12/24

Doh!!! I cannot believe I said gas dryer. I meant electric.

Jeff


"Jeff Durham" wrote in message
...
That is correct. If a trolling motor draws 30 amps at 12v for a certain
thrust, a 24v system will only draw 15 amps for the same amount of thrust.
This is hypothetical. In practice, it will be slightly different. That's
the advantage of a gas dryer using 240 volts rather than 120 volts in that
the amount of current will be half.

Jeff


"Todd Copeland" wrote in message
nk.net...
wrote in message
news:a4GBd.57477$k25.3566@attbi_s53...
A 24 volt system only uses half the current to do the same job as a 12
volt
system, a 36 volt system uses 1/3 the current.

So a 24 volt system only needs 12 volts to do the same job as a 12 volt
sytem? Hmmm....

Doh!!! I cannot believe I said gas dryer. I meant electric.

Jeff


"Jeff Durham" wrote in message
...
That is correct. If a trolling motor draws 30 amps at 12v for a certain
thrust, a 24v system will only draw 15 amps for the same amount of thrust.
This is hypothetical. In practice, it will be slightly different. That's
the advantage of a gas dryer using 240 volts rather than 120 volts in that
the amount of current will be half.

Jeff


"Todd Copeland" wrote in message
nk.net...
wrote in message
news:a4GBd.57477$k25.3566@attbi_s53...
A 24 volt system only uses half the current to do the same job as a 12
volt
system, a 36 volt system uses 1/3 the current.

So a 24 volt system only needs 12 volts to do the same job as a 12 volt
sytem? Hmmm....

pat gustafson wrote:

On 1/3/2005 6:53 PM, Bill Durham wrote:
snip Todds

Current and Voltage are not the same thing. Think of voltage as the
rate of flow in terms of speed. Current is the power behind the flow.

Or even visa-Versa. Voltage is the push. Current is the amount of
electricity.


Say a Mack truck is moving at 5 mph and it hits your car...disaster

If a bicycle hits your car at 5 mph..then there is a scratch. Thats the
diff between current and voltage!
BD

Here the voltage (5mph) is the same, but the current (mass of the
truck/bike) are different.


pat

thank you pat....I was close!

BD

pat gustafson wrote:

On 1/3/2005 6:53 PM, Bill Durham wrote:
snip Todds

Current and Voltage are not the same thing. Think of voltage as the
rate of flow in terms of speed. Current is the power behind the flow.

Or even visa-Versa. Voltage is the push. Current is the amount of
electricity.


Say a Mack truck is moving at 5 mph and it hits your car...disaster

If a bicycle hits your car at 5 mph..then there is a scratch. Thats the
diff between current and voltage!
BD

Here the voltage (5mph) is the same, but the current (mass of the
truck/bike) are different.


pat

thank you pat....I was close!

BD

"SimRacer" wrote in messageSNIP

I agree with your advice, though from a different persepctive. 1 single
12v
battery on a 12v troller can definitely give out if one fishes a full day
in
my experience. But rather than the expense of a new motor AND an extra
battery, for now I just added a second battery. I put in a Perko 2 battery
selector switch and have 2 full 12v batteries to use over a day's worth of
fishing with my 12v troller. I've used them one at a time, and I've used
them both at once, in parallel of course, and either way they seem to last
equally as long, all day typically, with neither getting too deeply
discharged.

I do agree the 24v systems are likely more efficient, but even with a 12v
motor, a second deep cycle battery (if you can fit one onboard) can still
be
a good thing until you're ready to upgrade to a nice 24v motor.

Oh, I agree with you most definitely if the guy already has a good 12 volt
motor. However, if it's a fact that he's initially setting up a boat, or
having to replace an existing motor, I'd say spring for the 24 volt motor.
--
Steve @ OutdoorFrontiers
http://www.outdoorfrontiers.com
G & S Guide Service and Custom Rods
http://www.herefishyfishy.com

"Steve @ OutdoorFrontiers" wrote in
message ...

"SimRacer" wrote in messageSNIP

I agree with your advice, though from a different persepctive. 1 single
12v
battery on a 12v troller can definitely give out if one fishes a full
day
in
my experience. But rather than the expense of a new motor AND an extra
battery, for now I just added a second battery. I put in a Perko 2
battery
selector switch and have 2 full 12v batteries to use over a day's worth
of
fishing with my 12v troller. I've used them one at a time, and I've used
them both at once, in parallel of course, and either way they seem to
last
equally as long, all day typically, with neither getting too deeply
discharged.

I do agree the 24v systems are likely more efficient, but even with a
12v
motor, a second deep cycle battery (if you can fit one onboard) can
still
be
a good thing until you're ready to upgrade to a nice 24v motor.

Oh, I agree with you most definitely if the guy already has a good 12 volt
motor. However, if it's a fact that he's initially setting up a boat, or
having to replace an existing motor, I'd say spring for the 24 volt motor.
--
Steve @ OutdoorFrontiers
http://www.outdoorfrontiers.com
G & S Guide Service and Custom Rods
http://www.herefishyfishy.com


Yup, agreed. I figured since I had a 12v motor in place, first I'd figure
out where to put a second battery, and then when I do replace the troller,
all I have to do to go to 24v is rewire the batts into series...to start
from scratch, then yes, that would be the time to decide 12/24 and likely
just go with 24v from the get-go.

"Steve @ OutdoorFrontiers" wrote in
message ...

"SimRacer" wrote in messageSNIP

I agree with your advice, though from a different persepctive. 1 single
12v
battery on a 12v troller can definitely give out if one fishes a full
day
in
my experience. But rather than the expense of a new motor AND an extra
battery, for now I just added a second battery. I put in a Perko 2
battery
selector switch and have 2 full 12v batteries to use over a day's worth
of
fishing with my 12v troller. I've used them one at a time, and I've used
them both at once, in parallel of course, and either way they seem to
last
equally as long, all day typically, with neither getting too deeply
discharged.

I do agree the 24v systems are likely more efficient, but even with a
12v
motor, a second deep cycle battery (if you can fit one onboard) can
still
be
a good thing until you're ready to upgrade to a nice 24v motor.

Oh, I agree with you most definitely if the guy already has a good 12 volt
motor. However, if it's a fact that he's initially setting up a boat, or
having to replace an existing motor, I'd say spring for the 24 volt motor.
--
Steve @ OutdoorFrontiers
http://www.outdoorfrontiers.com
G & S Guide Service and Custom Rods
http://www.herefishyfishy.com


Yup, agreed. I figured since I had a 12v motor in place, first I'd figure
out where to put a second battery, and then when I do replace the troller,
all I have to do to go to 24v is rewire the batts into series...to start
from scratch, then yes, that would be the time to decide 12/24 and likely
just go with 24v from the get-go.

Has anyone ever tried running a higer voltage on a 12 volt motor. Since I am using 2x 6volt golf cart batteries, I was thinking that maybe I could get away with 3 batteries (18 volts) on the same 12 volt motor, and get a little more thrust out of it. What do you all think?

Mark

Originally Posted by RGarri7470

If I had a good 12 volt motor that was strong enough and in good shape, but I
wanted more battery life, I would keep the motor, add a second battery in
parallel to the first and double the time it would run.
Ronnie

http://fishing.about.com

"markm4" wrote in message
...

Has anyone ever tried running a higer voltage on a 12 volt motor. Since
I am using 2x 6volt golf cart batteries, I was thinking that maybe I
could get away with 3 batteries (18 volts) on the same 12 volt motor,
and get a little more thrust out of it. What do you all think?

I think that you'll go like crazy....for a little while.

If you want to run higher voltage, buy a higher voltage motor. You can't
get Ferrarri performance from a YUGO and running 18 volts into a 12 volt
motor is a nice recipie for a toasted motor and/or fire.
--
Steve @ OutdoorFrontiers
http://www.outdoorfrontiers.com
G & S Guide Service and Custom Rods
http://www.herefishyfishy.com

"Steve @ OutdoorFrontiers" wrote in
message ...

"markm4" wrote in message
...

Has anyone ever tried running a higer voltage on a 12 volt motor. Since
I am using 2x 6volt golf cart batteries, I was thinking that maybe I
could get away with 3 batteries (18 volts) on the same 12 volt motor,
and get a little more thrust out of it. What do you all think?

I think that you'll go like crazy....for a little while.

On a different type of motor...

When I was a kid I took apart a couple tape decks and used the electric
drive motors to make model airboats. The more juice I put into the motor
the faster they went. They drained batteries so fast though that I never
really noticed any overheating of the motor. Heat is the main killer of
electric motors.

Basically the motor is built such that it can handle the total electrical
power Volts X Amps going through it. The size of the wire and the number of
wraps in the windings are factors in this. Typical engineering for this
type of application is atleast 1/3 safety margin. So in theory given that a
12V battery at full charge puts out at about 13.5 volts and a minimum 1/3
safety margin would be 13.5 X .66apx = 22.49apx volts. Now even given a
liberal safety margin built into the motor you aren't quite up to the 26-27
volts that two fully charged batteries in series would put out. Also,
figure that even if you could push the safety margin exactly (which is not
practical) the motor is not designed to handle that for an extended time.

Remember when we talked about the size of the wire and number of wraps in
the winding. Well the wire has some resistance to the flow of electricity.
It tends to get warm, but its designed to radiate off the excess heat. If
it gets too hot it will melt. By pushing your safety margins the motor will
accumulate more heat than it is capable of shedding. This will cause it to
over heat and break down. The wire may melt, but also many electric
trolling motors have more than a simple motor and voltage (speed) control).
Those other components are designed to operate within a certain range and
going otuside that range will fry them.

Now add one more thing. With trolling motor manufacturers each pushing to
have the better motor than their competitor, the better price, and the
better profit margin. They probably didn't build them with the 1/3 general
engineering safety margin that you might expect. Honestly, all they have to
do is get them to last until the end of the warranty.

If I didn't care about the life of the motor (like my old tape recorder
drive motors) I might try it, but if you are doing it because you can't
afford a bigger and better motor then I would err on the side of caution,
because you might find yourself with nothing.

I think that you'll go like crazy....for a little while.

--
Bob La Londe

Win a Tackle Pack
Jig Fishing - Tips and Techniques Contest
Courtesy of Siebler Custom Baits
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