for four or five days.

An alternative is to feed the "spare" by a tube, which is threaded
into his or her stomach via the mouth. Some lambs - already distraught
at being separated from their mothers - are killed or injured during
this process.

Another method is for the shepherd to insert his hand deep into the
ewe's vagina and manually "palpitate" it and the cervix for two
minutes - thereby persuading the ewe that she has given birth to
another lamb. Where a ewe has lost her own lamb, she might be
persuaded to take on a "spare" by this method, particularly if that
spare is cloaked in the skin of her dead new-born.

Shearing
Shearing can be stressful and is often carried out with little regard
for welfare. For instance, recently shorn animals may be exposed to
hot sun at markets without shelter. Shearing of pregnant ewes in the
winter is sometimes done to enable more of them to be crowded into
housing and may leave them suffering from cold. In December 1999, a
National Sheep Association spokesman told The Times (Dec. 8) that
winter shearing "is the future of sheep farming. The fact that you
take their coats off means they have to eat more to keep warm. You end
up with a better meat-to-bone-and-fat ratio."


The idea is that winter-shorn sheep will head for a barn where they'll
huddle together and put on body fat. But with muck and urine gathering
under foot, they also face, within the sheds, an increased risk of
picking up and passing on disease, such as foot rot. But, of course,
there won't always be a barn within reach.

The stresses of livestock markets
80% of UK-produced sheep pass through domestic livestock markets prior
to slaughter, further fattening, or export. Harsh treatment and hours
standing in crowded pens on hard stone floors is the norm during the
bartering process. The Welfare of Animals at Markets (Amendment) Order
1993 prohibits the sale of lambs (or goat kids) with unhealed navels.
Even so, navels are usually already healed within seven days, and
sometimes as quickly as 48 hours. Also, spray products can be
purchased to dry out navels rapidly. Hence, lambs as young as two or
three days old are frequently seen in markets. Often, they will be
with their mothers and sold as a "job lot". But many very young
orphans are also bartered and sold for a few pounds. Lambs may be sent
for slaughter between the ages of 3 and 10 months.

Live exports of sheep
Although the live export of sheep has dropped from the massive 1993
levels of 1.9 million, around 68,000 were exported in 2003. As has
been well documented, sheep endure horrific suffering on long journeys
from UK ports to continental destinations.


Current EU rules allow sheep to travel for 14 hours without a rest or
water. They must have a rest period of one hour after a 14 hour
journey, after which, they may be transported for a further 14 hours.
By the time the animals have been unloaded and loaded within an hour,
which causes a lot of stress, they will not have a full hours rest off
the vehicle. If the destination can be reached within another 2 hours
then they may go a full 16 hours. After the second 14 hour journey, if
the destination has not been reached, the sheep must be unloaded,
given food and water and rested for 24 hours. The journey times can
then be repeated and this pattern can be repeated infinitely.

At the end of March (2004), the European Parliament voted to impose a
9 hour maximum overall journey limit for animals travelling to
slaughter. Before this can become law the measure requires the
approval of the Commission and the Agricultural Council of Ministers.
A final decision has been deferred until 2011.

While a maximum journey length of 9 hours will be a considerable
improvement on current legislation, it is still a long time to be
spent in a confined space with no room to turn around, lie down and
without access to water.

Animal Aid campaigns peacefully against all animal abuse, and promotes
a cruelty-free lifestyle. You can support our work by joining, making
a donation, or using our online shop.
Contact Animal Aid at The Old Chapel, Bradford Street, Tonbridge,
Kent, TN9 1AW, UK, tel +44 (0)1732 364546, fax +44 (0)1732 366533,
email .

Jim Webster wrote:
wrote in message
oups.com...
Jim Webster wrote:
wrote in message
oups.com...


I only wish that it was true but unfortunately there is nothing to make
up about all the horrible cruelty associated with factory farming.

but the only evidence you have is what comes from those who make a living
out of selling that story
These who somehow neglect to mention that all farms get cross compliance
inspections from government agencies on a regular basis, and also they
neglect to mention that if they have a case, then the RSPCA will be round
there pretty damn quick to deal with it, and the RSPCA enthusiastically
prosecutes.
So how many of these cases they have produced have resulted in RSPCA
prosecutions, or any sort of prosecution?

They are purely scam artists conning a gullible public for their own
financial gain

Count me as one of the gullible public.

fair enough

There is a big difference
between what the government with meat industry input considers cruel
and what most people of reasonable caring does.

except the democratically elected government acts on the behalf of the
public in this matter

We got the best government money can buy. Lobbyists' influence must be
restricted before we can have true representative democracy but that is
another topic.

Perhaps you just think that most people don't care

They would care if they knew what goes on inside factory farming and
slaughter houses. I wonder how many people would buy meat if some of
the photos and videos of animal abuse were displayed next to the meat
counters.