OT and Political: Blizzard Exercises: Knee Jerking

On Dec 18, 2:18*pm, Todd wrote:
On 12/18/2010 02:06 AM, DaveS wrote:

"TODD"
You are a pushy anonymous religionist, who apparently has been deeply
influenced by extreme right-wing historical revisionism, which in this
case you mistake for Christianity. Your "tells" are numerous, in part
because you "cut and paste" odds and ends that reveal a very narrow
and biased set of soft Fascist influences. Specifically . . .

soft Fascist. *Boring. *At leat I make references. *You don't.
I have a hard time telling what is and what is not your opinion.



1. The assertion that Thomas Paine was an atheist, for example. Wrong.
He was a Deist, a belief system shared by many of the Revolutionary
generation. There are too many of Paine's own words surviving to claim
otherwise. Fake quotes, edited quotes etc., much used by the Radical
Christian Right Wing to support their attempt to undermine the US
Constitution's separation of church and state, just can't work for
Paine. *Consequently, the few founding fathers that this crowd cannot
pretend were evangelical Christians, are labeled as "atheist."

You are correct in that he considered himself a "Deist":http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_paine

* * * He described himself as deist, saying:

* * * * * How different is [Christianity] to the pure and simple
* * * * * profession of Deism! The true Deist has but one Deity,
* * * * * and his religion consists in contemplating the power,
* * * * * wisdom, and benignity of the Deity in his works, and
* * * * * in endeavoring to imitate him in everything moral,
* * * * * scientifical, and mechanical.

Looking at:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deism#W...y_Thomas_Paine

* * * * * Deism is a theological position (though encompassing a wide
* * * * * variety of view-points) concerning God's relationship with
* * * * * the natural world which emerged during the scientific
* * * * * revolution of seventeenth century Europe and came to exert
* * * * * a powerful influence during the eighteenth century
* * * * * enlightenment. By virtue of this, deism as a theological
* * * * * doctrine has had a great influence on the character of the
* * * * * modern world. Deism stood between the narrow dogmatism of the
* * * * * period and skepticism. They rejected atheism,[3] but often
* * * * * were called "atheists" by more traditional theists

I come from the "more tradition" interpretation. *Have you read
Thomas Paine's writing on the subject. *He really, really was
not friend to believers. *Left himself a back door. *I will give
you that.

His point still holds about the need for a religious and moral
people for the Constitution to succeed. *You have yet to
address this issue.



2. The assertion that Nazis and Fascists are/were "left wing"
political ideologies, like Communism and Socialism. This is a standard
slur of the David Barton/Glenn Beck strain of Rightwing Historical
Revisionism, promoted in a propaganda campaign of literally hundreds
of talks targeted on evangelical preachers for almost 10 years now.
This assertion helps confuse the association of the extreme American
right wing, and past church leaders with their flirtations with
Fascism, the Nazis, Neo-Nazis, anti Semitism and the KKK.

Nazis and Communists are both left wing. *Calling Nazis right
wing is the propagandists slight of hand. *Can't tell the
two apart.

Who would this be?

* * *The worker in a capitalist state � and that is
* * *his deepest misfortune � is no longer a living
* * *human being, a creator, a maker. He has become a
* * *machine. A number, a cog in the machine without
* * *sense or understanding.

Marx? *Obama? *You? *It would be Joseph Goebbelshttp://www.calvin.edu/academic/cas/gpa/haken32.htm

Who would this be?
* * *What is the profane basis of Judaism? Practical
* * *need, self-interest. What is the worldly cult
* * *of the Jew? Huckstering. What is his worldly god?
* * *Money. Very well: then in emancipating itself
* * *from huckstering and money, and thus from real
* * *and practical Judaism, our age would emancipate itself.

* * *As soon as society succeeds in abolishing the empirical
* * *essence of Judaism � huckstering and its conditions � the
* * *Jew becomes impossible.

Hitler? *Goebbels? *You? *It would be Karl Marx.http://www.moonbattery.com/archives/...azis-were.html

Can't tell them apart. *Both Leftist.

3. Your denial of the well documented failure of the Christian
churches, (and the complicity of some) to stand up to the racial and
ethnic policies of the Nazis . . . is pathetic, as is the outrageous
claim of a ratio of 1.2 Christians per Jew killed in the Holocaust.
You have no idea (I hope) of the company this assertion places you in.

Here is quick link for Poland:http://www.holocaustforgotten.com/Lucaire.htm

I got the 1.2 number from the same guy that wrote the phrase
"first they came for they Jews". *He wrote a big
old book about it. *Sorry I do not have the time
to look it up for you.



4. This attempt to protect yourself, by claiming reaction to your
nonsense, equals bigotry against Christianity. Your words and tenacity
suggest that your spiritual health right now seems to depend on some
pretty goofy secular right wing historical fictions. Christian
practice regarding "repentance" and "works," for example do not seem
to figure in your equation.

And you know this how? *What a Bigot!

This is more of a response than you deserve. I do not hate you or
Christianity. It is entirely possible, you know, to be a political
conservative and a Christian, without swallowing the whole turd of
cheap, worldly, political fictions concocted by thinly educated
preachers. It's your choice but it will not end well when you learn
that you have been deceived, and that these nasty fictions you defend,
demean the faith you profess.

Dave

Next time, accuse me of peeing in the Penns. *Much more fun.

-T

Moron.

g.