Egg patterns

On 24 Jul 2004 19:36:49 GMT, ojunk (George Adams)
wrote...:

snip

Below the surface, trout feed on a number of creatures...the larval and pupal
forms of aquatic insects, aquatic worms, small fish, and fish eggs. Most of the
above, when properly fished, are fished in the same manner as bait. Here in MA,
in late April, I'll often be fishing a Hendrickson nymph, dead drift, bouncing
off the bottom in anticipation of the impending hatch. A couple of weeks later,
I'll be fishing sucker egg imitations in the same place, and in the same
manner. No difference, IMO.

I have to take issue with you here, George. :-) Many nymph patterns will
be ignored, unless you can impart the right kind of movement in them
during the retrieve. OTOH, imitations of land insects blown on the
water, or spent spinners are just dead drifts... to the dry flier. :-)

Anyway, whatever works! I was brought up a man who fished the Clyde to
survive during the war. Some of that hunter/gatherer attitude has rubbed
off, and I'll quite happily fill my freezer during spates by fishing the
worm. Lol. The only method which offends me are the fisheries that let
people slaughter tame trout! Grrrr...

Anybody that tries to outsmart a wild trout, by whatever method has my
respect.


John
"When the only tool you own is a hammer, every problem begins to resemble a nail."
-- Abraham Maslow

On 25 Jul 2004 05:39:10 GMT, ojunk (George Adams)
wrote...:

From: "Sierra fisher"

I was recently getting ready to get into a lake whee the fish were rising
all over the place. At the same time, 3 guys were leaving the lake in
disgust saying "the bite is off" They had been there for three days and
hadn't caught anything...the bite was off.

I asked them what they had been
fishing with......You guessed it..nymphs!

If there was a hatch on, and these guys were fishing with nymphs and not
catching anything, then they didn't know what they were doing.


I bet the suspender buzzer would have been a better bet...

I'm a great believe in matching the hatch... perhaps the rise was caused
by spinners laying their egg, in which case the appropriate dry fly
would have been the logical choice. :-)

Sounds like these guys couldn't differentiate the type of rise... mouth
popping at the surface, head-tail rise, or the bampot leap out of the
water to snatch... They obviously didn't read the fish's behaviour or
understand what the trout were up to.


John
"When the only tool you own is a hammer, every problem begins to resemble a nail."
-- Abraham Maslow

On Sun, 25 Jul 2004 06:09:58 -0700, "Sierra fisher"
wrote...:

you're right! But that is where the novice is led these days. Fly fishing
has become a numbers game. "Fish spend 90% of their time eating nymphs so
you'll catch X times more fish using nymphs". "Boy, I had a great
day..caught 40 fish (the method doesn't count)"

I took a 75 year old doctor fishing one day. When arrived at the water, we
found a hatch. I put on a dry fly for him, and hequickly caught a few fish.
Then he said "lets put on a nymph, I want to catch a lot of fish!"

I find tht this attitude prevails amoungst a lot of fishermen(?) and there
are few people who teach differently

Perhaps I am guilty of holding this attitude... Although I would be
kinder to myself, taking pride in my limited knowledge of trout
psychology. :-)


John
"When the only tool you own is a hammer, every problem begins to resemble a nail."
-- Abraham Maslow

On Sun, 25 Jul 2004 16:28:47 GMT, Ken Fortenberry
wrote...:

Dave LaCourse wrote:
If using streamers (immitating bait fish) is ok, then egg patterns are ok.

Streamers are made of fur and feathers, but yeah egg patterns are OK
(where legal) if that's what you want to do.

BTW,. nymphing is the most difficult of the ways to fish, far more difficult
than drifting a dry where you can see the drag. ...

Pure, unalduterated caca. Nymphing is so easy I've been in places
where if you go three drifts without catching a fish you know that
you've got moss on your fly. Been there, done that, but no more.
Anybody who says catching fish consistently with nymphs is more
difficult than catching fish consistently with dries doesn't know
jack **** about fishing either.

Then I know Jack ****!

It's all down to the conditions. I fished a reservoir last night, using
GRHE, buzzers, dial bach. ace of spades, viva, dry upwings, caddis,
daddy longlegs... the whole shebang! What did I catch... zip.. nada...
SFA... Why? It was a water that was frequented by course anglers and
bait fishers... the trout were so well fed by ground bait that they were
torpid towards anything from nature I tried to imitate.

Fish not only adapt to the natural environment, they react to the way
man impacts on their world.

BTW, if anybody can give me any hints on tying the bronzed teal feathers
on an ace of spades, without making an arse of it, I would be eternally
grateful. LoL


John
"When the only tool you own is a hammer, every problem begins to resemble a nail."
-- Abraham Maslow

On 25 Jul 2004 20:00:35 GMT, irate (Dave LaCourse)
wrote...:

Ken Fortenberry writes:

Dave LaCourse wrote:
If using streamers (immitating bait fish) is ok, then egg patterns are ok.

Streamers are made of fur and feathers, but yeah egg patterns are OK
(where legal) if that's what you want to do.

It's what they are immitating, not what they are made of. I have streamers
that have neither fur nor feather on them. They immitate bait fish. An egg
pattern also immitates another entree on the trout's menu.


BTW,. nymphing is the most difficult of the ways to fish, far more
difficult
than drifting a dry where you can see the drag. ...

Pure, unalduterated caca. Nymphing is so easy I've been in places
where if you go three drifts without catching a fish you know that
you've got moss on your fly. Been there, done that, but no more.
Anybody who says catching fish consistently with nymphs is more
difficult than catching fish consistently with dries doesn't know
jack **** about fishing either.

My, my, my. I seem to have hit a nerve, which indicates I was right on target.
Try nymphing in a moss and slime covered bottom (i.e. a tailwater which you
just *hate* to fish) stream like the Big Horn or Henry's Fork without getting
your hook fouled. *That* is part of the fishing, and if you can't do it (you
obviously can not), then ya ain't gonna catch fish. On three of my four trips
to Idaho and Montana, you wouldn't have caught jack **** because you didn't
know how. The dry fly is a wonderful way to fish, my preferred method, but
you, like a certain departed friend, are too stubborn to realize it. BTW, a
dry fly "purist" who goes steelheading is a hypotcrite. But, that's ok too.
d;o)

Dave, you are a man after my own heart. Purists who say that dry fly is
the only skillful way to fish are like art aficionados who would say
that oils paintings are superior to watercolours. Horses for courses! If
it brings you enjoyment, gets you closer to nature, (the whole
spectrum,) and puts tasty fish on yer plate... who gives a rat's arse?
LoL

Nothing worse than a drunken Scottish newbie, eh?


John
"When the only tool you own is a hammer, every problem begins to resemble a nail."
-- Abraham Maslow

On Mon, 26 Jul 2004 14:18:39 -0700, "Sierra fisher"
wrote...:

Nymphs are what you use when you have dry fly fishing for about 3 hours and
haven't caught anything. It is one step above going home!

I disagree... Imitation is the name of the game. Why are you so against
nymphing? It's just another aspect of the sport.

There are moorland waters, near where I live that have trout leaping out
of the water at dries, because the lochs are devoid of a rich
sub-surface fauna. Using dry imitations of terrestrials is akin to
genocide in these conditions. Put on a PTN and the trout think "WTF is
that?"

Here's an interesting question... I have already mentioned the suspender
buzzer... it is a dry fly... it imitates a lava transforming into a fly
on the surface. How does that fit in with your view of what is and what
is not cheating?


John
"When the only tool you own is a hammer, every problem begins to resemble a nail."
-- Abraham Maslow

On Mon, 26 Jul 2004 17:46:01 -0600, Willi wrote...:

Snip


The Bighorn last Fall was a good example. We were there during a massive
Black Caddis hatch. (It was LOTS of fun) There was some surface activity
but most were splashy rises indicating fish chasing emergers. I fished
mainly soft hackles fished with a lift or swung and a dry with a soft
hackle dropper fished actively. I spotted a nice fish up in the water
column chasing emerging caddis. I cast a soft hackle to it and did a
lift as it approached him. Several casts later I hooked up and a guide
came up and netted the fish for me. He asked me what I caught it on and
I told him a soft hackle. He didn't even know what a soft hackle was. I
showed it to him and he had never even seen one before.

I don't know what it is... sounds like the kind of fly I cut my teeth
on... wet flies, tied with hen hackles?

I learned to fish from my father, who was a devotee of upstream wet fly
fishing... it's a real bugger to master... keeping the line tense,
watching the drift, imitating surface and subsurface patterns with the
same fly. I have to admit, I never achieved the mastery that he did... I
swear the old man could read a trout's mind. LoL

I still try this way of fishing... his indoctrination did bring out the
purist in me. BTW, all the dry fly purists out there would have earned
nothing but contempt from dad... All this talk of using nymphs with
indicators... to him using a fly that made a trout visible was using an
indicator. LoL

I'm not saying he was right, or slagging off anybody's preferred MO...
Well... the sig says it all....

Big hugs!



John
"When the only tool you own is a hammer, every problem begins to resemble a nail."
-- Abraham Maslow