Best connection between salmon fly line and leader?

Danl wrote:

I've been experimenting with the nail-less nail knot and the needle knot
version thereof. Why do you say that it's not practical to tie a needle
knot in the field? My vest usually has enough room to carry a needle and I
usually don't notice the extra weight.

I guess I'm saying that it's not practical for me, because I don't
carry a needle and I don't carry a razor blade or sharp knife to the
shave the leader butt to a point. I guess if you carry enough equipment
you could build an entire new rod in the field. :-)

In truth, although I acknowledge that the needle knot is better, I
rarely bother with it, even at home, using either a leader link or an
ordinary nail knot.

I think I've attached a leader butt to a flyline in the field about
twice in the past five years. I just tie the new leader to the existing
butt section with a blood knot.

--
Cut "to the chase" for my email address.

Ken Fortenberry wrote:

rw wrote:

Ken Fortenberry wrote:

The only thing I ever use anymore is a nail knot. I've tried
the gadgets and geegaws but there is nothing more elegant,
effective and fail-proof as a well tied nail knot.


The needle knot is better because it makes a smoother transition
through the guides. Its only disadvantage is that it's not practical
to tie in the field.


I don't like it because I don't like poking a hole in
my fly line. And I don't think a needle knot has any
practical advantage over a well tied nail knot although
I will admit to nicer aesthetics.

The advantage of the needle knot is not merely aesthetic. It doesn't
have the butt end of the flyline sticking out to the side where it can
hang up on the guides.

--
Cut "to the chase" for my email address.

rw wrote:
Ken Fortenberry wrote:
... And I don't think a needle knot has any
practical advantage over a well tied nail knot although
I will admit to nicer aesthetics.

The advantage of the needle knot is not merely aesthetic. It doesn't
have the butt end of the flyline sticking out to the side where it can
hang up on the guides.

I trim the fly line butt flush to the knot with a razor blade.
Works for me.

--
Ken Fortenberry

Ken Fortenberry wrote:
rw wrote:

Ken Fortenberry wrote:

... And I don't think a needle knot has any
practical advantage over a well tied nail knot although
I will admit to nicer aesthetics.


The advantage of the needle knot is not merely aesthetic. It doesn't
have the butt end of the flyline sticking out to the side where it can
hang up on the guides.


I trim the fly line butt flush to the knot with a razor blade.
Works for me.

Even if it's flush with the knot, it's still there and it can still hang
up on the guides.

--
Cut "to the chase" for my email address.

Jerome,

I am using the nail knot but I have not been fishing salmon/seatrout.

I use a thin tube isntead of a nail, because the knot is is easeir to
make with a tube.

Osmo

"The Leaping Frog" wrote in message
...
For salmon / sea trout fishing, what connection would you recommend
between
fly line and leader to optimise solidity whilst ensuring optimum
transmission of energy between fly line and leader.?

I currently use a braided loop but would welcome suggestions?

Many thanks
Jerome

Jerome For salmon / sea trout fishing, what connection would you
Jerome recommend between fly line and leader to optimise solidity
Jerome whilst ensuring optimum transmission of energy between fly
Jerome line and leader.?

Jerome I currently use a braided loop but would welcome suggestions?

I used to use braided loops, but stopped using them because they
broke, got detached from the fly line or had too large loops. Now I
mostly use nail knots. One good tip is to nail knot a section of mono
(about one foot of mono that has the same diameter as the butts of my
hand-tied leaders) to the fly line, and then nail knot the leaders to
this section of mono. This way you don't have to shorten the fly line
every time you change the leader, but only when the extra section of
mono becomes too short.

In medium trout fishing (line weights 5-6) I am currently testing mono
loop-to-loop-connections. This is because of the need to change
leaders more often, and because I don't consider energy transmission
to be critical here. The loop on the line side is made by attaching a
section of 0.021" mono to the fly line, and tying a perfection loop at
the end of this mono section. On the leader side I also tie a
perfection loop. Like I said, this is a test: it remains to be seen
what kind of problems the two perfection loops cause. However, I do
know that many people use this connection successfully. Hint: by
applying a crochet hook you can make very small perferction loops.

--
Jarmo Hurri

Commercial email countermeasures included in header email
address. Remove all garbage from header email address when replying,
or just use .

Jarmo One good tip is to nail knot a section of mono (about one foot
Jarmo of mono that has the same diameter as the butts of my hand-tied
Jarmo leaders) to the fly line, and then nail knot the leaders to
Jarmo this section of mono.

Eh, the knot I use to attach the mono section to the leader is of
course the blood (barrel) knot.

--
Jarmo Hurri

Commercial email countermeasures included in header email
address. Remove all garbage from header email address when replying,
or just use .

Thanks to all who replied. Good to see some valuable experience being
shared.

On the trout front, I currently use a furled leader between line and home
made knotted leader:
* on the line end it is currently attached with a loop to loop connection
but that connection is too stiff and certainly for line #4 & #5 not discrete
enough for my liking. Looking forward I sense I will be using a needle or
nail knot to attach furled leader to fly line. A friend of mine was pointing
out the risk of "sinking the floating fly line if the end of it is not
proparly sealed after the knot is made (as the water gradually percolates
and travel up the fly line making it sink with time. he seals the end with
heat to this effect or puts the tiniest drop of glue)
* on the leader end: the furled leader is terminated by a tiny ring and a
blood not is all thta is required to connect the leader.

For salmon, I am giving some thought to the idea of a piece of thick nylon
knotted to the fly line instead of a braided loop. Several of your comments
go in this direction.

I have to point out that although some of us are agile with their hands, he
who is not that creative or very handy sees a bigger challenge in fiddling
with fly lines, glues and other bits and bobs.
I persists in thinking that this fly fishing stuff is very technical. A lot
more complex to succeed that appears to the eye of passers-by. Anyway we all
progress at our own paces, don't we!

Tightlines
Jerome



"Jarmo Hurri" wrote in message
...

Jerome For salmon / sea trout fishing, what connection would you
Jerome recommend between fly line and leader to optimise solidity
Jerome whilst ensuring optimum transmission of energy between fly
Jerome line and leader.?

Jerome I currently use a braided loop but would welcome suggestions?

I used to use braided loops, but stopped using them because they
broke, got detached from the fly line or had too large loops. Now I
mostly use nail knots. One good tip is to nail knot a section of mono
(about one foot of mono that has the same diameter as the butts of my
hand-tied leaders) to the fly line, and then nail knot the leaders to
this section of mono. This way you don't have to shorten the fly line
every time you change the leader, but only when the extra section of
mono becomes too short.

In medium trout fishing (line weights 5-6) I am currently testing mono
loop-to-loop-connections. This is because of the need to change
leaders more often, and because I don't consider energy transmission
to be critical here. The loop on the line side is made by attaching a
section of 0.021" mono to the fly line, and tying a perfection loop at
the end of this mono section. On the leader side I also tie a
perfection loop. Like I said, this is a test: it remains to be seen
what kind of problems the two perfection loops cause. However, I do
know that many people use this connection successfully. Hint: by
applying a crochet hook you can make very small perferction loops.

--
Jarmo Hurri

Commercial email countermeasures included in header email
address. Remove all garbage from header email address when replying,
or just use .

Hej Osmo,

Actually the only nail knots I did (recently to reattach backing to fly
line) where made with a tube. And the fact that the end tag can be threaded
through the tube is a real bonus
Thanks
Jerome
"Osmo Jauhiainen" wrote in message
...
Jerome,

I am using the nail knot but I have not been fishing salmon/seatrout.

I use a thin tube isntead of a nail, because the knot is is easeir to
make with a tube.

Osmo

"The Leaping Frog" wrote in message
...
For salmon / sea trout fishing, what connection would you recommend
between
fly line and leader to optimise solidity whilst ensuring optimum
transmission of energy between fly line and leader.?

I currently use a braided loop but would welcome suggestions?

Many thanks
Jerome

there are now a lot of lines made with a solid core. Nail knots do not hold
very well ont these because the core will not crush, and the nail knot can
cut and strip off the coating. For salt water fishig, most people I know
have gone to braided loops held on by two nail knots tied close together at
the upper end of the braided loop, then cover the knots with aquaseal or
equivalent. . As someone else mentioned, the chinese finger puzzle benefit
of a braided loop only works if it can stretch, so only the portion below
the last knot works .
I also use braided loops for light trout fishing but I apply Crazy glue or
some other CA glue before sliding on the plastic sleeve or shrink wrap.