Bob La Londe wrote:

Just stupid? Really. Well, before posting my suggestion I actually

[snip]
newsgroups are made to raise and discuss as I did, not for insulting
others and waste their time. and nobody is forced to respond answers.
if people would just to learn stuff can just go and buy books and search
on Google, not writing on newsgroups.
in a newsgroup I'm free to ask and discuss all IT arguments I want.
I have thousands posts in it.hobby.pescare where I discuss and suggest
newbies how to fish in salt water, as a lot of other people taught to
me.
go to Google and check.
in freshwaters I consider myself not a newbie but I learner, so I've
many answers to ask, so don't waste your time and mine with stupid "go
and search on Google" and do yourself a pleasu don't read my posts
and live in peace.

--
ciao
Vittorix

"Vittorix" wrote in message
...
don't read my posts
and live in peace.


ROFLMAO


--
Bob La Londe
www.YumaBassMan.com

How a fly should be dressed is one of those great controversial topics !

I'm only an amateur, but I think like any keen angler, we quite often start
with a tried and trusted pattern and then over time we vary the theme
slightly to see if it will improve effectiveness. I personally believe that
both colour and overall shape are important factors, but like many people,
I'm still looking for that perfect combination.

Having said that, if there was such a thing as the one perfect fly for all
conditions, venues and seasons, I think everyone's fly boxes would look far
far less interesting than they do today.

If you want some examples, you can find some of ours at
http://harelaw.net/lflies.htm. if you look at the cormorant or the greenwell
spider, you will see that they are quite different to the depictions on many
other sites.

While I'm here, when you talk about realizing, I think you mean dressing
(or alternatively tying).

Have fun with your new pastime

John







"Vittorix" wrote in message
...
Flycatcher wrote:
Well I think that's pretty good for a first attempt - My first fly
was a bog standard black spider although my daughter's first attempt
was more like something you'd see worn at royal ascot!

thanks Flycatcher, thats encouraging!

One other thing, fish tend not to be too fussy about the finer points
of flytying - so don't worry too much about how it looks. Your
creation is just as likely to catch something as the most
professionally tied fly.


I'm trying to enstabilish what is really important to fishes and I'm
discussing in other newsgroups about colors, I don't know if fishes see
really them or not.
maybe the form and the movement of the fly it's more important than the
color, but some people swears colors can make the difference!

--
ciao
Vittorix

Flycatcher wrote:
How a fly should be dressed is one of those great controversial
topics !

I'm only an amateur, but I think like any keen angler, we quite often
start with a tried and trusted pattern and then over time we vary the
theme slightly to see if it will improve effectiveness. I personally
believe that both colour and overall shape are important factors, but
like many people, I'm still looking for that perfect combination.

do you prefer gloom or bright or natural colors?

Having said that, if there was such a thing as the one perfect fly
for all conditions, venues and seasons, I think everyone's fly boxes
would look far far less interesting than they do today.

I agree! fishing it's so nice because you never know

If you want some examples, you can find some of ours at
http://harelaw.net/lflies.htm. if you look at the cormorant or the
greenwell spider, you will see that they are quite different to the
depictions on many other sites.

nice, two things make me curious: the first is the semplicity and the
second is the fact that the hook it's not hidden.
why?

While I'm here, when you talk about realizing, I think you mean
dressing (or alternatively tying).

thanks, I'm Italian, I just moved in Usa and I apreciate emendations

--
ciao
Vittorix

do you prefer gloom or bright or natural colors?
Personally, I like the traditional colours achieved by a variery of natural
feathers and fur., but there are those times when you have a particular
colour you're looking for and you just can't find it in the natural world.
(for instance theres a distinct lack of wild red ibis around here, and even
if there were a few, I think there would be objections to me shooting them
for their feathers


I'm not sure I'd use the word gloom. Some of the best flies appear quite
dull, but I think thats because of the way we humans see the world. If you
were a fish or a bird, the greens and browns are probably really quite
interesting colours as most of their insect food take on these colours to
camouflage themselves. Those that are less well camoufllaged tend to be less
pleasant to eat .
Flies imitating fish fry, and various aquatic invertebrates have more room
for colour. obviously that is not a hard and fast rule.

nice, two things make me curious: the first is the semplicity and the
second is the fact that the hook it's not hidden.
why?

There's a tradition in the north of england (which extends into scotland)
for very sparsely tied flies. Its been around for a long time and is known
as the north country method. Two classic north country flies are 1). the
snipe and purple and the 2). partridge and orange. If you do a search for
those flies, on google you will see what I mean.

Why is the hook not hidden ? because the fly catches fish whether or not
they see the hook. Perhaps the hook shape imitates the curve of a
particular type of insect larva. I can't say for sure, I can only vouch for
them as consistent catchers of good trout and grayling.

Regarding the english thing. no problems, any time. I wish I could
speak/write another language with as much fluency as you.

John









"Vittorix" wrote in message
...
Flycatcher wrote:
How a fly should be dressed is one of those great controversial
topics !

I'm only an amateur, but I think like any keen angler, we quite often
start with a tried and trusted pattern and then over time we vary the
theme slightly to see if it will improve effectiveness. I personally
believe that both colour and overall shape are important factors, but
like many people, I'm still looking for that perfect combination.

do you prefer gloom or bright or natural colors?

Having said that, if there was such a thing as the one perfect fly
for all conditions, venues and seasons, I think everyone's fly boxes
would look far far less interesting than they do today.

I agree! fishing it's so nice because you never know

If you want some examples, you can find some of ours at
http://harelaw.net/lflies.htm. if you look at the cormorant or the
greenwell spider, you will see that they are quite different to the
depictions on many other sites.

nice, two things make me curious: the first is the semplicity and the
second is the fact that the hook it's not hidden.
why?

While I'm here, when you talk about realizing, I think you mean
dressing (or alternatively tying).

thanks, I'm Italian, I just moved in Usa and I apreciate emendations

--
ciao
Vittorix

Personally speaking, I think that the quest for knowledge comes in many
guises. Yes theree are other sources, but to accuse someone of being lazy
because he is asking for information from those who know something about the
subjectIsn't really fair. Surely asking questions here shows a degree of
enthusiasm which should be encouraged rather than be a cause for criticism.
After all, the primary reason I use this newsgroup is to acquire knowledge
from those with more experience.

I hope that at some point I will be able to share any gained knowledge with
others and encourage them in their endeavours.

"Bob La Londe" wrote in message
...

"Vittorix" wrote in message
...
Bob La Londe wrote:

today I realized my first fly :)
http://snipurl.com/firstfly
I tried to realize just taking ideas from other flies, I didn't read
anything about fly realizing yet.

the only thing is that it is a little too much unbalanced, it sinks
down too much with the head, I'd like it could go down less
vertically. any suggestion?

Some kind of spray on dressing?

I've a lot to learn, what kind of spray?

Yes, a lot to learn including how to reap the benefits of other's
knowledge
with out sounding like you are too lazy to do any research on your own.

I think Joe Haubenreich first pointed this out to you in another thread,
but
you have a way of coming off that sounds like "do it for me."

Now I am going to give you a little extra help anyway.

1. First bear in mind, I am not a fly fiherman, but I GAVE you this
basic
concept.
2. Go to Google. Oh allright. Type www.google.com into the address
box
on your browser, and then press Enter.
3. Goto the text box that appears in the middle of the screen and type
in
fly dressing. If that doesn't give you anything useful then try "fly
dressing", if that still doesn't show any good results try make flies
float.
4. a. Now visit all the links it shows you and read what it has to
say.
b. Go more than 1 or 2 pages deep in the search results.
Usually
you can get to all the decent informational pages within 3 or 4 pages of
search results. Don't discount purely commercial pages though. Often
those
people understand that in order to sell product they have to give some
useful information.
5. After spending a day or two studying and learning so that you have a
real knowledge of what others have taken the time to document for you go
back to Google and do a search for answers to your new questions.
6. After doing all of that go back over to ROFF and ask the brand new
questions you have that you have not been able to research and figure out
on
your own. Questions you don't even know to ask right now.

Not trying to be sarcastic (well maybe a little bit)
Bob La Londe
http://www.YumaBassMan.com

Flycatcher wrote:

I'm not sure I'd use the word gloom.

I use a vocabulary to help myself translating from Italian my ideas :))

Some of the best flies appear
quite dull, but I think thats because of the way we humans see the
world. If you were a fish or a bird, the greens and browns are
probably really quite interesting colours as most of their insect
food take on these colours to camouflage themselves. Those that are
less well camoufllaged tend to be less pleasant to eat .
Flies imitating fish fry, and various aquatic invertebrates have
more room for colour. obviously that is not a hard and fast rule.

interesting!
so I should avoid too vivid colors?
I thing maybe the best thing should know the river better and the
natural food is in every period, like larvae or eggs or whatever, before
concentrating about colors and forms. I'd take a mask and try to observe
the rivers :)
when I learned fishing on the sea, I often did diving near my worms and
clouds of larvae :)

nice, two things make me curious: the first is the semplicity and the
second is the fact that the hook it's not hidden.
why?

There's a tradition in the north of england (which extends into
scotland) for very sparsely tied flies. Its been around for a long
time and is known as the north country method. Two classic north
country flies are 1). the snipe and purple and the 2). partridge and
orange. If you do a search for those flies, on google you will see
what I mean.

I found the birds and the flies, they're so beautiful!!!

http://www.danica.com/flytier/bobpetti/s&p.htm
http://www.danica.com/flytier/hweile...ipe_purple.htm
http://www.fishingwithstyle.co.uk/NC...Purple%202.JPG
http://www.fishingwithstyle.co.uk/NC...nd%200%202.JPG

do they work in american rivers and lakes?

Why is the hook not hidden ? because the fly catches fish whether or
not they see the hook. Perhaps the hook shape imitates the curve of a
particular type of insect larva. I can't say for sure, I can only
vouch for them as consistent catchers of good trout and grayling.

perfect!
but the hook should be restrained or can be bis like for basses?

Regarding the english thing. no problems, any time. I wish I could
speak/write another language with as much fluency as you.

my wife is American and we live here, so I must survive :-)

--
ciao
Vittorix

Flycatcher wrote:
Personally speaking, I think that the quest for knowledge comes in
many guises. Yes theree are other sources, but to accuse someone of
being lazy because he is asking for information from those who know
something about the subjectIsn't really fair. Surely asking questions
here shows a degree of enthusiasm which should be encouraged rather
than be a cause for criticism. After all, the primary reason I use
this newsgroup is to acquire knowledge from those with more
experience.

well said Flycatcher!
a lot of enthusiasm.
i changed continent, friends, habits in a year and I had to change from
sea fishing to freshwaters.

I hope that at some point I will be able to share any gained
knowledge with others and encourage them in their endeavours.

it's very good to do so and I enjoy it.
I have been posting in the Italian fishing newsgroup for about 6 years
almost every day and at the beginning I learned a lot, I had the fortune
to meet world champions and I became friend with many Italian fishermen
through the newsgroup. I still share often my holidays and friendship
with them, and daily I respond questions on the newsgroup fishing
newbies passing my knowledge as I can.
that's the original aim and the target of newsgroups.

--
ciao
Vittorix

"Flycatcher" wrote in message
...
Personally speaking, I think that the quest for knowledge comes in many
guises. Yes theree are other sources, but to accuse someone of being lazy
because he is asking for information from those who know something about
the
subjectIsn't really fair.

100% true. It isn't fair, but neither is it fair to ask for a tip or lead
on something and THEN without looking it up or following up on it expect
those that help you to feel obligated to do the follow up for you.

This is the kind of behavior which finds fewer and fewer good Samaritans out
there. Offer to jump start somebody's car and when you discover there is
something else wrong they EXPECT you stay and help them fix it. I know my
example is extreme, but this is the type of feeling this posters brings
about. I have also noticed a different tone to this poster's new posts
since this began.

Some of the tech newsgroups are worse which is why I rarely read them
anymore. "I know you get paid for doing this and I expect to get paid for
what I do, but I am to cheap to pay a technician in my home town to fix it
for me so please take lots of your time and write a detailed reply about
which wire to put under which screw so I can do for myself for free what you
normally get paid for." On the other hand those who start with what they
have done and tried and ask for a little help knowing that whoever answers
them is being generous to share with them somehow don't set me off even
though their intent is the same.

By the way, every one of the threads by this poster that I have replied to I
offered good solid feedback. He just took offense when I told him to look
up something very straight forward and very simple. Even then I gave him
solid details on how to get good results.

--
Bob La Londe
www.YumaBassMan.com

Well its a perfectly valid (although imho a rather cynical) outlook on life.
I have to say though, if everyone had that particular outlook, there
probably wouldn't be much point of joining a newsgroup at all - as everyone
would be be asking for money for any advice offered.

If you really feel that someone is being lazy and "scrounging the
information (my rather sweeping interpretation of your reply to me - I
acknowledge that its a bit more complex than that) that we've all worked so
hard to gain", what was the point in replying to the post at all?

I did notice that you did offer some quite good advice, but again that is a
bit confusing as if you truly believe what you wrote, why bother giving any
advice at all?

John



"Bob La Londe" wrote in message
...
"Vittorix" wrote in message
...
don't read my posts
and live in peace.


ROFLMAO


--
Bob La Londe
www.YumaBassMan.com