Merry Christmas!

Jonathan Cook wrote:
Well I guess it's now old-fashioned to say that, but
some of you might get a smile from the link below, while
others...might not. It's twice the fun if you know
Baxter Black's voice, but if not just pick your
favorite cowpoke twang as you read it.

http://www.cattletoday.com/archive/baxter.shtml

(it's a Christmas editorial for now, I don't know if it
will change soon.)

Jon.

And a Merry Christmas to you as well!

Some would say "Season's Greetings" or "Happy Holidays", but if there
was no Christmas I really don't think there would be any widely popular
holidays in December at all. So much for a season of them.

Where's the ad RW mentioned? Maybe my browser blocked it. I sure don't
see it.

Karl S.

On Tue, 20 Dec 2005 12:41:37 -0800, Karl S
wrote:

And a Merry Christmas to you as well!

Some would say "Season's Greetings" or "Happy Holidays", but if there
was no Christmas I really don't think there would be any widely popular
holidays in December at all. So much for a season of them.

Holidays is derived from Holy Days. So, if you don't believe in a
diety (especially Jesus Christ), there is no sense in saying Happy
Holidays.

Merry Christmas to you and yours, Karl, and wishes for a Prosperous
and Happy New Year.

Dave

In article ,
says...
On Tue, 20 Dec 2005 12:41:37 -0800, Karl S
wrote:

And a Merry Christmas to you as well!

Some would say "Season's Greetings" or "Happy Holidays", but if there
was no Christmas I really don't think there would be any widely popular
holidays in December at all. So much for a season of them.

Holidays is derived from Holy Days. So, if you don't believe in a
diety (especially Jesus Christ), there is no sense in saying Happy
Holidays.

The original holy days were all associated with the sun and the moon.
Solstices and equinoxes were very important holy days. One doesn't even
need to believe in a diety to have holy days in a farming society. Only
those who have lost touch with the original meanings need the crutch of
a diety.
- Ken

Jonathan Cook wrote:
Well I guess it's now old-fashioned to say that

Nonsense. It has always been acceptable for anybody to wish people a happy
holidy of their choice. The pundits saying otherwise are rabble rousing
(and pretty successfully, too).


Karl S wrote:
And a Merry Christmas to you as well!

Some would say "Season's Greetings" or "Happy Holidays", but if there
was no Christmas I really don't think there would be any widely
popular holidays in December at all. So much for a season of them.

I call bull****.
Here's some details:
http://www.simpletoremember.com/vita...eRealStory.htm

The Roman Saturnalia celebration predates Christianity, and the Romans
actually stole (errr, adopted) the idea from the Greeks who called it
Sacaea. And the Greeks stole it from Babylon where it was called Zagmuk.
The solstice was celebrated in Babylon 4,000 years before Christ and a lot
of the 'Christmas traditions' have been handed down from the ancient past.
Note that Zagmuk is very similar to Zagnut, a wicked fine candy bar, which
has been made for over 75 years which predates most of us. Not that that
relates to Christmas at all, except that if somebody wanted to buy me a
reasonable priced candy bar for a present, well, hint, hint, wink, wink.

Gonna open a nice bottle of port tomorrow to toast "Longer Days!".
--
Stan Gula
http://gula.org/roffswaps

"Stan Gula" wrote in message
news:_%%pf.4368$u36.627@trndny01...
Jonathan Cook wrote:
Well I guess it's now old-fashioned to say that

Nonsense. It has always been acceptable for anybody to wish people a
happy
holidy of their choice. The pundits saying otherwise are rabble rousing
(and pretty successfully, too).


Karl S wrote:
And a Merry Christmas to you as well!

Some would say "Season's Greetings" or "Happy Holidays", but if there
was no Christmas I really don't think there would be any widely
popular holidays in December at all. So much for a season of them.

I call bull****.
Here's some details:
http://www.simpletoremember.com/vita...eRealStory.htm

The Roman Saturnalia celebration predates Christianity, and the Romans
actually stole (errr, adopted) the idea from the Greeks who called it
Sacaea. And the Greeks stole it from Babylon where it was called Zagmuk.
The solstice was celebrated in Babylon 4,000 years before Christ and a lot
of the 'Christmas traditions' have been handed down from the ancient past.

And then there's the Chinese and the Meso-Americans.....and many
others.....all of whom were well aware of and celebrated the solstice for
thousands of years before some quasimythical upstart megalomaniacal
messianic carpenter of unknown parentage and birth date (not to mention
basic reality) got mistaken for something else.

Note that Zagmuk is very similar to Zagnut, a wicked fine candy bar, which
has been made for over 75 years which predates most of us. Not that that
relates to Christmas at all, except that if somebody wanted to buy me a
reasonable priced candy bar for a present, well, hint, hint, wink, wink.

I'd send you one but......well, you know how it goes.

Gonna open a nice bottle of port tomorrow to toast "Longer Days!".

Ah! A splendid idea!

Uh oh......just checked.....no port in the house. Oh well, sherry will have
to do. I raise my glass to you and yours, and to all our fellow travelers
on the road to peace, good health........and sanity.

Wolfgang

Stan Gula wrote:

I call bull****.
Here's some details:
http://www.simpletoremember.com/vita...eRealStory.htm

The Roman Saturnalia celebration predates Christianity, and the Romans
actually stole (errr, adopted) the idea from the Greeks who called it
Sacaea. And the Greeks stole it from Babylon where it was called Zagmuk.
The solstice was celebrated in Babylon 4,000 years before Christ and a lot
of the 'Christmas traditions' have been handed down from the ancient past.
Note that Zagmuk is very similar to Zagnut, a wicked fine candy bar, which
has been made for over 75 years which predates most of us. Not that that
relates to Christmas at all, except that if somebody wanted to buy me a
reasonable priced candy bar for a present, well, hint, hint, wink, wink.

Gonna open a nice bottle of port tomorrow to toast "Longer Days!".

I said "widely popular holidays", Stan.

What percentage of the world today celebrates Saturnalia? Sacaea?
Zagmuk? The Solstice? The most popular runner-up would be Chanukah or
Hanukkah, whichever spelling you prefer, but that is a rather minor
celebration of the Jewish faith which is widely recognized only because
it occurs in the same part of the year as Christmas.
Forgotten celebrations to dead religions really don't count as a basis
for a holiday season.
It doesn't even really matter that Christmas is near the solstice.
If Christmas happened in July, the holiday season would be in July.
And December would be only a time of waiting for New Year's Day.

Karl S.

"Karl S" wrote in message
...
Stan Gula wrote:

I call bull****.
Here's some details:
http://www.simpletoremember.com/vita...eRealStory.htm

The Roman Saturnalia celebration predates Christianity, and the Romans
actually stole (errr, adopted) the idea from the Greeks who called it
Sacaea. And the Greeks stole it from Babylon where it was called Zagmuk.
The solstice was celebrated in Babylon 4,000 years before Christ and a
lot
of the 'Christmas traditions' have been handed down from the ancient
past.
Note that Zagmuk is very similar to Zagnut, a wicked fine candy bar,
which
has been made for over 75 years which predates most of us. Not that that
relates to Christmas at all, except that if somebody wanted to buy me a
reasonable priced candy bar for a present, well, hint, hint, wink, wink.

Gonna open a nice bottle of port tomorrow to toast "Longer Days!".

I said "widely popular holidays", Stan.

What percentage of the world today celebrates Saturnalia? Sacaea? Zagmuk?
The Solstice? The most popular runner-up would be Chanukah or Hanukkah,
whichever spelling you prefer, but that is a rather minor celebration of
the Jewish faith which is widely recognized only because it occurs in the
same part of the year as Christmas.
Forgotten celebrations to dead religions really don't count as a basis for
a holiday season.
It doesn't even really matter that Christmas is near the solstice.
If Christmas happened in July, the holiday season would be in July.
And December would be only a time of waiting for New Year's Day.

You sort of missed the point, Karl. Christmas couldn't happen in
July......the winter solstice......get it? Most of the world pays attention
to the winter solstice in one way or another, and celebrates Saturnalia,
Sacaea, Zagmuk, Christmas, Chanukah or whatever.......and has since
antiquity.....they just change the name and the idols periodically. The
Christians merely borrowed from a variety of creation myths (as did the
Jews.....and the Romans......and others.....before them) and stuck some of
their own window dressing on it. Their major problem was that they weren't
real good with calendars........or at making up their minds for that matter.
They missed the solstice.....and they still can't decide whether or not they
like the vernal equinox (about the timing of which they are equally
uncertain).....the whole death and rebirth (resurrection, blah, blah....you
know, Easter) better than the solstice. See, the old year dies.....cosmic
significance and all that.....right? But when does it begin anew?
Hm......is it when they days start to get longer?......or is it when the
grass starts to grow again? Well, what the hell......let's start it both
times! Can't lose!

Wolfgang
i mean, does ANYBODY really still believe that december 25th marks an
important birthday?

Wolfgang wrote:

i mean, does ANYBODY really still believe that december 25th marks an
important birthday?

Sir Isaac Newton was born on December 25.

--
Cut "to the chase" for my email address.

"rw" wrote in message
nk.net...
Wolfgang wrote:

i mean, does ANYBODY really still believe that december 25th marks an
important birthday?

Sir Isaac Newton was born on December 25.

And?

Wolfgang

Wolfgang wrote:
"Karl S" wrote in message
...

Stan Gula wrote:

I call bull****.
Here's some details:
http://www.simpletoremember.com/vita...eRealStory.htm

The Roman Saturnalia celebration predates Christianity, and the Romans
actually stole (errr, adopted) the idea from the Greeks who called it
Sacaea. And the Greeks stole it from Babylon where it was called Zagmuk.
The solstice was celebrated in Babylon 4,000 years before Christ and a
lot
of the 'Christmas traditions' have been handed down from the ancient
past.
Note that Zagmuk is very similar to Zagnut, a wicked fine candy bar,
which
has been made for over 75 years which predates most of us. Not that that
relates to Christmas at all, except that if somebody wanted to buy me a
reasonable priced candy bar for a present, well, hint, hint, wink, wink.

Gonna open a nice bottle of port tomorrow to toast "Longer Days!".

I said "widely popular holidays", Stan.

What percentage of the world today celebrates Saturnalia? Sacaea? Zagmuk?
The Solstice? The most popular runner-up would be Chanukah or Hanukkah,
whichever spelling you prefer, but that is a rather minor celebration of
the Jewish faith which is widely recognized only because it occurs in the
same part of the year as Christmas.
Forgotten celebrations to dead religions really don't count as a basis for
a holiday season.
It doesn't even really matter that Christmas is near the solstice.
If Christmas happened in July, the holiday season would be in July.
And December would be only a time of waiting for New Year's Day.


You sort of missed the point, Karl. Christmas couldn't happen in
July......the winter solstice......get it? Most of the world pays attention
to the winter solstice in one way or another, and celebrates Saturnalia,
Sacaea, Zagmuk, Christmas, Chanukah or whatever.......and has since
antiquity.....they just change the name and the idols periodically. The
Christians merely borrowed from a variety of creation myths (as did the
Jews.....and the Romans......and others.....before them) and stuck some of
their own window dressing on it. Their major problem was that they weren't
real good with calendars........or at making up their minds for that matter.
They missed the solstice.....and they still can't decide whether or not they
like the vernal equinox (about the timing of which they are equally
uncertain).....the whole death and rebirth (resurrection, blah, blah....you
know, Easter) better than the solstice. See, the old year dies.....cosmic
significance and all that.....right? But when does it begin anew?
Hm......is it when they days start to get longer?......or is it when the
grass starts to grow again? Well, what the hell......let's start it both
times! Can't lose!

Wolfgang
i mean, does ANYBODY really still believe that december 25th marks an
important birthday?


I'm sorry Wolfgang, but you are not missing - but rather, ignoring - the
point.

Christmas could indeed be any time of the year, because it seems nobody
really knows the exact date of Jesus' birth. That it was set in December
was a slightly shameful political decision taken a long time ago, that
is true. Mankind, even well-meaning scholarly types, can get political.

However, Christmas is in fact the celebration of the birth of Jesus, the
Christ. The salvation of mankind is worth celebrating.

You will of course continue to ignore this, for the sheer malicious fun
of it. By all means do so, for this time of year is the hatching season
for Christ-haters, if that is how you celebrate the winter solstice.
By the way, celebrate it today.

Not on the 25th. That's Christmas.

Karl S.