Question About Tippet

I took this sport up in October of last year, so I'm still a novice -
pardon me if this is a stupid question,

Last week, I broke off my 7x tippet at least 4 times on strikes. It
broke anywhere from just below the knot joining it to the leader, at
the hook, and other places in between. This happened with two
different spools and types (Orvis and Frog Hair) 7x. None of the
tippet is old (according to the expiration dates, at least). The last
few times I broke off, I replaced the entire tippet - but it still
broke off. (Oddly enough, I don't break off once the hook is set.)

I haven't had the same problem with 6x, which leads me to believe I'm
doing something wrong. I'm still catching fish, but would prefer for
environmental/stealth reasons to go with the lighter tippet. I'm
careful in handling the tippet, and am using a surgeon's knot to
attach it to my leader.

Can anyone hazard a guess as to the flaw in my technique that might be
causing me to break off with the 7x?

And, if you catch an obstruction (tree on the backcast, underwater
rock/ log) but manage to get off. Is there a method for examining the
tippet for damage, or should it usually be replaced as a precaution?

I'm going to ask down at the FLFS (friendly local fly shop) also, but
hoped someone here might be able to shed some light on it.

TIA-
Charles

On Tue, 14 Jun 2005 13:19:49 GMT, Charles Crolley
wrote:


I took this sport up in October of last year, so I'm still a novice -
pardon me if this is a stupid question,

Last week, I broke off my 7x tippet at least 4 times on strikes. It
broke anywhere from just below the knot joining it to the leader, at
the hook, and other places in between. This happened with two
different spools and types (Orvis and Frog Hair) 7x. None of the
tippet is old (according to the expiration dates, at least). The last
few times I broke off, I replaced the entire tippet - but it still
broke off. (Oddly enough, I don't break off once the hook is set.)

Hang on a bit - RW will be along soon to tell you both how
ginchy-wonderful 7x is, as well as give the extensive list of
disclaimers as to the things that will break it faster than a starving
pit bull can eat a piece of carpaccio...it sounds like a peckerupper
pill commercial:

"IT'S THE GREATEST THING IN THE WORLD!!!!*"

I haven't had the same problem with 6x, which leads me to believe I'm
doing something wrong. I'm still catching fish, but would prefer for
environmental/stealth reasons to go with the lighter tippet.

I'm reminded of the George Carlin bit about man being conceited enough
to believe that HE can take out a planet that has survived al these
billions of years with volcanoes, ice ages, asteroid strikes, and both
the Johnson and Nixon US presidencies with a pack of Pampers and a can
of Right Guard...well, he may be right, but as long as folks like you
are keeping the environment safe of things like an extra .001" of tippet
material, I think this good ol' third rock from a minor star will do
just fine...

HTH,
R


*(but remember, if your connection lasts for more than 4 seconds, call
an undertaker...immediately...)

On Tue, 14 Jun 2005 08:38:25 -0500, wrote:

On Tue, 14 Jun 2005 13:19:49 GMT, Charles Crolley
wrote:



I'm reminded of the George Carlin bit about man being conceited enough
to believe that HE can take out a planet that has survived al these
billions of years with volcanoes, ice ages, asteroid strikes, and both
the Johnson and Nixon US presidencies with a pack of Pampers and a can
of Right Guard...well, he may be right, but as long as folks like you
are keeping the environment safe of things like an extra .001" of tippet
material, I think this good ol' third rock from a minor star will do
just fine...


When I used the word "environmental", it was used in the context of
describing the fishing situation - to the water being particularly low
and/or clear, or the fish being particularly spooky - not to specific
pollution/ecologic concerns I may or may not hold.

"Folks like me..."?

Help me out since I'm new he are you normally a hot-headed gasbag?

HTH,
R


It didn't.

Charles Crolley wrote in
:

Last week, I broke off my 7x tippet at least 4 times on strikes. It
broke anywhere from just below the knot joining it to the leader, at
the hook, and other places in between. This happened with two
different spools and types (Orvis and Frog Hair) 7x. None of the
tippet is old (according to the expiration dates, at least). The last
few times I broke off, I replaced the entire tippet - but it still
broke off. (Oddly enough, I don't break off once the hook is set.)



I've had similar problems with Frog Hair in the past. I never tracked it
down to my knots, age, improper storage, or the product itself. I stopped
using it.

I do know that the company sent me a stack of samples of their leaders, and
they came with instructions for tying a knot I don't usually use--I think
it might be the uniknot. I can't tell you why they do this.

Scott

Charles Crolley wrote:
On Tue, 14 Jun 2005 08:38:25 -0500, wrote:



I'm reminded of the George Carlin bit about man being conceited enough
to believe that HE can take out a planet that has survived al these
billions of years with volcanoes, ice ages, asteroid strikes, and both
the Johnson and Nixon US presidencies with a pack of Pampers and a can
of Right Guard...well, he may be right, but as long as folks like you
are keeping the environment safe of things like an extra .001" of tippet
material, I think this good ol' third rock from a minor star will do
just fine...



When I used the word "environmental", it was used in the context of
describing the fishing situation - to the water being particularly low
and/or clear, or the fish being particularly spooky - not to specific
pollution/ecologic concerns I may or may not hold.

"Folks like me..."?

Help me out since I'm new he are you normally a hot-headed gasbag?

Bingo. He also thinks he can write like Hunter S. Thompson. (He can't.)

Regarding your tippet problem, try a softer rod.

--
Cut "to the chase" for my email address.

On 14 Jun 2005 14:09:37 GMT, Scott Seidman
wrote:

Charles Crolley wrote in
:

Last week, I broke off my 7x tippet at least 4 times on strikes. It
broke anywhere from just below the knot joining it to the leader, at
the hook, and other places in between. This happened with two
different spools and types (Orvis and Frog Hair) 7x. None of the
tippet is old (according to the expiration dates, at least). The last
few times I broke off, I replaced the entire tippet - but it still
broke off. (Oddly enough, I don't break off once the hook is set.)



I've had similar problems with Frog Hair in the past. I never tracked it
down to my knots, age, improper storage, or the product itself. I stopped
using it.


Now that I think of it, I'm not absolutely sure I used the Orvis 7x .

I'll be sure to do that the next time out and see if it works any
better for me. Good to know that at least one other person had this
same kind of problem. Thanks.

"Charles Crolley" wrote in
message ...
On Tue, 14 Jun 2005 08:38:25 -0500, wrote:

On Tue, 14 Jun 2005 13:19:49 GMT, Charles Crolley
wrote:



I'm reminded of the George Carlin bit about man being conceited enough
to believe that HE can take out a planet that has survived al these
billions of years with volcanoes, ice ages, asteroid strikes, and both
the Johnson and Nixon US presidencies with a pack of Pampers and a can
of Right Guard...well, he may be right, but as long as folks like you
are keeping the environment safe of things like an extra .001" of tippet
material, I think this good ol' third rock from a minor star will do
just fine...


When I used the word "environmental", it was used in the context of
describing the fishing situation - to the water being particularly low
and/or clear, or the fish being particularly spooky - not to specific
pollution/ecologic concerns I may or may not hold.

"Folks like me..."?

Help me out since I'm new he are you normally a hot-headed gasbag?

HTH,
R


It didn't.

Richie has never been made to understand that simply stating clearly and
unequivocally that he has nothing to say.....or not saying anything at all,
for that matter.....would be at least as effective (and considerably less
trouble) as demonstrating it repeatedly.

Good luck.

Wolfgang

Charles Crolley wrote:
I took this sport up in October of last year, so I'm still a novice -
pardon me if this is a stupid question,

If you look back at past threads there is one on small tippets, people
fly fishing 20+ years can't agree on it.


Last week, I broke off my 7x tippet at least 4 times on strikes. It
broke anywhere from just below the knot joining it to the leader, at
the hook, and other places in between. This happened with two
different spools and types (Orvis and Frog Hair) 7x. None of the
tippet is old (according to the expiration dates, at least). The last
few times I broke off, I replaced the entire tippet - but it still
broke off. (Oddly enough, I don't break off once the hook is set.)

I haven't had the same problem with 6x, which leads me to believe I'm
doing something wrong. I'm still catching fish, but would prefer for
environmental/stealth reasons to go with the lighter tippet. I'm
careful in handling the tippet, and am using a surgeon's knot to
attach it to my leader.

Can anyone hazard a guess as to the flaw in my technique that might be
causing me to break off with the 7x?

I prefer Frog Hair to Orvis tippet tho I perceive the Orvis to be a
little stronger, i think it has less *stretch* than the Frog Hair.

7x tippet is fine and very easy to bust off. Without seeing you break
it, how *hard* are you setting the hook? Are you tugging to set it or
are you just kind of raising the rod and tightening the line? Tugging
too hard, especially with a fast action rod and a reel with the drag
set too tight is a prescription for popping the tippet.

What position are you placing the rod when trying to play the fish?
Overhead in the traditional "Orvis" pose or otherwise straight up tends
to put more pressure then playing the rod off to the side.

How is the drag on your reel set? If there is a lot of start up inertia
when the line gets pulled off there may be too much pressure there.

And Lastly, what kind of rod are you using when fishing this tippet?
Again, IMO, it is tougher to fish small tippets with a fast action rod
than it is with a moderate action rod, because the moderate action rod
tends to absorb some of the energy across the entire rod where as the
faster action rods don't flex as much, too much energy stays in the tip
section. It may just be that 6X is the limit to your tackle. If the rod
is a Sage SP+ or a T&T Horizon I would say 6X is stretching it.

My thoughts, others will disagree.

Wayne

On 14 Jun 2005 08:47:15 -0700, "Wayne Knight"
wrote:

If you look back at past threads there is one on small tippets, people
fly fishing 20+ years can't agree on it.


In my short time here, I haven't found much that anyone agrees on!

7x tippet is fine and very easy to bust off. Without seeing you break
it, how *hard* are you setting the hook? Are you tugging to set it or
are you just kind of raising the rod and tightening the line? Tugging
too hard, especially with a fast action rod and a reel with the drag
set too tight is a prescription for popping the tippet.


Slight tug - less than the BassMaster "jerk 'em into the boat"
approach, but more than just raising the rod. I should try to be less
excitable...

What position are you placing the rod when trying to play the fish?
Overhead in the traditional "Orvis" pose or otherwise straight up tends
to put more pressure then playing the rod off to the side.


Not straight up, maybe about 15 degrees off either direction. Again,
I'm only experiencing this when setting.

How is the drag on your reel set? If there is a lot of start up inertia
when the line gets pulled off there may be too much pressure there.


The drag seems okay (again, only in reference to playing the fish) but
if this continues I'll play with that, too.

And Lastly, what kind of rod are you using when fishing this tippet?

A 5wt Orvis Trident TLS, mid-flex.

My thoughts, others will disagree.

Thanks for the advice.

In article ,
says...
On 14 Jun 2005 08:47:15 -0700, "Wayne Knight"
wrote:

7x tippet is fine and very easy to bust off. Without seeing you break
it, how *hard* are you setting the hook?

Slight tug - less than the BassMaster "jerk 'em into the boat"
approach, but more than just raising the rod. I should try to be less
excitable...


You can also use a "slip strike," where you set the hook normally, but
you hold the line loosely in your line hand so that the line slips
through your fingers. This is useful in any situation where the size
of the fish is large relative to the breaking strength of your tippet;
say, if you are setting the hook on a 10 pound pike with 10 pound
tippet.

Kevin



--
reply to: kevin dot vang at minotstateu dot edu