Thank you, Mr. O.

On 2010-01-21 20:57:59 -0500, jh said:

On Jan 21, 5:50*pm, Giles wrote:
On Jan 21, 6:33*pm, "Tom Littleton" wrote:

"jh" wrote in message

John

P.s. I'll save Giles the trouble

idiot

you didn't really have to add that last part. You've clearly shown your
intellect without tacking on such a concise self-descriptive tag after
your
name.......

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
* * * sheesh!
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
* * * * Tom

Nicely said.

I like that.

giles
like, who wouldn't have guessed, right? * * *

ok, i'm begining to get it - what we need then is good income, but not
income at the expense of others- that about right? Also, since its
health insurance is too profitable for the ins. co's - they need to be
eliminated. I think I'm catching on.

What about say, auto insurance, liability insurance for contractors?
(there is good one to eliminate- lets start on that one next-ok?
Someone is making too much here, (I just lost $25,000 worth of small
equipment yesterday to theft - insurance is already denying coverage)

how about work comp? i like the idea of eliminating those guys too.-
they cost me a fortune every year - obviously that has to be wrong. I
mean for structural steel work, i pay almost as mcuh insurance as I do
wages (75% IIRC)

And pensions- multiemployer pension funds are in deep dark **** right
now, yet they are a huge expense for those of us unlucky enough to pay
into them, and are financially liable for them if they fail (thank you
IRS). We need to get started on those while we are fixing things.

this could be good, i see now. ve vill all march together like gut
little vorkers and ve vill sing happy songs, for uncle joe, er sam.

you know rose colored glasses work really well shooting in certain
light conditions. not so much in the real world.

I think I need to get a job where someone else gets to worry all night
about this ****, i'll just worry my empty little head about whether I
should fish the Madison this weekend, or maybe the Clearwater? what
do you think?

john

knuclehead

John, you are forgetting: "From each according to his ability, to each
according to his need ." *That's* what most of these liberal,
progressive mutton heads believe and *want*. But, it doesn't work,
does it? Try telling them that.

Madison works for me. Enjoy. I'll be fishing delayed harvest this
week-end - stocked trout that have wintered over. Come May I will move
north to New England and fish my beloved Rapid River.

Dave

On Jan 21, 8:41*pm, David LaCourse wrote:
On 2010-01-21 20:57:59 -0500, jh said:





On Jan 21, 5:50 pm, Giles wrote:
On Jan 21, 6:33 pm, "Tom Littleton" wrote:

"jh" wrote in message

John

P.s. I'll save Giles the trouble

idiot

you didn't really have to add that last part. You've clearly shown your
intellect without tacking on such a concise self-descriptive tag after
your
name.......


* sheesh!

* Tom

Nicely said.

I like that.

giles
like, who wouldn't have guessed, right?

ok, i'm begining to get it - what we need then is good income, but not
income at the expense of others- that about right? *Also, since its
health insurance is too profitable for the ins. co's - they need to be
eliminated. *I think I'm catching on.

What about say, auto insurance, liability insurance for contractors?
(there is good one to eliminate- lets start on that one next-ok?
Someone is making too much here, (I just lost $25,000 worth of small
equipment yesterday to theft - insurance is already denying coverage)

how about work comp? i like the idea of eliminating those guys too.-
they cost me a fortune every year - obviously that has to be wrong. *I
mean for structural steel work, i pay almost as mcuh insurance as I do
wages (75% IIRC)

And pensions- multiemployer pension funds are in deep dark **** right
now, yet they are a huge expense for those of us unlucky enough to pay
into them, and are financially liable for them if they fail (thank you
IRS). *We need to get started on those while we are fixing things.

this could be good, i see now. *ve vill all march together like gut
little vorkers and ve vill sing happy songs, for uncle joe, er sam.

you know rose colored glasses work really well shooting in certain
light conditions. *not so much in the real world.

I think I need to get a job where someone else gets to worry all night
about this ****, i'll just worry my empty little head about whether I
should fish the Madison this weekend, or maybe the Clearwater? *what
do you think?

john

knuclehead

John, you are forgetting: *"From each according to his ability, to each
according to his need ." **That's* what most of these liberal,
progressive mutton heads believe and *want*. *But, it doesn't work,
does it? *Try telling them that.

Madison works for me. *Enjoy. *I'll be fishing delayed harvest this
week-end - stocked trout that have wintered over. *Come May I will move
north to New England and fish my beloved Rapid River.

Dave

Idiot.

Pig.

Who does your hair?

g.

On Jan 21, 6:41 pm, David LaCourse wrote:

: "From each according to his ability, to each
according to his need ." *That's* what most of these liberal,
progressive mutton heads believe and *want*. But, it doesn't work,
does it? Try telling them that.



The IDEOLOGY of communism has been PROVEN to fail and fail badly in
the real world, as a tool to better the conditions of society as a
whole and promote social stability

The IDEOLOGY of unregulated free market capitalism has been PROVEN to
fail and fail badly in the real world, as a tool to better the
conditions of society as a whole and promote social stability ( ask
even Greenspan, who flat admitted that the ideology was flawed .. try
telling YOU that :-)

Capitalism and Communism are economic systems, NOT governmental ones,
although we all tend to lose sight of that often.

Government is a needed thing in human society. Good government is
ALWAYS at risk from the forces of economic systems.

Unchecked and unregulated, any economic system WILL undermine the
desirable effects of government. In this country, Capitalism has,
is and will cause the near downfall, at times, of our society, by
undermining the restraints on 'free enterprise' needed to protect
against too much concentration of wealth and power.


One of the things that strikes me as very odd about our culture is
that, often, the very individuals that most fear "big brother"
government willingly open their arms to the very real potential of
"big brother" corporate and wealthy individual power. Concentrate
all the money ( and resulting power ) in too few hands and YOU will
become a slave.

A slave is a slave, regardless of who his owner is .... we are at real
risk of becoming slaves to "business" as democracy is downgraded and
undermined by capitalism.


OF course, I think capitalism has worked better, thus far, than
communism, in real world tests .... but, largely because it has been
regulated and restrained by democracy's goal of serving and protecting
all of the people ...anti-trust laws, environmental protection laws,
worker protections, etc etc. For instance, without government
regulations on business, your search for trout still living in clean
water would most certainly be much more difficult, and your life
therefore much sadder.

One thing I simply can't understand is why people would vote for
individuals that openly state that they want to undermine government,
as a whole. To me this is like being on the board of directors of
a large business, interviewing applicants for key management
positions, and then choosing the ones that say," I don't believe in
this business and will do all I can to wreck it."

There is most certainly room for serious debate on the subject of what
the roles of government should be, but I'm looking for applicants that
will try to make it work better at those roles, not worse. Limiting
those roles to ones achievable and needed is, obviously, part of that
process towards improvement.

Anyone that honestly believes that "no government" is the best
government, needs to research conditions in the many places where "no
government" is a near reality.


Oh, one last thing ... jumping to the conclusion that anyone the
doesn't think just like me is a "mutton head" is, also, a way to
become enslaved. Consider the historic fates of nearly everyone
that has embraced an ideology at the cost of real thought and
conversation.

On 2010-01-22 14:37:00 -0500, Larry L said:

On Jan 21, 6:41 pm, David LaCourse wrote:

: "From each according to his ability, to each
according to his need ." *That's* what most of these liberal,
progressive mutton heads believe and *want*. But, it doesn't work,
does it? Try telling them that.




OF course, I think capitalism has worked better, thus far, than
communism, in real world tests ....

Really! Your grasp of the obvious, Larry, is simply amazing. This
president wants to redistribute wealth. It ain't, it can't, work.

Leave the system alone. Obama says from one side of his mouth that we
live in the greatest economy the world has ever known, and from the
other side he says, "Help me change it."

Hello? It seems to be working just fine. Yeah, there are times when
things get rough, but we always manage to survive. Today is no
different. For the government to be in the car, insurance, banking,
and health care business is asking for trouble. Regulate all you want,
but keep Obama out of my pocket. You take my wealth and give it to
someone who never worked for it, there is gonna be some BIG problems.
Count on it.

Carry on.

On Jan 22, 2:20*pm, David LaCourse wrote:
On 2010-01-22 14:37:00 -0500, Larry L said:

On Jan 21, 6:41 pm, David LaCourse wrote:

: *"From each according to his ability, to each
according to his need ." **That's* what most of these liberal,
progressive mutton heads believe and *want*. *But, it doesn't work,
does it? *Try telling them that.

OF course, I think capitalism has worked better, thus far, than
communism, in real world tests ....

Really! *Your grasp of the obvious, Larry, is simply amazing. *This
president wants to redistribute wealth. *It ain't, it can't, work.

Leave the system alone. *Obama says from one side of his mouth that we
live in the greatest economy the world has ever known, and from the
other side he says, "Help me change it."

Hello? *It seems to be working just fine. *Yeah, there are times when
things get rough, but we always manage to survive. *Today is no
different. *For the government to be in the car, insurance, banking,
and health care business is asking for trouble. *Regulate all you want,
but keep Obama out of my pocket. *You take my wealth and give it to
someone who never worked for it, there is gonna be some BIG problems. *
Count on it.

Carry on.

So, just for the record, do you think Larry is stupider than
you.....or vice versa?

g.
not that it matters.

"sgr" wrote in message
ews.com...
On Fri, 22 Jan 2010 15:20:24 -0500, David LaCourse
wrote:

For the government to be in the car, insurance, banking,
and health care business is asking for trouble.

"Federal Reserve earned $45 billion in 2009"
"Wall Street firms aren't the only banks that had a banner year. The
Federal Reserve made record profits in 2009, as its unconventional
efforts to prop up the economy created a windfall for the government."
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...011103892.html

Just sayin'.

God only knows what might come next? Could the government possibly have its
eyes on the military?

Op --heaven forbid that the U. S. government try to build a national
highway system or something--

On Jan 22, 4:16*pm, sgr wrote:
On Fri, 22 Jan 2010 15:20:24 -0500, David LaCourse

wrote:
For the government to be in the car, insurance, banking,
and health care business is asking for trouble.

"Federal Reserve earned $45 billion in 2009"
"Wall Street firms aren't the only banks that had a banner year. The
Federal Reserve made record profits in 2009, as its unconventional
efforts to prop up the economy created a windfall for the government."http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/01/11/AR201...

Just sayin'.

So, just for the record, do you think davie is stupider than
you.....or vice versa?

g.
not that it matters.

On Jan 22, 7:59*pm, sgr wrote:
On Fri, 22 Jan 2010 17:04:04 -0800 (PST), Giles
wrote:

So, just for the record, do you think davie is stupider than
you.....or vice versa?

Doesn't matter.

It may or it may not. There are numerous considerations to take into
account.

g.
not that it matters.

Good point.

Well, it was when I made it.


g.

"Larry L" wrote in message
...
On Jan 21, 6:41 pm, David LaCourse wrote:

: "From each according to his ability, to each
according to his need ." *That's* what most of these liberal,
progressive mutton heads believe and *want*. But, it doesn't work,
does it? Try telling them that.



The IDEOLOGY of communism has been PROVEN to fail and fail badly in
the real world, as a tool to better the conditions of society as a
whole and promote social stability

The IDEOLOGY of unregulated free market capitalism has been PROVEN to
fail and fail badly in the real world, as a tool to better the
conditions of society as a whole and promote social stability ( ask
even Greenspan, who flat admitted that the ideology was flawed .. try
telling YOU that :-)

Capitalism and Communism are economic systems, NOT governmental ones,
although we all tend to lose sight of that often.

Government is a needed thing in human society. Good government is
ALWAYS at risk from the forces of economic systems.

Unchecked and unregulated, any economic system WILL undermine the
desirable effects of government. In this country, Capitalism has,
is and will cause the near downfall, at times, of our society, by
undermining the restraints on 'free enterprise' needed to protect
against too much concentration of wealth and power.


One of the things that strikes me as very odd about our culture is
that, often, the very individuals that most fear "big brother"
government willingly open their arms to the very real potential of
"big brother" corporate and wealthy individual power. Concentrate
all the money ( and resulting power ) in too few hands and YOU will
become a slave.

A slave is a slave, regardless of who his owner is .... we are at real
risk of becoming slaves to "business" as democracy is downgraded and
undermined by capitalism.


OF course, I think capitalism has worked better, thus far, than
communism, in real world tests .... but, largely because it has been
regulated and restrained by democracy's goal of serving and protecting
all of the people ...anti-trust laws, environmental protection laws,
worker protections, etc etc. For instance, without government
regulations on business, your search for trout still living in clean
water would most certainly be much more difficult, and your life
therefore much sadder.

One thing I simply can't understand is why people would vote for
individuals that openly state that they want to undermine government,
as a whole. To me this is like being on the board of directors of
a large business, interviewing applicants for key management
positions, and then choosing the ones that say," I don't believe in
this business and will do all I can to wreck it."

There is most certainly room for serious debate on the subject of what
the roles of government should be, but I'm looking for applicants that
will try to make it work better at those roles, not worse. Limiting
those roles to ones achievable and needed is, obviously, part of that
process towards improvement.

Anyone that honestly believes that "no government" is the best
government, needs to research conditions in the many places where "no
government" is a near reality.


Oh, one last thing ... jumping to the conclusion that anyone the
doesn't think just like me is a "mutton head" is, also, a way to
become enslaved. Consider the historic fates of nearly everyone
that has embraced an ideology at the cost of real thought and
conversation.

well stated,immho

Op

"Larry L" wrote in message
...

well put, Larry. It's sort of enlightening that our founding fathers built a
system of government, not an economic model. They knew what was truly
important, and also knew they couldn't forsee the economies of the future.

What John doesn't see is that when it comes to healthcare, we are talking
about something that ought to be a birthright of citizenship, not a profit
center. It works well that way in so many other places, there is no reason
it shouldn't here.

What Dave regularly misses is that income has been redistributed from day
one, either by government or at the point of a gun, or a host of other
methods. He talks as if what he has earned has no bearing on governmental
programs, yet admits he was a child of a home which benefitted from public
assistance. Still, no mention of paying my family and thousands of others
back for the fact he was allowed to grow up and earn, rather than starve in
a gutter, thanks to governmental largesse.No big thank-yous for the GI
benefits he started his career upon, nor the pension he draws, thanks to our
tax money. Hell, every last person in this nation with any sort of
substantial wealth is the beneficiary of the largesse of others, somehow.
It's how the system works, and has worked for damn near forever.

Tom