rod abuse??

In article ,
(Greg Pavlov) wrote:

On Wed, 26 Nov 2003 14:58:17 -0700, "Rusty Hook"
wrote:


Tell them that you broke the rod on a fish, and leave it at that.
Everything should be fine.


Ding ! Wrong answer (but far too common).

What is the right answer then?

From: (Greg Pavlov)

Tell them that you broke the rod on a fish, and leave it at that.
Everything should be fine.

Ding ! Wrong answer (but far too common).

Many of the warranties I have seen say they will replace a broken
rod....period. No need to make up stories, just return the rod for replacement.
If a person was looking for cash reimbursement, it would be a different deal,
but the replacement cost must be factored into the original sale price of the
rod, so I see nothing wrong in asking for a replacement.


George Adams

"All good fishermen stay young until they die, for fishing is the only dream of
youth that doth not grow stale with age."
---- J.W Muller

Hi Mike,

All these service charges have been going up lately in these tough econmic
times.

We have to see where every manufacturer is for 2004.

--
Bill Kiene

Kiene's Fly Shop
Sacramento, CA
www.kiene.com

"Mike" wrote in message
...

Cortland only charges 10 bucks


Handyman Mike
Standing in a river waving a stick

Bill:

I'm not so sure the economic times have as much to do with it as dishonesty.

For example: a guide told me that he went into his favorite local shop
shortly after Orvis introduced the new T3's - which he was admiring. The
guide asked the owner what he thought of them. The owner responded that
Orvis had the toughest rods, and toughest warranties in the business. The
guide challenged him on the "toughest rod" statement, so the owner told the
guide to get his rod - he would prove it. The shop owner took the rod,
pulled the tip back into a major horseshoe, then released it to smack the
corner of the counter, exclaiming that no other rod could take that abuse,
while the guide was hollering that the shop owner was going to break the
rod. Well, sure enough, when the guide reflexed the tip, the rod broke. The
shop owner laughed and said, wow, that really suprises me - go get yourself
a new rod off the rack.

Example 2: A guide told me that he worked at an Orvis shop in Jackson Hole
several years earlier. One day a man came in with the tip section only of a
broken rod - but the damage looked rather strange. The man said it had
broken on a fish, but he had lost the butt section. After significant
questioning, the shop decided that Orvis would have to make the decision,
not the shop, since the entire (or major portion) of the rod was not
present. The following day a different man brought in the butt section of
the same model rod, claiming that it had broken on a fish. The grip showed
obvious signs of being run over by a car. Upon questioning, the man admitted
that he had laid the rod on the car roof, forgotten it, and driven away. He
remembered it some distance down the road, went back, and could only find
the butt. Actually, the Orvis warranty would replace the rod under those
circumstances (and did so to the apparent owner), but it once again
illustrates the burden imposed on all of us by the ethically challenged.

I think it more likely that the rod companies are seeing warranty returns
far higher than they ever imagined as fisherman decide that a broken rod may
net them a new model upgrade. I'm sure it isn't pervasive, but happens
enough to be a factor.

Jim Ray

--
email SPAM countermeasures require removal of allnails to reply
"Bill Kiene" wrote in message
. com...
Hi Mike,

All these service charges have been going up lately in these tough econmic
times.

We have to see where every manufacturer is for 2004.

--
Bill Kiene

Kiene's Fly Shop
Sacramento, CA
www.kiene.com

"Mike" wrote in message
...

Cortland only charges 10 bucks


Handyman Mike
Standing in a river waving a stick

In article ,
"Jim Ray" wrote:

Bill:

I'm not so sure the economic times have as much to do with it as dishonesty.

For example: a guide told me that he went into his favorite local shop
shortly after Orvis introduced the new T3's - which he was admiring. The
guide asked the owner what he thought of them. The owner responded that
Orvis had the toughest rods, and toughest warranties in the business. The
guide challenged him on the "toughest rod" statement, so the owner told the
guide to get his rod - he would prove it. The shop owner took the rod,
pulled the tip back into a major horseshoe, then released it to smack the
corner of the counter, exclaiming that no other rod could take that abuse,
while the guide was hollering that the shop owner was going to break the
rod. Well, sure enough, when the guide reflexed the tip, the rod broke. The
shop owner laughed and said, wow, that really suprises me - go get yourself
a new rod off the rack.

Example 2: A guide told me that he worked at an Orvis shop in Jackson Hole
several years earlier. One day a man came in with the tip section only of a
broken rod - but the damage looked rather strange. The man said it had
broken on a fish, but he had lost the butt section. After significant
questioning, the shop decided that Orvis would have to make the decision,
not the shop, since the entire (or major portion) of the rod was not
present. The following day a different man brought in the butt section of
the same model rod, claiming that it had broken on a fish. The grip showed
obvious signs of being run over by a car. Upon questioning, the man admitted
that he had laid the rod on the car roof, forgotten it, and driven away. He
remembered it some distance down the road, went back, and could only find
the butt. Actually, the Orvis warranty would replace the rod under those
circumstances (and did so to the apparent owner), but it once again
illustrates the burden imposed on all of us by the ethically challenged.

I think it more likely that the rod companies are seeing warranty returns
far higher than they ever imagined as fisherman decide that a broken rod may
net them a new model upgrade. I'm sure it isn't pervasive, but happens
enough to be a factor.

My friend is a fly shop owner and he told me the reason warranty prices
are rising is dishonesty. He said guides will break a rod themselves
and send it back to the company at the end of the season. They have
down time so they can afford the wait, and it prevents them from having
it break on a guide trip and loosing serious $$

wrote...
My friend is a fly shop owner and he told me the reason warranty prices
are rising is dishonesty. He said guides will break a rod themselves
and send it back to the company at the end of the season. They have
down time so they can afford the wait, and it prevents them from having
it break on a guide trip and loosing serious $$

Yeah, those people who slam them in car doors, ceiling fans, etc are just a
minor segment of the warranty returns...... What a dumbass!
--
Warren
(use troutbum_mt (at) yahoo to reply via email)

In article ,
wrote:

wrote...
My friend is a fly shop owner and he told me the reason warranty prices
are rising is dishonesty. He said guides will break a rod themselves
and send it back to the company at the end of the season. They have
down time so they can afford the wait, and it prevents them from having
it break on a guide trip and loosing serious $$

Yeah, those people who slam them in car doors, ceiling fans, etc are just a
minor segment of the warranty returns...... What a dumbass!

Since the no fault warranty warranty repairs have skyrocketted. So
those accidents just happen to dramatically increase?

And you call ME a dumbass when I have the facts and the anecdotes from
fly shop owners to back it up?

"steve sullivan" wrote in message
...
In article ,
wrote:

wrote...
My friend is a fly shop owner and he told me the reason warranty
prices
are rising is dishonesty. He said guides will break a rod themselves
and send it back to the company at the end of the season. They have
down time so they can afford the wait, and it prevents them from
having
it break on a guide trip and loosing serious $$

Yeah, those people who slam them in car doors, ceiling fans, etc are
just a
minor segment of the warranty returns...... What a dumbass!

Since the no fault warranty warranty repairs have skyrocketted. So
those accidents just happen to dramatically increase?

And you call ME a dumbass when I have the facts and the anecdotes from
fly shop owners to back it up?

You don't have any facts, just the opinion of one flyshop owner, and it
doesn't make sense. I sincerely doubt guides will intentionally break a rod
at the end of the guiding year. I have never intentionally broken a rod, and
none of the folks I guide with do either. In fact, about the only time I
break a rod is when I am fishing on my own, and when it happens, it usually
through something pretty spectacular like a fall.

You should take a closer look at the stated reasons for guides breaking fly
rods intentionally. According to you, if a guide intentionally breaks a rod
at the end of the season, it won't happen on a guided trip? That is just
plain ridiculous. In the first case, it presupposes that fly rods wear out
in a year. That is nonsense. Secondly, clients typically use their own rods,
not the guides'. Guides will carry spare rods in case of accidents, and
these rods would never see enough use by a client to wear out so that a
guide would consider breaking it. Thirdly, fly rods break for a variety of
reasons, and a new rod is a likely to snap as an old rod. Breakage is not
predictable, and a pretty low probability event that few really worry about,
short of carrying a few spares with them.

I think the point Warren was trying to make, and it is a good one, is that
guides are a relatively small component of the rod market. There are many,
many, more anglers than there are guides. The reason fly rod replacements
have increased is because of the increase in rod sales to the general
public, not to guides.

Tim Lysyk
timlysyk at telus dot net

"Tim Lysyk" wrote in message
news:k%5yb.208979$jy.156982@clgrps13...

.....I think the point Warren was trying to make, and it is a good one, is
that
guides are a relatively small component of the rod market. There are many,
many, more anglers than there are guides. The reason fly rod replacements
have increased is because of the increase in rod sales to the general
public, not to guides.

True.....very true. However, in fairness, I believe it should be made clear
that Warren was evidently also making another point.......that Mr. Sullivan
is a "dumbass". I think it is always a mistake in this forum to gloss over
such an accurate assessment made on the first try.

Wolfgang
who realizes, of course, that it may have been a lucky guess but really, the
correct answer is of greater import than is the process by which it was
derived.

"Wolfgang" wrote in message
...
True.....very true. However, in fairness, I believe it should be made
clear
that Warren was evidently also making another point.......that Mr.
Sullivan
is a "dumbass". I think it is always a mistake in this forum to gloss
over
such an accurate assessment made on the first try.

Wolfgang
who realizes, of course, that it may have been a lucky guess but really,
the
correct answer is of greater import than is the process by which it was
derived.

You are right, Wolfgang, I should not have glossed over Warren's assesment,
but I felt it was so obviously accurate that I did not need to belabor the
point.

I'll just go back to snapping all my rod tips now.

Tim Lysyk
timlysyk at telus dot net