Tuna salad anyone? Death of a Tuna and Deathof a Whale

"Rodney Long" wrote in message ...
pearl wrote:


restore

"The implication is that older hominids practised nut-cracking
like the chimps."

Could be true,, but "Modern" man was a hunter, and killer from the get
go,

How?

end restore

'Brown says that pushing the emergence of Homo sapiens from
about 160,000 years ago back to about 195,000 years ago "is
significant because the cultural aspects of humanity in most cases
appear much later in the record - only 50,000 years ago - which
would mean 150,000 years of Homo sapiens without cultural stuff,
such as evidence of eating fish, of harpoons, anything to do with
music (flutes and that sort of thing), needles, even tools. This
stuff all comes in very late, except for stone knife blades, which
appeared between 50,000 and 200,000 years ago, depending on
whom you believe."

Fleagle adds: "There is a huge debate in the archeological literature
regarding the first appearance of modern aspects of behavior such
as bone carving for religious reasons, or tools (harpoons and things),
ornamentation (bead jewelry and such), drawn images, arrowheads.
They only appear as a coherent package about 50,000 years ago,
and the first modern humans that left Africa between 50,000 and
40,000 years ago seem to have had the full set. As modern human
anatomy is documented at earlier and earlier sites, it becomes
evident that there was a great time gap between the appearance of
the modern skeleton and 'modern behavior.'"

So this proves that man's "intelligence" did not mature (the making of
tools, not just killing and butchering tools) until he started eating
meat. This also is a good theory why vegetarians today, are loosing
their cognitive thinking ability, they are also actually loosing their
"basic survival" instinks

Evolution happens over very, very long periods of time, not overnight.
A history of millions of years of progressive adaptation and learning
brought primates to hominids to man to the point where more complex
tasks could be devised and carried out, and necessity in a cold climate
presented new challenges which drove technological advance - in the
making of tools and weapons for *needed* food in the form of meat,
warm clothing *needed* to survive in colder conditions, and houses.
It was not meat and hunting per se that brought about technological
advance, - environmental conditions demanded change in the culture.
And, when stuck indoors with others, rather than foraging in loose
groups in the big outdoors, you'll understand that there is a lot more
time to sit and communicate ... stories and legends are born.. making
carvings, paintings, and so on ... there's time to imagine and visualize ..

..
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases...0223122209.htm

so was Neanderthal Man, they both ate meat and veggies,,

"COLUMBUS, Ohio - The bands of ancient Neanderthals
that struggled throughout Europe during the last Ice Age
faced challenges no tougher than those confronted by the
modern Inuit, or Eskimos.
..
[..] the short lifespans of Neanderthals and evidence of
arthritis in their skeletons suggests that their lives were
extremely difficult.
..
Guatelli-Steinberg has spent the last decade investigating
tiny defects -- linear enamel hypoplasia -- in tooth enamel
from primates, modern and early humans. These defects
serve as markers of periods during early childhood when
food was scarce and nutrition was low.

These tiny horizontal lines and grooves in tooth enamel
form when the body faces either a systemic illness or a
severely deficient diet. In essence, they are reminders of
times when the body's normal process of forming tooth
enamel during childhood simply shut down for a period
of time.

"Looking at these fossilized teeth, you can easily see these
defects that showed Neanderthals periodically struggled
nutritionally," she said. "But I wanted to know if that
struggle was any harder than that of more modern humans."
..
"The evidence shows that Neanderthals were no worse
off than the Inuit who lived in equally harsh environmental
conditions," she said, despite the fact that the Inuit use more
advanced technology.

"It is somewhat startling that Neanderthals weren't suffering
as badly as people had thought, relative to a modern human
group (the Inuits)."

And in both cases their "primary" source of food, if not their total
source, was MEAT !

Yes.

..'
http://researchnews.osu.edu/archive/neander.htm

The Neanderthals ..... ?? The Inuit don't fare very well either..

'American Journal of Clinical Nutrition, Vol 27, 916-925, 1974
Bone mineral content of North Alaskan Eskimos
Richard B. Mazess Ph.D.1 and Warren Mather B.S.1
1 From the Bone Mineral Laboratory, Department of Radiology
(Medical Physics), University of Wisconsin Hospital, Madison,
Wisconsin 53706
Direct photon absorptiometry was used to measure the bone
mineral content of forearm bones in Eskimo natives of the north
coast of Alaska. The sample consisted of 217 children, 89 adults,
and 107 elderly (over 50 years). Eskimo children had a lower
bone mineral content than United States whites by 5 to 10% but
this was consistent with their smaller body and bone size. Young
Eskimo adults (20 to 39 years) of both sexes were similar to whites,
but after age 40 the Eskimos of both sexes had a deficit of from
10 to 15% relative to white standards. Aging bone loss, which
occurs in many populations, has an earlier onset and greater
intensity in the Eskimos. Nutritional factors of high protein,
high nitrogen, high phosphorus, and low calcium intakes may
be implicated.
http://www.ajcn.org/cgi/content/abstract/27/9/916

'First Nations people and Inuit have higher rates of injury,
suicide and diabetes.'
http://www.hc-sc.gc.ca/fnih-spni/index_e.html

'Combined, circulatory diseases (23% of all deaths) and injury
(22%) account for nearly half of all mortality among First Nations.
In Canada, circulatory diseases account for 37% of all deaths,
followed by cancer (27%).
..
For First Nations aged 45 years and older, circulatory disease
was the most common cause of death.
..'
http://www.hc-sc.gc.ca/fnih-spni/pub..._profil_e.html

'Ethnographic parallels with modern hunter-gatherer communities have
been taken to show that the colder the climate, the greater the reliance
on meat. There are sound biological and economic reasons for this, not
least in the ready availability of large amounts of fat in arctic mammals.
From this, it has been deduced that the humans of the glacial periods
were primarily hunters, while plant foods were more important during
the interglacials. '
http://www.phancocks.pwp.blueyonder..../devensian.htm

'Anthropologically speaking, humans were high consumers of calcium
until the onset of the Agricultural Age, 10,000 years ago. Current
calcium intake is one-quarter to one-third that of our evolutionary diet
and, if we are genetically identical to the Late Paleolithic Homo sapiens,
we may be consuming a calcium-deficient diet our bodies cannot adjust
to by physiologic mechanisms.

The anthropological approach says, with the exception of a few small
changes related to genetic blood diseases, that humans are basically
identical biologically and medically to the hunter-gatherers of the late
Paleolithic Era.17 During this period, calcium content of the diet was
much higher than it is currently. Depending on the ratio of animal to
plant foods, calcium intake could have exceeded 2000 mg per day.17
Calcium was largely derived from wild plants, which had a very high
calcium content; animal protein played a small role, and the use of
dairy products did not come into play until the Agricultural Age
10,000 years ago. Compared to the current intake of approximately
500 mg per day for women age 20 and over in the United States,18
hunter-gatherers had a significantly higher calcium intake and
apparently much stronger bones. As late as 12,000 years ago,
Stone Age hunters had an average of 17-percent more bone density
(as measured by humeral cortical thickness). Bone density also
appeared to be stable over time with an apparent absence of
osteoporosis.17

High levels of calcium excretion via renal losses are seen with both
high salt and high protein diets, in each case at levels common in the
United States.10,11
..
The only hunter-gatherers that seemed to fall prey to bone loss were
the aboriginal Inuit (Eskimos). Although their physical activity level
was high, their osteoporosis incidence exceeded even present-day
levels in the United States. The Inuit diet was high in phosphorus
and protein and low in calcium.20
..'
http://www.thorne.com/altmedrev/full...alcium4-2.html

so do I :-)

'Campbell TC, Junshi C. Diet and chronic degenerative diseases:
perspectives from China. Am J Clin Nutr 1994 May;59(5 Suppl):
1153S-1161S.
A comprehensive ecologic survey of dietary, life-style, and mortality
characteristics of 65 counties in rural China showed that diets are
substantially richer in foods of plant origin when compared with
diets consumed in the more industrialized, Western societies. Mean
intakes of animal protein (about one-tenth of the mean intake in the
United States as energy percent), total fat (14.5% of energy), and
dietary fiber (33.3 g/d) reflected a substantial preference for foods
of plant origin. Mean plasma cholesterol concentration, at
approximately 3.23-3.49 mmol/L, corresponds to this dietary
life-style. The principal hypothesis under investigation in this paper
is that chronic degenerative diseases are prevented by an aggregate
effect of nutrients and nutrient-intake amounts that are commonly
supplied by foods of plant origin. The breadth and consistency of
evidence for this hypothesis was investigated with multiple intake-
biomarker-disease associations, which were appropriately adjusted.
There appears to be no threshold of plant-food enrichment or
minimization of fat intake beyond which further disease prevention
does not occur. These findings suggest that even small intakes of
foods of animal origin are associated with significant increases in
plasma cholesterol concentrations, which are associated, in turn,
with significant increases in chronic degenerative disease mortality
rates.


I eat MEAT three times a day, I'm 53 years old, my cholesterol
level,,,,,, ""91"" ,,,,, which is lower than most vegetarians. There is
a whole lot more involved in cholesterol levels than just eating, or not
eating meat

Every morning I have two eggs and four strips of bacon, for lunch their
will be either ground beef or chicken, for dinner, Steak, pork, chicken
or fish , with about 40 venison meals through the year. I also consume
at least 1/2 lb of "real" butter a week

I have ZERO heart disease, but I still had them do an echo cardiogram at
my last physical, it was perfect.

My Doctor says that all this is impossible, because of my diet. No, Not
really, I eat huge quantities of powdered GARLIC, I eat it on, and in
everything. I have for my whole life.

I have lost 115 lbs over the last two years, and kept it off, what I
stopped eating was bread and sugar or anything made with processed
flour, and processed sugar,, those are the two things that will kill
you, not meat

Anecdotal evidence. Hmm to that. Sorry.

'Am J Clin Nutr 1999 Sep;70(3 Suppl):532S-538S
Associations between diet and cancer, ischemic heart disease,
and all-cause mortality in non-Hispanic white California
Seventh-day Adventists.
Fraser GE. Center for Health Research and the Department of
Epidemiology and Biostatistics, Loma Linda University, CA USA.

Results associating diet with chronic disease in a cohort of 34192
California Seventh-day Adventists are summarized. Most Seventh-day
Adventists do not smoke cigarettes or drink alcohol, and there is a wide
range of dietary exposures within the population. About 50% of those
studied ate meat products 1 time/wk or not at all, and vegetarians
consumed more tomatoes, legumes, nuts, and fruit, but less coffee,
doughnuts, and eggs than did nonvegetarians. Multivariate analyses
showed significant associations between beef consumption and fatal
ischemic heart disease (IHD) in men [relative risk (RR) = 2.31 for
subjects who ate beef or =3 times/wk compared with vegetarians],
significant protective associations between nut consumption and fatal
and nonfatal IHD in both sexes (RR approximately 0.5 for subjects
who ate nuts or =5 times/wk compared with those who ate nuts
1 time/wk), and reduced risk of IHD in subjects preferring whole-grain
to white bread. The lifetime risk of IHD was reduced by approximately
31% in those who consumed nuts frequently and by 37% in male
vegetarians compared with nonvegetarians. Cancers of the colon and
prostate were significantly more likely in nonvegetarians (RR of 1.88
and 1.54, respectively), and frequent beef consumers also had higher
risk of bladder cancer. Intake of legumes was negatively associated
with risk of colon cancer in nonvegetarians and risk of pancreatic
cancer. Higher consumption of all fruit or dried fruit was associated
with lower risks of lung, prostate, and pancreatic cancers.
Cross-sectional data suggest vegetarian Seventh-day Adventists have
lower risks of diabetes mellitus, hypertension, and arthritis than
nonvegetarians. Thus, among Seventh-day Adventists, vegetarians are
healthier than nonvegetarians but this cannot be ascribed only to the
absence of meat. - PMID: 10479227'