Bamboo flyrod

On Wed, 05 Sep 2007 06:19:00 -0700, Mike
wrote:

On 5 Sep, 14:59, Pete wrote:
Gorilla Glue tends to expand as it cures, it could distort or break an
old ferrule.

Traditional "Ferrule Cement" (the kind you melt), gets brittle. Use for
emergency temporary repairs in the field.

I'd go along with Mike's recommendation of a 2-part epoxy.

--
Pete

The gentleman is correct. Two-part epoxy is the safest option here.
This is in any case only "semi-permanent", as relatively mild heat
will also break epoxy bonds if desired. This is no problem on a cane
rod.

Sorry, but no, you and he aren't necessarily correct. Not all two-part
epoxy is "breakable" with "mild heat." Some, in fact, is designed
specifically to withstand heat. IAC, most of these, um, JCPOS (Tim, a
new one for ya...) rods won't last long enough under use for ferrule
cement to get brittle, but if the OP does have one of the few decent
ones, he'll wish he had used something readily, certainly, and easily
reversible so as to be able to refinish the rod with minimum fuss (or
cost). Whatever your opinion(s) on epoxy v. ferrule cement, I think all
would agree that the various "wonderglues" out there - Gorilla, etc. -
are not suitable and whatever one uses, it should be safely reversible
until one is to the point of not shiving a git about reversibility.

Take care when removing the ferrule, as many of these rods had
pinned ferrules. A pin through the rod, and riveted into the ferrule
at either side. If it has a pin, see below. *

Just a comment - IME, _none_ had pinned ferrules (my guess is that it
was because that was simply more work on a rod that sold purely on
price), but on this, I'll readily concede there is no "standard," and
so, there may be 1000s out there with them. I only say this because it
might lead to confusing a decent, if not, superb old cane rod (for
example, many Gillums had pinned ferrules...) with a JCPOS. I have seen
the "combo kit" rods and casting rods with them (well, they looked more
like sewing pins inserted into the ferrules, but...), but not the 2-pc
fly rods. If it does have a pinned ferrule, the advice below is good.

If it has no pin, remove the whippings, and work the ferrule slowly
loose. Remove all old glue by scarping with a blade held
perpendicular to the surfaces. Clean all surfaces thoroughly with
alcohol or similar,before gluing. I would go for twenty minute epoxy
here. Mix very thoroughly, smear the surfaces smoothly but
completely. Join as desired, ensuring that no excess epoxy squeezes
into the ferrule itself. Allow to set at least overnight, preferably
in a warm place like an airing cupboard or similar, ( this increases
epoxy bond strength). Although such epoxy sets up fairly quickly,
final bond strength is only reached after some time.

* If it has a pin, this of course must be removed. The simplest way
to do this is to file the head off one side, and carefully drive the
pin through. It is not necessary to replace the pin, as epoxy gives a
strong enough bond to prevent the ferrule moving much.


Suction
ferrules on cane rods MUST ON NO ACCOUNT BE TWISTED WHEN dismantling
etc. Just pulled straight apart! one may use solder to fill the pin
holes in the ferrule.

And this advice should be considered __ABSOLUTE__ when dealing with cane
rods unless you _KNOW_ what you are doing.

I saw one JCPOS that had started to come apart and the sections/strips
could be "peeled" almost like a banana, with no real evidence of glue. I
even thought that maybe they had simply coated everything in shellac,
slapped it together wet, let it dry and wrapped it, and sold it - it was
an odd thing.


TC,
R

On 5 Sep, 17:23, wrote:
On Wed, 05 Sep 2007 06:19:00 -0700, Mike
wrote:



On 5 Sep, 14:59, Pete wrote:
Gorilla Glue tends to expand as it cures, it could distort or break an
old ferrule.

Traditional "Ferrule Cement" (the kind you melt), gets brittle. Use for
emergency temporary repairs in the field.

I'd go along with Mike's recommendation of a 2-part epoxy.

--
Pete

The gentleman is correct. Two-part epoxy is the safest option here.
This is in any case only "semi-permanent", as relatively mild heat
will also break epoxy bonds if desired. This is no problem on a cane
rod.

Sorry, but no, you and he aren't necessarily correct. Not all two-part
epoxy is "breakable" with "mild heat." Some, in fact, is designed
specifically to withstand heat. IAC, most of these, um, JCPOS (Tim, a
new one for ya...) rods won't last long enough under use for ferrule
cement to get brittle, but if the OP does have one of the few decent
ones, he'll wish he had used something readily, certainly, and easily
reversible so as to be able to refinish the rod with minimum fuss (or
cost). Whatever your opinion(s) on epoxy v. ferrule cement, I think all
would agree that the various "wonderglues" out there - Gorilla, etc. -
are not suitable and whatever one uses, it should be safely reversible
until one is to the point of not shiving a git about reversibility.

Take care when removing the ferrule, as many of these rods had
pinned ferrules. A pin through the rod, and riveted into the ferrule
at either side. If it has a pin, see below. *

Just a comment - IME, _none_ had pinned ferrules (my guess is that it
was because that was simply more work on a rod that sold purely on
price), but on this, I'll readily concede there is no "standard," and
so, there may be 1000s out there with them. I only say this because it
might lead to confusing a decent, if not, superb old cane rod (for
example, many Gillums had pinned ferrules...) with a JCPOS. I have seen
the "combo kit" rods and casting rods with them (well, they looked more
like sewing pins inserted into the ferrules, but...), but not the 2-pc
fly rods. If it does have a pinned ferrule, the advice below is good.



If it has no pin, remove the whippings, and work the ferrule slowly
loose. Remove all old glue by scarping with a blade held
perpendicular to the surfaces. Clean all surfaces thoroughly with
alcohol or similar,before gluing. I would go for twenty minute epoxy
here. Mix very thoroughly, smear the surfaces smoothly but
completely. Join as desired, ensuring that no excess epoxy squeezes
into the ferrule itself. Allow to set at least overnight, preferably
in a warm place like an airing cupboard or similar, ( this increases
epoxy bond strength). Although such epoxy sets up fairly quickly,
final bond strength is only reached after some time.

* If it has a pin, this of course must be removed. The simplest way
to do this is to file the head off one side, and carefully drive the
pin through. It is not necessary to replace the pin, as epoxy gives a
strong enough bond to prevent the ferrule moving much.
Suction
ferrules on cane rods MUST ON NO ACCOUNT BE TWISTED WHEN dismantling
etc. Just pulled straight apart! one may use solder to fill the pin
holes in the ferrule.

And this advice should be considered __ABSOLUTE__ when dealing with cane
rods unless you _KNOW_ what you are doing.

I saw one JCPOS that had started to come apart and the sections/strips
could be "peeled" almost like a banana, with no real evidence of glue. I
even thought that maybe they had simply coated everything in shellac,
slapped it together wet, let it dry and wrapped it, and sold it - it was
an odd thing.

TC,


They probably dipped it in champagne and Caviar, and the shock was
more than it could stand.

Think I´ll have a beer.

MC

On 5 Sep, 16:56, "nrosefl" wrote:
Thanks to everyone for the information !
I think I'll just leave it on a shelf in my garage like my neighbor did
Norm Rose"nrosefl" wrote in message


To be perfectly honest with you, that is probably the best course of
action. Many such rods are simply not worth the bother one might be
inclined to invest. But some people enjoy having a go anyway.

It is extremely doubtful whether you will enjoy casting it, but it
wont hurt you to try, and you might also learn something in the
process. Wont do you any good at all of course, wont make you any
money, wont make Dirty Dicky Disagree less. Wont make you disdain a
KPOS more, quite the reverse, ( perhaps a lesson in itself?), also
helps to prove that war is hell, ( at least as far as fly-rods are
concerned).

After the third world war ( patience grasshopper!), you will be able
to buy cheap IM15 blanks to take home with you. Of course they will
disintegrate if you breathe on them, and future Dicky´s will Disagree
Decidedly.

****.............. Time for another whisky.

TL
MC